V10 MOJO
Enthusiast
im considering the roe s/c when it comes out. recently ive been thinking about NOS also. what are the prosa nd cons to nos? whats recommended? cost? etc.
NOS questions
- Thread starter V10 MOJO
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MadMaxx
Enthusiast
For cheap power, the juice can't be beat.
However, it's not on all the time like a blower, and can be just as dangerous as a blower if not used correctly. A lean burn condition will toast pistons within a few seconds. You have to refil the bottle at 30$ a tank (roughly, after taxes and junk). To get the best setup, you have to buy lots of extras (window switch, bottle heater, remote opener, purge lines, etc. etc.).
However, if pure quarter mile bang for the buck is your goal, then you cannot beat the value of the laughing gas.
I love power all the time, thats why i'm a blower/turbo guy. But for these motors, the nitrous setup seems to fit very well, keeping the internals stock and visualy unchanged for the most part. Although having a propane tank a few inches behind me is a bit unnerving...
MadMaxx
However, it's not on all the time like a blower, and can be just as dangerous as a blower if not used correctly. A lean burn condition will toast pistons within a few seconds. You have to refil the bottle at 30$ a tank (roughly, after taxes and junk). To get the best setup, you have to buy lots of extras (window switch, bottle heater, remote opener, purge lines, etc. etc.).
However, if pure quarter mile bang for the buck is your goal, then you cannot beat the value of the laughing gas.
I love power all the time, thats why i'm a blower/turbo guy. But for these motors, the nitrous setup seems to fit very well, keeping the internals stock and visualy unchanged for the most part. Although having a propane tank a few inches behind me is a bit unnerving...
MadMaxx
V10 MOJO
Enthusiast
I think ill just stick with the supercharger, thnx maxx for the input, and when i move down, ill se ya at a show or event sometime. Im driving down (family trip, Imdriving viper solo; no one likes to ride with me, LOL) end of july to myrtle beach
MadMaxx
Enthusiast
If you ever need a place to take the family for the weekend in the upstate lemme know. We got a lake house and a mountain house (in TN) than you can use if you wanted.
James
James
SneakyPete
Enthusiast
rdustman,
I am going to run both. I am going to use the ROE Supercharger as my base power plant package along with B&B header/cat bat, filters and smooth tubes.
I am over a Sean's place atleast once a week. He is finishing up the aluminum intake manifold now for the SC, and is going to have additional blowoff plate or valve, in case you get a backfire on nitrous.
Then I am going to have Tom Welch from BTR Viper, put on a 2 stage 300 rwhp NOS/Propane/gas system. This comes with a separate fuel cell for NOS/Propane injection, which insures rich fuel mixture. I dont want this power all the time, but when I need it, flip the switch and its show time.
The Roe SC at 5/6 PSI(motors with cast pistons) will give give you about 100rwhp, at 8 psi(forged pistons) I think its 175rwhp. These are not exact numbers, but close.
The BTR 2 stage Nos/prop/gas setup is 300 rwhp.
you figure stock car 97 gts: 405 rwhp, then the headers, cat back, tubes and filters another 75.
475 rwhp + roe sc 175 rwhp + BTR 2 stage 300 rwhp= 950 rwhp for about half the price of what these tuners want for a 800 rwhp twin turbo/super charger setup and alot less maintence nightmares in the long run, no open heart surgey on the viper.
Really depend on your budget.
<FONT COLOR="#ff0000" SIZE="1" FACE="Verdana, Arial">This message has been edited by SLITHRN on 05-30-2002 at 10:06 AM</font>
I am going to run both. I am going to use the ROE Supercharger as my base power plant package along with B&B header/cat bat, filters and smooth tubes.
I am over a Sean's place atleast once a week. He is finishing up the aluminum intake manifold now for the SC, and is going to have additional blowoff plate or valve, in case you get a backfire on nitrous.
