Bugeater
Enthusiast
Awesome.
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=1867414842
Check out the Dyno!
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=1867414842
Check out the Dyno!
Roe, Levin, etc...you gots competition!
- Thread starter Bugeater
- Start date
ExecUtron Technologies
Viper Owner
Hey! It might cost 1000 times less, but it's not as pretty as DLM's! Who cares about warranties anyway!...
MadMaxx
Enthusiast
BWAAHAHAHAHAHAHA
Is that like the turbo in the can deal?
MM
Is that like the turbo in the can deal?
MM
Andrew2KRT10
Enthusiast
go ahead and call me a dope, but someone tell me why I wouldn't try this.
Doug ?
Sean ?
Wizard ?
Thanks.
Doug ?
Sean ?
Wizard ?
Thanks.
I laughed pretty hard at the comparison to "oldfassion" turbos, but my favorite part is the "All sales are final. . .Refunds are negotiable." I can hear the exchange now:
Customer: How do I send this thing back?
Seller: I'm sorry, all sales are final.
Customer: This POS wouldn't dry my hair; you're a crook, and after I leave negative feedback on ebay, I'm going to sue your a$$ off.
Seller: Refund accepted.
The sad part is that the reason people run these ads is a high percentage of buyers just toss the crap out and don't even seek a refund.
Customer: How do I send this thing back?
Seller: I'm sorry, all sales are final.
Customer: This POS wouldn't dry my hair; you're a crook, and after I leave negative feedback on ebay, I'm going to sue your a$$ off.
Seller: Refund accepted.
The sad part is that the reason people run these ads is a high percentage of buyers just toss the crap out and don't even seek a refund.
S
SUN RA KAT
Guest
I wonder if it would fit my lawnmower...
Viper Wizard
Enthusiast
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by SUN RA KAT:
I wonder if it would fit my lawnmower...
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
![laughing2[1].gif](/vca/proxy.php?image=http%3A%2F%2Fvca1.viperclub.org%2Fubb%2Fsmilies%2Flaughing2%5B1%5D.gif&hash=44ede181bdbbbb16a006ddd7153c47a2)
I wonder if it would fit my lawnmower...
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
TacDoc
Enthusiast
With a max flow of 450 cfm that thing is just liable to slow you down.
Larry Macedo
Enthusiast
If you go down to your local Marine Supply store, you'll find bilge blowers in varying sizes and CFM. That is basically what you see before you on Ebay.
Larry Macedo
Enthusiast
Ooops, I meant to add that you could purchase (2) for $50 and save yourself the shipping charges.
red98GTS
Enthusiast
Will ALL the Viper owners who order or plan to order one or more of these bilge pumps for their car, please email me immediately. I have a bridge in Lake Havasu, Arizona, slightly used (over in London), and I'm offering it at a substantial discount, but the offer expires TODAY and payment must reach me by midnight tonight. The bridge is the real thing, I guarantee it. Oh yes, and I can also make you a package deal which would include this bridge, PLUS......yes, IN ADDITION, some beach-front property here in Arizona. Yes, we have a beach here. Beautiful sand. Don't hesitate. Hurry. PS>>>PT Barnum said it best, and if you don't know what he said, see previous post! pete the ex glass guy and bridge owner
Bugeater
Enthusiast
I bought 2 because I figured twin turbo, and 850cfm wouldnt require larger fuel injectors. I'll post the dyno later.
I just hope I can beat 230 hp (like Direct2U's car).
Plus, I will sleep better at night knowing I am not overheating my engine with all those other turbo kits.
My car is gonna fly.
WATCH OUT NORM! I'M GONNA BUST A CAP IN YOUR WATER PISTOLA!
SEE ALL YOU POSERS AT THE TRACK!!!
I just hope I can beat 230 hp (like Direct2U's car).
Plus, I will sleep better at night knowing I am not overheating my engine with all those other turbo kits.
My car is gonna fly.
WATCH OUT NORM! I'M GONNA BUST A CAP IN YOUR WATER PISTOLA!
SEE ALL YOU POSERS AT THE TRACK!!!
Doug Supercharged Vipers
Enthusiast
They pack a real sucker punch ;-)
Thanks for sharing,
Doug
Thanks for sharing,
Doug
SurfSnake
Enthusiast
I think mounting a propane bottle under the hood of your viper could be dangerous, you know with all that heat and all.
joe117
Enthusiast
It's a bilge blower for a boat. For you non nautical types, it's used to remove gas fumes from compartments inside the boat after fueling.
That being said, If you look at their dyno claims they are only showing about 25 hp gain. I don't know. If they ran the first run with a normal air filter and ran the second run with their blower and no filter, it just might give 25 hp.
