Car&Driver:ZR1 beats the Viper...again

[kdaviper]

If I were a betting man, I'd say that SRT is going to use the results from these mags to sell the optional aero kit for the new viper, which hasn't been tested by any mags so far.

 

[vancouver-gts]

The Gen IV ACR I believe has a drag coefficient of .382.

The Gen IV ACR has a big ***** spoiler, results a high coefficient number! The Gen V at LS, didn't have one.

 

[SSGViper]

Why would I be sad? I hope they are enjoying their vehicle, as I will be mine. I hope they are driving the hell out of it, as I plan to do with my car.

I guess I don't quite get your posturing, but whatever floats your boat.

You just don't understand or "get" the Viper heritage, do you?

 

[tbi]

Well.....

So far weve seen....

0-60 in 3.2
1/4 mile in 11.4
1/4 mile mph at 128.7
Laguana Secca at 1.35x

way I figure it is this new viper runs toe to toe with a 2008 acr on a track and is faster straightline with a 206 mph top speed.

All with a very nice exterior and the nicest interior Ive ever seen in an american sports car.

This cars a winner in my book. that said. a gen4 coupe with headers and tune is just as fast straight line and arguably equal exterior wise. probally just a second slower at LS.

I cant lie and say as a 3 time viper owner I think the gts is worth 140k. But man oh man at 99k the srt is one sweet deal and imho the hood looks nicer and its even lighter.

3.2 0-60 in a rear wheel drive car may be the fastest Ive ever seen from a magazine. Im honestly wondering if a 2.9 is possible.

So far it seems to get a lil faster in the quarter mile with each review

 

[Boxer12]

The Viper heritage is high HP on the positive side, and poor handling cars (understeer and oversteer) on the negative side...whereas the Vette has always appealed to the masses with lower price and easier driving. Cudos to the Vette for success in GT/LeMans racing scene as well. SRT needs to stay the course, and keep improving the car, with a higher performance track model (better tires and brake pads) available in the model run. Performance alone doesn't sell cars, however, as witnessed by the Gen IV ACR...although it dominated on the track, there are still unsold units out there and not that many were made to begin with. I think more wins for the GTS-R, esp LeMans, will sell more cars than track records in street or even ACR version. Just my 2c.

 

[bluestreak]

I think laguna lowered the Db limit to 90 for most of 2013 but dont know what they ran it at for this event. They are trying hard to get it shut down out there. Randy obviously didnt lift.

 

[HOLLYWOOD1]

I respect your thoughts here but I think the resistance to using boost is at the route of the problem. My car has more than 22,000 miles on it. It has been and continues to be bullet proof. It has been used for a few road course track days, standing mile events and daily driving. Are you saying that a manufacturer cannot produce this type of vehicle but I can? The flaw was thinking that 640 HP was enough. Many of us knew that 700 HP was needed based on our own personal experience. But, I still believe in SRT and its gear heads and as I said, I think they will step up to the challenge. A good crisis should not be wasted. Perhaps the two tests will wake up the dragon. The SRT engineers are the best in the business. I know that if they are allowed the budget to do so, they can fix the problem.

(

Too late to fix anything this year as production runs are already happening. There wont be any changes until 2014.

 

[tbi]

Nothing to change. a 13 non acr outperforms a 10 nonacr in every way. it has the 96 gts look so many wanted and an amazeing interior.

It beats the gtr and even 458 ect.

Zr1 is an amazeing performer but not special. srt could give us a 120k srt8 that ran 10s and did LS in the 1.33 range.

But at the end of the day it would still just be a charger.

The viper is now truly a exotic even amongst the lambo crowd. I ve got a lambo buddy who dropped 300k on his Italian whos more excited about getting a genv than most on this board.

The previous vipers didnt appeal to the masses like this one.

 

[REDSLED]

I think laguna lowered the Db limit to 90 for most of 2013 but dont know what they ran it at for this event. They are trying hard to get it shut down out there. Randy obviously didnt lift.

Not correct. SCRAMP (Sports Car Racing Association of the Monterey Peninsula) which actually runs Laguna Seca has more 90+ dbs days scheduled for 2013 than ever before. There are actually 105 dbs track days available for HPDE groups for 2013, which is a first in a number of years as previous 105 dbs days were reserved for SCCA Racing. Non dbs days are usually reserved for Grand Am/Rolex, ALMS, Historics and Rennsport. People mention brake fade, but although Laguna Seca is rough on brakes (especially turn 2) a few hot laps should not be an issue for the brakes. Like I mentioned before, I do not understand why they have 10 year old calipers (same as the 2003 SRT) on a newly designed car. A fantastic car nonetheless.

 

[SnakeBitten]

The Viper program under any of its owners has never had a proper budget. It's always been underfunded compared to its contemporaries. This is one reason why I've always liked these cars and the engineers that were able to make them perform on a world class level despite their hands being tied due to a small budget.

