stepping up from S2000

[madman]

Hi folks, 2 1/2 years ago I was thinking to get the SRT but since they were so unavailable I got myself S2000 (which is called by many as miniviper - or perhaps viper's called as maxiS2K for similar styling cues and purity. Now with SRT's more available and my lease almost up I think I am ready to get one.

I would like to know if anybody could provide me with loss/gain/what-to-look-for as far as handling differences. Frankly after what I've read here I've got the respect for SRT. I am little afraid after what I've read here that it would be too easy to get wasted on the 'less then perfect' back roads and canyons here in the Bay Area.

Thanks!

P.S. I forgot to add - I am 36 (god!) family man, not a high school kiddo if this would tell you anything about my potential driving habits. I am used to drive the S hard (most of the time in VTEC zone but never been on track.

P.P.S. And yes, Viper would be my daily driver (16 miles commute). I am sitting behind the computer all day and the commute is one of my few chances to reset myself

 

[Kai SRT10]

I too wanted an SRT-10 when they first came out, and I too was reluctant to pay the crazy premiums they were demanding for the cars back then.

I'm also a "family man" with a wife, kids, etc.

The Viper is my daily driver when it's not raining or snowing. In spite of its rough edges, it is a fine daily driver.

I take it up on the twisty mountain roads all the time. You will love the feel of the tidal wave of torque when you get on the gas coming out of a slow corner. I really think that very few things better than driving hard in the Viper, top down, checking out the beautiful scenery as it blurs past, the roar of your V10 engine scaring the furry woodland creatures.

Yes, the Viper's handling on bumpy roads could be improved, but it's rough road handling isn't too bad once you get used to it. Just start slow, and give yourself some time to become accustomed to how the car handles and responds. Above all, spend the money to take a day or two of high performance driving lessons. I did this early on, soon after I bought my car, and it really was worth it.

You will love this car. I do. I love driving it. I look for excuses to go places in the car. After you first buy it, you'll be asking your wife if she needs you to run and get anything from the store. If she says yes, you will find yourself going to the store all the way across town (or in the next town) "because I thought that milk was on sale there."

Buy the car. When you are 80 years old, and thinking about the decisions you made in your life, buying a Viper will be one of the "good" ones.

 

[madman]

Thanks for sharing your experience Kai, it's exactly the spirit I see in the whole 'getting the Viper' deal. What I am trying to find out is how much the handling will be different from razor sharp S.

The S is so precise and nimble in steering. When I upgraded my wheels to 18 and got 225 in front (instead of 205) I immediately felt disconnected from the road. Coming back to 215 improved the feedback significantly. Now Viper has how much in front? 275 or so? Does it has impact on the 'road feel' or is it simply different chassis and car?

Also - S is 2800. Viper is 3400. Sqft of S tires is much less then Vipers. Yet the law of physics and G force works with the weight. My wife's car is 04 M3cvt and she hates me when I call it a truck. But to me it is a truck. 3600 pounds is so heavy that I feel the mass rolling in the curves. Plus it feels really disconnected. Now Viper is 3400 yet much wwwider and lower so it shouldn't be as bad.

It's difficult to reasonably decide about this car since they won't let you drive it here in Bay Area. Even me coming in 04 M3 - they say once the numbers worked out you can test drive it before taking home to make sure everything is ok. Ridiculous. On the other hand side - everybody wants to drive it so they would get easily 2000 miles on a vehicle before the sale (which wouldn't happen because nobody wants to buy new car with 2000miles). Maybe that's the whole problem with the Viper sales, maybe they should invest in making 100 test vehicles for dealerships to let people enjoy and maybe they would not be forced to shut down the factory for surplus inventory... who knows.

Anyway, I went too far away from the subject. What about the handling?

 

[Viperfreak2]

The handling is great. Not too sudden at the limit as the earlier cars. I could talk for days about it, but the best advise is to find a local who will take you for a ride (or maybe even a drive?)

 

[vincent_esq]

How about taking a skip barber course at Laguna Seca? It ranges from $600 to $3k for the 3 day course. They have 4 red 03 srt there. You will get to drive one. Thus, you will get to test drive it, and get some fun in for the day? Then you can decide. That's what I did.

