New Purchase Questions

[mtmclaughlin]

I looked at a first generation RT/10 this week and I love the car. I have a few questions/concerns though before I make a decision on this one. The car has great paint, a had top, and looks pretty much original. Oh, and new tires! My questions:

1.) There was obviously a piece missing from the roll bar. It is the black piece of trim that runs along the front of the bar (i.e. if you stick your right arm straight up while driving and let it rest backwards, it should hit this piece). The owner said his car didn't come with this piece, so it's probable that the first owner lost or broke it. Isn't this where the soft top latches to the car? Any idea how I could replace this if I buy this one?

2.) How loud are these cars from Dodge? He said it had OEM mufflers, but it was pretty loud. Not unbearable... in fact, it sounded absolutely awesome, but I didn't think cars were this loud from the manufacturer.

It had some normal aging issues I think, and I accept that in a car that was built when I was 10. (I have aging issues too.) It ran great though and I absolutely am going to buy one. My aim is to buy an unmodified (or relatively unmodified) 1993-1995 car.

 

[impalassed]

It sounds like the sport pad had been removed. Depending on the hard top ( factory or aftermarket) it may need to be removed for proper hard top fitment as in the case of one variety of aftermarket types I know of. There are at least 2 dealers I know of that are helping us out by buying and parting out wrecked Vipers. I have bought several items(and need a few more) from them. Bet one will have exactly what you need. Soft top will clip into the two small slots on top of the "roll bar". It's more cosmetic than a true roll bar BTW.

Loud. No. Typical to sound like a UPS truck.... Yes. Mine is (er... Was) all stock. Well the exhaust system still is at any rate.... I would venture to guess there are hi flow cats on it as well as a different muffler. But that is just a guess.

Best of luck to ya in your search! I hope you find the right one and enjoy it for years to come.

 

[Zee]

They are not loud at all. I test drove a 94 with a stock exhaust and it sounded very quiet.

I'd highly consider test driving a Gen II as well. Not sure what your budget is but I was given some words of wisdom because i also was going to buy a Gen I since it fit my budget better. However, I am so glad I went with a Gen II instead...there are small creature comforts that make it a much better driving experience (again, just my opinion). Some people love the raw Gen I feel.

 

[Doug Supercharged Vipers]

The car you looked at may have a Mopar hard top. That is a good thing. Mopar tops on Gen I cars would ONLY fit if you removed the sport bar pad.

Sound: Question is, does it have cats? Removing cats on a Gen I will make it sound much louder/deeper even with mufflers.

Additionally: If you do purchase a Gen I R/T, make sure the head gaskets have been updated to the newer MLS set. A lot of cars have had the procedure done although the gaskets may have been replaced with the same.

Best of luck!

Doug

 

[mtmclaughlin]

I just looked up the Carfax on this thing and apparently it was totaled in Florida in 2008 and has a junk title. What do I do?! I was ready to move forward and buy it, but I can't buy a car I can't get titled. I'm really worried now. The ad also calls it a 1995 but the Carfax says it's a 1994 (the door sticker says built 3-94). Is there another source I can check? Carfax has a complete record for the car while it was in Florida. Rear end damage, car was totaled, carries a junk title.

 

[terminator02]

Mtclaughlin,

I highly suggest you begin right now to take emotions out of your purchase/search. There is noting to be worried about as you haven't moved forward. There is no reason to verify if it is a 94 or 95. It was totaled, my guess is the price is not being indicative of it being totaled (if you have an idea of pricing of these cars). If you don't know about pricing, then I think you need to take some time to educate yourself a bit more on pricing, what to look for and exactly what type of car you really want to get. I am not a mechanically inclined person and have been fortunate to have a VCA member in Michigan help me when I needed it. However, one thing I am good at, is patience and taking emotion out of my purchasing. When I was searching, I relentlessly searched for about a year. Members on this forum actually gave me some respect because I had a price point that a few scoffed at but even some of the people I turned down said "at least he is willing to search and stick to his price." I wasn't low balling, but I was looking for something pretty specific within my budget and looking for a good deal. A deal is a bit different than a flat out insult low ball. So I can already tell you are a bit emotionally connected to something you should definitely walk away from.

Rear end damage must have been HUGE and likely heavy frame damage. Florida is also known, to the best of my knowledge, of needing a good viper person to look over the car becaues many cars can have problems that are not even detected on Carfax, searches etc. This ad, by your description, wreaks of an uneducated seller, or just someone really trying to be deceptive.

Walk away. However, if you want help, then please post the ad and pictures, post your price and budget and also what is important to you (your purpose). Maybe you are a great mechanic looking for a project and this is a perfect car; however I don't think this is the case based on the way you have been writing. We are here to help.

