Exhaust set-up Question?

[byron69]

I have a stock 98 GTS with Balenger Headers, R/T Hi-Flow Cats and a 3" Corsa Cat-Back. This system is way too loud and my neighbors are hating I would like to know if I can but a cat-back (any kind even stock)to hush the system way down! since I would like to keep the Headers and the R/T Cats.

Help!

 

[VPRVENM97]

Easy fix. Put the stock cats back on. You'll reduce the sound level but will probably lose a few HP and gain some side sill heat doing it. I'm sure there are tuners out there that have stock cats laying around or someone with stock cats willing to trade you for the high flow cats.

 

[Steve 00RT/10]

This system is way too loud and my neighbors are hating I would like to know if I can but a cat-back (any kind even stock)to hush the system way down! since I would like to keep the Headers and the R/T Cats.

Help!

The proper solution would be to move. You have bad neighbors. Ours is louder than yours and I get only compliments

Steve

 

[kcobean]

Is it the car idling they complain about or is it you coming and going that they have a gripe with? I usually baby my car (which has the same setup minus the headers) out of the neighborhood before I start to play (just to be courteous), and really, how much idling does the car do in the driveway/garage?

This is where "Hey, ****" sometimes is an appropriate response to the overly sensitive and intrusive neighbor.

 

[DAMN YANKEE]

Byron, that IS the big question.

I take it your engine is pretty puch stock? I'm being told that with a Roe unit on (even at 5 lbs) the stock cats get overwhelmed and will generate big heat. But...you said it all, putting on hi flo cats and a 3" cat back seems to be loud to me too. Add the headers and you are L-O-U-D. Some people love it, some people don't.

This is what I've been told;

1. Run with the stock cat, but watch out for long hard, high rpm runs as your sills will get red hot. Work on the insullation, work on the sills (hence my thread on "Holy Grail - Quiet High Flo Cats" and "The Best Gen II products never made". I'm trying to figure it out too.

2. Run a hig flo cat, stay with the stock exhaust. Heat out, sound is louder but not too loud. Exhaust is still restrictive.

3. Run with a high flo cat and get a good muffler shop to put a cross-over on the stock exhaust. HEat is out, louder, less restrictive (but not much).

4. Run wit a high flo cat and use the Belenger 4 muffler set-up. No heat, better exhaust but not too loud.

5. Run with the high flo cat and use any other exhaust you want, put in a set of these:

http://store.summitracing.com/partdetail.asp?part=dtc-72-32510

But, I'm getting told that the sound suppression is non-existant and these units rattle.

6. Add mufflers to the 3" cat back systems.

God knows what to do, but sounds like moving maybe easier....

 

[pocketAA]

byron69,
I have a 99 RT/10 that has stock cats. I would be willing to trade you your Hi-Flows for my stock ones? In my book, the louder the better!

 

[wastntim]

You want quiet? Trade me for my complete stock setup. I can't wait to make my car loud enough to upset the neighbors.

 

[Mr Hemi Head]

Byron, that IS the big question.


5. Run with the high flo cat and use any other exhaust you want, put in a set of these:

http://store.summitracing.com/partdetail.asp?part=dtc-72-32510

But, I'm getting told that the sound suppression is non-existant and these units rattle.

I have installed these in my Corsa, there is no rattle and they reduced exhaust noise at cruising rpms. WOT is another story .

 

[ViperTony]

Byron, that IS the big question.


5. Run with the high flo cat and use any other exhaust you want, put in a set of these:

http://store.summitracing.com/partdetail.asp?part=dtc-72-32510

But, I'm getting told that the sound suppression is non-existant and these units rattle.

I have installed these in my Corsa, there is no rattle and they reduced exhaust noise at cruising rpms. WOT is another story .

Did you tack them on or use the supplied bolts/screws? Where did you install them? In the collector or by the tailpipes? I'm thinking about installing a pair and heard the best thing to do is tack them in. Did they help with your idle noise? What kind of setup are you running? I have Borla headers, B&B 3" exhaust and cats. And it's simply loud. Even with the engine off it's loud.

 

[byron69]

Is it the car idling they complain about or is it you coming and going that they have a gripe with? I usually baby my car (which has the same setup minus the headers) out of the neighborhood before I start to play (just to be courteous), and really, how much idling does the car do in the driveway/garage?

This is where "Hey, ****" sometimes is an appropriate response to the overly sensitive and intrusive neighbor.

Its just when I start it and the engine is cold it sounds like a Dragster. The sound just bounces down the street the houses are packed like sardines.

 

[byron69]

Byron, that IS the big question.