That being said, If you look at their dyno claims they are only showing about 25 hp gain. I don't know. If they ran the first run with a normal air filter and ran the second run with their blower and no filter, it just might give 25 hp.
VPRGTS
Enthusiast
That's no propane bottle.
That looks like an inline blower fan out of a boat. They are used to ventilate fumes from the engine compartment.
Someone will buy it. If I nailed two boards together they could be sold on ebay.
There is a sucker born every minute.
That looks like an inline blower fan out of a boat. They are used to ventilate fumes from the engine compartment.
Someone will buy it. If I nailed two boards together they could be sold on ebay.
There is a sucker born every minute.
CitySnake
Enthusiast
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by RedGTS:
This POS wouldn't dry my hair...
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
That's great
Pro: It will NOT rust.
Con: It costs 34% of the purchase price for shipping and handling
.
This seems to be a "motorized Tornado". I also wonder if it WOULD actually make some HP increase.
This POS wouldn't dry my hair...
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
That's great
Pro: It will NOT rust.
Con: It costs 34% of the purchase price for shipping and handling
This seems to be a "motorized Tornado". I also wonder if it WOULD actually make some HP increase.
Andrew2KRT10
Enthusiast
Wow. Guess I got my answer. Lawn mowers, boats, hair driers......I'll pass.
AC
AC
Tom and Vipers
Enthusiast
Actually, electric turbos or superchargers are all over the place.
There was one outfit that produced one that was around 1000 cfm and here is the important part, it drew 40 amps.
On a Honda, it would produce .5 to 1.0 psi of boost and you could cascade them.
There was a video on their site where the open air thrust of the blower was greater than it's weight. They guy would hold it, energize it, let it go and it would take off like a rocket!
At the Reno Airraces, a fellow showed up with an APU driven supercharger. There was no power consumption on the engine to drive the S/C!
There was one outfit that produced one that was around 1000 cfm and here is the important part, it drew 40 amps.
On a Honda, it would produce .5 to 1.0 psi of boost and you could cascade them.
There was a video on their site where the open air thrust of the blower was greater than it's weight. They guy would hold it, energize it, let it go and it would take off like a rocket!
At the Reno Airraces, a fellow showed up with an APU driven supercharger. There was no power consumption on the engine to drive the S/C!
Vic
VCA Venom Member
- Joined
- Nov 12, 2000
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<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by TacDoc:
With a max flow of 450 cfm that thing is just liable to slow you down.
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
Our V10s are probably somewhere in the neighborhood of 850 CFM.
And if other models, or a twin set up, can supply enough CFM, then what pressure can they supply at 850CFM? IT must be able to supply its boost even near redline, where the CFMs are highest.
An electric blower DOES put a load on the engine, because the alternator will be pumping out more current to keep the battery voltage up. This makes the alternator harder to turn, but the gains of boost are far greater than the load imposed on the engine by the blower's current consumption. Right, Doug?
With a max flow of 450 cfm that thing is just liable to slow you down.
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
Our V10s are probably somewhere in the neighborhood of 850 CFM.
And if other models, or a twin set up, can supply enough CFM, then what pressure can they supply at 850CFM? IT must be able to supply its boost even near redline, where the CFMs are highest.
An electric blower DOES put a load on the engine, because the alternator will be pumping out more current to keep the battery voltage up. This makes the alternator harder to turn, but the gains of boost are far greater than the load imposed on the engine by the blower's current consumption. Right, Doug?
Vic
VCA Venom Member
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<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by joe117:
I still think it might give the 25 hp they claim. Anyone who goes for smooth tubes shouldn't pass up 25 hp.
I always wondered if one could sc a motorcycle with a gas powered leaf blower. No kidding.
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
I have personal experience with this. The first electric blower I built was a leaf blower adaptation, that I experimented with on a Dodge Dakota.
Rather than drag you through all the mistakes I made in my naivete`, I'll just let you in on the crux of the issue.
Most leaf blowers have forward curved blades, that give a good volume and velocity, when NO RESTRICTION is put on the air flow. This type of blade sort of "slings" the air off of the leading edge of the blade. As soon as you put your hand over the output, the flow tapers off to "nothing useful".
Blowers of any type that make any signifigant pressure have reverse curved blades, in a tight tolerance housing. This design sort of compresses the air off of the trailing edge of the blade, as it spins. If you put your hand over the intake of a strong vaccum, it will **** your skin until it turns red. Conversely, the output side also remains strong when obstructed. This is a simple common example of reverse curved blades that everyone has experience with.
There are positive displacement blowers, (Whipple, Roots), centrifugal blowers, (Paxton, Vortech)
Other considerations are sometimes detonation, which must be compensated for by water injection, or spark timing. Lower intial compression ratio may help, when building an engine to be supercharged. And then there is the fuel management system to consider, because the computer is mapped for a certain maximum flow rate to the injectors. If the Viper had a mass air flow sensor, things would be easier.