Then I am going to have Tom Welch from BTR Viper, put on a 2 stage 300 rwhp NOS/Propane/gas system. This comes with a separate fuel cell for NOS/Propane injection, which insures rich fuel mixture. I dont want this power all the time, but when I need it, flip the switch and its show time.
The Roe SC at 5/6 PSI(motors with cast pistons) will give give you about 100rwhp, at 8 psi(forged pistons) I think its 175rwhp. These are not exact numbers, but close.
The BTR 2 stage Nos/prop/gas setup is 300 rwhp.
you figure stock car 97 gts: 405 rwhp, then the headers, cat back, tubes and filters another 75.
475 rwhp + roe sc 175 rwhp + BTR 2 stage 300 rwhp= 950 rwhp for about half the price of what these tuners want for a 800 rwhp twin turbo/super charger setup and alot less maintence nightmares in the long run, no open heart surgey on the viper.
Really depend on your budget.
<FONT COLOR="#ff0000" SIZE="1" FACE="Verdana, Arial">This message has been edited by SLITHRN on 05-30-2002 at 10:06 AM</font>
MadMaxx
Enthusiast
Next time your over there, ask when he will adapt the kit to gen1 cars eh? I still want one for my 96 RT..
MadMaxx
MadMaxx
Butch The Snake
Enthusiast
I choose my NOS system over a supercharger because it's easy to install and easy to use. It's also a lot cheaper to compared to a blower and can be easily serviced.
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SneakyPete
Enthusiast
MadMaxx,
thought you were going to a gen 2 GTS??
<FONT COLOR="#ff0000" SIZE="1" FACE="Verdana, Arial">This message has been edited by SLITHRN on 05-30-2002 at 10:07 AM</font>
thought you were going to a gen 2 GTS??
<FONT COLOR="#ff0000" SIZE="1" FACE="Verdana, Arial">This message has been edited by SLITHRN on 05-30-2002 at 10:07 AM</font>
MES
Enthusiast
So SLITHRN, your saying that your going to put a 8 lb supercharger + 300 shot on a stock motor? Have you talked to any of these guys about this? Seems like a good combo to grenade your motor with
Seriously I don't think it's going to work unless you don't use more than one bottle per year.
I'm also considering something like that since I already have nitrous, but much milder (650-700 rwhp)
Also your numbers seem optimistic
Bolt on's will get you in the 440 rwhp range
Based on 85 rwhp w/5 lb boost = 17HP/lb so 8 lb boost = 135 rwhp
BTR N/G/P = 300 shot or about 200-225 rwhp but with a blower it may get you 300 rwhp
total = 775-875 rwhp
Too much power for the street to say the least, and enough power to break stuff at the track... and that's the way I like it
I'm also considering something like that since I already have nitrous, but much milder (650-700 rwhp)
Also your numbers seem optimistic
Bolt on's will get you in the 440 rwhp range
Based on 85 rwhp w/5 lb boost = 17HP/lb so 8 lb boost = 135 rwhp
BTR N/G/P = 300 shot or about 200-225 rwhp but with a blower it may get you 300 rwhp
total = 775-875 rwhp
Too much power for the street to say the least, and enough power to break stuff at the track... and that's the way I like it
SneakyPete
Enthusiast
MES,
There just rough numbers. I talked with Tom Welch about getting one of his twin turbos a month ago. He called and wanted to know when I wanted my NOS kit installed, but had troubles with my 2001 motor, so I could not do it.
He said they were running about 700 rwhp with the Twin turbo car and if that is not enough, he said he would wet it down.
what was listed above is my basic initial plan, I wont use the NOS that much, only when I run into really fast cars or to give someone a real joy ride.
After what I just went through with Chrysler with my lemon law deal and them not wanting to fix a new car, I might just do the exhaust, headers, filters, tubes and a 355 rear gear.
let me know what you are planning to do.
