Can someone explain why I made more power?

[dragon rider]

I'm not complaining, but today I went to the dyno today with some GA club members and made 11 more rwhp and and 4 more rwt. Now I make 490 and 525. This is the same dyno that I use all of the time for consistency. The only mods since my last trip to the dyno are changing from 10 spoke to the light weight 6 spoke, Eurotech rotors and Woodhouse motor and tranny mounts. It was also 20 degrees cooler the last time I dynoed. Does a tune take a certain amount of miles to reach its full potential? The old motor mounts were broken the last time on the dyno, will that effect hp? Does a reduction in rotational was gain hp?

 

[IEATVETS]

I am by no means an expert but I believe that air temperature and humidity have some effect on your numbers. I am sure those in the know will chime in.

 

[dragon rider]

Thanks IEATVETS. My post is a little confusing about the temp. It was 70 deg today 50 deg the time before. I made more power in worse weather. Oh yea, these numbers are sae correct so it supposed to keep things consistent.

 

[SweetRed04]

It is likely you used an inertia type dyno (one that doesn't generate or dissipate power) - the ones with that accelerate a large roller.

Then your lighter wheels will show up as higher HP as well as the lower temperature, which puts more oxygen per cfm of air ingested into your engine....

That could easily change your power readings the amount you saw between runs.

 

[Twister]

also keep this in mind...

i have dynoed 5 differant vehicle over the past 6 years and I dyno EVRYTHING I do..

id take a wild guess and say I probally have well over 100 dyno pulls..maybe more like 150.

All on the same dyno jet as well..


THESE VIPER ENGINES ARE HUGE 8.0-8.4 BEASTE!!!!


WITH THAT SAID THE KOOLER OR HOTTER THE ENGINE IS BEFORE YOU DYNO MAKES HUGE DIFFERANCES...

sURE MY LIL NSX OR CAMARO OR VETTE WITH THEIR BABY SIZE 3.0-5.7 LITER ENGINES WOULD LOOSE SOME hp ON A HOT ENGINE DYNO VERSES KOOL ENGINE DYNO..bUT YOUR TALKING 10-15 RWHP..

Example..A warm engined stock LS1 vette will dyno 285 rwhp...but lrt her sdit for 30-45 minutes and she will hit 300 rwhp on that kooler engine...

the Viper with it's larger engine is in a totally differant league..Your talking 20-30 rwhp on a kool verses warm engine...

I hit 437 rwhp on a semi warm engine in my srt10..let her kool down for just half an hour and pulled the 459 number...22 rwhp more..And she could have defiently been kooler..


im takeing a wild guess here that you pulled up with your viper friends and had the car parked for a while and then watched a few pulls and then only turned your car on after that extensive kool down to drive onto the dyno......


Vette guys do this at the track all the time and even go as far as pushing their car to the stageing lanes to get that engine cold..Us Viper guys prefer real results that can be duplicated...

What ever the reason Im gonna update you on the bolt on srt10 list..CONGRATS

 

[Twister]

made a couple of revisions as of 17Apr2010

1
NAME-Dipapa
YEAR-2005
RWHP/RWT-521/538
TYPE DYNO-Dyno Dynamics
MODICICATIONS-KN intake...headers...no cats...VEC3 tune...67mm throttle body

2
NAME-Copperhead245 "Ron R"
YEAR-2005
RWHP/RWT-508/522
TYPE DYNO-mustang
MODICICATIONS-Kn filters...x metal throttle body...autolite XP985 spark plugs...daves Big brakes under drive pulley...corsa exhaust...SCT tune

3
NAME-Gonabite
YEAR-2006
RWHP/RWT-499/550
TYPE DYNO-???
MODICICATIONS-American raceing headers...high flow cats...B&B exhaust...SCT tune

4
NAME-Dragon rider
YEAR-2003
RWHP/RWT-490/525
TYPE DYNO-???
MODICICATIONS-corsa exhaust...high flow cats...KN intake...sct tune

*CONGRATS DRAGON RIDER..YOU WENTH FROM 9TH TO 4TH!!!*

5
NAME-Reggie
YEAR-???
RWHP/RWT-490/523
TYPE DYNO-Dyno jet
MODICICATIONS-KN filters...headers...exhaust...VEC3 tune

6
NAME-Nader
YEAR-2004
RWHP/RWT-482/511
TYPE DYNO-Mustang
MODICICATIONS-corsa exhaust...single blade throttle body...KN filters...DC tune

