NO SRT-10 COUPE!

[Venom Lover]

Sorry I've been out of the loop for a few days. Very busy at work. You know, have to do some work to be able to afford Viper goodies. Anyway....

Steve,
I never said Dodge was misleading anybody. Strictly speaking, you are correct that Dodge is producing what it showed (though I don't know if the VGX coupe was shown as a street legal car vs. a track only car, since I never went to a car show before this year). I'm just questioning the wisdom of a marketing strategy in which, apparently, there would've been great interest in a street-legal coupe, and in fact many would've preferred it to the SRT, and in the end, we will only be rewarded with another street legal coupe if sales for the SRT are stellar. I don't get the logic or the strategy there, but I'm not saying Dodge mislead anybody.

Joe,
We asked for a convertible? I guess I haven't been around long enough (only since May of '00), but no one asked me. And based on the "pockets of resistance" that we've seen here to the actual version of the convertible that Dodge decided to produce, perhaps the question was ill-posed. I.e., I believe many people asked for a true convertible -- just not this exact one. With all due respect, the competition coupe is out of my price/practicality range, since I go road racing about 3-4 times a year, and I don't have a truck and trailer, and I'm just a working stiff. And practicality issues notwithstanding, I'm not even allowed to buy one, based on the rules that were established.

Mike B,
Yeah, car sales are way up, but based on what I've heard, one major reason for that is 0% APR financing, which is not available for the Viper. It's a very different thing for someone to decide to risk it and buy a long-overdue new $20K minivan for the family because the financing terms are so good, vs. buying an $80K toy with 5.9% financing.



<FONT COLOR="#ff0000" SIZE="1" FACE="Verdana, Arial">This message has been edited by Venom Lover on 04-16-2002 at 08:14 PM</font>

 

[Joseph Houss]

Venom Lover,

Good points once again.

Lets just keep a wait and see attitude. Can we agree to revisit this two years down the road.... and can the victor say.....


I TOLD YOU SO?

 

[Venom Lover]

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by CobraCam:
I'm actually much more concerned about how the aerodynamics of the SRT are going to be changed. From what I hear, we have a convertible here capable of topping 200mph. That's no small feat, since Lambo's latest offering tops out at the SAME place.
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Obviously, we all have different criteria regarding what we'd like to see in the new Viper, and no one is right or wrong about their individual preferences. Richard seems to think that there are convertible-haters here, and maybe there are, but I'm not one of them. I love the Ferrari 355 Spyder, for example. So I don't mind that the SRT is a convertible per se.

However, sacrificing good looks for aerodynamics leading to the ability to cross the mythical 200 mph top speed threshold seems silly to me. I'm one of those guys who doesn't care what the car can do on paper; I only care what it does for me on the street and at the track. In the half-dozen road racing events and numerous drag racing events I've been to over the last year and a half, I don't think I've been over 140 mph. Nor do I ever drive any where near the top-end capability of my current Viper on public roads. So, what do I care if the new Viper can go 200 mph, vs. 189 mph or whatever top end for my GTS? Irrelevant, except for bragging rights, which I could give a sh** about. But obviously others have a different opinion on this matter, and I respect that!

For me, I'd sacrifice several hundredths or even a tenth of Cd to have more outrageous styling that is "useful" every single day, in that you get to look at the car every single day.

 

[Venom Lover]

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Joseph Houss:
Venom Lover,

Good points once again.

Lets just keep a wait and see attitude. Can we agree to revisit this two years down the road.... and can the victor say.....


I TOLD YOU SO?

<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Fair enough! I'm already used to a steady diet of crow!

 

[KenH]

Why don't they just drop the VGX motor into the current GTS body and keep it around along with the SRT-10 for those who want to race or prefer the more aggressive GTS look? Seems like it would be the best of both worlds.

--- Ken

 

[Lee00blacksilverGTS]