<FONT COLOR="#ff0000" SIZE="1" FACE="Verdana, Arial">This message has been edited by SLITHRN on 05-30-2002 at 10:07 AM</font>
There just rough numbers. I talked with Tom Welch about getting one of his twin turbos a month ago. He called and wanted to know when I wanted my NOS kit installed, but had troubles with my 2001 motor, so I could not do it.
He said they were running about 700 rwhp with the Twin turbo car and if that is not enough, he said he would wet it down.
what was listed above is my basic initial plan, I wont use the NOS that much, only when I run into really fast cars or to give someone a real joy ride.
After what I just went through with Chrysler with my lemon law deal and them not wanting to fix a new car, I might just do the exhaust, headers, filters, tubes and a 355 rear gear.
let me know what you are planning to do.
<FONT COLOR="#ff0000" SIZE="1" FACE="Verdana, Arial">This message has been edited by SLITHRN on 05-30-2002 at 10:07 AM</font>
MES
Enthusiast
That's cool
Well I have BTR heads now which I'm going to put on in a couple of weeks. The nitrous is a PITA so I'm thinking of ditching it in favor of a supercharger later this year. But then I'm thinking I'll be lucky to sell the nitrous kit for half of what I paid for it, so might as well keep it, and since it's on the car now, might as well use it
So I'm thinking motor w/heads ~500 rwhp + supercharger (6 lb) = low 600's then maybe a small shot (75-100) on top, just for luck
MadMaxx
Enthusiast
SLTHRN:
I am planning on a second car next year, a coupe project (rebuild). If I track it (trying to get into it slowly) then a blower is not what I need... too hot.
We'll see where things go. Next year will be a slower year... no wedding to worry about
MadMaxx
I am planning on a second car next year, a coupe project (rebuild). If I track it (trying to get into it slowly) then a blower is not what I need... too hot.
We'll see where things go. Next year will be a slower year... no wedding to worry about
MadMaxx
Snakester
Enthusiast
I would have doubts about being able to keep the engine together very long with a blower AND nitrous.
And please guys, don't call it NOS.
N20 or nitrous is correct, NOS is a brand name.
It's like calling every soda pop Coke.
I'm still wondering whether to install my NX nitrous setup on my Viper.
I pulled it off when I sold my Corvette, and I'm wondering if it's wise to put it on the Viper.
Like MES, I'm sure that I'd only get half what I paid for the setup if I tried to sell it, and it looks like it would cost only about $150 to adapt my N20 setup to the Viper.
But I'm new to the car and I'm still getting used to the regular 400rwhp. Maybe when I get beat up on the track I'll start heading down that never-ending power upgrade path.
-Dean.
And please guys, don't call it NOS.
N20 or nitrous is correct, NOS is a brand name.
It's like calling every soda pop Coke.
I'm still wondering whether to install my NX nitrous setup on my Viper.
I pulled it off when I sold my Corvette, and I'm wondering if it's wise to put it on the Viper.
Like MES, I'm sure that I'd only get half what I paid for the setup if I tried to sell it, and it looks like it would cost only about $150 to adapt my N20 setup to the Viper.
But I'm new to the car and I'm still getting used to the regular 400rwhp. Maybe when I get beat up on the track I'll start heading down that never-ending power upgrade path.
-Dean.
SneakyPete
Enthusiast
Sheyster,
I dumped my 2001 lemon back on Chrysler, Got a 97 GTS now, got a love forged pistons and a hot cam.
It is just a general plan, I am going to start with the supercharger and then see what I can get away with after that.
MES,
I hear those BTR heads, with a cam and nitrous kit will really make the car move.
MadMaxx,
I am going to go over to Roe Racing tomorrow, right after I pick up my check from Chrysler and start spending it. I am one of 5 on Sean's Pilot list for the Supercharger, get a preproduction version, get to try it out, and give him feed back. I will let you guys know how it goes.
<FONT COLOR="#ff0000" SIZE="1" FACE="Verdana, Arial">This message has been edited by SLITHRN on 05-30-2002 at 10:07 AM</font>
I dumped my 2001 lemon back on Chrysler, Got a 97 GTS now, got a love forged pistons and a hot cam.