I take it your engine is pretty puch stock? I'm being told that with a Roe unit on (even at 5 lbs) the stock cats get overwhelmed and will generate big heat. But...you said it all, putting on hi flo cats and a 3" cat back seems to be loud to me too. Add the headers and you are L-O-U-D. Some people love it, some people don't.

...

My car is all stock except for the exhaust (Belanger Headers, R/T Hi-Flow Cats, 3" Corsa Cat-Back), I have the complete stock set-up (came with the car).

I was thinking if it fits putting back just the stock cat-back.

Or using a set of the Vortex Silencer Cones @ the exhaust end and if need be another set between the headers and the cats.

 

[Mr Hemi Head]

Byron, that IS the big question.


5. Run with the high flo cat and use any other exhaust you want, put in a set of these:

http://store.summitracing.com/partdetail.asp?part=dtc-72-32510

But, I'm getting told that the sound suppression is non-existant and these units rattle.

I have installed these in my Corsa, there is no rattle and they reduced exhaust noise at cruising rpms. WOT is another story .

Did you tack them on or use the supplied bolts/screws? Where did you install them? In the collector or by the tailpipes? I'm thinking about installing a pair and heard the best thing to do is tack them in. Did they help with your idle noise? What kind of setup are you running? I have Borla headers, B&B 3" exhaust and cats. And it's simply loud. Even with the engine off it's loud.

Installed in the Corsa 3" tail pipe with 1 SS nut and bolt for each. With Belangers and their hiflo cats it was too loud. The cones made it just right from idle to about 2K rpms.

The digital salute (middle finger) may help in some situations.

 

[ViperTony]

The digital salute (middle finger) may help in some situations.

LOL. Thanks for the info.

 

[FE 065]

I just took a look at the Corsa system on their web site. From what I see, their mufflers under the side sill are really short. Plus I think the Random Techs are shorter than the OE cats.

If all that's true you could take out the Corsa side sill mufflers and add in some longer mufflers. Moving the cat forward if you need to for max muffler room.

Use a fat cased muffler under there, like 6"OD or so for maximum sound control. With a 3" core, you'll need a big case OD to do much good.

I prefer Dynomax myself. Plenty of CFM ability (no HP loss) thru a 3" core Dynomax. Quiet too.

Better than jamming a bunch of cones inside your exhaust. No offense to those who use them, but it's just not the way to go performance-wise.

 

[Ron]

Re: Exhaust set-up Question?

.

 

[ViperJames]

I have discussed this "Vortex Cones" thing with The Wizard, because i think my exhaust is too loud, and he told me they are useless. Has he ever steered anyone here wrong?

 

[ViperTony]

I have discussed this "Vortex Cones" thing with The Wizard, because i think my exhaust is too loud, and he told me they are useless. Has he ever steered anyone here wrong?

hmmm... Wizard or Vortex.... I'll take Chuck every time!

 

[GTS Bruce]

The Corsa system does not have any mufflers.Those large tubes have chambers off to the sides to absorb/cancel resonance as in no drone and tune the sound.You can see right through one and notice openings off to the side for the side chambers.There is no packing etc.BTW I have headers,no cats,corsa,3" all the way.I don't think its loud at all.Course in a GTS the sound is behind you.WHAT? GTS Bruce

 

[FE 065]

Corsa had one cut open on display at Norwalk 3 yrs ago come to think of it. Showing the side chambers.

 

[JKVIPER]

I can vouch that the hi-flow cats on a corsa is much louder than stock cats, especially on acceleration.


Cruising and idle, not much difference.

 

[byron69]

My only concern is at start-up (idle) with engine cold. This is when it sounds like Drag Car. I love the sound while running, it's just at idle it sounds loud with rpm's going up and down (which they are not).

I found a performance exhaust shop in town that has a great reputation with Viper and Porsche owners. I will take it in next week for a consultation and let you know what recommendations were given.

Thanks.

 

[JKVIPER]

My advice is most exhuast shops really can't design/engineer anything that will sound good on a Viper. I messed around with extra mufflers both bullet mufflers, spintech mufflers, etc. and nothing sounded as good the stock cats with the corsa exhaust. I know all of this is subjective, but it is just my opinion.

The Viper has a unique sound and if the exhaust is not engineered corectly you get tons drone. The spintech mufflers reduced the volume alot, but the exhaust still droned pretty bad.

If you want it quiet, I would sugguest stock cats and keep the corsa.

 

[ViperJames]

My advice is most exhuast shops really can't design/engineer anything that will sound good on a Viper. I messed around with extra mufflers both bullet mufflers, spintech mufflers, etc. and nothing sounded as good the stock cats with the corsa exhaust. I know all of this is subjective, but it is just my opinion.

The Viper has a unique sound and if the exhaust is not engineered corectly you get tons drone. The spintech mufflers reduced the volume alot, but the exhaust still droned pretty bad.

