890 rwhp/840 rwtq ( LETHAL 750 + Heffner SCi )

[Jason Heffner]

I think one of the most interesting pieces of paper to post would be the reciepts from the tuners, like a who got hit the hardest thread. One of the best things about Mash's car is the fact that the supercharger package was done in under a month for around 15K. Those are numbers that I don't think many of you can beat. This thread started out with a guy who was happy with his car and all you guys can do is try to stroke your own egos and try to convince yourselves that yours is better than his is. I'm sure that if I didn't have a dozen car in the shop now and all I had to do was work on Gary's car and take it to the track we may have run a better number that what we have but I think that 10.20 @ over 140 on pump gas is respectable to say the least. I wish I had more time to play with you guys but with a new baby in the house and customers to please it doesn't leave me with much time for the internet right now. I'll see you kids later, meanwhile try not to kill each other.

 

[Dr Roof]

I always SHow up on Race Day! Let's just have some more drag racing and have all the Supercharger Guys run until the 9 second pass happens!

It wasn't too long ago that the nitrous guys were having the same discusions. We have to take the cars to the track!

 

[Larry Macedo]

WOW, the last few S/Cer posts here have really become ridiculous. What's really funny is the BS that should be moderated isn't and the BS that shouldn't be moderated is...I wonder what newbies think when they come here and read this garbage? People can no longer have their day in the sun w/o someone talking trash or rehashing worthless old history. Can't we all be happy for someome that owns a S/C Viper making 700rwhp to 1000rwhp? What really matters is the person spending their hard earned money is happy with the end result.

Jason, Congrats on the new baby, man!

 

[1TONY1]

they DO NOT have to get an ego boost by BRAGGING about it on this board. LIKE I SAID BEFORE .......THEY "WILL" BE RUNNING 8 SECONDS THIS YEAR

They don't have to. You are doing a fine job for them. 8 months left and counting.

 

[Dr Roof]

At the end of the Day the SUpercharger route is the way to go! I would say especially on the street. The supercharged car will outperform nitrous! On the track we have a ways to go!

I love all supercharged Cars.

Heffner's
Levin
Roe

I can't wait until we all meet up!

 

[Paolo Castellano]

Jason, good point and one that has definitely been overlooked.

I have one other observation that I feel has been missed thus far:

For all you ********* drag racers, here is something to consider==> The Viper was NEVER designed to be a drag car. It was designed to be a road race/grand tourer. Because of all the torque, it happens to make a very good factory 1/4 miler compared to other sports cars. Any independent rear car is not a good candidate for a drag car.

I agree with David in that a supercharger is the way to go for the street over other potential applications. We can bring up the old 8-9 second Mustang argument for the guys who want to go that fast at the strip. For the price of putting the powerglide tranny in the Viper, you could almost go 8's in a Mustang. None of the supercharger guys are telling the drag guys they are nuts for buying an 80K car to do 12's and then spending relatively large $$$$$$ to go 9's or 8's. I think the drag guys should consider this flip side before they point the finger at the supercharger guys.==> In the end we all should be free to go the route we want to go to be happy without being harassed. Peace.

 

[treynor]

> One of the best things about Mash's car is the fact that
> the supercharger package was done in under a month for
> around 15K. Those are numbers that I don't think many of
> you can beat.

One supercharger package: $15,000
One APEX Lethal 750 package: $38,700
One dyno pull and scanned brag sheet: $75
The ability to talk smack on the 'net for months: Priceless

 

[Paolo Castellano]

Paulo - maybe you could make a tshirt and send it to your SC brothers:

"Top 10 Reasons My SC Got Spanked at the Track"
1. SW was not driving.
2. Its too hot where DLM's shop is.
3. Its too cold where Hefners shop is.
4. Drag race? Forget that, let's just compare dyno sheets.
5. I didnt lose - I just kept going and you slowed down - we were racing the MILE not the 1/4 mile.
6. I dont have any race gas in my auxillary fuel cell.
7. My (insert your name here SC owners to be) car is not done yet, but when it is, then look out man!
8. I was only running 2 psi, but if i go home and put on my thimble sized pulley then I can run 30 psi and then watch out!
9. All that chrome looks cool in the parking lot, but it slows me down on the track.
10. I could not find the boost control in my cockpit.....