 

[mtmclaughlin]

Thank you for the advice. I thought I had been doing this smartly, but it is obvious that I wasn't.

I will talk to the seller. In the mean time, I was given the name and phone number of a local VCA person up here in MD/VA (I live near Baltimore). I will call him tomorrow and see what he recommends.

**The seller just told me he doesn't have a junk title. So I am wondering what really happened. If anyone has Carfax access, the vin is 1B3BR65E2RV101516.

Can somebody ballpark a fair price for a 1994-1995 RT/10? KBB.com is way off. It seems as if most e-bay cars are going for between 25-30k with clean titles. Much less if they have salvage titles. This was listed at 28k.

 

[mtmclaughlin]

I just realized that I may have posted this in the wrong forum. Maybe I should have posted in the new owner forum? I apologize if I did this wrong. But again, thanks for all your help!

 

[BlknBlu]

Do not settle on a car, get what you want.

Bruce

 

[mtmclaughlin]

Well, what do you guys think about e-Bay? This listing: http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/1994...1015532?pt=US_Cars_Trucks&hash=item4d1263d9ec illustrates exactly what I want. I love that color, but black is great too. I love those wheels too. I am just looking for a good car for around 25k. It doesn't have to be perfect or low mileage, but unmodified is a huge plus to me. Small modifications, like shift knobs, aren't a big deal because I can easily change that.

That e-bay car may very well go for much more than 25,000, but it is what I am looking for. (I'm sure it probably belongs to a forum member. )

 

[impalassed]

While I am an e-Bayer.... I personally would not buy a car that way. You will find what you want. As a point of reference. I paid $26,400 for my '94 18k miles in 2009.

 

[LifeIsGood]

There aren't many pictures on that ebay ad. It's very hard to tell, but the pictures look like the paint finish needs some work. It looks to have the MGW AC control knobs, cigar lighter and ash tray cover...all upgrades. The gaps between the hood and front fascia look good. That's all I can tell about it.

 

[terminator02]

The ebay car is OK. 25-30k is about right for a clean gen I. I am assuming you realize the wheels of that car is stock so it's easy to have them. The problem I have with that car is that there are stres cracks on the hood; the most expensive part of the car. I'd pass on that on as well.

Check autotrader as well. As for the first car; just walk. Even if not a salvage, it's probably not worth your time further investigating. There are too many non-storied cars that can be had for 25-30k on a Gen I. Prices are going up but are NOT going up fast enough to fret. I bought my 2000 ACR in 09 with 14,800 miles for 37k. I'd say it's about worth that much money today as a reasonable price to sell with almost 28k on the clock.

What's your budget? A salvaged gen I is a VERY hard sell as prices are pretty low on those cars but there is still a "bottom" where a car and the parts alone are worth money. If you buy a salvaged with good work done to it and NO frame damage AND you don't plan on selling the car, then a salvage car may be worth buying for saving some money. However the price difference between a salvaged Gen I is going to be less than a Salvaged Gen II. For example a 99 with 15k miles and no stories could be worth 40-43k. A salvaged 99 with 15k miles may be worth 32k. I would think only a few thousand will separate cars when you are already dealing with claen title cars going for 25-32.

 

[mtmclaughlin]

... The problem I have with that car is that there are stres cracks on the hood; the most expensive part of the car. I'd pass on that on as well.

So the stress cracks... he says they're in the paint, but I don't know what a stress crack comes from. I think it wouldn't be uncommon for a body part that's as big as the Viper's hood to flex a bit and crack the paint over the years. But is it a common issue for the hood itself to crack? Is a crack in the paint on the hood OK, but a crack in the hood itself much worse? I don't mind imperfections in the paint on a 20 year old car.

I asked for clarification from the seller and some better pictures.

My budget is dependent on the car, but I'd say $25,000 would be a happy place for me. I don't expect to spend much less but I can spend a little more.

I hope I'm not asking dumb questions. What else would you recommend I ask this e-bay seller (or any other seller for that matter)?

 

[CajunMojo]

Are you dead set on a Gen I? Assuming you are willing to go with the salvage title route, you can get into a Gen II in your price range.

 

[mtmclaughlin]

I'm pretty much set on the Gen I. I like the looks the best on the first generations. So beautiful, so minimalistic.

 

[dru282]

A gen one is a great value as long as you get the right one. Many have been abused and you need to keep an eye out for it. I too am from Maryland and if you need any help just pm me anytime and we can talk. Good luck

 

[mmcc269]

I've been down this road.... And have looked at over 10 Gen 1s before finding a bream car. I also wanted a 93-95 RT and came across the right one in Ohio - I live in NJ and finally settled on a price with the owner and had it delivered.

Please do your home work - my car looks brand new with zero issues which you can find.... Also the more documents about the car the owner has the better... Helps tell a story!

