Opinions about Paxton vs. Procharger

[Doug Supercharged Vipers]

Hello Adam -


I spoke with Steve Padfield at Paxton and his general response regarding your situation was not an easy one. Please do not quote me, however, Paxton Automotive does care very much about customer relations. Steve did say there may be no simple answer to remedy your situation.

It's very difficult in the go-fast business to make everybody happy.
That's why there are different levels of systems tuners provide for their customers when making a decision to modify their car. For example, our DLM Level I, may make good horsepower and the parts we use are extremely adequate as such, but if you want better quality and more horsepower, the customer has to be willing to spend and upgrade accordingly.

As far as their kit is concerned, DLM has installed numerous "Paxton Viper Systems" (supplied by Paxton in their kit form) and the installation and performance has gone extremely well. Some parts provided are extremely well built and I guess some parts could use improvement, although, this is an "entry level" system and for what it's worth, I find it to be well engineered as a DYI bolt-on package.

Adam, I know it doesn't help your cause when others have faired better then you have, so let me know If I can arrange some kind of happy medium to help your cause. I can assure you Paxton is willing to work with me on this one - they want satisfied customers.

Hope to hear from you soon!
Doug

 

[Qualitywires.com]

Doug,

I rather you not get involved in this. At this point if Paxton wants to pay for my car to be shipped to you to be tuned with no expense out of my pocket, then we could talk. I appreciate your concern and would rather talk to you in person because I DO not want any bad blood between us. I have a lot of respect for you as a person, but this Steve Padfield guy is hiding many different things about this Paxton kit.

Doug, I understand you trying to moderate things here but in my opinion, Steve Padfield can't explain what I asked him and I would love to hear his explanation because so far he has none. I have come a long ways of understanding force induction and can thank you for part of it.I have a pretty good understanding of force induction due to reseaching it quite a bit.

I hope Steve didn't call you to ask you to post something like this to try to discredit me because that would not be cool Doug and of all people you would be the last person I would think that would do that. I may get some "hate" mail over this, but you know me, if it's wrong then I am not one to bend over and take it. Doesn't matter what the outcome is, I want the truth to come out.

As far as other's have faired better than me...that's not is not entirely true. I made close to 600 rwhp but it was not at a point where it was safe. I will not quote our conversations about this.


As far as their customer service, yeah maybe they treat YOU good, but the rest they don't. That is a flat out lie. But hey I am open to solutions

Are you saying Doug this is not a DIY kit? Are you saying that only a tuner should install this due to extensive tuning that is needed?

 

[King RT10]

If ab followed the DYI instructions and there are problems then paxton should pay to fix his car. Take the car to a reputable tuner and let them decide if the install was proper. If so then paxton should pay for final repairs because they market the kit DYI.

 

[Doug Supercharged Vipers]

Adam -

There will ALWAYS be peace between us; that's why "I" wanted to get involved. I have interest in both parties, you & Paxton.

We've known each other for years without exchanging a single penny...... just friendship. I haven't any monetary interest with any of this, of course you know me better than that Let's chat and I will explain to you my end of this.

Regards,
Doug

 

[Marc Lublin]

Hey Adam,
I know you want to stick to your guns and don't want to take it in the rear from anybody, but do yourself a favor and talk to Doug. Since he's taking an interest, there may be something he can do to help you. He is the fairest in the land. Remember although you feel you have been burnt, ultimately it's about getting your car in perfect working order. Hope it turns out well!

 

[Chuck B 98 GTS]

ab,
I would listen to Doug Levin. He's definitely a man of his word. I've had the DLM version of the paxton system on my car since 1998. It's been flawless and tuned to perfection. I can't think of a better way to do it if you REALLY want to work things out. If your just venting it's not going to help your case. I hope paxton and you get things worked out.

Cheers,
Chuck

 

[Qualitywires.com]

I will talk to Doug, but to be honest here..I am really not venting. It's facts. I think Paxton should take care of not just myself but everyone else who is involved. But at the same time I am NOT going to play games on this. Count on that. If Paxton makes right, then I will be there biggest advocate, but I am not getting hopes up high.

