Greg Good Heads Dyno Results on a Gen One RT/10, Exhaust, Smooth Tubes & Filters

[ericj96]

I recently had my gen one head gaskets go bad and decided if I was going to go through all this trouble I might as well have something to show for it. I asked around and the guys I know in the Georgia Viper club held a guy named Greg Good in high regard. So I gave him a call and sent them off.

This is the before and after results.


Mod Set 1=Smooth Tubes & Filters, 3" Borla exhaust from the manifold flange back
Mod Set 2= Smooth Tubes & Filters, 3" Borla exhaust from the manifold flange back, with Greg Good Heads and 1.7 Harland sharp Rockers
Both data sets have stock trottle bodies, intake, cam and exhaust manifolds.

RPM.....RWT1...RWT2

2000…406…425
2200…412…422
2400…410…422
2600…417…441
2800…417…450
3000…420…452
3200…432…461
3400…442…479
3600…461…492
3800…460…491
4000…455…495
4200…455…502
4400…451…495
4600…438…490
4800…433…485
5000…420…470
5200…401…450
5400…383…437
5600…365…418
5800…335…390


The entire torque curve lifted at least 12 ft pounds from 1500 rpm all the way out. Average increase in ratational force was about 9% at all points. Peak RW torque was up 40 ft lbs and peak horse power was up exactly 50 RWHP. Cranking cyclinder pressure was just 172 so using a .027 cometic head gasket would have moved the compression ratio from about 9.6 to about 10 and given a five point further bump. Peak HP and torque moved up 400 RPM.

The heads flowed 285 cfm at 575 lift and 225 at 550 lift respectively. I have a ring problem on one of my cyclinders so next run she is going to get thin head gaskets, bored out throttle bodies and a aluminum fly wheel. I will post these results when I get them plus a load of other data that may be helpful to gen I guys. I think these heads are good enough for get me into the 475 RWHP and 520 RWT range with stock intake, exhaust manifolds and cam still in place. I like a smooth cam and stock engine personality but high output. It think Greg Good heads with a thin head gasket is as close as it gets to a perfect mod.


Thanks

Eric Jordan

1996 RT/10
452 RWH at 5400 rpm
502 RWT at 4250 rpm

 

[speedracervr4]

Thanks for posting!! I'm gonna be installing my GG heads and cam on my Roe S/C Viper in the next couple months.

 

[plumcrazy]

great results and thanks for posting it

 

[Zentenk]

That is awesome! Get some manifolds and a nice tune.. can you tune the Gen1's as easy as Gen2?

 

[NukedGTS]

Great looking numbers. Can you share the total cost of the GG heads and rockers upgrade?

 

[rpm9000]

I had Greg do my heads a couple of months ago. I haven't been to the dyno yet but you can definitely feel the difference in performance. I did install a 708 cam (because I had already purchased it a year before) and used .027 head gaskets. He milled .030 off the heads and the intake, did some porting on the intake and throttle bodies. Before the cam and head work it was doing 418 RWHP and 485 RWT. That was with Belanger headers, Dynomax mufflers, 3" Roe cats and T & D 1.7 roller rockers. I am hoping for some good numbers. We'll see soon.

 

[ericj96]

Thanks for all the comments guys.

How rough is the 708 cam? I am thinking about a 708 cam when I fix my scratch in the cylinder wall but I am afraid of the car being very rough at 500 rpm. I want to end up with 180 psig cranking cylinder pressure (10-10.2) compression. High compression and 1.7 high lift rockers exacerabates cam lope. Comments?


The 1996 RT/10 is the first car that has OBD2 and can be programmed by an SCT tuner. This is the only gen I car that tunes like a gen II, III etc.

My upgrades were about 3 grand for the head work using used valves. $600 for the rockers, $250 for the strong rods to push the beehive springs, and $500 to get the valves adjusted and push rod lengths done by a pro, $1000 for SCT tuning to get my air fuel correct and $100 for a used set of gen II injectors from Archer racing.

If any of you guys want to talk about mods give me call at 770-377-3703. PM me with your email address and I will send over the dyno sheet.

