Chuck 98 RT/10
Enthusiast
5 points would be safer.
Here is a interesting thought or question on 5 point harnesses...
- Thread starter Chuck 98 RT/10
- Start date
Anthony - 98 GTS
Enthusiast
Seems like during side-impacts people are having injuries from hitting their side/ribs into the center console. I think 5 points would be safer.
SteveBCloud9
Enthusiast
From a safety standpoint, Dodge engineered a safe vehicle to travel in, just like any other car with seat belts and an air bag. For MORE protection I would think the harness would be an added plus. Then again, I do not have any proof of this to back up my claim, so my OPINION would be that the harness offers added protection in SOME circumstances. It may prove worse in others. I'd be nice to see some tests.......
jimandela
Enthusiast
I added the 5pts because i felt they would be safer than just the stock belts when the top is off. Don't want to be ejected in a wreck.
Tony Cantafio
Enthusiast
I think Officer Friendly is right: 5-points are illegal on the road. Seems there's a problem in the event of an accident that folks coming to your rescue would not know how to undo the belts.
Obviously, that does not apply to the track, assuming you have qualified corner workers.
Obviously, that does not apply to the track, assuming you have qualified corner workers.
jimandela
Enthusiast
i asked my local PD about the legal issue of my 5pts. His reply was so long as you are wearing something we are happy. Just getting people to wear a stock belt is a major chore.
but the NYS DMV wasn't as nice they said the following:
I have received your email regarding a 5 point safety harness. There is no prohibition in the Vehicle and Traffic Law against wearing the 5 point harness. However, you are required, at minimum, to wear the seat belt that is in the vehicle when sold by the manufacturer.
I trust this information assists you.
DMV Counsel's Offic
but the NYS DMV wasn't as nice they said the following:
I have received your email regarding a 5 point safety harness. There is no prohibition in the Vehicle and Traffic Law against wearing the 5 point harness. However, you are required, at minimum, to wear the seat belt that is in the vehicle when sold by the manufacturer.
I trust this information assists you.
DMV Counsel's Offic
There are several sad and gruesome anecdotes about previously living Viper owners wearing OEM belts, or no belts.
There are only "Amazing Tales" of stunned onlookers who responded to harnessed street and track drivers, amazed to find them alive and virtually unhurt. Or crewmembers who expected incapacitated or dead drivers and found minumal injury.
In my opinion: case closed.
There are only "Amazing Tales" of stunned onlookers who responded to harnessed street and track drivers, amazed to find them alive and virtually unhurt. Or crewmembers who expected incapacitated or dead drivers and found minumal injury.
In my opinion: case closed.
Skip White
Enthusiast
Just how much trouble is it to bucle up in the five point harness?And what about getting out?I am sure it gets easy with time but how much easier?Does the passenger have much problem on the first time? I'm sure they are much safer than O.E.M.belts. Ergonomics,practicality,general comfort,Just how much of a give and take item do we have here? Please no coments on whats your life worth to ya.................
Tony Cantafio
Enthusiast
Well, if you get 5-points, make sure you get two sets. I don't think a passenger would feel comfortable with OEM belts and the driver with 5-points. I'm sure Jon B will make you a deal. I know he uses his a lot, especially doing absolutely perfect 360s at the track!
GTS Dean
Enthusiast
5-points are safer, period.
This BS about a Good Samaritan not knowing how to undo a harness latch is just so much stuff and nonsense. The latch is right there between the belly button and the '****, where all the belts come together. You either grab some 'lever thingy' and pull, or twist the friggin' knob. Even a ***** could figure that out.
This BS about a Good Samaritan not knowing how to undo a harness latch is just so much stuff and nonsense. The latch is right there between the belly button and the '****, where all the belts come together. You either grab some 'lever thingy' and pull, or twist the friggin' knob. Even a ***** could figure that out.
Tony Cantafio
Enthusiast
GTS Dean: I know 5-points are safer, and you know they are safer.
Question: Why aren't they installed in all cars? My guess is that it's hard enough to get people to buckle up OEM belts, let alone 5 points. Finally, there are a lot of morons on the road.
Question: Why aren't they installed in all cars? My guess is that it's hard enough to get people to buckle up OEM belts, let alone 5 points. Finally, there are a lot of morons on the road.
GTS Dean
Enthusiast
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Tony Cantafio:
My guess is that it's hard enough to get people to buckle up OEM belts, let alone 5 points. Finally, there are a lot of morons on the road.
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
Bingo!
Hey, you noticed that too?
My guess is that it's hard enough to get people to buckle up OEM belts, let alone 5 points. Finally, there are a lot of morons on the road.
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
Bingo!
Hey, you noticed that too?