 

[madman]

Didn't know about this, thanks! Do you have url/phone ?

 

[vincent_esq]

Yes, here it is http://www.skipbarber.com/

 

[Snakester]

I don't have a SRT-10, but I do live in the Bay Area too, and I love driving up in the mountain roads. And have driven my Viper almost every day for 3 years now.

It's hard to say exactly what your impressions will be as the S2000 is nearly the polar opposite of the Viper in it's execution. I have owned a turbo Mitsubishi with a small high revving engine in a light car.

The Viper feels VERY differently, but no less fun in the twisties.

As Kai accurately mentioned, the Viper is a car that needs some seat-time getting a feel for it's handling and power delivery before you can take it out full-bore up in the mountains.

But the other side of the coin is that you can go as fast as most sporty cars out there running at 80% of the car's capability.

Like the Corvette (which I also owned) the S2000 is more of a car to appeal to a larger market, and frankly both would make a better commuter car than the Viper does.

But the Viper is a truly unique car, and the SRT-10 has excellent braking, more predictable handling, and the torque at low RPMs will be something that may astonish you coming from a S2000.

If you consider the new BMW M3 to handle like a "truck", you definitely will need to drive the Viper yourself to see if it best matches what you expect from a performance car.

I'd give you a ride in mine, but you should really try and get a ride in the SRT-10 Viper as all of the car's improvements are more suited to attracting someone who wants a more civilized specialty convertible, but still wants superior performance.

 

[madman]

Thanks Snakester. I am aware of that torque gain. Well as we speak I am working out the deal with one of the local dealers, maybe I will join you next month at the meet.(?).

Having said that I should reverse the subject of this thread: What not to do so I won't trash it on the way from the dealership? (And seriously what not to do when driving - say - Hwy 9?)

 

[Snakester]

The general guidelines are to avoid punching the gas in a corner until you become familiar with the car. And generally roll-on to the gas as if there was a raw egg between your foot and the pedal. The engine's power can easily overwhelm the big tire's grip in lower gears.

Don't downshift from higher speeds until you know the car. Without matching the RPMs when downshifting during decelleration you can unsettle the car. Just use the brakes.

And of course on wet roads these points need even more respect. Even though the new Viper does have ABS, it doesn't have traction control, and so it requires more experience to drive near the limit.

One thing that is decieving is that the Viper can very quickly get up to triple-digit speeds, and you need to be very conscious of your speed (to avoid tickets and accidents) as it doesn't always feel like you are going that fast.

Hwy 9 would be great fun to try the Viper out (providing that it's dry), and it would give you a great feel for the handling, acceleration, and braking capabilities of the car. Just have the mindset of running the road at about 50%-75% of max speed in the twisties, and you should be fine.

Remember that absolute power corrupts absolutely, and throttle back to get a feeling of the car's capabilities and general balance without trying to actually see how fast it will go. As that's how it will always bite the new, overzealous driver.

 

[Kai SRT10]

Remember that absolute power corrupts absolutely, and throttle back to get a feeling of the car's capabilities and general balance without trying to actually see how fast it will go. As that's how it will always bite the new, overzealous driver.

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You should check out this thread comparing the Viper and the Elise:

http://vca2.viperclub.org/forums/showflat.php?Cat=&Board=UBB21&Number=469428&Forum=All_Forums&Words=chiropracter&Match=Entire%20Phrase&Searchpage=0&Limit=25&Old=allposts&Main=469118&Search=true#Post469428

 

[Hirohawa]

The good thing about the SRT 10 is most people will still think you are in your S2000.

 

[SilverSnake]

Hirohawa- , Don't worry about our srt's were miles ahead of you.

Robert

 

[Hirohawa]

Robert

Won't be the case with the new Z06. So sorry.

Same HP less weight less money than an SRT 10.

 

[SilverSnake]

I will belive it when the numbers are released. Till then so sorry about your luck.

Robert

 

[Viper X]

Madman,

Big step up. As the Snakester says, power delivery is much different and will take some seat time. You'll love the car.

Dan

 

[madman]

Hiro, something is wrong with you. I bought the new red 05 today and after driving around 50 miles I do not see other people thinking I am driving an S. Nore vette. Why wouldn't you just settle for the fact that both S and Viper were designed (by coincidence) by **** and it looks as if **** look at the sports car similarly.

