Finally Got the Smooth Tubes In, And............

[Vipuronr]

Okay, I kept putting off installing the smooth tubes and S&B filters as there just seemed to be something else that had to get done.

So, now they are in....and, here's my take on a few things:

1) The smooth tubes from Roe Racing (after much reading of posts) do not seem as substantial as I would have thought...more importantly, they seem a little skimpy as they are not as long as the factory tube, just making over the air filter opening (not instilling much confidence that they wouldn't somehow be pulled off over time).
2) The tubes were softer then I thought they would be, though I do remember Sean saying that there is no negative pressure that would cause them to collapse....still, they seem a little soft.
3) The S&B filters certainly look good and very substantial compared to factory, but seemed a little bit longer then the opening and bowed a little before clamping in. All closed up nicely, so assume they are good.

Last, as luck would have it, one of the clips (bottom, driver's side of course) came off after the piece it goes into broke. I assume this is common as plastic probably dries out and gets brittle after awhile.

Question: Is it a big deal if one clip is missing? I do not race and the center "hold-down" screw is in place and tight.

Comments appreciated.

Peter (aka Wetsand Guy)

 

[ViperTony]

If you want something substantial slap on a super charger, head work, exhaust or all of the above. Whether or not tubes/filters contributes anything is irrelevant...it's simply a rite of passage of Viper ownership.

I'm missing 4 clips and the airbox hasn't flown off yet. You can get them from Chuck and I believe they're also a common GM part number but you better buy them from Chuck, or else.

 

[Mad Max 93 RT10]

but you better buy them from Chuck, or else.

Crack that wip Tony!

 

[Vipuronr]

Yo, Tony......I didn't lose the clip, the piece it snaps into on the box itself broke off. Since its only one clip, figured it wasn't much of a deal...but had to ask anyway.

As for your (short) list of mods.....supercharger (love it), head work (like it), exhaust (catback next for car)...

Not sure what mods I want to do, but the cost of a SC is a bit out of range these days....but, who knows. I would also like to pick up an autoform top with vent.

Thanks for the comments though. Just needed to ask.

Peter

 

[V10SpeedLuvr]

I had part of 1 of the plastic clip holders break as well. I superglued the clip back onto the box. I would think the box needs to be closed as tight as possible to keep a good seal around the filters. It probably doesn't make a big difference, but knowing 1 clip was missing would've annoyed me to no end.

Signed,

Type-A personality

 

[Vipuronr]

Hey Chad...got me defined to a "T". Yes, it bothers me to have anything in the car that is not exactly right. Fortunately, the clip that broke is the bottom left inside, so the box is held together fairly tightly on that side by the three clips and the center screw-down.

I am undecided if I want to eventually get the open air filter box made by K&N. I just haven't seen much posted on the added performance of going to that filter setup, if it actually adds HP or is more for looks.

Since it doesn't look like a SC is in my future, I'm looking for smaller things to upgrade hp/performance.

That is, aside from the fact that the car is already faster because its RED!
Thanks....

Peter

 

[2001-V10 Power Nut]

I had one of the clips on my stock "cup holder" brake off, man that *****, LOL

 

[Vipuronr]

Funny.....but, while I'm on the subject of the stock air filter box, I recall a post where someone mentioned a machined aluminum "screw" for the bottom center of the box. I think the stock piece is some kind of plastic.

Anyone know where I can get this piece or at least who makes it?

Thanks.

 

[ViperTony]

www.davesbigbrakes.com has it.

 

[Vipuronr]

Thanks Tony, those are the ones! Wonder what they are going to do with Dave's business?

Thanks.

 

[Vic]

One time I made my own smooth tubes, using Goodyear hosing.
When Dan Cragin had it on his dyno, they saw that the hoses were collapsing as the engine was running. Needless to say, I bought DC Performance's smoothies! A soft tube can collapse. (I'm not saying Roe's do).

2) The tubes were softer then I thought they would be, though I do remember Sean saying that there is no negative pressure that would cause them to collapse....still, they seem a little soft.

Peter (aka Wetsand Guy)

 

[Tom F&L GoR]

One time I made my own smooth tubes, using Goodyear hosing.
When Dan Cragin had it on his dyno, they saw that the hoses were collapsing as the engine was running. Needless to say, I bought DC Performance's smoothies! A soft tube can collapse. (I'm not saying Roe's do).

Wow, whether the replacement tubes collapse or not, that would imply a huge pressure difference between the tubes and ambient, meaning the filters are big restrictors!?.

 

[Vipuronr]

This was discussed at length, mostly between Sean Roe and John from Part's Rack. I think the conclusion was that there shouldn't be enough pressure to collapse them.

