Next mod: headers vs VEC2 vs rockers?

[MoparMan]

I'm trying to figure out the next mod to the car (already have the Mopar cat back, smooth tubes and K&N's) and am considering the following:
1) VEC 2
2) Headers (probably the Belangers from Fat Albert)
3) Mopar rockers
Any and all advice would be appreciated.

 

[mntngts99]

What about gears? I did the K&N's,smooth tubes and cat back and it was ok. Then the 3.55 gears,which are great. Nitrous is a blast! Now Roe S/C with Nitrous. Depending on what you plan to do with the car, gears are a mod I would do over the others on your list.

 

[Jack B]

Everything works better when the exhausts are opened up. Use that as your first building block. You will see many posts where the hp seems good after a mod, however, when you look closer, if the car does not have headers the hp and especially the torque are very peaky and drop off very quickly. It is especially noticeable on N2O cars, without headers the torque drops like a lead balloon.

 

[IEATVETS]

Do 3.55's really that much of a difference? What is it like? The 3.07's **** for launching and are not that bad when you mash the gas in 2nd gear while going 60 but is it a good mod to do? Inquiring minds want to know!

 

[Russ M]

On a creampuff rockers will probably be best gain.

 

[Got_Vnum]

Do 3.55's really that much of a difference? What is it like? The 3.07's **** for launching and are not that bad when you mash the gas in 2nd gear while going 60 but is it a good mod to do? Inquiring minds want to know!

HUGE difference! Feels like 40-50 hp, will really help your launches, makes 6th gear actually usable. Well worth the $850 or so. IMHO, should be your second mod after smooth tubes/filters.

 

[STUGOTS]

well I have a 99 (non cream) and I got a nice diffrence from the jesel 1.7 rockers and also not a really nice gain from the vec and im heading up to VOS tomorrow to have the vec to tuned on a dyno to get a little more out of it.

I have yet to do headers so can't help ya there.

 

[Snakester]

I added the VEC1 and although it didn't add gobs of power on the dyno, it made the car feel better overall, in the same way that it feels better running in cold air.

The RRs made more power, but were more pricey.

And I didn't get headers, but I'd suspect that they would easily provide 2X the power of RRs, and 3X the power of the VEC, but they are relatively expensive.

The gears don't add any power to the Viper, but they feel GREAT! As if the car is in the meat of it's power curve in nearly any gear.
Plus the car actually pulls well in 5th with 3.55s, while still providing an overdrive in 6th for comfortable highway cruising.

 

[ChicagoGTS]

If you've got $4000 burning a hole in your pocket, spend a few more and get the roe blower that comes with the Vec2. All of that other crap you could pick up for pennies on the dollar in the classified's. Do some due diligence and you'll find that there are about a half-dozen people with Roller-Rockers on there garage floor that they were going to get installed but never did. I bought my belanger exhaust system off the classifieds from a guy in FL. for $1400 headers and all. Honestly with all the TT setups these days S/C kits are becoming available for amazing prices. However, I am real leary about buying used "Mechanical parts" but last I heard Jason Heffner was re-installing them for people. But something like headers, why spend $1800 when you could catch someone bringing there car back to stock and grab them for half of that. Besides, you make 550/575 with the blower kit with out any other bolt-on's. But if push come's to shove your car needs to breath, If you can only choose one get the headers.

~Matt~

 

[MoparMan]

Thanks for all the info. I'm a little skeptical about the gains from headers as I've heard a few times now that they won't show much improvement on a 2000. I'd like to stay away from power adders such as nitrous and a blower for right now because of the pistons and rods in the creampuff engine. As of right now I'm leaning towards the rockers followed by a VEC2 with a good dyno tuning.

 

[BJH1]

I added the VEC1 and although it didn't add gobs of power on the dyno, it made the car feel better overall, in the same way that it feels better running in cold air.

The RRs made more power, but were more pricey.

And I didn't get headers, but I'd suspect that they would easily provide 2X the power of RRs, and 3X the power of the VEC, but they are relatively expensive.

The gears don't add any power to the Viper, but they feel GREAT! As if the car is in the meat of it's power curve in nearly any gear.
Plus the car actually pulls well in 5th with 3.55s, while still providing an overdrive in 6th for comfortable highway cruising.

How much mph do you lose on the top end with 3.55 gears?

 

[Makara]

Rockers sound like they might be a good mod for me. What rockers would work best with a 2002 GTS?

Big difference in price between these
http://partsrack.blastmart.com/customer/product.php?productid=1343&cat=172&page=1

and these

http://www.roeracing.com/ProductCart/pc/viewPrd.asp?idcategory=10&idproduct=173#details

 

[mntngts99]

Gear chart shows at 6000 rpm's in 5th gear with 3.55 = 173 mph.

 

[Jack B]

Moparman:

I lot of comments are missing the point, not only are the headers going to give you the biggest power increase (usually @5200 rpm), but, more importantly nothing is close to increasing the area (big midrange increases)under the full curve which is what gets you down the track the quickest. Once again look at any modded car without headers and the midrange is anemic, torque drops off dramatically. I have all three mods and they are all documented on the dyno.

 

[mntngts99]

Jack B is right,If you are looking for Dyno # and HP. If you want a smile on your face then go with the gears.

 

[STUGOTS]

Jack what headers do you suggest?

 

[Jack B]

There is a lot of argument of which is better, the Belanger's or B&B's. My 97 was an honest 442 hp with the Belanger headers and exhausts (no cats and only mod at that time). I think that is consistent with several other posts on this board.

 

[REDSLED]

I have had Belangers, Borlas, TNT and even Edelbrock on previous Vipers and all were within 5-7 HP of eachother. There's a good chart on www.dcperformance.com that lists the pros & cons of many brands of headers. Good luck.

 

[MoparMan]

I'm leaning towards the roller rockers due to ease of install and the fact that I have line on a decent price on the Mopar rockers. Does anyone have a before and after dyno run for the Mopar rockers?

Headers are definitely high on the list so I'll probably look at doing those next.

 

[J DAWG]

look in Jack B's gallery. I believe he netted a little over 20 rwhp, but I think that was with exhaust already in place. Hard to compare exactly, but most see 15 to 20 at the wheels, but most probably have exhaust as well.



I put the rr's on with stock exhaust, but did not dyno. There was a noticeable difference in performance and sound.


John

 

[99 R/T 10]

I have both the B&B headers and Mopar rockers for sale(check the classifieds). Pm me if interested.