Eric

 

[Zentenk]

708 Is not that rough, I need rougher...

 

[plumcrazy]

708 is a waste of money. its a lot of work to change a cam in these. get a better one from GG. its not much more money

think about it., how good of a cam would you get from a STOCK engine ? and 708 = stock

 

[EllowViper]

Greg gave me some ideas for my blower cam and recommended I work with Comp Cams to get it ground. Even with the grind I got, I have near 180 psi cranking pressure (stock head gaskets, chambers open up a bit)...and its a lumpy solid roller cam. Idles like crap (have to ramp it up to around 900 RPMs to get good vacuum with the ROE manifold), but that is the trade-off I have to live with 'cause when I hit the LOUD button, it is night and day from the stock cam.

 

[AZTVR]

Thanks for posting that torque vs RPM info ! Maybe you could post up the HP numbers in the same format. I recently thought that I was going to have to do a valve job and was wondering what exactly could be had as an improvement with just doing what you did.

 

[ericj96]

.........MOD1....MOD2
RPM T....HP.....T.....HP
1600 ................423 129
1800 ................424 145
2000 406 155 ..425 162
2200 412 173.. 424 178
2400 410 187.. 422 193
2600 417 206.. 441 218
2800 420 224.. 450 240
3000 420 240.. 452 258
3200 432 263.. 461 281
3400 442 286.. 479 310
3600 461 316.. 492 337
3800 460 333.. 491 355
4000 455 347.. 495 377
4200 455 364.. 502 401
4400 451 378.. 495 415
4600 438 384.. 490 429
4800 433 396.. 485 443
5000 420 401.. 470 447
5200 401 397.. 450 446
5400 383 394.. 439 451
5600 365 389.. 418 446
5800 335 370.. 390 431
6000 ........................360 411

These are eye ball numbers pulled from my dyno sheets. The cars output changes slightly between pulls as it gets hot so there are some slight changes from the first data set. But not much.

Eric

 

[AZTVR]

Thanks !

 

[ericj96]

Greg gave me some ideas for my blower cam and recommended I work with Comp Cams to get it ground. Even with the grind I got, I have near 180 psi cranking pressure (stock head gaskets, chambers open up a bit)...and its a lumpy solid roller cam. Idles like crap (have to ramp it up to around 900 RPMs to get good vacuum with the ROE manifold), but that is the trade-off I have to live with 'cause when I hit the LOUD button, it is night and day from the stock cam.

Greg told me two things when I was in his shop watching him rework my heads. When I showed him my stock gen one throttle body with its tiny 58mm blades and roughly 55mm conical reducing exit he said that TB is costing you at least 5 and maybe 10 hp. He also told me that if I wanted to get everything out of his heads I would need a serious cam and he had some Comp cam profiles that were serious. I have no doubt that you guys are correct about your after market cams producing at well over 20 more RWHP and higher peak torque rpm.

My problem is my car is 95% street use and go out to dinner with the wife. 5% go run with the guys. My stock cam with 1.7 rockers is about a 294 intake with 550 lift and 290 exhaust with 525 lift and thats more than I have run in most of my motors over the years. My goal is to lift the whole torque curve from 1500 all the way out to 6,000 rpm. I dont want to trade bottom end for top end becasue I have a street car with 3.07 (street gears). When all the work is done I hope to have a stock looking and stock behaving car at 500-3500 rpm where I drive it but still pull off high 11 second quarter miles and defend myself from the many outstanding factory stock machines that cover the roads. I hope I can get into the 475-480 RWHP and 520-525 rwt range. This is as good a result as as 500 RWHP and 500 RWT because my torque is showing up in the all important 4250-4800 rpm range. Our grear sets and intake manifold shapes dictate about 4200-6000 rpm shifts.

I hope to learn some things from you guys to help me get where I would like to be. Maybe what I post will help you guys do the sames.

Best Wishes,

Eric

 

[mralbuquerque]

Eric96 thanks for posting the results. I have a 95 with all the bolt ons and was thinking of having Greg Good port the heads, change cam (emissions issues) maybe the 708 cam, and have the intake ported. I'm currently making 410 hp on a dynojet and thats with 1.7 rocker arms.

For whats its worth the rocker arms added 27 hp peak on my Gen 1. So I think the heads bolted on would make roughly another 30 hp (rear wheel). The 708 cam (5-8 hp) and porting the intake (5-10 hp). It would be nice to have another 50 hp to the rear wheel.
In my neck of the woods I run approximately 3 mph less than a stock z06 in the qtr mile. I also know a a guy that has an 08 ls3 vette and he did a cam change and exhaust and his car runs about 5 mph better than my car in the qtr. Last, i saw a stock gtr trap 6 mph higher and close to 3/4 of second better et and we are both on street tires.

