anyone powershifting?

[BlackOutBoxing]

I want to powershift my viper like i used to with my older muscle cars. When i say powershift i mean shifting using the clutch but not lifing off the gas. Its easy at low rpm but i want to do it at peak rpm. 2nd to 3rd is the main problem. i had numrerous gen 1s and 2s. I had one gen3. I went right back to a gen 2 for numerous reasons but i never missed a gear in the gen3. Is it better to work my gen2 trans besides the shifter cause the ones i tried ****. Internaly work the trans or is it just beter to use a gen 3 trans in my gen 2? Any info would be great thanks. And yes i had aftermarket clutches as well. Specs they were.

 

[Allan]

Wow dude, you got BALLS. I like to drive hard, but wow....really, what do you gain from doing that anyway?....in any car?

 

[APGTS]

hmm i always thought the gen2s, gen3s had the same t56s and the gen4s had the tr6060s

 

[Allan]

Yeah, I think gen 2 and 3 are the same tranny. it's just that each car is a different kind of ****...

 

[BlackOutBoxing]

What do you gain from powershifting? Speed! On the dragstrip you can gain 4 10ths of a second! That's alot. Almost 1/2 a second. In any race it's a big advantage.

 

[SlayerLS1]

Ranger does not powershift, so I'm guessing there is little benefit to it. Why not work on shifting faster instead?

 

[Allan]

Wow,.......go ahead and "power shift" your Viper I guess.......let us know how that works out......not trying to be a wise-a$$....just don't see how it's worth the risk

 

[2BADD-4U]

Wow,.......go ahead and "power shift" your Viper I guess.......let us know how that works out......not trying to be a wise-a$$....just don't see how it's worth the risk

Allan, I have to agree with you 100%....it might get you a few tenths of a second...but could end up costing tens of thousands....IMHO

Dave

God Bless!

 

[prpaster]

I have yet to try to power shift I would think the ass end would get loose quick

 

[BlackOutBoxing]

Anyone who drag races knows powershifting is a big plus. Your never coming offf the gas! If your getting traction its the difference in a 10th each shift. So if you turn 11.3 the difference can be breaking a 10.9! Thats a bigger difference than putting a $1200.00 cat back on your car. No risk. I have warranty anywayif u miss u just miss. Its not missing anyway. It just doesnt go in smooth from 2nd to 3rd and it did in the den 3 trans. Ill just swa trans and see if it works.

 

[F8L SNK]

Not done properly you are correct. I will say that done properly it is more than worth it. I have heard Ranger mentioned, he drives a Vette not a Viper and their is a difference. Don't believe me? Check into Evan Smith, ask him is he powershifts. It depends on the car, the tires and the track conditions. I actually thought that Ranger DID power shift 2-3 or 3-4th. Again, it is really irrelevant because the track, car, conditions and driver vary.

Allan, I have to agree with you 100%....it might get you a few tenths of a second...but could end up costing tens of thousands....IMHO

Dave

God Bless!

 

[BlackOutBoxing]

10s of thousands? A gen 2 trans cost $1200.00 on ebay

 

[F8L SNK]

lol, you are correct, a Gen IV costs $3,500 new. I think he was referring to a mechanical over rev situation if you got it wrong. That WOULD be 10's of thousands of dollars.

10s of thousands? A gen 2 trans cost $1200.00 on ebay

 

[TowDawg]

I can shift pretty quick and have powershifted plenty of cars at the strip growing up, but the Viper shift action isn't near as quick as other cars. I've got a MGW shifter and short shift handle, and I still move through the gears like some other cars. For some reason, the Viper version of the T56 is clunky instead of smooth. Not mention, I'm not sure if a lot of Vipers would hold the tires on the 2-3 shift (forget 1-2). I guess it depends on the conditions.

 

[2BADD-4U]

BOB, Yep, I have discussed this problem numerous times.....2nd to 3rd shift under power.......power shifting or not.....at redline it did the same thing on my 2002 FE

the engine torque causes trannyflex thru out the engine/trans mounts and causes you to miss 3rd big time.....the shift handle can (flex)move up to 2 inches or more..

next time you are in 2nd and hammer it....carefully eyeball the shift handle ball to a reference on the dash, now wind her up and watch the flex to the right...you will then see what i mean

I wonder if installing better engine/tranny mounts like woodhouses will help here.

the 2 to 3 shift ends up getting caught between gears even there is no gate...i have seen this a lot



Best of Luck

Dave

God Bless!

 

[BlackOutBoxing]

Warranty and new cars shouldnt over rev. They hav fuel cut offs. If u go out and push the clutch and floor your viper it shoukdnt blow up! But hey dont try it just in case

 

[APGTS]

idk before my viper i used to have a built & supercharged z06 that i would put threw the paces and have a reallllll good time in regularly. . . Just cant bring myself to beat my viper the way i did my vette . . .