JPH....... one more thing, I would like to see your top ten list of what drove you to trash your demigod Viper tuner reputation that had become a household name all over the world. We're talking about someone whose work graced many a cover of Motor Trend etc... to where you are now......BANNED from the Viper board to the point where nobody can even mention your name in a post. Think of it H*******y, Hmmm... So sad.

.....What would be even more interesting would be the top ten list of how you can make it up to all to whom you have done wrong...... I think everybody would love to see that one. Well John, give it your best shot! I guess we'll see just how good you are, or, should I say....... were!

 

[Paolo Castellano]

Whatever Pablo. You miss my point all together as you and others are more concerned about trying to stroke your own egos.

John Kent, I mean John H*******y, in case you need glasses or have that little attention to detail, it is PaOlo. It seems you completely missed my most recent reply to you about top ten lists that myself and all in the Viper community would really like to see from you. ==> Instead of answering the question, you have to go and make fun of my name...... Like I said before, I think it is time for you to add yet another name change to your glorious list of alter screen name pool. And remember, what Bill Murray said in the movie, What About Bob: "Roses are red, violets are blue, I am a schizophrenic, and so am I"!

Hit the road John. Go to another board where you can stroke your own ego using your real name!

 

[THEMASH]

One APEX Lethal 750 package: $38,700
One dyno pull and scanned brag sheet: $75
The ability to talk smack on the 'net for months: Priceless

I paid no where near that price ($38,700). that price includes the mopar heads (3500) which i dont have and at the time, mopar stopped making them. exhaust and headers (3000-3500), which i already had. (computer + injectors + carbon intake + radiator + hoses + shifter + half shafts + and many other parts that i either did not want or already had. ( prices are not exact)

in the end, i paid a lot less then you did Ben.
Shipping your car back and forth to FL every time it breaks down is going to cost you more in the end then my whole kit did , J/K

The dyno was free

As for smack talking, show we where i talked smack. the only part of what i said that you might perceive is smack is when i said "Heffner has the 2 most powerful SC only cars", which is true since at that time Roof did not have his dyno sheet out yet and you my friend ran on 103 race gas, and i was talking ( ON PUMP GAS ONLY, NO NOS )

Its really sad, when you and roof posted your first dyno numbers, i was happy for all of you, i honestly was. i never posted anything other then my congrats, and many of the times i just admired the work done and went to another thread. i wish you could do the same.

 

[GaryA]

> One of the best things about Mash's car is the fact that
> the supercharger package was done in under a month for
> around 15K. Those are numbers that I don't think many of
> you can beat.

One supercharger package: $15,000
One APEX Lethal 750 package: $38,700
One dyno pull and scanned brag sheet: $75
The ability to talk smack on the 'net for months: Priceless

Ben,

Care to divulge how much you spent to make 25 HP more than mine? I'm guessing you paid about 4 times what I did.

 

[SMCBUILDERSINC]

I think im tired of seeing this word writen like this,"John H*******y." I think you meant to say was "John [******]."

There ive done it.

John [******]
John [******]
John [******]
John [******]

Strike me down.......

 

[ronviper]

I see all the braging about the horsepower numbers but no has yet tapped the potential. Numbers are great but results are even better, in most cases people are more impressed with stock Vipers running low to mid eleven's. Albert has already challenged you guys to put up the numbers, so far Nos cars are kicking your butts with less horsepower.

 

[Gerald]

Pardon me if I'm wrong here, but peak numbers are a different ball game. Peak numbers are good bragging rights. If I'm not mistaken I think Roofs car has 150 RWTQ (!!!!) more than your car at 3,500 RPMS. Peak HP and HP delivered in the RPM range are two different ball games. Two different motors and packages built entirely different and tuned entirely different. I'm not comparing, just stating what I see. Please no flames. I'm sure Bens is even stronger than Roof's.. How can you compare? HP delivered for a split second at RedLine and HP delivered THROUGHOUT the entire band are two different animals. So if one person wants to brag about peak HP and the other person wants to brag about consistent HP thru the entire band, then they are bragging about two different things..