 

[forced]

ab,
I do want to do what's right. The question is, right for who? I need to do what is right for Paxton and what is right for you, our customer. I must say that after talking to Doug last night, I realized I was thinking of another Paxton customer. (lame excuse, but it is true) So my first posts on this board and my first to you were intended for someone else. I apologize. Now that I have my ducks in a row, lets talk resolution. Doug has offered to take a look at your car. He will inspect the install, the supercharger and the rest of your car. If the supercharger pulley has not been changed and everything else is stock that would affect the way the supercharger performs, than Paxton will pay to have DLM tune your car. How does this sound?

 

[JGK95]

I hope to hear that this worked out for all involved

Jay K.

 

[Janni]

I must say that after talking to Doug last night, I realized I was thinking of another Paxton customer. (lame excuse, but it is true) So my first posts on this board and my first to you were intended for someone else.

Oh my. I sure hope the other guys initials we ab, too.

I hope this can be resolved, but I think the only reason that is might is because of Doug.

 

[forced]

Doug was a big reason (he made me realize the mistake). The person I was thinking of does not have ab as his/her initials, but I was going off who I thought he was. I should have sat down with Micah and Jamie here and planned a more...strategic approach and then I would of realized this was a different person. Whatever it is, it is not a good excuse for how I started off and I have already apologized. Now I want to get this resolved and the offer is on the table.

ab?

 

[Qualitywires.com]

We will see what happens. I do have saved emails from previous conversations that I have not brough up. But I will leave it at that.

I am not going to jump through hoops to come to some agreement due to the fact I am not wrong on what I have described. If Paxton wants to resolve this, then I will listen. I tried to resolve this "behind" doors but nothing was done. I will not post anymore about this subject until I see what kind of "right" is done.

There are many Paxton owners keeping an eye on what happens and future buyers.

 

[pullshard]

Maybe your talking about me????????????

 

[forced]

I'd rather not say who I was talking about before. I'd like to get a mullegan (you know, a do-over like in golf).

 

[JimT 99RT]

ROE ROE ROE your boat over to our side...

 

[Gerald]

Dang Adam, perhaps I"m reading this wrong? Seems like your jumping down Dougs throat after he offered to help you? wow. You really don't sound like yourself latley

 

[2002_Viper_GTS_ACR]

Maybe your talking about me????????????

OR Maybe its me ??

hmmm.. seems to be too many for him to keep straight.

Jon (not AB, but definetly a public enemy of Paxtons Viper Kit).

 

[Qualitywires.com]

Dang Adam, perhaps I"m reading this wrong? Seems like your jumping down Dougs throat after he offered to help you? wow. You really don't sound like yourself latley

Yes Gerald you are reading this wrong. Go back to bed.

 

[Qualitywires.com]

We will see what happens. I do have saved emails from previous conversations that I have not brough up. But I will leave it at that.

I am not going to jump through hoops to come to some agreement due to the fact I am not wrong on what I have described. If Paxton wants to resolve this, then I will listen. I tried to resolve this "behind" doors but nothing was done. I will not post anymore about this subject until I see what kind of "right" is done.

There are many Paxton owners keeping an eye on what happens and future buyers.

This email was not toward Doug at all. Just a response to Paxton.

 

[2MANYTOYS]

So what's the problems with the kit on the 2000-2002 cars???????????? No one has ever said either way.

 

[forced]

ROE ROE ROE your boat over to our side...

It will be my quest to change these opinions.

 

[FE 065]

ROE ROE ROE your boat over to our side...

It will be my quest to change these opinions.

You'd better hurry. Once the kit's considered dead by the Viper community, it'll be hard to resurrect.

From what I've read here, a couple suggestions would be:

Find out which Paxton parts the tuner shops are throwing away when they install a Paxton, and incorporate the same quality parts into your kit.

Find out what parts the tuner shops are adding when they install your kit that weren't there in the first place, and include them.

Do something about that crossbrace with the rod ends on it. That's not doing the same job as the OEM unit, at all.

 

[forced]

Adam,
I have talked to Doug again and I still feel that we need to have your car inspected. I know you want us to send you parts to fix your problem, but we need to know for sure what your problem is (besides just running lean). We need to know why it is and be certain. This situation would be handled the same way by a car dealer, you could not ask for parts under warranty without the dealer inspecting your car. Can you get the Viper to Doug for a thorough check up?

