MIchelin Pilot Sports on the track (road course)

[Docta Vipa]

I bought a brand new 2001 Viper GTS ACR in March, 2003. It has the original Michelin Pilot Sport tires on it. After 4,000 miles and about eight track days (road course only), I am wondering whether they have lost some of the grip. How much does sitting around for two years affect the rubber? Is the rubber nearer the center of the tire harder, and therefore less grippy?
Thanks.

 

[Chuck 98 RT/10]

Heat cycling affects the tires a lot regardless of wear. I'm not sure what the optimum is but eight track days is probably in the middle somewhere. It makes no difference to me since mine are usually in the shape of a stop sign after that many track days. LOL

 

[Stephen Yap]

Doc, why do you think the tires have lost some grip ? With less tread it should actually be better. Tire temp, tire pressure, track conditions are also factors. I don't have the Sports but the MXXX are good once I get rid of the old hard rubber on the surface.

 

[Docta Vipa]

I have been told that the rubber is harder toward the center of the tire. Maybe I am racing against too many folks who are on race tires and just expecting too much out of these. I assumed initially that less tread would be better (like on shaved race tires) but I have been told that this is not the case with street tires, apparently. The track was very hot on Monday, at Thunderhill - over 100 degrees, and my lap times were off by a few seconds - I could not do better than 2:13. I was running about 29-30 psi front and rear.

 

[Chuck 98 RT/10]

I was running about 29-30 psi front and rear.

psi sounds low to me. I start out at 36/32 front/rear cold and usually drop a pound or so from there depending on handling. It's amazing what 1 psi difference will do.

 

[TOOOFST]

The rubber is harder toward the center,i've been told many dealers aside from trying serveral sets.The newer the pilot and rubber the better.

 

[Jack B]

Scott:

Remember the MXX3's had a wear rating of 140, versus, the new Pilot's with a WR of 220.

 

[Gavin]

HEAT CYCLES, HEAT CYCLES, HEAT CYCLES - Skip preaches 16 heat cycles and a set of tires are done - this is for slicks.
My experience is like Chucks - I get three track weekeends out of a set of tires - by then they are either square, particularly the right front, or the tread is gone (Michenlin Sports)

Luck

 

[SoCal Rebell]

8 track days=32 heat cycles=dead tires. The hotter the track (100+ degree) the slower the lap times, tires get greasy QUICK. I start with 32-30 f/r air pressure to where it's at 40/38 f/r HOT. If you wanna go faster at Thill (my favorite track) get a track alignment and put on a set of Michelin Pilot "CUP" tires, you'll be amazed!

 

[Docta Vipa]

Thanks for the wealth of good information. Sounds like I will go ahead with my plan to replace my tires before my next track day. Regarding those Pilot Cup tires, Ron, how do they compare with Hoosiers (stickiness, cost, longevity, in the rain, etc)? I understand that I can flip the Hoosiers on the rim to extract more life out of them after the edge gets worn, but cannot do this with the Cups because of the tread pattern.

 

[SoCal Rebell]

The Cups are 1-2 seconds slower then Hoosiers but 3-4 seconds faster then the pilots (cups are 80 treadwear to the pilots 220). Yes you can flip Hoosiers but can't drive em on the street, with the cup tires just go to the tire shop and have em "flipped" on the rims. Whatever you do make sure you get a track alignment.

 

[Stephen Yap]

How do the Kumhos compare to the Cups and the Hoosiers ? They have a treadwear rating of 50. From that you would assume they would slot between the Hoosiers and the Cups. My track wheels are 17" and I don't think Michelin has the sizes for those wheels.

 

[SoCal Rebell]

Kumhos & Cups are pretty equal

 

[Tpup]

Panorama (Porsche Club Mag) did a back to back test on the same car, same track, same driver, etc. Cups were 2 seconds per lap faster than Kumhos and had better wear...

Roy

 

[Docta Vipa]

Sounds like the Cups might be the way for me to go. It would be very nice not to have to change tires when I get to the track (and not to have to lug them there either.) Basically I drive my snake to and from the track, ON the track, plus a few miles to work and back each week.

 

[George Murray]

In West Virginia, those things are called "Tars."

 

[SoCal Rebell]

Sounds like the Cups might be the way for me to go. It would be very nice not to have to change tires when I get to the track (and not to have to lug them there either.) Basically I drive my snake to and from the track, ON the track, plus a few miles to work and back each week.

Docta, I think the cups are a wise choice for your applications, at the very least get a "semi" track alignment (-1.5 front, -1.0 rear camber) This will make you turn better, make the tires wear better on the track and is very streetable. When the outside edge of your tires start to wear just flip em on the rims.