Problems after engine & transmission (Woodhouse) Mounts installation with Headers

[Stahlhart]

Hey Guys,

I want to wish you all a happy New Year.

I have some problems with my engine mounts (and transmission). I installed the mounts as shown in the picture below. I made the two bolts on each side not tight so that the mounts can easily slide in the slots.

You must be registered for see images attach

The mounts had different Long thread length. I installed them with the longer thread to the Body side. See link below, Also the threads are oriented to the bottom.

http://www.bilder-upload.eu/show.php?file=600ab9-1357042362.jpg

Now, everything is in the Viper again, there are following Problems:

On the passenger side the (Bellanger) Headers are too high. If they Heat up and expand, it will Hit the Body:

http://www.bilder-upload.eu/show.php?file=04e609-1357042424.jpg

So I put a water Level on my intake manifold but it seems Good:

http://www.bilder-upload.eu/show.php?file=086930-1357042478.jpg

http://www.bilder-upload.eu/show.php?file=083039-1357042521.jpg

Now I liftet the engine on the driver side by loosen the two bolts on the bracket till the Header in the passenger side go down a little bit. This was the max. and the headers would fit through:

http://www.bilder-upload.eu/show.php?file=a3ddf0-1357042573.jpg

But then the engine is not straight any more:

http://www.bilder-upload.eu/show.php?file=d564a1-1357042620.jpg

So what did I do wrong? I know the OEM engine mount on the passenger side doesn't have a "knob", but even without this "knob" I only can go higher and not lower on the passenger side.

One more problem, it's also a reason that I belief there is someting wrong. I can't re-install my Short shifter, I think the transmission is too high and so the thurst Short shifter will not fit in Position. Last Year I installed the short shifter with OEM engine & transmission mounts and it was very easy!

Hope you can help me.

Greetings from Germany

Jürgen

 

[Mad Max]

Is the car itself sitting level?

 

[Stahlhart]

Hi,

I think so, the car stands on concrete floor in my workshop. Also when it stands on the hydraulic lift it´s sitting level.

Jürgen

 

[dave6666]

I actually had to shim my engine UP when I put the Woodhouse mounts and Belanger headers in. I would check to see that everything including the brackets, are oriented correctly.

On the tranny mount, you can eliminate the preload plate; that metal spacer as people incorrectly call it. That will give you another 1/8" Also, since your engine is sitting too high in the front, that will compound the problem with your shifter hitting the top of the tunnel.

 

[Stahlhart]

Maybe you can have a look an tell me, maybe there was a fault in my way of thinking:

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The longer thread shows to body, and the thread is underneath the knob. The shorter thread goes to the bracket, the thread is on top and the knop bottom side.

You must be registered for see images

Greetings

Jürgen

 

[dave6666]

Here is a pic I took of mine a while back. It shows the locating pin to the bottom.

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If the center to center distance of the threaded stud to the locating pin are the same on each side of the mount, then it sounds like flipping it over is meaningless in regards to resulting in a different position when you are done.

The only other thing is the aluminum brackets to the engine themselves. I looked at the picture of yours and first guess is they are correct, but the pic is not at the perfect angle so I am guessing.

Regarding your concern of the pipes heating up and expanding... They will do that, but here is what direction they will go: out and down. So if they are high in the frame opening, they will after the headers heat open that clearance some. I would guess that to be maybe a few millimeters at best, that expansion.

Also, the engine torque will raise the driver side header and lower the passenger side. So if you are already high on the passenger side, the downward header tube expansion and the downward engine torque movement may be of no concern.

Here are pics of mine after I shimmed the engine up.

You must be registered for see images

You must be registered for see images

 

[rpm9000]

I was thinking about getting Woodhouse mounts for my car but if they are a big problem to install I may just pass.

 

[dave6666]

I was thinking about getting Woodhouse mounts for my car but if they are a big problem to install I may just pass.

If you would read this thread, there is a conclusion forming that indeed there is no problem. Certainly not an install problem.

 

[ViperTony]

You must be registered for see images attach

Maybe I'm still recovering from last night and my head may still be a bit fuzzy but for some reason the engine bracket in this picture doesn't seem right to me as if it's oriented upside down. Double check the orientation of your brackets. Like Dave, one of my turnouts was close, within an 1", to the frame but I didn't shimy the engine. It was level and I figured that the pipe was not going to expand an 1" and touch the frame. These mounts also don't allow my engine to flex, if at all, like the OEM ones did. So no worries about the engine torquing/lifting and caused the pipe to hit the frame. I've had these installed for the last 5 years without issue. I have an SVS aftermarket shifter. As Dave suggested, I ended up removing my pre-load plate from the trans mount to gain the clearance the shifter needed. I think the Hurst shift is taller than OEM, certainly taller than my SVS is memory serves correctly.