People like Doug Levin, Jason Heffner, and Sean Roe have taken the time to pre-engineer a supercharger system for the Viper.
Part of the cost of these systems are for the intensive engineering, dyno testing, and custom parts manufacturing.
Ok, now I will respond like the typical idiot, when confronted with something unknown.
Boy, that blower looks like a P.O.C.! Ha- Ha- Whats he smokin?
I still think it might give the 25 hp they claim. Anyone who goes for smooth tubes shouldn't pass up 25 hp.
I always wondered if one could sc a motorcycle with a gas powered leaf blower. No kidding.
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
I have personal experience with this. The first electric blower I built was a leaf blower adaptation, that I experimented with on a Dodge Dakota.
Rather than drag you through all the mistakes I made in my naivete`, I'll just let you in on the crux of the issue.
Most leaf blowers have forward curved blades, that give a good volume and velocity, when NO RESTRICTION is put on the air flow. This type of blade sort of "slings" the air off of the leading edge of the blade. As soon as you put your hand over the output, the flow tapers off to "nothing useful".
Blowers of any type that make any signifigant pressure have reverse curved blades, in a tight tolerance housing. This design sort of compresses the air off of the trailing edge of the blade, as it spins. If you put your hand over the intake of a strong vaccum, it will **** your skin until it turns red. Conversely, the output side also remains strong when obstructed. This is a simple common example of reverse curved blades that everyone has experience with.
There are positive displacement blowers, (Whipple, Roots), centrifugal blowers, (Paxton, Vortech)
Other considerations are sometimes detonation, which must be compensated for by water injection, or spark timing. Lower intial compression ratio may help, when building an engine to be supercharged. And then there is the fuel management system to consider, because the computer is mapped for a certain maximum flow rate to the injectors. If the Viper had a mass air flow sensor, things would be easier.
People like Doug Levin, Jason Heffner, and Sean Roe have taken the time to pre-engineer a supercharger system for the Viper.
Part of the cost of these systems are for the intensive engineering, dyno testing, and custom parts manufacturing.
Ok, now I will respond like the typical idiot, when confronted with something unknown.
Boy, that blower looks like a P.O.C.! Ha- Ha- Whats he smokin?
joe117
Enthusiast
I still think it might give the 25 hp they claim. Anyone who goes for smooth tubes shouldn't pass up 25 hp.
I always wondered if one could sc a motorcycle with a gas powered leaf blower. No kidding.
I always wondered if one could sc a motorcycle with a gas powered leaf blower. No kidding.
joe117
Enthusiast
That was an interesting experiment with the leaf blower. I'd like to know exactly what happened, did you drive it with the experimental rig? Was it just a total bust?
The bilge blower supercharger that we are talking about is obviously not a real sc and anyone who buys one expecting sc results, will be very disappointed.
All that being said, they are only claiming a small hp gain. It's not the same kind of fan that you find in a leaf blower. Even if it couldn't give boost at 850 cfm it might flow 850 cfm, could it give more air without boost over 14.7 psi? Could it improve flow without boosting? I just want to know why it couldn't give a handful of hp more than without it.
People buy smooth tubes for a very small gain in flow. People buy K&N air filters for a very small gain in flow.
I wouldn't put one of these on my lawnmower let alone my Viper. I know it's a misrepresentation. I just want to know if their actual claims are necessarily false.
The bilge blower supercharger that we are talking about is obviously not a real sc and anyone who buys one expecting sc results, will be very disappointed.
All that being said, they are only claiming a small hp gain. It's not the same kind of fan that you find in a leaf blower. Even if it couldn't give boost at 850 cfm it might flow 850 cfm, could it give more air without boost over 14.7 psi? Could it improve flow without boosting? I just want to know why it couldn't give a handful of hp more than without it.
People buy smooth tubes for a very small gain in flow. People buy K&N air filters for a very small gain in flow.
I wouldn't put one of these on my lawnmower let alone my Viper. I know it's a misrepresentation. I just want to know if their actual claims are necessarily false.
Bugeater
Enthusiast
Strap ML to the front of your snake? Why not?!?
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=1775474087
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=1775474087
Vic
VCA Venom Member
- Joined
- Nov 12, 2000
- Posts
- 6,765
- Reaction score
- 1
After re-reding my earlier post, I see some mistatements and inaccuracies. Surprised I'm not all fried-up by now! Maybe no ones listening. Thats good, now I can escape!
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by joe117:
That was an interesting experiment with the leaf blower. I'd like to know exactly what happened, did you drive it with the experimental rig?