I really had hopes with Fiat. But when you see 10 yr old calipers, determination to stay with steel brakes "only", 10 yr old tweaked frame, no GDI etc you realize these guys are still not working with a comparable budget to the likes of the GTR etc. Ralph and SRT deserve credit for what they have done despite the apparent constraints.

However this isn't 1996 anymore. A comparative shoe string budget car can't get the same job done in 2013. Loose those purse strings Fiat and lift the edict that the Viper can't be faster than Ferrari, if that does indeed exist. At the very least give the car the Trofeos and a better brake package.

 

[bluestreak]

That's because they are willing to pay the premium for it. Everyone is not. Clearly C&D did not and MT did or just didn't get busted. Some organizers have caved in to 90db for pretty much all of 2013. And even if it wasn't 90 db. The Viper won't likely pass sound with 92,93 or 95 either. Will probably need 97 Db or more at WOT past the sound stations.

Not correct. SCRAMP (Sports Car Racing Association of the Monterey Peninsula) which actually runs Laguna Seca has more 90+ dbs days scheduled for 2013 than ever before. There are actually 105 dbs track days available for HPDE groups for 2013, which is a first in a number of years as previous 105 dbs days were reserved for SCCA Racing. Non dbs days are usually reserved for Grand Am/Rolex, ALMS, Historics and Rennsport. People mention brake fade, but although Laguna Seca is rough on brakes (especially turn 2) a few hot laps should not be an issue for the brakes. Like I mentioned before, I do not understand why they have 10 year old calipers (same as the 2003 SRT) on a newly designed car. A fantastic car nonetheless.

 

[ViperSmith]

You just don't understand or "get" the Viper heritage, do you?

I am starting to see it is a bunch of whiny crybabies.

Tell me, is the ACR, which Pobst was within .5 seconds of his time at Laguna slow piece of garbage as well?

Sure, we all would have liked to see the new Viper best the ZR1, but as I said before, this isn't 1992 anymore where dropping a higher HP engine in a car wins the race alone.

There are amazing vehicles out there now and it is great the Viper is amongst them, underfunded and hampered by their parent company.

It is great America is producing two of the fastest cars on the planet. I think we will see the Viper best the ZR1 within a year and all the haters will be no where to be found.

I'll do what bob did in the other thread Ill donate $100 to Wounded Warriors if SRT doesn't beat the ZR1 time within the year. You donate if it does.

 

[InjectTheVenom]

Given the Gen 5 is still in it's first inning , I wouldn't take these early reports to seriously ! JMHO

You Sir are a mastermind.

 

[InjectTheVenom]

I am starting to see it is a bunch of whiny crybabies.

Tell me, is the ACR, which Pobst was within .5 seconds of his time at Laguna slow piece of garbage as well?

Sure, we all would have liked to see the new Viper best the ZR1, but as I said before, this isn't 1992 anymore where dropping a higher HP engine in a car wins the race alone.

There are amazing vehicles out there now and it is great the Viper is amongst them, underfunded and hampered by their parent company.

It is great America is producing two of the fastest cars on the planet. I think we will see the Viper best the ZR1 within a year and all the haters will be no where to be found.

I'll do what bob did in the other thread Ill donate $100 to Wounded Warriors if SRT doesn't beat the ZR1 time within the year. You donate if it does.

*ahem*

The Gen 5 was as much of a "what if" as the original RT/10 was when Corvette had already been around for a number of generations, considering that it was absolutely NOT sure there would ever be a Gen 5 at all at one point. Lighten up folks and be patient, give SRT a chance to make good on this because I am positive they will.

 

[REDSLED]

That's because they are willing to pay the premium for it. Everyone is not. Clearly C&D did not and MT did or just didn't get busted. Some organizers have caved in to 90db for pretty much all of 2013. And even if it wasn't 90 db. The Viper won't likely pass sound with 92,93 or 95 either. Will probably need 97 Db or more at WOT past the sound stations.

Blue,
Just curious as to how many days you have running a Viper at Laguna Seca?

 

[Simms]

After reading the Viper portion of the article, I get the impression they could have gotten more out of the car with more time. Hell, it even says that. I'm still hoping SRT will do some testing of their own to see what a viper familiar driver can do.

I'm still slightly dissapointed with some of the track times, but part of me doens't really care anymore what the magazines say/do. IMO, they have always bashed the viper for being what it was intended to be. They will be real quick to put it on their covers, but its a habit to put it down in their articles.

Too loud, hot, brutish, can kill you in second, etc.......Oh but a blast to drive if you know what you are doing. Isn't that why most of us bought this car?

I'll still be pursuing a Gen V. If I have an issue with a ZR1 on the street, I guess I'll go home and get my old, crude, ragged out Gen 2 to take car of business.