RPM9000 did you get your car dynoed?

 

[viper067]

Just got a package from GG today ...... heads, 1.7 RR, comp cam. Can't wait to get them in.

 

[happy]

Hey does gg have a website ?? im not pulling mine apart right now, but coming close to the winter i want a drop mine off to a shop and get them to pull it apart while im away for work and squeeze a few more hp out of my lil v10 lol!! Plus i really want a nice lopey idle!! So what do you guys do just send your heads down to him using ups, he does them over and sends them back?? I live up in Canada!!Thanks i have been hearing lots of good about this gg guy !!!!

 

[AZTVR]

Hey does gg have a website ??

http://forums.viperclub.org/members/22304-Greg-Good-Cylinder-Heads

 

[Slithr]

Hey does gg have a website ??

Yes, but it's under construction/coming soon.

http://www.greggoodracing.com/

 

[plumcrazy]

yes but his email is listed on the bottom, just kinda hard to see.

 

[Greg Good Cylinder Heads]

I haven't had any time to devote to material for the site. I want to post some tutorials and pics. When things slow down a bit, maybe during the Holidays, I'll do it.

 

[99 R/T 10]

I haven't had any time to devote to material for the site. I want to post some tutorials and pics. When things slow down a bit, maybe during the Holidays, I'll do it.

Now that is a good one, I don't think it ever slows down for you. Forget ever trying to get you to go to a BBQ................

I will have 2 more sets for you to do soon.........................


Next time, take some time off and go to Tony's BBQ!!!!!! Everybody there got to see my very special set of heads for the ACR...............

 

[Greg Good Cylinder Heads]

I wanted to be there!

Yeah that's a pretty set of heads. Hope the guys liked them.

 

[ericj96]

Eric96 thanks for posting the results. I have a 95 with all the bolt ons and was thinking of having Greg Good port the heads, change cam (emissions issues) maybe the 708 cam, and have the intake ported. I'm currently making 410 hp on a dynojet and thats with 1.7 rocker arms.

For whats its worth the rocker arms added 27 hp peak on my Gen 1. So I think the heads bolted on would make roughly another 30 hp (rear wheel). The 708 cam (5-8 hp) and porting the intake (5-10 hp). It would be nice to have another 50 hp to the rear wheel.
In my neck of the woods I run approximately 3 mph less than a stock z06 in the qtr mile. I also know a a guy that has an 08 ls3 vette and he did a cam change and exhaust and his car runs about 5 mph better than my car in the qtr. Last, i saw a stock gtr trap 6 mph higher and close to 3/4 of second better et and we are both on street tires.

RPM9000 did you get your car dynoed?

*******************
Well I would highly recommend thin head gaskets and a milled Greg Good port job for the heads. If you want to stay NA then thats where the big jumps are found.

 

[Jack B]

Thanks for all the comments guys.

How rough is the 708 cam? I am thinking about a 708 cam when I fix my scratch in the cylinder wall but I am afraid of the car being very rough at 500 rpm. I want to end up with 180 psig cranking cylinder pressure (10-10.2) compression. High compression and 1.7 high lift rockers exacerabates cam lope. Comments?




The 1996 RT/10 is the first car that has OBD2 and can be programmed by an SCT tuner. This is the only gen I car that tunes like a gen II, III etc.

My upgrades were about 3 grand for the head work using used valves. $600 for the rockers, $250 for the strong rods to push the beehive springs, and $500 to get the valves adjusted and push rod lengths done by a pro, $1000 for SCT tuning to get my air fuel correct and $100 for a used set of gen II injectors from Archer racing.

If any of you guys want to talk about mods give me call at 770-377-3703. PM me with your email address and I will send over the dyno sheet.

Eric

A couple of suggestions/insights: If the idle bothers you raise the idle rpm to 750 with the SCT X2. The oem idle is 670, not 500, the hash marks are deceiving. Don't fixate on cranking pressure, it is not always linear to comp ratio. If anything, a higher compression can smooth out cam issues.

A question, how do you plan on fixing the nick in the cyl wall.

 

[eucharistos]

.....Everybody there got to see my very special set of heads for the ACR...............

 

[ericj96]

No picks sorry