Fuel pump upgrade

[dansauto]

Posted this a couple days ago on the other forum, not many responses. What have people been doing to upgrade thier fuel pump in order to handle 750 RWHP? I knwo I will also have to upgrade rails and injectors, my main concern now is just the Pump in the stock canister.

 

[jp]

A Walbro 340 (255l/h)is used by most turners. $110-140. Or just install a Kenne Bell "Bost-A-Pump"...or both
I would plump the intake and build a return line with a pressure regulator aswell.

 

[dansauto]

I don't think that will be enough, I am thinking about 300-350 lph or 100 gph.

 

[Yellow Fever]

You might want to call the guys at Racetronix..They know there stuff !

I'm sure they would be able to help you out .

www.racetronix.com

Cheers

Jeff

 

[jp]

255 l/h is good for 900Hp.

I don't think that will be enough, I am thinking about 300-350 lph or 100 gph.

 

[DChan415]

900HP at 90 PSI and 14.7:1 AF's maybe. I wouldn't risk it though.

255 l/h is good for 900Hp.

I don't think that will be enough, I am thinking about 300-350 lph or 100 gph.

 

[jp]

Danny, according to all formulas I know is it enough for 800-900hp. The psi does not have much to do with needed flow.
This is an interesting article on the subject.
http://www.kennebell.net/media/articles/FUELPUMP.pdf
I do use a Boost-A-Pump and a 255 l/h pump.

/JP

900HP at 90 PSI and 14.7:1 AF's maybe. I wouldn't risk it though.

255 l/h is good for 900Hp.

I don't think that will be enough, I am thinking about 300-350 lph or 100 gph.

 

[DChan415]

Oh, I wasnt saying that you were wrong. I just believe that you should always have more fuel than you need, and fuel systems arent where you should get cheap. Especially under boost where the AFs should be richer and any type of fuel starvation could mean a blown engine. I wouldnt want to run my pump at high pressure or high voltage, and I wouldnt want to run my injector duty cycles far past 80%. I have a thing about fuel from working on rotaries where there isnt any room to make mistakes so dont mind me. =)

Are you running any boost?

Danny, according to all formulas I know is it enough for 800-900hp. The psi does not have much to do with needed flow.
This is an interesting article on the subject.
http://www.kennebell.net/media/articles/FUELPUMP.pdf
I do use a Boost-A-Pump and a 255 l/h pump.

/JP

900HP at 90 PSI and 14.7:1 AF's maybe. I wouldn't risk it though.

255 l/h is good for 900Hp.

I don't think that will be enough, I am thinking about 300-350 lph or 100 gph.

 

[jp]

Danny, no I'm not running on boost, I'm using Nitrous as additive. I do agree with you about beeing carefull. I use a set of fixed installed Wide band lambdas with displays to always be on the safe side.

 

[varanus]

I put in the walbro 255 but it doesn't have the reach of the stock pump thus I cannot pick up the last 4 gallons of fuel in the tank. How did you adapt it?

 

[jp]

Just a hose long enough to get the pump down to correct level...

I put in the walbro 255 but it doesn't have the reach of the stock pump thus I cannot pick up the last 4 gallons of fuel in the tank. How did you adapt it?

 

[Miles B]

Depending on the fuel pressure you want to run, the Walbro 255 l/h can get really good flow.. boosting you will need decent pressure, and 2 Walbros are better than one..
http://www.mkiv.com/techarticles/fuel_pumps_test/pump_test.jpg

 

[Jack B]

The viper oem pump is also a Walbro, what Walbro part number is used and what is the flow.

 

[jp]

As JonB says, "The year matters" The Gen1 Viper has a higher flowing pump.

The viper oem pump is also a Walbro, what Walbro part number is used and what is the flow.

 

[Jack B]

JP:

what does the Gen II oem pump flow.

 

[dansauto]

JP what are you using for injectors?

