Is the economy really this bad................

[99 R/T 10]

When you see a 99 RT sell for this:

eBay Motors: Dodge : Viper (item 110207531092 end time Dec-30-07 07:44:35 PST)


And a really nicely done GTS go for this:

eBay Motors: Dodge : Viper (item 320199441222 end time Dec-30-07 10:15:00 PST)

You have to wonder where it will end?

If I hadn't already commited to my B/W, that GTS would have been mine.

 

[FinalEd357]

Those deals are crazy, the GTS just insane! Over $150k invested, sold for $44k...

 

[Twister]

I beleave the economy really is that bad.....

Here in hawaii a decent 4 bed room home in a halfway decent area will set you back 600-700K....Thats 4-5 grand a month just for a OK 2000 square ft home in an OK neiborhood...

Then for a decent car/Insurance/cheap gas at 3.30 a gallon theirs another 1000 gone per month....

So your talking 5-6 grand a month just for a decent 2000 square ft home and an OK 30 grand car...Add on utilities/Insurance/food/clothing/recreation and your at a minimum of another 1000 per month ( and thats assuming it's just you or you and your significant other)

Now your at 6-7 g's a month just to have an average life style..That 72-84 grand cash a year. Wich means that in order to have this average life style you need to be making 100K a year by your self or you and your significant other are making 50 K a year a peice.....

Point is that hardly no one makes 100K a year and usually both partners arent bringing in 50K a year...So many people ( atleaste here in hawaii) who have pretty good jobs making 50-70K a year are really struggling...And I mean scared to buy food at mcdonalds struggling. I know many of them personally...

Fortunatly/Unfortunetly in a time when many are struggling My Liquor store is exceeding...Still makes me feel bad though

 

[Lee00blacksilverGTS]

READ the ebay ads. Lousy feedback, one with 0 and the other with 87%. Mileage statement issues with the rt10 and a custom job on the GTS that only the creator could love (If you're gonna do a GTSR Replica find some decals) and neither are low mileage, so probably the only bids were the buddy shill bids. Worry about the economy or the low price of Vipers when you hear about a confirmed non ebay sale of a low mileage car with no stories.

 

[98viperGTS]

^ Exactly.

 

[Sam 01 RT10]

Lee's right, especially on the car with the mileage issue. A title listed TMU, or true mileage unkonwn is equal to a salvage title. I won an ebay auction a few weeks ago for what appeared to be a clean, average mile graphite 02 RT 10. Upon arrival, the car smelled so musty, I started pulling things apart, and found rust where none should be. Thankfully, the seller is taking the car back, but I'm out shipping two ways.
I'm planning on finding another, but will stick to the legit dealers, not the wholesalers.
Caveat emptor.

 

[AFL in NJ]

When the middle class or upper middle class have credit crunches, plus the housing market going soft, it means that prices for disposable items such as a Viper get a little soft.....that being said, if you're sitting on cash, this is a great time to be a buyer!!

Regards,
Aaron

 

[rmani]

combo of what everyone above has already said.

ebay scares away people with cash that are ready to buy. viper market is also very soft as is the market for other high performance cars. middle class is really feeling the crush from a poor stock and housing market, and horrific gas prices.

it's definitely a nice time to be a buyer

 

[viper spray]

If you know E-bay , you know that these cars are not really being sold as stated in the auction...........

 

[thebigsnake]

Somebody please ask Gregg Jackson to help in two weeks.
He rules the public's opinion on old car values.

He was so ******* Ferraris in past years, that they had to start their own little circuis auction to keep used Ferrari prices high.


Jerry.

 

[FrankBarba]

Upon contacting the owner of the GTS with some questions which i thought were normal. the only response i rec'd was "Maybe". I was not longer interested.

 

[Red Mist Viper]

Just a little off topic, but the Viper listed below appears to be a pretty good deal for the money, however I find it interesting there have been no bids. Probably because of timing and a few other things already mentioned.

eBay Motors: Dodge : Viper (item 270199133731 end time Jan-03-08 07:33:01 PST)

 

[PDCjonny]

Although the economy is certainly soft especially for Vipers and other higher dollar sports cars, Ebay "incredible" deals always seem to have a hidden story about them. There is always something that is not quite right.

 

[agentf1]

READ the ebay ads. Lousy feedback, one with 0 and the other with 87%. Mileage statement issues with the rt10 and a custom job on the GTS that only the creator could love (If you're gonna do a GTSR Replica find some decals) and neither are low mileage, so probably the only bids were the buddy shill bids. Worry about the economy or the low price of Vipers when you hear about a confirmed non ebay sale of a low mileage car with no stories.

Exactly.

I don't think I would want either one of those cars even at those prices.

Nice Viper are few and far apart. I looked for close to a year before I found mine and paid top dollar for it. You get what you pay for. I continue to follow the market and in the 6 or 7 months I had mine I "may" have seen 1 or 2 others that I would have considered buying at best.

 

[whitebluevipe]

let's think about this: 150,000 invested? the owner only states it's a replica car with 600 hp. no other specific description at all. if i put 150,000 into a car i would have two pages of desription of everything that was done to it!! blatant lying. i am suprised he got as much as he did.

 

[TAXIMAN1]

READ the ebay ads. Lousy feedback, one with 0 and the other with 87%. Mileage statement issues with the rt10 and a custom job on the GTS that only the creator could love (If you're gonna do a GTSR Replica find some decals) and neither are low mileage, so probably the only bids were the buddy shill bids. Worry about the economy or the low price of Vipers when you hear about a confirmed non ebay sale of a low mileage car with no stories.

could not have said it better myself...