Bought a new book last weekend, DODGE VIPER by Daniel Carney. Whole section and pics. on the new car and it's development.
John Fernandez being quoted....."VGX designers knew they needed agressive styling, but they also had to to have a body that used the wind to best advantage." "The wind tunnel doesn't appreciate the beauty of flowing curves, so they are largely absent from the VGX." "We wanted to spend a lot more time in aerodynamic analysis of the car," Fernandez said. "The original car spent a lot of time trying to stay true to the styling exercise that was shown at the North American show in 1989. In order to do that we had to make some aerodynamic compromises." "This time we hadn't shown any car so we knew we could go to the wind tunnel with the design exercises Tom Gale and his group were working on. We spent a trmendous amount of time in the wind tunnel, to make sure that we got the maximum amount of leverage from the style of the body. And we've gone to a flat-bottomed car with a full belly pan." "THE FRONT OF OUR CAR, EVERY LITTLE DETAIL IN THE GRILL OPENINGS TO THE RADIUSES WE'RE USING ON THE FASCIAS AND EACH EDGE, WAS WORK WE DID IN THE WIND TUNNEL. EVERY LITTLE PIECE OF AIR WE GET GOING INTO THIS THING IS PURPOSEFUL, TO COOL THE BRAKES, TO COOL THE ENGINE, AND TO GET AIR INTO THE INTAKE SYSTEM. WE SPENT A LOT OF TIME ON THE FRONT END OF THE CAR.
The caps are mine to draw attention to the front end comments. I for one after reading this book would hope that DC is not going to pay any attention to Mcguire and whoever else keeps griping about the hood scoop or anything else about the front. The thing that really amazes me is that you guys all love the comp. coupe and it's the same car from the doors forward, INCLUDING THE MUCH MALIGNED SCOOP! It just does'nt show as much with the stripes on the coupe. I bet this car is going to run 200mph, and I don't want to read later this year that it won't because DC listened to some whiners and substituted form for function. Don't get me wrong. I love my GTS and I'm keeping it, and I love the comp.coupe. But let's at least respect the engineering that went into the front of this car. Now if they would only tack the back of the comp. coupe on. Whoops! now I'm complaining. Interestingly enough the book does not address any comment about aerodynamics of the rear. And the comp. coupe and the SRT are sure different in that regard! And I much prefer the coupe. But again if the aerodynamic function of the SRT demands the style it's got now, than I say leave that alone too.

 

[Steve Ferguson]

Mr. D-Dog, you might want to get a copy of the former Chrysler company hand-book. Since the company I work for provided Chrysler a portion of the Mandatory benefit insurance, I can state to a fact that Chrysler has to have an age limit, since it becomes to costly to get re-insurance for high salary executives after certain ages. Lutz was the first executive to EVER get the two year extension on that rule, but it dramatically affected the cost Chrysler had to absorb just to keep him aboard. Know since you obviously know EVERYTHING, and I am sure that you are going to come back with, "well then, how did GM get past that factor"? Easy, GM and Ford are SELF-INSURED, while Chrysler is not. If you need that clarified let me know.

As for modifications, to each his own. But I will say that there is nothing more gratifying than a bone stock Viper kicking the crap out of a modified version. I love the expression you see on an owner who invested in the car rather than himself, it's priceless. If a modified wins it's the car. If a Stock wins, it's the driver. I guess I am satisfied knowing I make a difference rather than someone else's effort.

 

[John ACR]

Wind Tunnel BULL!
Look at all of the race cars out there from F1, CART, LeMans, etc... and supercars the last time I saw something racing without curves was the other evening on speedvision a repeat from the runoffs "A FORD CORTINA." They are boxy, but good.
BULL!
ENUF said.

 

[Mike Brunton]

John ACR,

Are you saying it's bull that the SRT was designed to be aerodynamic? So are you also claiming that, because it is curved, the GTS is, in fact, aerodynamic?

If so, I have a bridge I'd like to sell you.

Curves do not equal aerodynamics. Look at the CART and Formula 1 cars - while they are curved, they have a lot of sharp lines and angles than any Viper does. The Corvette is alot more "angled" than the Viper, and is WAY more aerodynamic.

If you have an insight into aerodynamics that we don't have, then perhaps you could get a job at PVO teaching them the things that they (obviously) don't understand?

 

[DEVILDOG]

Steve,
Seems to me DC should wise up and become self-insured like the big boys you mentioned. Obviously, they are risk adverse which explains the less dynamic SRT-10 styling since Lutz and other risk takers left.

 

[Steve Ferguson]

Dog, self-insurance is a big risky game. At some point in the future DC will get into it, but at this point they are putting 40 billion into new products over the next five years.

BTW. The original head of Chrysler design Tom Gale, still under contact at DC, was very involved in selecting this new body. This design was something brought on by many factors, one of the main ones being the input owners made at various VCA gatherings, the goal of high performance vs. looks, and the opportunity to produce a different version of the car we all love. Was it the right one? Personally, I wanted the mid-engine Viper, but that was not the direction they chose to go in. I also think that "civilizing a Viper (ie. air, windows, and now dead pedal and convertible top) are WRONG. But that is my opinion. You obviously love the GTS for more the looks, since you know you can add as much power as your heart desires. Now which one of us is right? Both, since we both write the checks to purchase whatever pushes our personal enjoyment buttons. Let's face it, if they made Vipers to order (to suite everyone's particular likes and dislikes) there would 12,000 different versions.