Are we headed to the Vette site in a couple of years?

[viperdrummer]

Autoweek says Bob Lutz is well on his way to shaking up GM and specifically Corvette. "he has already amended the look of the next Corvette (due in 04 as an 05)" according to AW. Given the controversial look of the 03 Viper (I still say it is too Camaroish for me), and that it will only be in RT format ,is this especially bad timing for snake fans. Could Viper for the first time in 12 years (by 04) be out-radicalled (even if not as much HP)by Vette . Will Bob be writing , "Ode to Vette" and taking potshots at the staid Viper? Will there be 25,000 Vettes that will be gawked at and 1500 snakes that get ignored at the gas pumps? Will Jon B start wearing bow ties again? Will we be buying time shares in Diablos so we can remember what is was liked to be noticed? Stay tuned.....

 

[Vreracing]

Competition is a great thing.

 

[Andrew2KRT10]

GOD FORBID!!!!

Not me! I'm not going anywhere. I will be pissed if Dodge lets the Viper die. I've heard too many rumors now that there may not be a '03, that there probably won't be a VOI7, and now that the Vette Site may dominate? First terrorism, now this? (just a joke, not trying to compare)

Andrew

 

[Joseph Houss]

VOI7 = YES!
2003 = YES!
WORLD CLASS ********** = YES!

IMHO the Vette, even with Lutz at the wheel, will always have to be a bit less raw, as it MUST sell to 30,000+ buyers a year. Which means automatics, climate control, heads up display, etc will be necessary.... and for us? ..... no thanks ... just more to turn off, or pull out when we go to the track!

Dodge - KEEP FOCUSED - The Viper SHOULD BE as close to a race car that the DOT will allow!

Heck, lets focus on making the Competition Coupe street legal, with as little change as possible!

 

[TAPROOT]

I am glad to see that my wife and I are not the only ones who think that Vettes are a "DIME a DOZEN".The reason why we bought our 01 RT is because of Dodge's new edge on design,we wanted to get our hands on the current body style.We like the extra power of the 03's but do not care for the looks..Is there still time for Dodge to change???

<FONT COLOR="#ff0000" SIZE="1" FACE="Verdana, Arial">This message has been edited by Taproot on 10-16-2001 at 09:43 AM</font>

 

[Joseph Houss]

Jon? Am I reading your post incorrectly?

We have had many surveys handed to us, at VOI's and even VCA Notes, that requested our thoughts ... and many, if not all, have been addressed in the new car.

Here's what I KNOW they took to heart:

More Power
V10
ABS
Better Aerodynamics
More Power
Real Convertible
More Power
No Cupholder
Dead Pedal

.. oh, and did I say.... More Power?

I'm not sure whether the surveys really focused on style (and maybe that was an oversight, as Dodge might have not prioritized this element as being significant), and I think many respondents might have taken it for granted that our new generation car would easily be able to look like the current gen car.. so their feedback may have been limited.

The Viper Nation Spoke.... and Dodge Listened!

I think the big issue still tends to be the styling that they chose.... and yes, Jon, once again, you're right; Everyone who buys the car, WILL LOVE THE CAR! (heck, otherwise, why would they buy it?) I think Dodge kept their priorities correct: If you want the Viper to stay on top....build a race car (the GTS/R and now the competition coupe), with total focus on power, aerodynamics, braking, and track worthiness...and then back things off..just enough...to make it street legal. If we should have one complaint, it should be that they took a bit more than we expected "off the top", as the '03 production car doesn't exactly "mirror" the competition coupe's much more aggressive look.... and maybe a "ground effects styling package" is in order. But all in all, Dodge surely listened, and it's safe to say, that the huge change in styling will make us ALL happy, as it'll keep the resale of our current generation cars high, as there will be many that think 450 HP is enough, and they will demand the added natural beauty of our "Cobra styled" current gen cars.

 

[garolittle]

Jon B. in bow ties? Is this just a marketing ploy?

 

[JonB]

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Taproot:
I am glad to see that my wife and I are not the only ones who think that Vettes are a "DIME a DOZEN".....We like the extra power of the 03's but do not care for the looks..Is there still time for Dodge to change??? <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>


In a word: NOPE! The only "changes" likley are tweaks, and programming issues. The tooling is all ordered and scheduled for install at CAAP.

But remember this: When C-5 vettes debuted, fans of vettes puked. "NSX styling" was the press comment. But photos did not do it justice. They sold 40,000. [Viper sold 1500.] Viper will sell EVERY car they build, and likley more each year on average than ever before. I suspect a 2500 / year goal. [Prowler will be gone....VGX will be easier to build more per day]

D-C does not really care what we think about the styling. Read Viper Mag, latest issue, for a frank, revealing, in-depth discussion. They are building tis car for the next-generation of enthusiasts.