Car#1 is a recreation at best, and the color/decal combo will turn ANY purist off..

Car#2 has stores..... A Canada car, miles not accurate, and yes, it was probably shill bidded..

You can go bny Ebay final sale prices to determine the condition of the car market..

 

[Dealmaker]

Exactly.

I don't think I would want either one of those cars even at those prices.

Nice Viper are few and far apart. I looked for close to a year before I found mine and paid top dollar for it. You get what you pay for. I continue to follow the market and in the 6 or 7 months I had mine I "may" have seen 1 or 2 others that I would have considered buying at best.

..............

 

[99 R/T 10]

READ the ebay ads. Lousy feedback, one with 0 and the other with 87%. Mileage statement issues with the rt10 and a custom job on the GTS that only the creator could love (If you're gonna do a GTSR Replica find some decals) and neither are low mileage, so probably the only bids were the buddy shill bids. Worry about the economy or the low price of Vipers when you hear about a confirmed non ebay sale of a low mileage car with no stories.

Even with the possible issues, if the car checked out(detailed inspection), at $30K you can't lose. You could probably part the car out for that much money, but it would make a great track rat or ****** .

I love that sceme on the the GTS, saw one done up very similar sell for $80K a few years back. Again, I would have it checked it out, but if clean and dyno proves the HP, helluva buy!on

 

[Custom Builder]

If you know E-bay , you know that these cars are not really being sold as stated in the auction...........

I bought both of my GTS's on Ebay as well as my wifes NSX. I got great deals on all 3. I don't know about those two, but there are some unbelieveable deals on 97's right now for some reason.

 

[InjectTheVenom]

Regarding that GTS-R clone... I seem to remember someone did a limited series of Vipers done up in that fashion, however I can not remember the exact details. I did see someone post about it a looooong while back though.

 

[ViperTony]

Yes, the economy is really that bad, for now. I suspect the majority of people are over-extended with their credit...rising adjustable ARM mortgages, 2nd, 3rd home equity lines of credit tapped out and the toys have to go. It will get worse before it gets better and I believe there will be better deals to be had out there soon. Hold on tight.

 

[00SVTdubs]

never did I think Id end up selling my viper for 37.5k and buying a 2000 sq ft house on a huge body or water for under 200k but I just did both.... I also picked up an 04 subaru sti for 18.5.

if you wait, you can find amazing deals on almost anything these days

 

[pdmracing]

saw a 97 red gts from a local quality dodge dealer this weekend listed for 31K!

 

[thebigsnake]

What's the big deal? The original buyers didn't worry about getting good value for their money when they bought these cars new. Why should they worry about good value when it's time to dump them?

The good thing about all this is that reality is pervailing over obsurdity.
Sports cars are for driving and enjoying that experience. These cars should be in this group's hands. Classic sports cars are not investments, or substitude mediums for wealthy people's equity, to be hoarded in warehouses.

What's bad is an old Mustang that because it came with a couple of thousand $ option originally, costing $300K today. Which enthusiast could afford to use that as a regular driver?

 

[ViperJay]

Yes, the economy is really that bad, for now. I suspect the majority of people are over-extended with their credit...rising adjustable ARM mortgages, 2nd, 3rd home equity lines of credit tapped out and the toys have to go. It will get worse before it gets better and I believe there will be better deals to be had out there soon. Hold on tight.

tony hit the nail on the head there. its going to get much worse, imo. im banking on a stiff recession in 08 lasting through 09. high end vipers will be very soft as will real estate. those sitting on piles of cash will find a buyers market in a year that will be like a "going out of business sale" on everything. cash is king .

 

[DAMN YANKEE]

Jackson spoke this morning on CNBC (largest auto dealer)...folks, its THAT bad.

 

[dave6666]

I've got all of the market speculators and watchers beat. Here's how:

Bought my car to drive, and use it to carry my money to a bank where I invest it.

Like all of my possessions it is not for sale, making the value irrelevant.

Oh yeah... I lied. All of my possessions are for sale for market price plus 50%. No questions asked, cash only.

 

[ViperJay]

"carry my money to a bank where I invest it."

if its gonna get bad, just be careful how that bank invests it. i agree with you that if your not planning on buying or selling, its an irrelivant point. those that are buying or selling should take heed.

 

[DAMN YANKEE]

Dave you and I have got to party sometime...

 

[RTTTTed]

You guys are whinning about paying only $3.20 for gas???? Try paying $5.00 like we do in Canada. The government (alberta and Federal) probably charge $over a dollar for their taxes, then the BC/Provincial government charges another $1.00 for their stinkin' taxes = $3. for gas and $2. for taxes!

And whining about housing in Hawaii? Same price for a house in Vancouver. Property taxes are nearing $700/month, what the Provincial Government calls "Social Services Tax" of 10% or more on Electricity, car registration, Property Transfer tax on any house or business that you buy, $10 SS tax on each phone bill, ***** by BC Government insurance, etc. etc. I personally don't know anyone (except a few millionaires) that make over $50-60,000 per year! It was announced that BC properties and prop. taxes went up an average 15% last year!

But, don't worry, it's getting worse. SS tax, enviromental taxes are going to have their names changed and then we'll get new, bigger "Green" Taxes next year, the year after that, and so on. Too late to whine now, either start screaming about it or join the homeless, lol. Oh yah, I forgot, they're going to build Billions worth of homes for the Homeless out of the tax moneys - that should raise the taxes quite a bit. Especially when the world's homeless are all moving here, lol.

What a joke!

Ted