Gerald

 

[Viperzilla]

One dyno pull and scanned brag sheet: $75

I don't mean to flame you here, Ben, but just for more info. Jason charges ~$40 for 3 dyno pulls on dyno days. I'm not sure what he would charge for just one person coming to his shop and wanting 3 pulls though on any given day.

 

[treynor]

Good lord, people are getting mighty touchy. I was trying to inject a little humor into this thread.

Mash, I'm glad to hear you got a "lethal 750" for far less than the published retail price. Realize, of course, that whether you already HAD the parts or bought them as part of one of the packages, you still paid for them. If you care to quote numbers, I'm quite curious (honestly!) to hear how much the whole thing came to.

Gary, I'm sure Doug would quote you a price for a level like Roof's if you're truly interested. I can't separate out how much the SC-only level of performance would have cost on my car because I didn't build it for that performance level -- remember, on spray mine makes 996 RWHP and 975 RWTQ. Also, as you may or may not know, my car wasn't running when I shipped it to Doug - I was one of the unfortunate few nailed by the faulty '01 water pumps, and my engine was a basket case (cracked head, bad main bearings, damaged cam, etc.) when I decided to have Doug redo it. I'm certainly curious to hear how much you ended up spending for your stroker motor + SC setup.

 

[RedSnakeGTS]

"mine makes 996 RWHP and 975RWTQ"

i thought you dumped the nitrous.....

 

[treynor]

> I don't mean to flame you here, Ben, but just for more
> info. Jason charges ~$40 for 3 dyno pulls on dyno days.

You east-coasters sure have it good! Our here, Apex charges $100 for 3 pulls, and the other local dyno (Mustang Ranch) charges $75. Maybe I can get Jason to open up a NorCal shop?

 

[treynor]

> i thought you dumped the nitrous.....

That was back when it was making more than that on SC alone. I'm undecided as to whether I want it back on for the moment -- if I run 9's and I still have the system in place, people may question whether I was spraying at the time. If it's completely removed, that avoid the question.

 

[BlueGTS]

I hope everyone realizes that the HP difference between the #1 SCed car and the #4 SCed car is only ~5%. To argue over such a small amount of peak HP is truly crazy. I will bet if all 4 cars were at the same dyno on the same day, 2 of the 4 rankings would change position as each dyno registers slightly different numbers. On the same token each of those 4 cars at the track with SW driving would turn near identical times. I understand the desire to be #1 but to be honest these 800+rwhp pump gas cars are much more similar than they are different. I think you guys are starting to split hairs. With that said, I enjoy reading about it.


As for John Kent... Lets see Clark Kent is Superman... So John H is making some egotistical Superman reference. Man that is that childish.

 

[HP]

At that level, it all come down to driving, and traction.
Speaking of traction, what is the largest imprint slick that can fit in the
fender well.

 

[Larry Macedo]

At that level, it all come down to driving, and traction.
Speaking of traction, what is the largest imprint slick that can fit in the
fender well.

HP, Contact John Purner @ Complete Custom Wheel (888)577-0144 and get the info on using the Hoosier's or contact Tony (1Tony1) Armour. I think he's using these tires as well.

 

[treynor]

> I hope everyone realizes that the HP difference between
> the #1 SCed car and the #4 SCed car is only ~5%

Aaron, you're correct, the practical value of the power differences involved is vanishingly small. As is so common in a "us vs them" debate, logic has taken a back seat to emotion in this thread.

(so shut the [******] up )

 

[Viperzilla]

You east-coasters sure have it good! Our here, Apex charges $100 for 3 pulls, and the other local dyno (Mustang Ranch) charges $75. Maybe I can get Jason to open up a NorCal shop?