 

[Qualitywires.com]

Steve,

Seriously I am really getting sick of all this.

My PSI is about 95-100 on my fuel.

So yes my fuel system is fine. I am not going to ship my car across country to have the "Iraqy inspection" being done. I have no time for that and it's not worth the time and money.

So again, we are back where we stand originally.

First off I returned a faulty Bypass valve back to paxton through kelly and kelly never had my card refunded the $250 some odd dollars to my credit card.

I had a bypass valve that was stuck open intially and replaced it with a new one I got charged for but never refunded.

What part are you talking about that needs to be replaced? All the parts I have are fine besides the car running lean, some belt slippage due to a cheap tensioner, tires worn out on the inside due to a cheap cross member...I could replace parts, but I would still have the same results.

Doug lives over 1200 miles away and no I can not get it to him. We can resolve this off line or we can continue to chat live.

I'm done playing. This is rediculous!

 

[forced]

We are not where we stood originally. If DLM is too far, lets find someone closer. I only suggested Doug because you have been there before and you guys already have a relationship. Is there a reason you don't want to take the car in for an inspection? I will look into the credit for the valve that you sent back. I don't know which parts may need to be replaced, that is why I want an authorized Paxton reseller, (preferrably one with Viper experience) to look at your car. Would you be willing to go somewhere closer?

 

[Qualitywires.com]

Find someone in Louisville who is a paxton dealer and certified in Vipers installs only. Otherwise I am not allowing anyone to touch the car period. We are not going anywhere with this. There are no parts that need to be replaced. Maybe you should buy me an adequite fuel system so I not having to use suppliments such as water/**** like Doug had suggessted I use to lower A/F ratio's.

All parts are functioning fine, it's the design and fuel system that is lacking big time. I am at around 100psi in fuel pressure, that shows that the pumps are intalled correctly. What else would there be? FMU is fine with the larger 8 to 1 disk. When under boost it raises the fuel pressure. Timing is fine. Wiring is fine. It was done by my viper tech who used a factory manual.

The Paxton install is pretty straight forward and there is very little tuning that is involved in this system. The only part that is adjustable is the FMU disk.

The splic sec box is the same as it was when it came from you.

How are you going to address the suspension issue? Cheap belt tensioner issue?
(Which those items don't cause high a/f ratio's.).

HOW ARE YOU GOING TO TAKE CARE OF ALL THE OTHER PAXTON CUSTOMERS THAT ARE IN THE SAME BOAT? THEY DO HAVE THE MAGICAL YEAR OF THE 2000-2002.

 

[forced]

OK Adam, how about this: Paxton will pay to ship it to DLM. There are some conditions though. If Doug finds modifications, Paxton will not foot the bill.

 

[Joel]

I'm independent here, but seems to me like Paxton are trying hard to sort this one out

 

[forced]

You know, after offering up to ship the car to DLM, I got to thinking. Why don't we get this resolved right now. After talking with Doug, he mentioned you wanted to do some stuff to your computer anyway, why don't you pick up the cost for those mods and Paxton will take care of the other programing. This way you can deal directly with Doug on your computer and get it tweaked how you want it. How does this sound?

Now, for the tensioner, we feel that it is adequate to handle the power of a stock system on a stock motor. If you changed the pulley on the s/c or made other mods, the tensioner might not be ideal for your situation. Same goes for our fueling situation.

 

[MIKE-HKS]

well let me share an experience i had with ATI procharger
i have a procharged z06, the way they made the kit the belt always slipped, and had hard belt slipage problem. very little belt contact .
I better the kit in my house i like to do all my work on the cars.
i called procharger and spoke with one of there techs
i email him before and after pictures of how to improve the bracket set up and asked them for bigger idler pulleys and one more pulley , i also asked for them to send me a 3.85 pulley because my 4.1 which was supposed to give me 8psi was only giving me 5psi.
they said sure thing and send them next day air to my door
free of charge.
the customer is always right well sometimes
but AB sounds like he knows what he is talking about and makes sense.
these kits are not cheap so when one customer needs help and is having problems with the kit i think he should get helpped.