D-C will STILL sell the entire 1st year build, [likley to VCAer-Viper Owners] who will LOVE the car when the see it in person.

[ Order your 2003 Smoothe Tube NOW! PartsRack: $129 ]

 

[viperdrummer]

D-C does not care what we think about stying. It is making the car for the next generation.BUT, they will sell out the first year mostly to CURRENT OWNERS. Hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm...............Maybe we need Lutz more than we even thought.

 

[remster]

I vote a big NO as well on the new viper look. Bleh.
I bought my viper because of its look, batmobile style. And the horsepower/performances. I liked the old corvette look but Chevy screwed it up. Seems like a virus in the auto industry. Take a good product, then screw it up.
The new look reminds me of a kids toy with goofy curves... I'll pass.
I'll wait until D-C wakes up and returns to the original look.

4aDodge main site is down... I checked out the pics again on that other site and the front reminds me of my old Honda Civic! Ugh! The back looks like a Mercedes SLK!
I know, they hired DOCTOR FRANKENSTEIN to put it together out of competitors' parts!!!

 

[Joseph Houss]

Good points Mako!

I truely have a feeling that Dodge won't dissapoint us. I can't imagine them building a car with racing harness bezels in the seats without having additional options on tap!

We'll find out soon enough!

 

[Steve Ferguson]

Remster, the fact that you think the new Viper syle is poor make me feel that much better for really being in love with the new aggresive look. Thanks for making my day

 

[viperdrummer]

..."new aggressive look" ?? What am I missing?

 

[Gerald]

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Steve Ferguson:
the new aggresive look.
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

You must be joking. What is really scary is people that head (or used head) the VCA and DC that think THAT (2003) is agressive..EGAD!!
But of course, this is my opinion, and we all know what that is worth..


The "NEW AGRESSIVE LOOK"

You must be registered for see images

The OLD NON AGRESSIVE LOOK

You must be registered for see images

Gerald

 

[GTS Dean]

D'ohhh..... That had to hurt!

 

[Jim Hodel]

I think it is quite natural for owners of a current model not too like the new improved model. I see this happen all the time. Owners of air cooled Porsche 911's don't like the 996 and I've heard E36 M3 owners bad mouth the new E46. Viper owners complain about the new Viper.

I think some of you are just being defensive because you fear that your 'ultimate' car is being upstaged, and you are upset by not being the big kid on the block anymore.

The new Viper also has much better brakes and weighs less. Evolutionary yes, but an improved product overall. Get used to it.

I am not going to make up my mind about the styling until I see one in person.

Jim

 

[Gerald]

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Jim Hodel:

I think some of you are just being defensive because you fear that your 'ultimate' car is being upstaged, and you are upset by not being the big kid on the block anymore.


<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Yup.. right on the money

Gotta give credit for Dodge on the power. But you and I know what makes a Viper... It's incredible lines, be honest.. NO CAR will upstage a GENI or GENII viper.

 

[VOI9 ASP]

I have seen the car in person 2 times. I like the looks. I don't think it looks anything like a corvette or a camero. The lines are more like a Ferrari than anythink else.

I have one of the 2003 RT/10's on order - but I would have liked to see it look more like this!

You must be registered for see images

 

[SapphireGTS]

Who cares what it looks like. It has 500 HP.

I dont drive my viper because it looks cool. I drive it because I like american power. To be honest, the current viper looks like a clown-shoe or perhaps a sausage that someone stepped on. My only complaint about the 2003 is those side pipes and its missing a roof.

 

[Joseph Houss]

Van Halen?

How 'bout:

You must be registered for see images

"I've driven a lot of great sports cars," said Perry, "but the Viper is in a class by itself. It's everything your mother warned you about."


...and by the way...that front view looks ALL VIPER!!!!

 

[Ray W]

Dodge only needs to do 2 things to get me to buy one every 2-3years.
1. Add 10-15 more hp each year.
2. Get me a guarantee (voucher) that I will get the
car. Regardless of how long it takes.
Bought every one of my 3 Vipers based on power only. Curb appeal
was just an added bonus.

 

[GTS Dean]

I like the front view, excepting the scoop. The profile and rear 3/4 views ****.

 

[garolittle]

I agree with Steve. This car will rule the auto world.

 

[Steve Ferguson]

For all those who DO NOT LIKE the new design, how many of you have seen it in person? I have! I have sat in it, seen it at 5 different stages of development, heard it, seen it driving next to me, and yes the new sleek look looks more aggressive IN MY EYES!

BTW. Am I not entitled to like something? As you do not approve of what I see visually appealing, I so too question the fact that you have to change your Viper to enjoy what it is? Does that make me right? That was a pretty sad statement, and makes me feel even better in my choice to say I do enjoy it.