Yup, it made some extra torque, (nothing outrageous, but noticable when mashing the throttle down), as measured with my seat of the pants dyno. This was mostly at 2500rpm and below, on a 350 V8. At higher rpms, it just got in the way, 'cause it didn't produce enough CFMs. Waste of time. Later versions, using reverse curved blades in a tighter housing, did better, but still not enough CFM to take it all the way up to redline. My experiments are sporadic, and I'm really not focused on making a blower, its just sort of tinkering around. Maybe I'll take another stab at it soon.
Was it just a total bust?
No, I learned about the characteristics of various blower designs a little better. Still learning.
The bilge blower supercharger that we are talking about is obviously not a real sc and anyone who buys one expecting sc results, will be very disappointed.
That might net you something on a small displacement engine, like a 4 ****** or something.
All that being said, they are only claiming a small hp gain.
Another issue is, Will your engine management computer be able to flow more through the injectors, to compensate for the greater air flow? If there is a max flow rate in software, then it don't matter how much air you pump in, it will just go lean. Thats what I like about having a mass air flow sensor, it will sense the increased air flow and adjust fuel flow accordingly. (Up to the limit in software, after that point you would benefit from a performance chip, with higher flow rate parameters)
It's not the same kind of fan that you find in a leaf blower.
Thats a good thing!
Even if it couldn't give boost at 850 cfm it might flow 850 cfm, could it give more air without boost over 14.7 psi? Could it improve flow without boosting?
If you somehow adapted that stuff, and had enough CFM at redline, but no gain in boost, then there is no net gain. Its just along for the ride. It must apply pressure of some sort, to be of any value. Maybe you end up with 1psi from 4000rpm up to redline, but 5 psi up to 4000rpm. That would give you a funny torque curve, but may be useful. But instead of thinking that way, why not aim for say 5psi at all rpms, and don't even think about anything less?
I just want to know why it couldn't give a handful of hp more than without it.
You need to get the technical data sheet from whoever makes that device, and see how many inches of mercury it moves, and at what CFM.
People buy smooth tubes for a very small gain in flow. People buy K&N air filters for a very small gain in flow.
I wouldn't put one of these on my lawnmower let alone my Viper. I know it's a misrepresentation. I just want to know if their actual claims are necessarily false.
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
I think if you strap Monica Lewinski to the front of your Viper, you may notice some gains, but if not, look at the fun you'll have!
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by joe117:
That was an interesting experiment with the leaf blower. I'd like to know exactly what happened, did you drive it with the experimental rig?
Yup, it made some extra torque, (nothing outrageous, but noticable when mashing the throttle down), as measured with my seat of the pants dyno. This was mostly at 2500rpm and below, on a 350 V8. At higher rpms, it just got in the way, 'cause it didn't produce enough CFMs. Waste of time. Later versions, using reverse curved blades in a tighter housing, did better, but still not enough CFM to take it all the way up to redline. My experiments are sporadic, and I'm really not focused on making a blower, its just sort of tinkering around. Maybe I'll take another stab at it soon.
Was it just a total bust?
No, I learned about the characteristics of various blower designs a little better. Still learning.
The bilge blower supercharger that we are talking about is obviously not a real sc and anyone who buys one expecting sc results, will be very disappointed.
That might net you something on a small displacement engine, like a 4 ****** or something.
All that being said, they are only claiming a small hp gain.
Another issue is, Will your engine management computer be able to flow more through the injectors, to compensate for the greater air flow? If there is a max flow rate in software, then it don't matter how much air you pump in, it will just go lean. Thats what I like about having a mass air flow sensor, it will sense the increased air flow and adjust fuel flow accordingly. (Up to the limit in software, after that point you would benefit from a performance chip, with higher flow rate parameters)
It's not the same kind of fan that you find in a leaf blower.
Thats a good thing!
Even if it couldn't give boost at 850 cfm it might flow 850 cfm, could it give more air without boost over 14.7 psi? Could it improve flow without boosting?
If you somehow adapted that stuff, and had enough CFM at redline, but no gain in boost, then there is no net gain. Its just along for the ride. It must apply pressure of some sort, to be of any value. Maybe you end up with 1psi from 4000rpm up to redline, but 5 psi up to 4000rpm. That would give you a funny torque curve, but may be useful. But instead of thinking that way, why not aim for say 5psi at all rpms, and don't even think about anything less?
I just want to know why it couldn't give a handful of hp more than without it.
You need to get the technical data sheet from whoever makes that device, and see how many inches of mercury it moves, and at what CFM.
People buy smooth tubes for a very small gain in flow. People buy K&N air filters for a very small gain in flow.
I wouldn't put one of these on my lawnmower let alone my Viper. I know it's a misrepresentation. I just want to know if their actual claims are necessarily false.
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
I think if you strap Monica Lewinski to the front of your Viper, you may notice some gains, but if not, look at the fun you'll have!
