Survey - TVS blower for SRT-10 Vipers

[Nine Ball]

That's okay Flatout because at this point, I doubt he has one (connections).

It is basically BS from the way I see it; What a pain in the a$$.

There is connected in knowing people and then connected in getting things done.

Let me go ahead and quote where you were acting like an ass. I have no reason to lie or make this stuff up, and anyone that knows me personally knows that I am heavily involved in the performance aftermarket industry. I don't have to prove this stuff to you, or make you any promises. As for this thread, YOU were the one that kept bumping it back up and keeping it going. I was only going to share info when I received updates. I didn't string anyone along, I simply put the idea in front of Magnuson to consider. It seems if anything, it was a waste of my own time - not yours. I'm also not going to apologize that it didn't turn out like WE wanted, it isn't my fault or my decision.

 

[Nine Ball]

I have a few questions. Is this basically a mass produced blower that just needs a different intake manifold to mount to different motors? Could a kit be offered that would basically be similar, with the manifold being where the difference lies, to fit all the first three generations. It seems like a tuner/builder could be able to make this work. As far as hood clearance goes on the Gen 3, couldn't a kit be arranged that has includes a Gen 4 type hood with more clearance. There has to be enough demand out there to put this together. Roes are still highly sought after and that's from a car that's over a decade old. I don't see how this was that easy for Paxton, yet impossible for anyone else. There is obviously more to this than meets the eye.

Yes, the blower head unit is mass-produced and uses Eaton internals. The front and rear covers are custom to the application. Someone who is resourceful and not financially challenged would have no problem buying a head unit, having a custom lower intake fabricated, and choosing the correct snout and pulley drive types. In fact, before the Z06 kit was a production kit, a shop in Georgia (MTI Racing) was doing just that - fabricating a kit for the C6 Z06 using a custom lower intake and pulley setup. The rest is a simple Bosch water pump and front mounted heat exchanger that goes in front of the radiator, a coolant reservoir, and some hoses. It is the lower intake and the filter+intake that require the custom parts for each application. Then they go through all the California CARB testing crap. Every system they sell is 50 state legal.

 

[troublemaker]

Thanks for the response. It seems like a project that could be taken on by a smaller company. I was just curious if this was something that could be built for one Generation but adapted to all the others. It would become much more cost effective to factor in the numbers of all Vipers and SRT pickups. The hood should be an easy fix if you could guarantee a certain number of oders.

 

[ViperGeorge]

Thanks for the response. It seems like a project that could be taken on by a smaller company. I was just curious if this was something that could be built for one Generation but adapted to all the others. It would become much more cost effective to factor in the numbers of all Vipers and SRT pickups. The hood should be an easy fix if you could guarantee a certain number of oders.

My guess is that emissions certification, especially in California, could be a challenge for a small company.

 

[FLATOUT]

Yeh OK.

 

[FLATOUT]

My guess is that emissions certification, especially in California, could be a challenge for a small company.

It's a pretty big company when you think about all of the blowers they churn out for the mass produced LSX platforms.

It's just a business decision plain and simple. It's too bad as I would have loved to have owned one.

 

[351carlo]

It's a pretty big company when you think about all of the blowers they churn out for the mass produced LSX platforms.

It's just a business decision plain and simple. It's too bad as I would have loved to have owned one.

The economics of it are tough. I've brought this same discussion to my contact at Whipple. Unfortunately with the plethora of new platforms, all of which sell more than 10k units per year, there's just a better direction they can go. Their offer to me was similar; they'd supply the blower housing, the drawings and some support, but I'd be left to engineer the intake, drive and all other peripheral systems. While this is a job I could take on, it's a lot for a small business with minimal return.

Clearly Nineball did his best to push the issue with them, there's not much more you can ask. I won't directly respond to the negativity in this thread, it's not worth it.

 

[shooter_t1]

It's a pretty big company when you think about all of the blowers they churn out for the mass produced LSX platforms.

It's just a business decision plain and simple. It's too bad as I would have loved to have owned one.

I think gbatejan is talking about a small company trying to take a project like this on, not talking about Magnuson.

 

[AbsolutHank]

What became of the Roe prototype? Could someone, with way more money than me, contact him and continue on with the project?

It seems they throw PD blowers on evertyhing these days...very frustrating the Viper isn't one of them, and really has never been one of them...if you don't include the Viper-specific Roe units.

 

[Coloviper]

Nineball and Flatout;

PM sent!

It was not my intention to state you did not have the contacts Nineball hence my smiley face behind that little jab. I also appreciate all the work you put into it, I do. It was never your decision to produce or not to produce the kit which everyone understands.

In the end, it is just very disappointing overall because I do feel there are many more than a few or 6 people really interested in this type of kit. My comment on waste of time actually has even more behind it than what is here, as I went down this path for well over a year+ with the other kit that was just mentioned a few threads ago. It was on another car, then in testing, then available soon, then dead, then what was left was for sale, then not. It is clear my vested time and energy in pursuing that avenue spilled out here in this thread when the word came back.

Like I stated, not my shinning moment. After waiting 4 years now to upgrade the performance with a bolt on blower kit, I will just have to go another route, though not sure what that is going to be.