 

[AZTVR]

The bent shaft of the Hurst is known to have a clearance issue on some cars (Gen 2) where it passes by the ashtray recess. So, it would take very little change in position to mess up a situation that previously cleared.

 

[Mad Max]

If you would read this thread, there is a conclusion forming that indeed there is no problem. Certainly not an install problem.

I installed the Woodhouse mounts on my Gen II, there were not any issues at all. I didn't have to modify anything. My Viper has a complete Belanger exhaust system.

 

[ROCKET62]

I'd send Mark Jorgensen at Woodhouse an email as he should be able to help. Are the mounts the same for all gens of Vipers ... ie Gen 2 vs. Gen 3?

 

[dave6666]

Maybe I'm still recovering from last night and my head may still be a bit fuzzy but for some reason the engine bracket in this picture doesn't seem right to me as if it's oriented upside down. Double check the orientation of your brackets.

As I pointed out above, I thought they did look right, but at that camera angle, who knows. It would certainly be worth checking. The location of the O2 sensor wiring mount clip hole should be a clue if nothing else.

 

[Stahlhart]

Hi,

thanks for your help.

The bracket is installed as it was before when I pulled out the engine. Checked this with my old photos. The engine is on level, so maybe I´m too fussy.

When I compare the pictures from Dave with mine, my driver & passenger side look the same. So I will just remove the pre-load plate. Maybe everything will be ok.

Thank you guys for your help I appreciate that.

Have a nice day.

Jürgen

 

[ViperTony]

As I pointed out above, I thought they did look right, but at that camera angle, who knows. It would certainly be worth checking. The location of the O2 sensor wiring mount clip hole should be a clue if nothing else.

Was hoping for an easy fix.

 

[Stahlhart]

The bent shaft of the Hurst is known to have a clearance issue on some cars (Gen 2) where it passes by the ashtray recess. So, it would take very little change in position to mess up a situation that previously cleared.

Hi,

even without the pressure plate, the is a problem with clearance with the short shifter. In 5th/6th Gear it rubbs on the tunnel. So what´s the best way to solve this problem? Cut a part out of the tunnel, maybe 1"x 1/4" ? Or bend the shaft of the shifter a little bit?

Greetings

Jürgen

 

[dave6666]

Use a stock or B&M.

 

[AJ02]

I have the Woodhouse engine and transmission mounts with the pressure plate, and also a Hurst short shifter. No clearance problems at all. Stock exhaust though.

 

[dave6666]

It's actually a "preload" plate. If you look at the urethane part of the mount, it has a **** in it where it would contact the plate. When compressed by bolting everything together it compresses the **** in the urethane and changes the dynamics of the mount. Or as some say, it energizes it. Since the bottom of the transmission is not flat where the mount goes, leaving the plate off deletes that feature. I doubt you could tell the difference tho. More desktop math than real life effect.

 

[LifeIsGood]

I don't know if it makes a difference, but I'm pretty sure the OP has a GEN I.

 

[mjorgensen Woodhouse]

BTW I really have a problem with the title of this thread that keeps popping to the top of my list, it cast a negative light on a good company and product whenever someone searches either or name or product... FWI

 

[Stahlhart]

Is it possible - for me - to change the title?

Jürgen

 

[LifeIsGood]

The title is accurate. It'll all be good once it's figured out and the solution is included in this thread.

 

[dave6666]

The title is accurate. It'll all be good once it's figured out and the solution is included in this thread.

I agree. The mounts are of slightly different dimension than stock, and this thread is constructive. Be glad it's not the alley...

Signed, Woodhouse mount user.

 

[WDW MKR]

Dave, what did you use to shim the engine mounts? I'm installing AR headers at the same time as the Woodhouse mounts and my driver side is resting on the frame opening. I was thinking of locating some 1/8" aluminum plate and drilling a pattern to match the stud and "pin" of the mount.

 

[WDW MKR]

Nevermind. Just found another thread where you mentioned 0.090" steel. Couldn't view the old pics, though.