It is just a general plan, I am going to start with the supercharger and then see what I can get away with after that.
MES,
I hear those BTR heads, with a cam and nitrous kit will really make the car move.
MadMaxx,
I am going to go over to Roe Racing tomorrow, right after I pick up my check from Chrysler and start spending it. I am one of 5 on Sean's Pilot list for the Supercharger, get a preproduction version, get to try it out, and give him feed back. I will let you guys know how it goes.
<FONT COLOR="#ff0000" SIZE="1" FACE="Verdana, Arial">This message has been edited by SLITHRN on 05-30-2002 at 10:07 AM</font>
varanus
Enthusiast
It seems the general feeling is that supercharger plus nitrous equals 800hp equals blown motor. Just curious as to why people think that. Don't the DLM cars have 800hp and stock internals?
Not flaming, Just curious because I am thinking the same path as slitherin.
Not flaming, Just curious because I am thinking the same path as slitherin.
MES
Enthusiast
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>It seems the general feeling is that supercharger plus nitrous equals 800hp equals blown motor. Just curious as to why people think that. Don't the DLM cars have 800hp and stock internals?
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
I don't think it's fair to compare a DLM car to a DIY (do-it-yourself) car. Which is what your doing by slapping on a supercharger from X tuner and using Y's nitrous kit. The two were never designed to go together. Even on DLM cars I don't think he makes a supercharger with nitrous on a stock motor.
Adding small shots of nitrous to a supercharged or turbo car is fairly common but they are always small shots (V-8's w/75-100 and 4 or 6 cylinders with 50-75) to use both, typically the engine was built, or it came from the factory with a supercharger/turbo (extra strong motor from the factory) How many Camaros or Mustangs with stock motors do you know that's running a blower and nitrous? None that I know of. There is a limit to what a motor can take before it becomes a ticking time bomb.
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
I don't think it's fair to compare a DLM car to a DIY (do-it-yourself) car. Which is what your doing by slapping on a supercharger from X tuner and using Y's nitrous kit. The two were never designed to go together. Even on DLM cars I don't think he makes a supercharger with nitrous on a stock motor.
Adding small shots of nitrous to a supercharged or turbo car is fairly common but they are always small shots (V-8's w/75-100 and 4 or 6 cylinders with 50-75) to use both, typically the engine was built, or it came from the factory with a supercharger/turbo (extra strong motor from the factory) How many Camaros or Mustangs with stock motors do you know that's running a blower and nitrous? None that I know of. There is a limit to what a motor can take before it becomes a ticking time bomb.
USAF BAD ASP
Enthusiast
I would like to pick up a used nitrous system if someone wanted to unload one. Email me if you've got something. Thanks!
varanus
Enthusiast
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by MES:
I don't think it's fair to compare a DLM car to a DIY (do-it-yourself) car. Which is what your doing by slapping on a supercharger from X tuner and using Y's nitrous kit. The two were never designed to go together. Even on DLM cars I don't think he makes a supercharger with nitrous on a stock motor.
Adding small shots of nitrous to a supercharged or turbo car is fairly common but they are always small shots (V-8's w/75-100 and 4 or 6 cylinders with 50-75) to use both, typically the engine was built, or it came from the factory with a supercharger/turbo (extra strong motor from the factory) How many Camaros or Mustangs with stock motors do you know that's running a blower and nitrous? None that I know of. There is a limit to what a motor can take before it becomes a ticking time bomb.
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
I'm not saying that the engineering is equal whatsover on the two. What I'm trying to determine since people are only saying is it is going to be a disaster is why. No one has stated whether it is an engine strength thing or that the nitrous/sc combo will run too lean from lack of proper tuning thus hurting the motor.
What I was refering to was the fact that DLM has 800 hp on stock internals and the motors don't all seem to be blowing up. So I am assuming that all of you think that the hp level is workable as far as the engine strength (forged internal not cast years), but that the tuning of the two together will cause the motor to run lean or something will not work correctly and cause damage.