GTS Dean
Enthusiast
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by GTS Dean:
Even a ***** could figure that out.
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
Which brings up another crucial point -
What about all the morons that might happen upon a Gen1 Viper (crashed or otherwise) and not know where the door handle is?
It happens........
Even a ***** could figure that out.
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
Which brings up another crucial point -
What about all the morons that might happen upon a Gen1 Viper (crashed or otherwise) and not know where the door handle is?
It happens........
SAM Team
Enthusiast
BAKNBLK95RT,
I have done all that you have mentioned in one accident. The cause "total" brake failure why we do not know...This is just my 2 cents worth after reading all the accident information our friends have shared with US and living through my accident without a scratch with the exception of a busied shin that I did not even notice to a few days later. I figure this is from my right leg be extended to the floor at impact and getting hit by the stuff underneath the dash, other than that nothing.
The thing I have noticed from everyone else is they seem to be getting thrown around in the car where I did not. I think for two reason the 5 point Team Tech belts and my size. I am a fairly bulky guy at about 290 lbs, I am constantly re-tighting my belts as I drive at the track because you are losing weight and they become lose. I really think the 5 point Team Tech belts, my size which did not allow me to shift even though I did not have a racing seat, and the tightness of the **** pit my head hit the roof before going to far forward saved my life and did not allow me to even get a scratch. My full faced helmet has some nice scratches on it where I must have hit the ground at some point. I did not even realize both air bags had deployed until it was all over the belts kept us away from them.
Just imagine the weight of your upper body getting thrown against one thin strap at 55 plus mph, ask Afy or our friend from NC they can tell you, not to mention the left and right movement. I can tell you what it feels like not to move, it sure is a lot better feeling and the outcome was much better....
Bottom line from my point of view anyone who puts one on the track 5 point is a must, just think it through. The street you need to weigh your odds of being in an accident like this, the odds are pretty good you will, you just do not know when it is your turn for someone to pull out in front of you...or maybe you push it a little to hard for the conditions. I remember during my interrogation by the insurance man he wanted to know why we were driving with helmets and 5 point seat belts on, he was trying to prove his point that we were racing, then he said why don't you use them while we are on the street??? My comment to him, we are a "fool" if we do not, because of what happen to me could have happened anywhere....it was going to break it was just a matter of when and where.
The following is part of the note I wrote to my close friends about the accident.
I have had my Viper/ACR five point harness system replaced with the Team Tech belts, which probably saved our lives these are great safety belts. The Team Tech seat belts came apart very easily at the 5 point buckle but I could not get the cross over strap up at the chest undone (this takes an additional 20 seconds, lesson, tie a string to the D buckle so you can find it quickly for those of you who have these type of belts), I could not see it with the full face helmet on. I panicked a little and told myself calm down, find it and undo it. It seemed like forever but I managed to get it unhooked. The lesson to learn here is never let someone buckle you in the car "you" do it in the "blind" and learn it and practice getting out of the car. Sean manages to get out(he did not buckle the cross over strap) he is "standing on" the passenger side of the car and pulls me up and out.
Sorry about the long note but this is like therapy for me.....If my accident saves one life or someone from being hurt for life then it was worth it. But we (I) have to learn from it to make it worth it!!!!
I have done all that you have mentioned in one accident. The cause "total" brake failure why we do not know...This is just my 2 cents worth after reading all the accident information our friends have shared with US and living through my accident without a scratch with the exception of a busied shin that I did not even notice to a few days later. I figure this is from my right leg be extended to the floor at impact and getting hit by the stuff underneath the dash, other than that nothing.
The thing I have noticed from everyone else is they seem to be getting thrown around in the car where I did not. I think for two reason the 5 point Team Tech belts and my size. I am a fairly bulky guy at about 290 lbs, I am constantly re-tighting my belts as I drive at the track because you are losing weight and they become lose. I really think the 5 point Team Tech belts, my size which did not allow me to shift even though I did not have a racing seat, and the tightness of the **** pit my head hit the roof before going to far forward saved my life and did not allow me to even get a scratch. My full faced helmet has some nice scratches on it where I must have hit the ground at some point. I did not even realize both air bags had deployed until it was all over the belts kept us away from them.
Just imagine the weight of your upper body getting thrown against one thin strap at 55 plus mph, ask Afy or our friend from NC they can tell you, not to mention the left and right movement. I can tell you what it feels like not to move, it sure is a lot better feeling and the outcome was much better....