Feel free to message me also should you have any questions.

 

[Nickel]

I bought a 94 with 4K miles on it. Plenty of good ones out there.

 

[mtmclaughlin]

You have all been very helpful and I am grateful for your support. I will keep pressing on until I find the right one!

 

[mrbob]

got my 1994 . with 3,100 miles on it 3 1/2 years ago like new for $25,500. happy as can be . like an idiot i took the motor apart and made it the way it should be . got mine on ebay but i brought a check with me when i picked up the car just in case something was not right . if you can try to get one within driving distance . and do what i did , just to protect yourself . ask lots of questions here , any question even ones that you think are dumb . better to do that than get burned . make sure you get what you want . i always say let the buy come to you ,don't just buy anything . you will regret it later . where are you located there are a lot of people that would be happy to help you here , good luck . enjoy

 

[mtmclaughlin]

where are you located there are a lot of people that would be happy to help you here , good luck . enjoy

I live outside of Baltimore, MD.

 

[PittsburghRT]

I'll sell you mine. I have my eye on a GTS. PM me if interested.

 

[mtmclaughlin]

I'll sell you mine. I have my eye on a GTS. PM me if interested.

I'm interested. I PMed you.

 

[Bugman Jeff]

So the stress cracks... he says they're in the paint, but I don't know what a stress crack comes from. I think it wouldn't be uncommon for a body part that's as big as the Viper's hood to flex a bit and crack the paint over the years. But is it a common issue for the hood itself to crack? Is a crack in the paint on the hood OK, but a crack in the hood itself much worse? I don't mind imperfections in the paint on a 20 year old car.

Viper hoods can crack easily if they're repeatedly closed improperly, and when they do, it's more than just the paint that pops. If you have it repaired, they'll have to sand down into the fiberglass to completely remove the crack or it will reappear in short order. Or, you can just live with the cracks for now.

As for the previous car, for a prior salvage car, you can generally knock 20% off the book value, even if everything is repaired perfectly. As has been said, there are many pristine Gen Is around with clean titles in your price range. For the car you describe, I'd only pay a bit over $20K. There's nothing wrong with a properly repaired salvage car, but it will always be worth less than a non-salvage of similar quality.

 

[mtmclaughlin]

Viper hoods can crack easily if they're repeatedly closed improperly, and when they do, it's more than just the paint that pops. If you have it repaired, they'll have to sand down into the fiberglass to completely remove the crack or it will reappear in short order. Or, you can just live with the cracks for now.

As for the previous car, for a prior salvage car, you can generally knock 20% off the book value, even if everything is repaired perfectly. As has been said, there are many pristine Gen Is around with clean titles in your price range. For the car you describe, I'd only pay a bit over $20K. There's nothing wrong with a properly repaired salvage car, but it will always be worth less than a non-salvage of similar quality.

Thank you for the insight. I appreciate your help. So it seems as if the cracks are possibly just a cosmetic nuisance if they're small. I am still waiting for clarification and pictures from that seller. Hopefully I'll know more in a few hours.

 

[slysnake]

As for the previous car, for a prior salvage car, you can generally knock 20% off the book value, even if everything is repaired perfectly. As has been said, there are many pristine Gen Is around with clean titles in your price range. For the car you describe, I'd only pay a bit over $20K. There's nothing wrong with a properly repaired salvage car, but it will always be worth less than a non-salvage of similar quality.

That's pretty sound advice. Basicly, if you are worried about resale, don't buy a prior salvage car. If you want to drive it, they can be a good deal.... IF ... the repairs were done well. You really need to get it checked by a neutral party that knows what they are doing.

 

[mtmclaughlin]

What do you guys think about this one? http://www.carsforsale.com/used_cars_for_sale/1994_Dodge_Viper_207443948_12

I love road trips. I can't imagine a more fun trip than fly and drive! I would just have to go out there prepared to buy a plane ticket home if it's not right.

 

[Nickel]

Would be nice if they would show the top and windows. Probably no AC since they dont list it. Probably not a big deal if your in a northern state. I cant drive mine during the summer days since I have no AC. Feels like an oven!

 

[klamathpro]

Take your time dude. My red 94' is in equal or better shape and I have both tops, AC, head gaskets done, B&B exhaust, 405rwhp at the dyno, perfect original interior with no dash scratches, with 26k miles and I would not be asking more than $28k. Make sure that the head gaskets were replaced because it's not a matter of if they will go bad, it's a matter of when they will go on the GEN1's. It's a $1200-$1600 job to have a good shop do it. Also, stress cracks in some spots, like on the hood, are common, as long as it's just the paint and not the fiberglass.
I'll sell you mine for $26k right now if interested, I want a GTR to go along with my GTS. (Or looking for a Lambo)