I have not heard of DLM with nitrous, but when he gets 800hp+ I don't think you need it.
As far as Camaros or Mustangs with stock motors running a blower and nitrous? I have not heard of any. But aren't all of them running with cast pistons and basically a "cheaper engine" I think many of these guys know that there are somewhat established limits of hp that those stock motors will handle and generally the combo of SC/nitrous is well beyong that. But if they built the motor up, they could run higher hp. Most at that point just start running more boost or nitrous.
"There is a limit to what a motor can take before it becomes a ticking time bomb."
I agree, I just thought that the viper engine could withstand 800hp as evidenced by the DLM cars and was perhaps built stronger than many other motors because of the forged internals.
If anyone has anything to add, i'd love to hear about it. Thanks for the input.
I don't think it's fair to compare a DLM car to a DIY (do-it-yourself) car. Which is what your doing by slapping on a supercharger from X tuner and using Y's nitrous kit. The two were never designed to go together. Even on DLM cars I don't think he makes a supercharger with nitrous on a stock motor.
Adding small shots of nitrous to a supercharged or turbo car is fairly common but they are always small shots (V-8's w/75-100 and 4 or 6 cylinders with 50-75) to use both, typically the engine was built, or it came from the factory with a supercharger/turbo (extra strong motor from the factory) How many Camaros or Mustangs with stock motors do you know that's running a blower and nitrous? None that I know of. There is a limit to what a motor can take before it becomes a ticking time bomb.
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
I'm not saying that the engineering is equal whatsover on the two. What I'm trying to determine since people are only saying is it is going to be a disaster is why. No one has stated whether it is an engine strength thing or that the nitrous/sc combo will run too lean from lack of proper tuning thus hurting the motor.
What I was refering to was the fact that DLM has 800 hp on stock internals and the motors don't all seem to be blowing up. So I am assuming that all of you think that the hp level is workable as far as the engine strength (forged internal not cast years), but that the tuning of the two together will cause the motor to run lean or something will not work correctly and cause damage.
I have not heard of DLM with nitrous, but when he gets 800hp+ I don't think you need it.
As far as Camaros or Mustangs with stock motors running a blower and nitrous? I have not heard of any. But aren't all of them running with cast pistons and basically a "cheaper engine" I think many of these guys know that there are somewhat established limits of hp that those stock motors will handle and generally the combo of SC/nitrous is well beyong that. But if they built the motor up, they could run higher hp. Most at that point just start running more boost or nitrous.
"There is a limit to what a motor can take before it becomes a ticking time bomb."
I agree, I just thought that the viper engine could withstand 800hp as evidenced by the DLM cars and was perhaps built stronger than many other motors because of the forged internals.
If anyone has anything to add, i'd love to hear about it. Thanks for the input.
Gerald
Enthusiast
Man, careful w/ that no2 on a s/c, unless you know what your doing. There's only a handful of ppl with that experience. You'll be high and dry with a viper w/ a blown motor if your not careful..
I don't know where the rumors are circulating, but I haven't turned a wrench on my car since I've gotten it..
Gerald
I don't know where the rumors are circulating, but I haven't turned a wrench on my car since I've gotten it..
Gerald
varanus
Enthusiast
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Gerald:
Man, careful w/ that no2 on a s/c, unless you know what your doing. There's only a handful of ppl with that experience. You'll be high and dry with a viper w/ a blown motor if your not careful..
I don't know where the rumors are circulating, but I haven't turned a wrench on my car since I've gotten it..
Gerald
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
What rumors? Did I miss something on this thread?
Man, careful w/ that no2 on a s/c, unless you know what your doing. There's only a handful of ppl with that experience. You'll be high and dry with a viper w/ a blown motor if your not careful..
I don't know where the rumors are circulating, but I haven't turned a wrench on my car since I've gotten it..
Gerald
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
What rumors? Did I miss something on this thread?
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