Not sure how north in CA you are. Back in MD, it was as cold as Columbus, OH in winter, and hotter than Pheonix in summer. They get temps in the mid-high 90s, with 80%+ humidity.
Maybe you should just move away from rice country, this way we can keep the fastest Vipers on the East and midwest, so I can see them all. The prices I quoted for dyno days are for VCA dyno days, so there's no confusion.

 

[THEMASH]

I'm quite curious (honestly!) to hear how much the whole thing came to.

I'm certainly curious to hear how much you ended up spending for your stroker motor + SC setup.

Dont worry soo much about how much i paid. its only money right. i am not the one drag racing a $120,000 benz.
Why don’t you let us in on how much you paid? And how many times ur car had to be shipping back and forth?
I spoke to Doug a few times, and the price he quoted me (for SCi plus top end, which i think is a stage 2) was more then what i paid for both the SCi and stroker (mind you, i got a good deal on both), so i am pretty sure your kit still costs a lot more then mine. like i said, your shipping costs in the end will exceed my setup (stroker + SCi) cost.
It seems like your trying really hard to feel better about how much money you ended up spending on your viper. Knowing how much i paid still won’t make you feel better, since its less then what you paid. I am sorry if you feel really dumb for spending all the money you did and your still not happy (being #1). Maybe you should have sent your car to Jason.
Just be happy with what you have, many guys here would love to have your viper and those bling bling wheels

 

[treynor]

> Dont worry soo much about how much i paid. its only money
> right. i am not the one drag racing a $120,000 benz.
> Why don’t you let us in on how much you paid? [...]
> It seems like your trying really hard to feel better
> about how much money you ended up spending on your viper.

Well this is a new all-time low - the combination of a really asinine statement ("I won't tell you how much I paid, but you tell me how much you paid") combined with a personal attack. Mash, I'll write this off as atypical behavior on your part due to the charged environment on this thread.

I'm finished with this thread.

 

[Tom Welch]

LOL,

Reminds me of the Eddie Murphy joke using the cast of the Honeymooners...."Norton ole pal, you know that I know that you know that I know that you want to (four letter explicitive starting with f and ending with k) me!" ROFLMMFAO..............

Amazing......BTW, Mash, nice numbers! You guys need to try and get along!

Tom

 

[THEMASH]

Your the one who is doing all the attacking, not me. i just posted my dyno sheet. Show me once where you posted your dyno sheet or anything else and i got on saying anything similar to what you are saying.
I never said I wont tell you, ….If you ask someone how much they spent on something, you should at least be willing to tell them how much you spent also, if YOU are not willing to let ppl know, then dont ask the same question, that was my point. Do you honestly think i really care what you spent?
I must have missed the personal attack, i don’t see where i did that

 

[THEMASH]

Thanks Tom,
I am getting along with everyone fine. i don’t think its nice to ask someone how much they paid for this or that, especially when your not willing to give out the same info. I just turned his question back at him. Because I know for a fact that however much I paid, he paid more, and for some reason that became the top issue instead of horsepower, which is what this thread is about.
This post was mainly to say how much power these 2 fine tuners combined made, and that I am happy with it. Nothing else.

 

[MaxedGTS]

[/QUOTE]

Dont worry soo much about how much i paid. its only money right. i am not the one drag racing a $120,000 benz.
Why don’t you let us in on how much you paid? And how many times ur car had to be shipping back and forth?
I spoke to Doug a few times, and the price he quoted me (for SCi plus top end, which i think is a stage 2) was more then what i paid for both the SCi and stroker (mind you, i got a good deal on both), so i am pretty sure your kit still costs a lot more then mine. like i said, your shipping costs in the end will exceed my setup (stroker + SCi) cost.
It seems like your trying really hard to feel better about how much money you ended up spending on your viper. Knowing how much i paid still won’t make you feel better, since its less then what you paid. I am sorry if you feel really dumb for spending all the money you did and your still not happy (being #1). Maybe you should have sent your car to Jason.
Just be happy with what you have, many guys here would love to have your viper and those bling bling wheels


[/QUOTE]Mash, i think Jason did a good job on your car. i also thought you were a gentleman.

after that comment I now confirm you are an [*****]!

Max