Get a life and move on. If I wanted the SAME VIPER, I would go buy one today. If you want to experience something different, then MOVE ON. I am willing to bet that those who do not approve the changes are still listening to Classic Rock? Nothing wrong with it, but quite frankly there is just as good of music today as there was then. Get it!

 

[remster]

I want the same look, with better stuff inside and more horses. And I'm sure lots of guys (gals) are like me.

DC should call that new thing a Dodge Sniper, or Dodge Griper, Dodge Piper... whatever. But not a Viper.

The new look doesn't look bad, but it reeks of low self esteeem and doubts on the part of management, feeling the need to get a Boob job just to try to feel better.
Some always think the grass is greener elsewhere. I loved my grass the way it was.
I loved that the Viper stuck to its original look. In the face of all the other automotive shmucks who kept tweaking the body to get it better, the viper was perfect from the get go, and didn't need cosmetic improvements. No balls.
Fire those who changed the look and save some development cost!

 

[viperdrummer]

Darn it. You're right. Like others, I am stuck in neutral.As I write this, I am drinking a classic coke and listening to Van Halen. Dodge hasn't made a significant design change to Viper since the last century and its high time. You are right. I have now seen the light. It does not look at all like a Camaro.It is the embodiment of all that is good and I can't imagine that Lutz will come up with anything in 04-05 to approach the sheer genius of the new design. I hereby retract all previous statements that could have in any way reflected poorly on Dodge, its engineers, other employees or any member of VCA that may have had an opinion contrary to mine. It will be my 3rd Viper!!!!!!!!!!

 

[remster]

viperdrummer, you forgot to put your shades on... you got zapped with the flashy thingy (Men in Black).

 

[Kid97GTS]

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Steve Ferguson:
For all those who DO NOT LIKE the new design, how many of you have seen it in person? I have! I have sat in it, seen it at 5 different stages of development, heard it, seen it driving next to me, and yes the new sleek look looks more aggressive IN MY EYES!

BTW. Am I not entitled to like something? As you do not approve of what I see visually appealing, I so too question the fact that you have to change your Viper to enjoy what it is? Does that make me right? That was a pretty sad statement, and makes me feel even better in my choice to say I do enjoy it.

Get a life and move on. If I wanted the SAME VIPER, I would go buy one today. If you want to experience something different, then MOVE ON. I am willing to bet that those who do not approve the changes are still listening to Classic Rock? Nothing wrong with it, but quite frankly there is just as good of music today as there was then. Get it!

<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Hey Fergie, pretty funny for you to get your ******* in a bunch over you feeling that someone is not entitling you to your opinion (especially after the cheap shot you took at the guy with the Hawaiian paint scheme). If you are going to make wise cracks at others, then fell free to thicken up that parchment thin skin of yours.

While we're at it, it would probably save us all a lot of time sifting through your posts if you just posted the following in lieu of your inane banter: " "

Those empty quotes can just symbolize the fact that every single post you've ever made merely mirrors the party line espoused by Dodge or the VCA. You better watch out you don't develop carpal tunnel from all the apple shining you do for Dodge and the VCA. Anytime anyone says anything remotely adverse to the rah-rah b.s. but down by the VCA, you go off.

Face it - there is a significant number of current Viper owners (and dare I say VCA members) that DO NOT like the styling of the Gen III car. Big deal, like Dodge cares - but that is not reason for you or any other Dodge teacher's pet to jump on them for it. As far as the "More Power" argument, wake up. A few simple mods to a Gen II gets you to the same or better power levels while still having a car that some may find better looking.

If people want to spend their cash on a Gen III and talk about how great it is, fine - just don't try to devalue the Gen II lovers' argument that they will stick with their cars until DC changes the uninspired Gen III styling.

 

[remster]

Well, to be fair, maybe Steve can tell us why DC felt the Viper needed such a radical new look?
There had to be some pretty high level meetings to decide something like this.
If it was just a way to release that concept model that was floating around a few year ago, then that's one goofy idea IMHO.
As a viper owners, I'd like to believe that DC hasn't gone insane.

 

[TAPROOT]

Is the pic a few posts back the 03 Camaro SS that they were not going to make but made it anyway,or is that the new viper?

I like Venom 2K's pic of the VIPER "that should of been". That to me has the added agressive stance while keeping the "viper" sting your a$$ look!To go way out like D-C did is hard for me to like it. To each's own ha?


Ivan-
2001 Viper(Yellow)RT
98 Camaro SS
2000 Eddie Bauer Expedition
98 Metro (park and scoot for the city)
01 Suzuki katana 750

<FONT COLOR="#ff0000" SIZE="1" FACE="Verdana, Arial">This message has been edited by Taproot on 10-19-2001 at 06:42 AM</font>