If you want it quiet, I would sugguest stock cats and keep the corsa.

I agree that will solve the answer of "quiet", HOWEVER....I believe that the reason why most people put high flow cats on is not necessarily for the HP....It is to reduce the cabin + Side sill heat. Putting the stock cats back on is going increase that heat to an unbearable degree. I have been trying to figure out the happy medium but there does not appear to be one....

 

[DAMN YANKEE]

And with ViperJames' comments we have it (and we have come complete circle, again). I think he is exactly right...its the HEAT not the HORSEPOWER that drives the High-Flo cat decision.

I wrote this in the other thread. Corsa DOES NOT have the solution to the high flo cat problem. I'ts here to show they tuned their system for one (and only one) cat and its not going to solve the heavy induction problem.

- Corsa spends huge amounts of time tuning their exhaust to meet the very narrow intersection point between IMPORVED PERFORMANCE (flo) and IMPORVED SOUND (interior and exterior). Folks, in the Viper, with a V10 that window is very very small. Corsa thinks they nailed it and state that they are the only company that can make the scientifically backed claim that they get great flo at the lowest overall resonance and best frequency sound

- Corsa also knows very well that that performanc-sound inersection requires by definition a "technical" resonance (his words). Pressed to explain, they are clear, Corsa's exhaust have a definate and purposeful frequency in the range that would (to my ears) suggest the more race, more metallic Formula Series, higher frequency note. Corsa also knows that in the absence of that intersecton you end up with a more muddy, more uneven, more baratone (my words) lower rumble, less defined, louder frequency (insert all the other brands, minus perhaps the sole provider of exhaust systems in non-stainless steel, Belanger). Belanger's all steel system has the higher frequencies as well, but is ot as specifically tuned for sound.All the major brand exhaust systems effectively deliver the flo required.

- Corsa's system IS luder with a high-flo cat, but *(IMPORTANT)* the cermaic high-flo cats are significantly quieter than the metal cats. Corsa has tested mos of the high-flo cats and they do not see failures with ceramic cats (good brands like Random) even in their heavy induction (750 hp+) engines.

Where we are:

1. Corsa needs to prepare a set of exhausts TUNED TO THE HIGH FLO CAT SYSTEM.
With this, they effectively provide for the OVER LOADING over their own system with a high flo cat. This IS the solution for the Corsa buyuer who wishes to have a car as quiet as possible with high flo cats. Borla, B&B, Belanger, etc. etc. too (if that is where their heads are at).

2. Somebody (still can't believe this one hasn't be recognized) needs to offer a high quality set of hi-flo air SILLS. Well designed, expensive, that drain and flo and look good. They can do this and make money charging less than the $1,200 for a new set of GENII sills (!!!???).

The bad news is....Our GENI, GENII cars are now OLD cars and they ARE NOT looking towards us for their newest products. NOT AT ALL. My guess is we have what we will ever have to solve this problem......

Folks anybody seen these?

http://www.spiralturbobaffles.com/streetrod.html

They are stainless, they can be inserted behind the Hi-Flo cat infront of the muffler.

 

[DAMN YANKEE]

My error on the comma on the stock sill it $12,000.00 not $1,200.00 for a set of new stock sills, Sorry, I hate that when it happens.

 

[ViperJames]

My error on the comma on the stock sill it $12,000.00 not $1,200.00 for a set of new stock sills, Sorry, I hate that when it happens.

That Baffle looks interesting...is that the same concept as the Vortex cones?....I know the Vortex cones are useless....Maybe this is a viable option?

 

[FE 065]

Considering that if louvered mufflers cores reduce muffler CFM about 50% over perforated muffler cores, these spiral thingamabobs should really play hell with exhaust flow.



This little thing I put together late this Fall did quiet things down quite a bit as a side benefit though.

You must be registered for see images

 

[DAMN YANKEE]

Very interesting, what is it that we are looking at here?

 

[ViperTony]

My error on the comma on the stock sill it $12,000.00 not $1,200.00 for a set of new stock sills, Sorry, I hate that when it happens.

That Baffle looks interesting...is that the same concept as the Vortex cones?....I know the Vortex cones are useless....Maybe this is a viable option?

It looks similiar to the Moroso Spiral Flow mufflers. I was going to install these between my BB cats and mullfers to act as a resonator:

You must be registered for see images

 

[1TONY1]

The spirals "may" be restrictive....but they do give the same sound level as the cats I had. The cats I had were stockers cut in half. I have the Morosos in place of the cats and a Dynomax can after that with 3" out the rear.

Sound vs flow.....always a trade off. My car is pretty quiet compared to most aftermarket systems......and it still hauls ***

Screw the neighbors or ditch the Corsa.