 

[F8L SNK]

Notice I said mechanical over rev, you miss fourth and go into 2nd do you think a fuel cut off will prevent damage Nope, it is gone just the same and good luck on warranty. I am in agreement that this is possible, t56, tr6060 stock shift aftermarket shifter what ever. Whether it is better will depend on track conditions, tires, etc.... as stated before. go out and practice and if you could do it before with other cars you CAN do it with a Viper.

 

[BlackOutBoxing]

K thanks at least we are on the same page. Ill try that when i get my car back from the shop. I blew the trans j/k im getting some work dun heads and goodies. When its dun il try it out. But im starting to think your right about the woodhouse mounts. Under load its torqueing too much? The mounts might be the answer thanx. As far as hooking up. It drag radials. Low pressure.

 

[F8L SNK]

Trans and Engine mounts made the WORLD of difference for me. Good luck with the ride and let us know the results!

 

[BlackOutBoxing]

ill try it after i get the trans mounts. 4th to 2nd ugh. That would hurt. Ive drag raced since i was 17 that never happened yet! Dont jynx me

 

[Allan]

dude, we're not trying to dog on you all ugly, this is a forum so we can bounce ideas, and help each other not have un-necessary bad experiences. I don't drag race, so I don't get it. I'm into driving the car hard, but smooth. (36,000 miles, original clutch -still solid as a rock...many sets of tires and brakes though) I'm curious to see the results of your "power shifting"--all joking aside. please post results.

 

[Ray W]

Move your seat or pedals so that your knee is not fully extended when you push in the clutch. This will keep your body from moving from side to side. Next on the 2-3 shift the spring in the shifter keeps it lined up to go right into 3rd. The trick is to trust it by not grabbing the shift knob with your fingers but use just the palm of your hand. When the car is off practice the 2-3 you will see the way the shifter just jumps in line with the third gear slot. Also notice that if you stretch to push in the clutch your body moves to right and makes you push the shifter over into 5th.

 

[BlackOutBoxing]

no worries your not dogging me. I owned 12 vipers. I dragged race them all. I raced muuscle cars with my Dad growing up. Take 2 cars that are evenly matched and drag race them. Power shift one and not the other. The powershifting car will win every time. Fyi i put 54000 on a brand new 1994 rt, i put 44000 on a 1999, i put 36000 on a different 1999. If you powershift correctly and it engages properlyi it is smooth. I drive my cars. And i rrace them too

 

[BlackOutBoxing]

thanks ray. My viper tech gave me tge same advice. Maybe all this alighnment stuff was different in the gen3? I houghtthe trans was different. I was told it can handle more power so somthimg must be better in it?

 

[StoleIt2x]

It's a T56...you can powershift. I did it in my 4th Gen Camaro (T56) and C6 Z06 (T56).

Can you hurt the car? Potentially yes. But you can also hurt the car just from accelerating from a red light if you ride the hell out of the clutch.

That being said, I haven't tried it in this car and don't plan on it (since I'm not drag racing). Just practice and make sure you can afford to screw up.

 

[Paul Hawker]

Don't think the syncros can react fast enough to power shift. Gonna need to use some arm power to get the gears to mesh, and it will not be smooth, and probably not reliable.

Maybe in Gen IV, which has beefed up syncro system, but better to lift at least 1/2 throttle to smooth things out, and dampen the shock a bit.

 

[evomind]

blackout, if you have owned 12 vipers how is it until now that you are asking about powershifting?
yes, its a drag racing technique, ive used it myself, but the "problem" you will run into is that even on a stock gen 2 there is enough torque to lift off throttle a bit to shift. if not, you will just spin going into second. you might even break traction going into 3rd. that defeats the purpose. powershifting was more in vogue in the past when cars didnt have the power and torque they do now. maybe some cars dropped too many rpms shifting into the next gear. dont know.
not sure if the rev limiter reacts fast enough to limit revs in a powershift situation.
let me know.

 

[Wezbad1]

a powershift huh.. hope you upgraded your halfshafts. Please try to get this on video, might be entertaining to watch.

 

[EllowViper]

Having just been elbows deep into my T56, the synchros are pretty stout, but the distance they have to slide to fully engage the gear is quite a bit (thus the long throw on the shifter and the notchyness you feel..shifting normally..as the synchros hit their detents between gears). BUT, the springs and retainers on the synchros are pretty crappy thus the reason billet upgrades and better forks are an option. As far as shifting goes, there is a mechanical shift gate just forward of the shifter mount (if you ever take that little cover off you can see it) which requires a deliberate notch in shifting btwn 2/3 gear. Some aftermarket shifters are designed or engineered to match their movements with the T56 shift gate which helps considerably when banging gears. So as far as hanging up btwn 2/3rd, yes...it is a mechanical challenge with how the shift rails and their corresponding gates are designed.