7
NAME-Viper Specialty
YEAR-2004
RWHP/RWT-480/520
TYPE DYNO-???
MODICICATIONS-corsa exhaust...high flow cats...Vec2 tune...RC1DECC spark plugs

8
NAME-Yelloh
YEAR-2005
RWHP/RWT-479/528
TYPE DYNO-???
MODICICATIONS-Bellanger headers...high flow cats...SCT tune

9
NAME-GripforceSRT10
YEAR-2005
RWHP/RWT-475/???
TYPE DYNO-???
MODICICATIONS-corsa exhaust...high flow cats...findanza light weight fly wheel...170 degree thermostat...DC tune

10
NAME-Mark Guolinos
YEAR-2006
RWHP/RWT-472/479
TYPE DYNO-Super flow
MODICICATIONS-American raceing headers...high flow cats...corsa exhaust...SCT tune

11
NAME-B767Driver
YEAR-2006
RWHP/RWT-470/477
TYPE DYNO-???
MODICICATIONS-Bellanger headers...KN intake...no cats...cat back exhaust

12
NAME-Pteam
YEAR-2005
RWHP/RWT-460/497
TYPE DYNO-Dyno jet
MODICICATIONS-KN intake...corsa exhaust

13
NAME-Ibstone
YEAR-2005
RWHP/RWT-460/470
TYPE DYNO-Superflow
MODICICATIONS-Bellanger headers...high flow cats...cat back exhaust...3.73 gears...SCT tune

14
NAME-Twister
YEAR-2003
RWHP/RWT-459/497
TYPE DYNO-Dyno jet
MODICICATIONS-KN intake...roller rockers

 

[dragon rider]

It is likely you used an inertia type dyno (one that doesn't generate or dissipate power) - the ones with that accelerate a large roller.

Then your lighter wheels will show up as higher HP as well as the lower temperature, which puts more oxygen per cfm of air ingested into your engine....

That could easily change your power readings the amount you saw between runs.

Thank Sweet red. It is a dyno jet style dyno. I'm not sure if that is an inertia type dyno. As stated the weather was warmer with the higher #'s.

 

[dragon rider]

"im takeing a wild guess here that you pulled up with your viper friends and had the car parked for a while and then watched a few pulls and then only turned your car on after that extensive kool down to drive onto the dyno......"

Twister. You could be on to something, the car did sit a while before I ran it. My butt o meter feels like the car is much quicker with the lighter wheels, rotors and motor mounts. The true test is the track, but it getting hot in the south time is running out.

 

[1BADGTS]

Rider SO MANY FACTORS influence CHASIS dyno numbers from time to time (engine operating temp,tie down tension,amount of oil in crankcase ,correction factor selection, temp probe location ).So many on these forums look at the numbers like they are true gospal instead they are simply tuning tools .

 

[PacificSEASnake]

WA club had our dyno day yesterday. It was on a 2-wheel Mustang dyno. WAAAAYY different numbers than last year on same dyno. (though I WILL take 'em)

Last year: 457 HP, 484 TQ

This year: 498 HP, 531 TQ

Sorry, printout is too faint to post results.

Can a virtually stock Viper really put this much down? The only mod I have is K&N filters. I haven't even replaced the spark plugs (which I am about to - or maybe not with these numbers)

 

[dragon rider]

1Bad I'm sure you ar right. I didn't know if lighter wheel and rotors would make a difference. I need to go the track to see if my times are better. Hopefully go 11.2's on PS2's.

Reidesign, your #'s on a mustang dyno are great. We need to start a thread on how to explain your big gains. Was everyone elses #'s consistent?

 

[Twister]

WA club had our dyno day yesterday. It was on a 2-wheel Mustang dyno. WAAAAYY different numbers than last year on same dyno. (though I WILL take 'em)

Last year: 457 HP, 484 TQ

This year: 498 HP, 531 TQ

Sorry, printout is too faint to post results.

Can a virtually stock Viper really put this much down? The only mod I have is K&N filters. I haven't even replaced the spark plugs (which I am about to - or maybe not with these numbers)

Prety good numbers for a mustang dyno ....But the 498 rwhp with just a intake..No way...

maybe your car was an arrow rebuild?????

Arrow rebuilt mine and added arrow roller rockers....For a price$$$..

 

[1BADGTS]

1Bad I'm sure you ar right. I didn't know if lighter wheel and rotors would make a difference. I need to go the track to see if my times are better. Hopefully go 11.2's on PS2's.

Reidesign, your #'s on a mustang dyno are great. We need to start a thread on how to explain your big gains. Was everyone elses #'s consistent?