The designers for both S and SRT did excellent job - they created (unlike Vette people) styling of a long time value - a true roadster with balanced proportions, clean lines and combination of curves/edges which will get people excited for some time to come. C6 vette on the other hand side has completely imbalanced front with the lights borrowed from S or Viper. The front from Vette simply does not match its back. Period. And the cocpit is a joke I guess. Or their target market is a truck driver convert? Look at the steering wheel, its sheer size and ugly look.

SRT same like S fits me like a glove. Vette - just another car with two doors. And on and on.... just my 2c on C6

 

[Hirohawa]

The designers for both S and SRT did excellent job - they created (unlike Vette people) styling of a long time value

Styling of a long time value? What does that mean? Are you saying the styling has a longer value than Vette people? I agree I like the way the SRT 10 looks more than Vette People. But most People don't have 500HP.

In terms of design the back end of the SRT 10 looks alot like the Sebring convertible. The lights are too big and the air dam is so bland. And as a VIPER OWNER I am not the only one on this board that thinks the design of the SRT 10 is lacking. Yes the SRT 10 looks like the S 2000, yes the new C6 also looks like it. And therin lies a problem. In 92 nothing looked like the RT 10 and in 96 nothing looked like the GTS. Even all these years later nothing looks like those two cars. Those cars are timeless.

There is a surplus of New Vipers and they even had to shut down their plant due to overstock. Porsche 911 Turbos and Ferarri 360 which are 130K and 175K+ are not sitting on lots new. And if you consider both of these are available as a ragtop they are direct competitors of the Dodge at least 50K more and they are flying out of the showrooms. And both the Porsche and Ferrari are older designs than the SRT 10.

The new SRT 10 Concept Coupe got pretty much blasted here for it's design.

Me personally I would rather get a Viper Coupe than the new Z06 providing that they bring back some originality and come up with a striking design.

 

[Y2K5SRT]

Don't you find it amusing when guys who don't own an SRT and don't like the SRT just hang around the SRT forums? Hmmmm... Let's see, your options are:

1. Troll

2. Sour grapes

3. Whiner

As soon as I saw the title of this thread I just waited to see who would jump on this golden opportunity. I figured Craig would hit it first, but we get this guy instead. Sir, with all due respect: Go insult other people's cars in YOUR forum and not ours. The S2000 thing is so incredibly played out that now it is simply pathetic. You don't see a single person insulting the RT or the GTS in those forums, but you enjoy stirring the crap here. Do us all a favor: Sell your Viper to somebody that appreciates Vipers in general, or at least has the tact not to slam other Vipers (and thus their owners) directly to their faces. Personally, I think you should sell both of your current cars and wait for the new Z06 with all the other lemmings. That will give you over a million fellow Corvette owners that you can insult every day. You will be crowned King of the Trolls. Maybe they will give you a hat.

 

[Kai SRT10]

Don't you find it amusing when guys who don't own an SRT and don't like the SRT just hang around the SRT forums? Hmmmm... Let's see, your options are:

1. Troll

2. Sour grapes

3. Whiner

As soon as I saw the title of this thread I just waited to see who would jump on this golden opportunity. I figured Craig would hit it first, but we get this guy instead. Sir, with all due respect: Go insult other people's cars in YOUR forum and not ours. The S2000 thing is so incredibly played out that now it is simply pathetic. You don't see a single person insulting the RT or the GTS in those forums, but you enjoy stirring the crap here. Do us all a favor: Sell your Viper to somebody that appreciates Vipers in general, or at least has the tact not to slam other Vipers (and thus their owners) directly to their faces. Personally, I think you should sell both of your current cars and wait for the new Z06 with all the other lemmings. That will give you over a million fellow Corvette owners that you can insult every day. You will be crowned King of the Trolls. Maybe they will give you a hat.

OUCH!!!

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[quickysrt]

i have a my05 suzuka blue s2k. big diffrence from the viper

have fun with your new car!

 

[vipersrt10]

Robert

Won't be the case with the new Z06. So sorry.