Bottom line from my point of view anyone who puts one on the track 5 point is a must, just think it through. The street you need to weigh your odds of being in an accident like this, the odds are pretty good you will, you just do not know when it is your turn for someone to pull out in front of you...or maybe you push it a little to hard for the conditions. I remember during my interrogation by the insurance man he wanted to know why we were driving with helmets and 5 point seat belts on, he was trying to prove his point that we were racing, then he said why don't you use them while we are on the street??? My comment to him, we are a "fool" if we do not, because of what happen to me could have happened anywhere....it was going to break it was just a matter of when and where.
The following is part of the note I wrote to my close friends about the accident.
I have had my Viper/ACR five point harness system replaced with the Team Tech belts, which probably saved our lives these are great safety belts. The Team Tech seat belts came apart very easily at the 5 point buckle but I could not get the cross over strap up at the chest undone (this takes an additional 20 seconds, lesson, tie a string to the D buckle so you can find it quickly for those of you who have these type of belts), I could not see it with the full face helmet on. I panicked a little and told myself calm down, find it and undo it. It seemed like forever but I managed to get it unhooked. The lesson to learn here is never let someone buckle you in the car "you" do it in the "blind" and learn it and practice getting out of the car. Sean manages to get out(he did not buckle the cross over strap) he is "standing on" the passenger side of the car and pulls me up and out.
Sorry about the long note but this is like therapy for me.....If my accident saves one life or someone from being hurt for life then it was worth it. But we (I) have to learn from it to make it worth it!!!!
Tom Welch
Enthusiast
Tests have proven that 5 point harnesses are far superior to standard 3 way factory belts. Look up "Calspan" for all kinds of OEM automotive tests.
All sanctioning bodies of racing either mandate or strongly recommend 5 way harnesses for entry into events.
Whiplash(which causes upper spine injury/brain injury, etc) is another facet of a collision, and It sounds like the poster may be confusing this seperate issue with that of seatbelt restraining systems. You can use a neck collar which is similiar but more comfortable than the device being used by NASCAR and others presently.
Remember that your politician and corporate america have benefited for years from the style of passenger restraints in the cars they build. Consider this; how would the insurance companies like it if all cars came from the factory with roll bars, 5 way harnesses and other safety devices that are proven to allow the occupant to WALK AWAY from 300+ MPH crashes. Snobby old farts might complain that its uncomfortable and takes a extra few seconds to buckle in, but they may have never been to a head on crash scene and witnessed the carniage.
Just my $ .02 once again. Note: my performance packages all include roll bar and harnesses as passenger safety is our number 1 concern.
Tom
Http://btrviper.com
All sanctioning bodies of racing either mandate or strongly recommend 5 way harnesses for entry into events.
Whiplash(which causes upper spine injury/brain injury, etc) is another facet of a collision, and It sounds like the poster may be confusing this seperate issue with that of seatbelt restraining systems. You can use a neck collar which is similiar but more comfortable than the device being used by NASCAR and others presently.
Remember that your politician and corporate america have benefited for years from the style of passenger restraints in the cars they build. Consider this; how would the insurance companies like it if all cars came from the factory with roll bars, 5 way harnesses and other safety devices that are proven to allow the occupant to WALK AWAY from 300+ MPH crashes. Snobby old farts might complain that its uncomfortable and takes a extra few seconds to buckle in, but they may have never been to a head on crash scene and witnessed the carniage.
Just my $ .02 once again. Note: my performance packages all include roll bar and harnesses as passenger safety is our number 1 concern.
Tom
Http://btrviper.com
silverviper
Enthusiast
Officer Friendly sure seemed to be amazed when he pulled me over and saw me wearing the ACR 5-points. "Buckled in there real good, aintch?" "Are those things legal? Don't look legal to me, son." Of course I may have done an illegal u-turn. The horror! Anyway, I wear the harnesses sometimes on the street, but oddly enough they seem to convince the boys that you're driving recklessly instead of driving more safely. Just my experience...
ACR Joe
Enthusiast
My $.02 worth .....
I've worn the five-points on the street because I thought they looked really cool when cruzin (silly but true). Reality is that the loss of cabin mobility greatly exacerbates the Viper's sail-panel blind spot rendering the use of such belts unquestionably hazardous. On numerous occasions, I was forced to release the belts to gain a better line of sight. As a result, I would strongly discourage the use of five-points restraints on the street.
I've worn the five-points on the street because I thought they looked really cool when cruzin (silly but true). Reality is that the loss of cabin mobility greatly exacerbates the Viper's sail-panel blind spot rendering the use of such belts unquestionably hazardous. On numerous occasions, I was forced to release the belts to gain a better line of sight. As a result, I would strongly discourage the use of five-points restraints on the street.
GTS Dean
Enthusiast
Joe,
That minor inconvenience can be cured by the application of a small convex spot mirror in the outside corner of the stocker.
That minor inconvenience can be cured by the application of a small convex spot mirror in the outside corner of the stocker.