I dont know know about the light weight wheels BUT there are MANY TRICKS a dyno operator can use to GREATLY INCREASE the numbers a dyno spits out(loosening the hold down straps for one jumps the number ).One guy actually put the temp indicator senser probe next to a WARM LIGHT so the ambient temp was over 100 degrees and the dyno corrected up ..Even straight up the numbers really dont measure true on track performance .A buddy of mine (on the same dyno that i used )made 35 to the tire more than i did .We put the same pro driver in both car the same day at Englishtown and after muliple runs i was over .5 tenths faster (5 mph trap speed )BUT the dyno indicated he made more HP

 

[dragon rider]

Yea I know that people do cheat to make #'s better, but this guy has dynoed the car five times now and everything has been consistent. I've known him a long time, he know that I am only interested in real #'s. My car made 497 & 530 tq, on a diff. dyno, but I threw those #'s out because I never used that dyno before, and the real temp outside was about fifty, but the SAE adjusted readings said 84 degrees. If it is making those #'s I should pick up a tenth and a mile per hour in the 1/4 mile.

 

[PacificSEASnake]

1Bad I'm sure you ar right. I didn't know if lighter wheel and rotors would make a difference. I need to go the track to see if my times are better. Hopefully go 11.2's on PS2's.

Reidesign, your #'s on a mustang dyno are great. We need to start a thread on how to explain your big gains. Was everyone elses #'s consistent?

A couple Gen 2's posted 20 hp gains with no mods vs. last year, not close to my 41 hp gain, but still seemed odd.

 

[PacificSEASnake]

Prety good numbers for a mustang dyno ....But the 498 rwhp with just a intake..No way...

maybe your car was an arrow rebuild?????

Arrow rebuilt mine and added arrow roller rockers....For a price$$$..

Yep, Arrow engine. Original owner blew up the first motor at 1500 miles.

 

[dragon rider]

Those arrow engines are the ticket. You luck out on that one.

 

[Twister]

Nine honestly didnt seem like anything special..It only hit 459 rwhp with the intake and roller rockers..Wich is about average..fadi's stock arrow rebuild only hit 437 rwhp..

So it just depends...

But the origional owner could have paid arrow for the roller rockers and CC cam.....good for 460 plus rwhp...Who knows???????????

 

[1BADGTS]

Yea I know that people do cheat to make #'s better, but this guy has dynoed the car five times now and everything has been consistent. I've known him a long time, he know that I am only interested in real #'s. My car made 497 & 530 tq, on a diff. dyno, but I threw those #'s out because I never used that dyno before, and the real temp outside was about fifty, but the SAE adjusted readings said 84 degrees. If it is making those #'s I should pick up a tenth and a mile per hour in the 1/4 mile.

Even without someone trying to inflate numbers- real life (on track PERF times) are way different than the numbers DYNOES they spit out.As i previously mentioned my buddy Joe S(VCA-NJ )and i both ran modded Gen 2 and dynoed at the same facility .I had a complete motor done (much larger CAM ) while he had a top end only YET the Dynojet said he was making 35 more to the tire both corrected.(I just dont think they are that accurate too many driveline issues involved .)According to the dyno he SHOULD have beat me by a few tenths instead i pulled him by close to .5 and 5 mph.=SAME DRIVER SAME DAY SAME TRACK.

 

[Twister]

While I agree with you to a certain extent..I can gurantee you that a srt10 with intake/exhaust/sct tune at 480 rwhp will be much faster at the same track on the same day with the same driver than a stock 440 rwhp srt10..

the stocker will run 12.0 at 119-121 mph while the 480 rwhp one will run 11.7 at 122-124 mph...

Dyno numbers do mean somthing..Id gather that you and your friend who dynoed 35 rwhp more than you both had wild setups..in this case it's not about the power but the way the power is made..

i beat my friends 700 rwhp supra in my 500 rwhp viper a month or so ago simply because the way my car makes power is superior

 

[1BADGTS]

While I agree with you to a certain extent..I can gurantee you that a srt10 with intake/exhaust/sct tune at 480 rwhp will be much faster at the same track on the same day with the same driver than a stock 440 rwhp srt10..

the stocker will run 12.0 at 119-121 mph while the 480 rwhp one will run 11.7 at 122-124 mph...