Same HP less weight less money than an SRT 10.

so, it will still be a vette, it will never get the thumbs up like the viper, nor will girls walk up to you at gas stations, etc and hand their phone numbers to you

 

[PMB NY]

"In 92 nothing looked like the RT 10"
_______________________________________

When I had a Mazda RX-7 in 93, some people thought it was a Viper.

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I am not trying to flame, I love all vipers

 

[NOMERCY]

Chris, I agree with you 1000000% It's getting to the point to where you can't post or read a post here without someone having to force an uwanted or unasked for opinion about the SRT10. If they dislike it so damn much why do they even come over here .... unless ... it is just trying to troll and get a rise. If so, it works ....

 

[NOMERCY]

Porsche 911 Turbos and Ferarri 360 which are 130K and 175K+ are not sitting on lots new. And if you consider both of these are available as a ragtop they are direct competitors of the Dodge at least 50K more and they are flying out of the showrooms.

Really??

 

[SRTJOE]

Don't you find it amusing when guys who don't own an SRT and don't like the SRT just hang around the SRT forums? Hmmmm... Let's see, your options are:

1. Troll

2. Sour grapes

3. Whiner

As soon as I saw the title of this thread I just waited to see who would jump on this golden opportunity. I figured Craig would hit it first, but we get this guy instead. Sir, with all due respect: Go insult other people's cars in YOUR forum and not ours. The S2000 thing is so incredibly played out that now it is simply pathetic. You don't see a single person insulting the RT or the GTS in those forums, but you enjoy stirring the crap here. Do us all a favor: Sell your Viper to somebody that appreciates Vipers in general, or at least has the tact not to slam other Vipers (and thus their owners) directly to their faces. Personally, I think you should sell both of your current cars and wait for the new Z06 with all the other lemmings. That will give you over a million fellow Corvette owners that you can insult every day. You will be crowned King of the Trolls. Maybe they will give you a hat.

Y2K5SRT

You forgot 4. *** *** envy!

 

[madman]

Second day happy owner of the Snake and counting

I think I know how this all S2k/SRT similarity came up. If you look around you will find out that S2k/SRT are the only roadsters of true classic roadster proportions on the market: long hood sloping down towards the front, steep windshield, wheels dimensions well balancing the body size (of course you must look at the modified lowered S such as this one

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Plus they share edge design philosophy, trunk ending higher then front and their mirrors (position AND shape) are incredibly similar. Other then that these are two different cars. All other 2 seaters went some other directions.

To answer why there may be more vipers on the lot sitting (and that's why I finally got mine I think (based on my 2days experience that:
- most of viper dealers won't do test drives
- the car is way more difficult to handle (on less-ten-perfect-roads then Porsche, vette and alike and you do have plenty of powerfull sedans/sports car in the 80k range which offer 'safe choice' decision. ANd they can test drive them.
- brute image in minds of most people

I think that these three scares most folks with means to shell out 85k away to purchase something more safe-choice-based and without hassles dealing with Dodge salesperson on the floor. I walked to one dealrship to express my interest and they've been like bees on me pushing and pushing. I dealt with the other one over the internet and it was one pleasant experience, I only came to sign papers.

But if you don't know if you want the car and want make first flirt with it you naturally drive around the dealership, right? And there we go - you can't test drive plus some pushing tactics are disguising. (same applies to vette and other us/*** brands dealers). Never had this experience with euro brands, isn't it strange?

I think right now the way the car is you must truly love Viper to appreciate it. And you must really like it hot (must research how to cool down the cabin, even with 55 outside one must have AC on

 

[knuk]

"In 92 nothing looked like the RT 10"
_______________________________________

When I had a Mazda RX-7 in 93, some people thought it was a Viper.

You must be registered for see images attach

I am not trying to flame, I love all vipers

LMFAO.....NOW PUT DOWN THAT COCKTAIL

 

[Viperfreak2]

You don't need the AC. Just shut off the fan. Even with the fan on low and the temp knob on cold, the air coming out of the vents is still warm/hot. With the fan off, the cabin stays cool, except your feet in bumper to bumper traffic.

 

[madman]

Like you would know what am I doing. In S manual they wrote "always have fan on, due to small scale of the cabin it will get warm even when cold outside". It looks this approach is reversed with the Snake