SRT10 suspension compared to driving 400+ hp Lightning

[qurtrn10]

I've watched video after video of SRT10s where the back end will whip out in front when pushed too hard. I'm looking to pick up a 2003-2006 Viper in the next few months, and I'm used to driving a Lightning pickup truck with 416hp / 500tq to the wheels. With no weight over the rear in the truck, how will that compare to driving the Viper? Is it just a matter of driving a high horsepower vehicle with little weight? If so, then I consider myself used to it. Or is there something unique about a Viper suspension that makes it a totally different animal?

Thanks guys,
William

 

[Nine Ball]

Vipers are happy to swap ends on the highway, which we refer to as "snake bite" here. The main problem is drivers that don't know how to drive or respect a vehicle with the torque and throttle response. They fail to lift when things get out of line. I've seen guys try and ride out or steer through a long peel-out before, which usually never ends well. With a Viper, if the tail gets out on you - LIFT! Staying in the throttle is sure to spin you around.

 

[Allan]

The Viper will have totally different handling dynamics than your Lightning.
(I have driven a couple of Lightnings, so I do know how they drive)
The big difference in the 'tail coming around' issue, is the front/rear weight distribution between the two vehicles.
I don't know the exact split on the Lightning, but it is obviously nose heavy. The Viper is almost perfect with just a little more weight in the rear than the front. So you get an ugly 'pendulum effect' going sometimes when you over correct, and back and forth. -then you hit something. -then you get a different car.
The Heavy nose of the truck provides a more predictable and controllable 'sideways experience' because you are pivoting around the heaviest part of the vehicle. You naturally have more grip in the front and it's easier to control what's going on.
The Viper's vehicle dynamics almost seem to have a mind of their own, and the car is sometimes unpredictable. -That's the appeal. Something bad could happen at any moment!
It's not so much about 'being used to whatever power'.
It's about, the Viper is pure insanity on wheels. -if you need some excitement in your life, this is it.
If you get a Viper, awesome. If you don't respect it, It will bite. -as many, many people have said.

 

[qurtrn10]

Thanks, that was exactly what I was looking for.

 

[mjorgensen Woodhouse]

To help this the first thing to do is make sure you have new non runflat tires installed!

 

[SlateEd]

+1

The run flats were awful and make a handful into an unpredictable twitchy mess.

In addition to weight distribution you have tire width... There is so much grip in the rear 345s that when they do break loose the chances are you're deep in the throttle so they're really going... The flip side to that is they can catch grip again suddenly and snap you back the other way

 

[JoelW]

As one of my driving instructors explained to me, one end of the polar moment of a Viper (or Corvette) is right behind your butt. You are sitting inches ahead of the rear wheel and if you start to lose it, there is very little warning. Contrast that with a Mustang where the rear wheels are several feet behind you. You can feel the car start to get loose with more time to react. Having said that, if you take some time to learn about your car - HPDE for example - in a relatively controlled environment, you will be better off than trying to figure this out on the street. Any time you have 450-500 horsepower and 500 ft.lbs. of torque, you have to learn respect. Gens I, 2, 3, and 4 do not have nannies to keep you safe. But Gen 3 and 4 and some late model Gen 2's have ABS which does help a good deal but if you do stupid stuff on the street, you will get bit. Probably in your Lightning too!

 

[Mamba52]

+1

The run flats were awful and make a handful into an unpredictable twitchy mess.

In addition to weight distribution you have tire width... There is so much grip in the rear 345s that when they do break loose the chances are you're deep in the throttle so they're really going... The flip side to that is they can catch grip again suddenly and snap you back the other way

+2 night and day!!!!!!! PS2s

 

[rw99]

As one of my driving instructors explained to me, one end of the polar moment of a Viper (or Corvette) is right behind your butt. You are sitting inches ahead of the rear wheel and if you start to lose it, there is very little warning. Contrast that with a Mustang where the rear wheels are several feet behind you. You can feel the car start to get loose with more time to react. Having said that, if you take some time to learn about your car - HPDE for example - in a relatively controlled environment, you will be better off than trying to figure this out on the street. Any time you have 450-500 horsepower and 500 ft.lbs. of torque, you have to learn respect. Gens I, 2, 3, and 4 do not have nannies to keep you safe. But Gen 3 and 4 and some late model Gen 2's have ABS which does help a good deal but if you do stupid stuff on the street, you will get bit. Probably in your Lightning too!

I've never before thought of the driver's position relative to the center of rotation, and that makes complete sense. Very insightful.

 

[MoparMap]

The gen 3's and 4's are a little more progressive in the suspension from what I've heard compared to the gen 1 and 2's. Some of that has to do with the tire and road conditions as well I suppose. I know I can feel the back end of my 04 coming around if I push it on one particular corner on the way home from work too hard, but I can catch it pretty easy without things getting ugly. I have a newer set of PSS tires on mine though, so it's a little harder compound than Viper spec PS2's and PSC's from what I understand. My mom's 94 has a tendency to slide around more and keeps coming around once it starts. My dad went to do a quick 180 when we took a wrong turn once and ended up doing more of a 270 because the tail just kept coming around. Likes others have said though, I think the real trick is just not trying to ride it out. It's grips like mad when it has traction, but when it loses it it gets real unstable in a hurry and can be hard to save.