 

[MtnBiker]

Too loud, hot, brutish, can kill you in second, etc.......Oh but a blast to drive if you know what you are doing. Isn't that why most of us bought this car?

You are correct sir!

 

[VIPER GTSR 91]

After reading the Viper portion of the article, I get the impression they could have gotten more out of the car with more time. Hell, it even says that. I'm still hoping SRT will do some testing of their own to see what a viper familiar driver can do.

I'm still slightly dissapointed with some of the track times, but part of me doens't really care anymore what the magazines say/do. IMO, they have always bashed the viper for being what it was intended to be. They will be real quick to put it on their covers, but its a habit to put it down in their articles.

Too loud, hot, brutish, can kill you in second, etc.......Oh but a blast to drive if you know what you are doing. Isn't that why most of us bought this car?

I'll still be pursuing a Gen V. If I have an issue with a ZR1 on the street, I guess I'll go home and get my old, crude, ragged out Gen 2 to take car of business.

I would be pissed being beat by the ZR1 you reference (if) after spending ALL that dough on a Gen V. And after you get your brutal Gen 2 a guy goes and gets his twin turbo ZO6 with NOS. It goes on and on with owners that have super mods but stock for stock is the problem possibly here.....

 

[Simms]

I would be pissed being beat by the ZR1 you reference (if) after spending ALL that dough on a Gen V. And after you get your brutal Gen 2 a guy goes and gets his twin turbo ZO6 with NOS. It goes on and on with owners that have super mods but stock for stock is the problem possibly here.....

I'm not saying I wouldn't be pissed, but if 0-150 was all I cared about, I have another car for that. If I wanted a pure track performer, I would get a Gen IV ACR. I know what you are saying, but for me I guess the Gen V will serve a different purpose.

And I have raced TT vettes before, neighbor/good friend has one. Always welcome the fun.

 

[vancouver-gts]

The non GTS is a great deal at $99K with room to upgrade the brakes. Just thinking outloud, what would the outcome be with a drift champion like Tanner Faust driving the new Viper at LS not relying so much on the size and compounds of the lesser brakes of the Viper vs the ZR 1's brakes? I'm no track expert but brakes are definitely a contributing factor to beat the ZR 1's performance IMO. Right or wrong?

 

[Simms]

I'd be curious what a Gen V with different pads and sport cups would do compared to factory form.

 

[Rizzo]

The non GTS is a great deal at $99K with room to upgrade the brakes. Just thinking outloud, what would the outcome be with a drift champion like Tanner Faust driving the new Viper at LS not relying so much on the size and compounds of the lesser brakes of the Viper vs the ZR 1's brakes? I'm no track expert but brakes are definitely a contributing factor to beat the ZR 1's performance IMO. Right or wrong?

Youre right about the brakes but if you think a drifting champ is going to get a car around the track faster than a professional race car driver your crazy. Drifting is slow. Looks cool and its fun but its not fast.

 

[bluestreak]

I'd be curious what a Gen V with different pads and sport cups would do compared to factory form.

Randy + Gen V + MPSC + better pads = 1:33.***

I would bet on that.

 

[vancouver-gts]

Tanner had a few cars under his belt on roads as well so I thought his drifting expertise could come handy. I wouldn't be surprised at all if he's familiar with the track at LS.

 

[Fatboy 18]

Wonder what the Guys on Top Gear will make of the car on their road test?

 

[vancouver-gts]

Wonder what the Guys on Top Gear will make of the car on their road test?

Jeremy would find the seats too tight,haha.

 

[ViperSmith]

Wonder what the Guys on Top Gear will make of the car on their road test?

The Hamster drove the Aventador and I think the biggest thing he took away from it was, it had lost its "soul" as a Lambo, a machine meant to kill you.

I wonder if he will feel the same about the Gen V, or if he will still find it raw(ish) like the previous generations, yet a bit more refined.

 

[elanderholm]

Ralph posted on twitter that the production seats have arrived and are much more comfortable. So it seems like some parts if the car are still being perfected.

 

[elanderholm]

From Ralph

https://mobile.twitter.com/RalphGilles/status/285063585388953600/photos

Makes you wonder why you deliver cars like this to the press..

@EdLoh I think Jonny would have liked these production Spec seats a lot better. Spent 1500miles in the others ouch! pic.twitter.com/aRlp01Li

 

[FLL-B/W-GTS]

If SRT thinks Porsche 911 Turbo owners would consider a Gen.5 Viper ,they are dreaming.I had a C6ZR1 and a Gen 4 Viper.Sold them both to get a new Porsche 911 Turbo S.The Gen 4 Viper and ZR1 do not compare with the Porsche.The Porsche will run away from both,easy,safe to drive at limit and drives like Benz.I like others,was going to get a Gen 5,would have been my 4 th. Viper for me.But,for now,not going to happen,not until the new Viper is a clear winner like our old Vipers were.I hope SRT does whatever they need to do to make the Viper a winner again.