Dyno numbers do mean somthing..Id gather that you and your friend who dynoed 35 rwhp more than you both had wild setups..in this case it's not about the power but the way the power is made..

i beat my friends 700 rwhp supra in my 500 rwhp viper a month or so ago simply because the way my car makes power is superior **

However you want to TRY to interpet it the facts are the facts he on the same dyno corrected her made 35 more to the tire.(torque was about the same )all corrected.Evan ran BOTH cars the same day at the same track (numerious runs )and the race were not even close .So tell me what the numbers mean.

 

[Bandit3]

Whatever the cause of the higher numbers-- they sure are good. See ya soon, John

 

[dragon rider]

Whatever the cause of the higher numbers-- they sure are good. See ya soon, John

Hey what is going on John. Hope you can make the trip to Tenn this year.

Twister and 1Bad, both your points are correct. Dynos are primarily used a tool to tune and test performance gains on various mods. High hp on a dyno doesn't mean fast track times if the power under the curve *****. But there is a better correlation be hp and trap speed. I know I'll run quicker in the 1/4 with the lighter wheel and rotor set up, but I don't know how my trap speed will be affected. Can't wait to find out. It is suposed to rain this weekend in Ga. Maybe hit the track in a week or two.

 

[Twister]

Hey what is going on John. Hope you can make the trip to Tenn this year.

Twister and 1Bad, both your points are correct. Dynos are primarily used a tool to tune and test performance gains on various mods. High hp on a dyno doesn't mean fast track times if the power under the curve *****. But there is a better correlation be hp and trap speed. I know I'll run quicker in the 1/4 with the lighter wheel and rotor set up, but I don't know how my trap speed will be affected. Can't wait to find out. It is suposed to rain this weekend in Ga. Maybe hit the track in a week or two.

Keep it going....

With your new rim/roter set up Im sure you'll get that 11.2-3 at 124-125 mph your lusting...

Add a throttle body/underdrive pulley/light weight fly wheel/headers and get rid of those high flow cats for some straight pipes!!!!!!!!!!!

go back to the dyno and lay down 530 rwhp and ...

run the worlds first 10.9 in a bolt on gen3 srt10 on street tires!!


You can do it..Just a few more bolt ons and some good air is all you need

 

[dragon rider]

10.9 would be real hard to do Twister, but thanks for the vote of confiedence. Hey I'll be in Hawaii to visit my brother in law this summer. I'll have to look you up.

 

[SilveRT8]

I went on the same Dyno 3 times when my 08 was totally Stock.
First time in 45F dry temp I got 557 hp on 94 oct gas.
Second time at 65F humid temp on 91 oct gas I got only 514 hp. Went back a week later with good 94 oct and 62F and got 545 hp.
Later with H/F cats I got 547 hp, then I added the Mopar controller and got 563 hp. All on Dynojet, SAE corrected.
Your results may vary but....

 

[Twister]

10.9 would be real hard to do Twister, but thanks for the vote of confiedence. Hey I'll be in Hawaii to visit my brother in law this summer. I'll have to look you up.

Kool let me know..

Honestly your one of the few guys who seems to want to push the limits with bolt ons and i enjoy reading about that..

lots of people change heads and cam or add FI..but even though those are fast it dosent excite me as much as seeing what a car can do eihter stock or with just bolt ons..

Honestly Im hopeing for spot number 2 or 3 on the bolt on list when i dyno..No track on my island as of yet..Hopefully we will have one again someday..

 

[dragon rider]

I went on the same Dyno 3 times when my 08 was totally Stock.
First time in 45F dry temp I got 557 hp on 94 oct gas.
Second time at 65F humid temp on 91 oct gas I got only 514 hp. Went back a week later with good 94 oct and 62F and got 545 hp.
Later with H/F cats I got 547 hp, then I added the Mopar controller and got 563 hp. All on Dynojet, SAE corrected.
Your results may vary but....

I'm suprised the octain used change your results that much on a NA car. Those are some good numbers for a stock 08. Man I would love to have one of them. It's gotta be a blast to drive.

 

[dragon rider]

"Honestly your one of the few guys who seems to want to push the limits with bolt ons and i enjoy reading about that." Twister

There is a lot of potential in Gen III's, but it takes more seat time than the other Gens to make them perform. Bolt ons keeps everything simple. You can work on the car and drive the piss out of it without always wondering if it going to break.

 

[1BADGTS]

I'm suprised the octain used change your results that much on a NA car. Those are some good numbers for a stock 08. Man I would love to have one of them. It's gotta be a blast to drive.

Thats the entire problem =who knows if it was the octaine or did the dyno operator do something like strap the car down differently or run the car at a different operating temp .So many nuances can effect the numbers how can one really tell.