Thanks.

 

[Purdue_Boiler_Viper]

Okay, I kept putting off installing the smooth tubes and S&B filters as there just seemed to be something else that had to get done.

So, now they are in....and, here's my take on a few things:

1) The smooth tubes from Roe Racing (after much reading of posts) do not seem as substantial as I would have thought...more importantly, they seem a little skimpy as they are not as long as the factory tube, just making over the air filter opening (not instilling much confidence that they wouldn't somehow be pulled off over time).
2) The tubes were softer then I thought they would be, though I do remember Sean saying that there is no negative pressure that would cause them to collapse....still, they seem a little soft.
3) The S&B filters certainly look good and very substantial compared to factory, but seemed a little bit longer then the opening and bowed a little before clamping in. All closed up nicely, so assume they are good.

Last, as luck would have it, one of the clips (bottom, driver's side of course) came off after the piece it goes into broke. I assume this is common as plastic probably dries out and gets brittle after awhile.

Question: Is it a big deal if one clip is missing? I do not race and the center "hold-down" screw is in place and tight.

Comments appreciated.

Peter (aka Wetsand Guy)

The airbox was engineered for a given number of clips. There is always some design margin built in. Don't test that margin. Replace the missing clip.

I also have Roe's smooth tubes. No issues at all. Not as "robust" looking as stock, but no corrugations which should lead to more laminar flow vs. tubulence. Worth at least 100 HP. I think.

 

[Vipuronr]

Well, the issue is the broken plastic piece where the clip "clips" into the air box back. Without the little slots, there is no way to re-attach the clip. So, to fix, I have to replace the back of the air box...no cheap expense. This being the case, then I would want to know the additional performance gained by the K&N open air-box with two cone performance filters....added performance or just looks?

Thanks.

 

[V10SpeedLuvr]

Well, the issue is the broken plastic piece where the clip "clips" into the air box back. Without the little slots, there is no way to re-attach the clip. So, to fix, I have to replace the back of the air box...no cheap expense. This being the case, then I would want to know the additional performance gained by the K&N open air-box with two cone performance filters....added performance or just looks?

Thanks.

Is there any of the clip on the airbox left where you could superglue the actual clip into place? Thats what I did to mine and its been fine for a couple years.

 

[carguy07]

Here is what I did on mine. I had to grind a flat side into the washers for the rivets to make them work. I can't say it is a great solution since I hate to cut anything up. But it did work perfect.

http://forums.viperclub.org/rt-10-gts-discussions/592723-fix-airbox-clips.html


Bigger pics.

 

[Vipuronr]

Interesting, have to think about those.....but,

DOES ANYONE HAVE AN OPINION OR HAVE THERE BEEN TESTS ON THE K&N OPEN AIR-BOX????

Thanks.

 

[ViperTony]

Thanks Tony, those are the ones! Wonder what they are going to do with Dave's business?

Thanks.

Dave's son is keeping it going, read more here: http://forums.viperclub.org/general...-daves-big-brakes-official-announcements.html

 

[Vic]

Wow, whether the replacement tubes collapse or not, that would imply a huge pressure difference between the tubes and ambient, meaning the filters are big restrictors!?.

Thats very astute, Tom. Yes, my air filters were pretty dirty. Maybe if they werent, even my Goodyear hoses wouldnt have collapsed. IDK, but I got good ones now. Done deal.

 

[dave6666]

Interesting suggestion on riveting the clips. I have one that has flown off before, put another on, then found it backed out and laying on the garage floor. But I do have all 8 in there now. Magic or luck? Dunno.

Anyway, a stock Gen 1 or Gen 2 airbox can be had on popular auction sites for $75. I have 3 of them at that price. Really!

Regarding the plastic headed mounting screws...

THROW THEM AWAY!

And get the ones from Dave's.

Here's what happens to your belt when that plastic screw that you got as tight as you can get a plastic headed screw comes out.

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Problem solved...

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[FE 065]

Wow, whether the replacement tubes collapse or not, that would imply a huge pressure difference between the tubes and ambient, meaning the filters are big restrictors!?.

Steady state running it's probably not a factor, but when 488ci goes WOT in the right gear that's a whole lot of sudden demand for LOTS of air. The tubes themselves might be a restriction in the lower gears at WOT.

Ten years or so ago, a local Chrysler engineer was concerned about his homemade smooth tubes collapsing under load. I gave him some thin wall plastic tubing I had left over to put inside..


No restriction with this modded OE airbox.

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OE tubes with curved 2.5 inch OD exhaust tubing inside eliminated the collapsing concerns for me, and gave me that nice factory look back.

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