 

[dester243]

I agree with everyone on here. I never owned a lightning but friends have them do I have driven a couple. Is a totally different experience and feel.

If you want driving excitement the Viper will not disappoint. My suggestion. .. especially the first couple months of ownership. Whatever you think you can clear a corner at speed wise... cut that in half. I had a couple friends with Vipers before I bought mine and that advice probably saved me from wrecking my Vipers when I first got one.

My gen 1 had gears but I remember the first butt pucker moment.

2 Lane divided Street 45 mph zone. I took a left turn in 3rd gear at probably 30 to 35 mph in third. Throttled probably 30% at les than 1500 rpm and the rear end came swinging already. So they come out from under you pretty quick.

 

[labtec]

smooooth throttle input....on or off, otherwise bad things will happen. Naturally when things are going off the rails letting off the throttle smoothly is difficult.

 

[PeterMJ]

I've watched video after video of SRT10s where the back end will whip out in front when pushed too hard. I'm looking to pick up a 2003-2006 Viper in the next few months, and I'm used to driving a Lightning pickup truck with 416hp / 500tq to the wheels. With no weight over the rear in the truck, how will that compare to driving the Viper? Is it just a matter of driving a high horsepower vehicle with little weight? If so, then I consider myself used to it. Or is there something unique about a Viper suspension that makes it a totally different animal?

Thanks guys,
William

apples and oranges, cannot seriously compare pick up truck and Viper. not even Viper powered ram.

 

[Bobpantax]

As shown by my signature below, I own both. They are nothing alike but both provide an enjoyable performance experience. Part of the difference is shown by the differing performance at the drag strip. See videos. You cannot compare the two on a road course because a Lightning is not suitable at all for a road course. The Lightning is a forgiving vehicle. The Viper, at least before the Gen V with nanny tech, is not. Vipers do not suffer fools lightly. They require a somewaht advanced skill set to drive to their full capabilities.

Ford Lightning vs Nissan GT-R Drag Racing 1/4 Mile - YouTube

Dodge Viper Paxton Supercharged Drag Racing 1/4 Mile - YouTube

 

[dester243]

Dang. I expected more mph from the Viper.

 

[Bobpantax]

Dear Dester. This thread is not about that subject.

 

[PeterMJ]

Dear Dester. This thread is not about that subject.

Well swami, why don't you explain what this thread is about?

 

[Bobpantax]

It's not about you

You must be registered for see images

either. But you might wish to comment on how your 2009 Viper convertible ( Nice looking by the way) handles as compared to a Ford Lightning if you have that experience. You also might want to start your own thread comparing your experiennce with your former Corvette Z06 with your Viper since you have had it since last summer.

 

[PeterMJ]

It's not about you

You must be registered for see images

either. But you might wish to comment on how your 2009 Viper convertible ( Nice looking by the way) handles as compared to a Ford Lightning if you have that experience. You also might want to start your own thread comparing your experiennce with your former Corvette Z06 with your Viper since you have had it since last summer.

Maybe you should start your own thread instead of looking over others? I still have and drive a vette

 

[dester243]

Dear Dester. This thread is not about that subject.

You posted videos of one drag racing in the thread and I commented on your video. But it's cool we can direct the attention back to you

You seem to have a nice collection of toys and I sure of the the concerns the op wanted have been replied to anyways. The thread is derailing on is own. Inserting Vette comments threw it off further.

 

[Bobpantax]

Yes. We all know that you still own a Vette. It's obvious. So do you have a relevant comment regarding the Viper Lightning comparison requested?

Maybe you should start your own thread instead of looking over others? I still have and drive a vette

 

[bigmack339]

Vette owners are tearing this place apart....

 

[PeterMJ]

Yes. We all know that you still own a Vette. It's obvious. So do you have a relevant comment regarding the Viper Lightning comparison requested?

Yup swamii, your drag strip times should give him all the answers he needs, comparing pick up truck to viper

 

[Bobpantax]

The videos are not presented merely to show the difference in ET and trap speed. They are presented primarily to show the difference between how the respective suspensions react upon launch and shifts during the run. If one watches closely, the differences are easily noted.

Yup swamii, your drag strip times should give him all the answers he needs, comparing pick up truck to viper

 

[ACRucrazy]

I think you two should just start ignoring each other.
I also think qutrn10 should also buy a Viper.

 

[HANKFAN]

I currently own 3 Lightning's and a Paxton 06 Coupe. With my 950hp Lightning on the street, I feel 100% in control of it. My Viper is totally different. Feels like it is right on the edge and any small mistake on my part equals trouble. Takes a little while to get used to driving the Viper. Don't expect to go out on the street and run it wide open on day one. You have to respect the car and if you don't it will bite you. Once you get used to it they are awesome and a thrill to drive and own. Getting rid of the OEM run flats for a set of PS2's should be the first mod.

 

[Allan]

.................. finally back on track with the original topic. .................