 

[proracer1]

I ran 2 external Bosch 400 GPH fuel pumps in sinc. I ran a # 8 feed line into a fuel regulator mounted on the fender well and a # 6 return line. You will need to replace the regulator in the sending unit with a fitting that will accept A.N. fittings. Then we kept the stock pump in the can, cut the hose that went to the stock regulator so it turned down. It's only job is to keep the canister full of fuel. We also ran a pickup line to the bottom of the canister to feed the 2 Bosch pumps. Running 62 psi Works great! 693RWHP 708 RWTQ

 

[dansauto]

I ran 2 external Bosch 400 GPH fuel pumps in sinc. I ran a # 8 feed line into a fuel regulator mounted on the fender well and a # 6 return line. You will need to replace the regulator in the sending unit with a fitting that will accept A.N. fittings. Then we kept the stock pump in the can, cut the hose that went to the stock regulator so it turned down. It's only job is to keep the canister full of fuel. We also ran a pickup line to the bottom of the canister to feed the 2 Bosch pumps. Running 62 psi Works great! 693RWHP 708 RWTQ

But your now using the Pumps to **** rather than push. I thought you must use the pumps to push only? What fitting did you use to replace the regulator in the sending unit?

 

[jp]

Ive been using Gen2 injector on 100% duty cycle. Works ok for Dragracing but not for Road Racing. Will use 40-50 lbs injectors next season.
/JP

JP what are you using for injectors?

 

[jp]

Jack B, I dont know. I have the data on another location.

JP:

what does the Gen II oem pump flow.

 

[proracer1]

Dan
You are correct to a point. We are sucking out of the tank. BUT the pumps are mounted inside the inner fender well on the drivers side rear. so they are pushing the fuel up to the injectors. We are using 50lb injectors also. If you PM me your e mail I will e mail you pics of the install. We had Kinsler fuel injection figure out the GPH and Scott at Vipermed was a big help in consulting on the delivery. We are running an 8 lb pulley on our Roe S/C and have NO fuel pressure drop all the way up the RPM. This works GREAT and it is enough for us when we go bigger cam or higher boost

 

[proracer1]

By the way the Walboro 255 pump IS NOT ENOUGH. When we ran on the dyno at Arrow they use that punp and we ran out of fuel at 4500 RPM Even with that pump and 1 of my Bosch pumps we still were running lean. When we disconnected thier pump and ran my complete set up it ran great. FYI

 

[dansauto]

I spoke with Scott a couple days ago, great guy. I am going to sump my tank, baffle and use a BG King Sumo pump on the rail. I hope to just gut the canister of the OEM pump and leave the sending unit. I am running the delivery and return lines and leaving the rail/regualator/injectors up to my tuner. We are probably going to use 55 or 60 lb injectors. I am shooting for 750 RWHP at 8-10 lbs boost.
I am PM'ing you this AM!

 

[James Bell]

I wish I could figure out how to post pictures of my custom fabricated fuel cell. I built it with a 1 gallon baffled sump. The tank will hold 24-25 gallons. I welded a -12AN male outlet **** on the bottom and -10AN return/ ventilation male bungs at the top-center. I used a GM style universal fuel gauge sender. It also uses the stock filler neck through the side with the factory seal. This is the best way to run a high volume, external fuel pump with a return system.

 

[dansauto]

Jim,

How did you get the GM sending unit to run your gauge? I was going to by a summit universal fuel cell (they are only about $150) that come with a GM style sending unit, but I thought they were not compatable with our gauge.

 

[James Bell]

The stock sending unit has a 0-100ohm signal. One of the GM universal sending units has a 0-90ohm signal. That is close enough, only in-accurate at the extreme full side. It is also a more sensitive cylinder style instead of the bulky stock (tiolet float) leveling arm sensor. The wire outlet is a simple two stud post instead of a plug. So you have to slightly modify the wire connections.
The only thing I did not like about production fuel cells is the lower fuel capacity and small shallow sumps. You will also have to figure out a way to couple the filler neck to the fuel cell.