Sorry if I upset or pushed you too much Nineball and Flatout as it was not my intention to upset either of you to the point of hating me.

Take care
Rick

PS Nineball, that comment you quoted me on was out of line and I apologize for it.

 

[V10lover]

I really wished somebody would have come up with a 4.5 psi ANYTHING type of blower kit for the GEN IV motor.

OH well, we dont even have an SCT/Diablo for the 08-10 cars.

 

[Blainne]

I really wished somebody would have come up with a 4.5 psi ANYTHING type of blower kit for the GEN IV motor.

OH well, we dont even have an SCT/Diablo for the 08-10 cars.

Reason is the 08+ Vipers can't be tuned due to the locked programming or something along those lines. Due to a Supercharger or Turbo installation requiring a tune. it makes the 08+ Viper unable to have S/C or Turbo installed, but there is a way around this by using a 03-06 Viper Computer instead. Not sure what else is required to make this work.

 

[Slithr]

but there is a way around this by using a 03-06 Viper Computer instead. Not sure what else is required to make this work.

I didn't think the 03-06 ECM could control the VV cam in the Gen IV's

 

[V10lover]

I didn't think the 03-06 ECM could control the VV cam in the Gen IV's

That + the dual electronic throttle bodies instead of the single cable one in the 2003-06..
Maybe the sct software allows those two things and they could be added to the STC handheld program??

At the same time the sct company made it work fine for cars with electronic throttle bodies and variable DOHC like the new 5.0 mustang and many previous vehicles. It can happen if they want to!

 

[shooter_t1]

Reason is the 08+ Vipers can't be tuned due to the locked programming or something along those lines. Due to a Supercharger or Turbo installation requiring a tune. it makes the 08+ Viper unable to have S/C or Turbo installed, but there is a way around this by using a 03-06 Viper Computer instead. Not sure what else is required to make this work.

It's possible and has been done. It's just REALLY expensive as Gen 4 TT builds just junk the OEM stuff and use a MOTEC. That's $20k just on ignition and controller. Then factor in the S/C or TT stuff.

 

[V10lover]

post deleted

 

[V10lover]

It's possible and has been done. It's just REALLY expensive as Gen 4 TT builds just junk the OEM stuff and use a MOTEC. That's $20k just on ignition and controller. Then factor in the S/C or TT stuff.

Do you know who made this happen to the GEN IV and if he is on this forums?

That could open up the way for us gen 4 guys to know more about the procedure and make it possible to boost our cars and maybe even to modify the paxton kits to fit in the 8.4L motor.

 

[shooter_t1]

Do you know who made this happen to the GEN IV and if he is on this forums?

Look up ART (American Racing Technology) in Buda, tx. Good bunch of guy's that help out us Viper owners all the time.

 

[Red Snake]

You guys keep mentioning developing this kit for SRT10 trucks. Roe already makes the kit for the truck. It just won't fit under the hood of the car. If you have a hood solution, just order one of the truck kits.

 

[GTS-R 001]

I had a good talk with Whipple today about building a kit using their charger, I laso had a good talk with one of the premier Viper engine builders about this project as well.

They have a number of options and they recommend their 2.9 or their 3.3 but I am taking a good look at the 4 liter, and if the 4 liter unit will fit longitudinally, I am not concerned about height as I would simply make a taller hood, (I think I know how to do that) and since I am in the "hood " business, if someone had an 08 hood already and needed to swap it out, I always have customers for hoods. Whipple adds 220 HP to the 6.2L camaros with their own kits so it is "realistic" to think that a similar increase can be found in an 8.3 L engine

Realistically, the cost of this "kit" would end up being approx $8K give or take $.5K plus tuning and hood.

 

[kllymartin]

I had a good talk with Whipple today about building a kit using their charger, I laso had a good talk with one of the premier Viper engine builders about this project as well.

They have a number of options and they recommend their 2.9 or their 3.3 but I am taking a good look at the 4 liter, and if the 4 liter unit will fit longitudinally, I am not concerned about height as I would simply make a taller hood, (I think I know how to do that) and since I am in the "hood " business, if someone had an 08 hood already and needed to swap it out, I always have customers for hoods. Whipple adds 220 HP to the 6.2L camaros with their own kits so it is "realistic" to think that a similar increase can be found in an 8.3 L engine

Realistically, the cost of this "kit" would end up being approx $8K give or take $.5K plus tuning and hood.

Damn. If your hoods can't clear a stock intake, I can't imagine the issues with a blower on top.

Toodles.

 

[FLATOUT]

Damn. If your hoods can't clear a stock intake, I can't imagine the issues with a blower on top.

Toodles.

Mines fits great.

 

[GTS-R 001]

Mines fits great.

Thanks Andy!

Your Carbon hood is one of the latest and any hoods I make for this kit will be based of the latest Gen hoods.

 

[AbsolutHank]

You guys keep mentioning developing this kit for SRT10 trucks. Roe already makes the kit for the truck. It just won't fit under the hood of the car. If you have a hood solution, just order one of the truck kits.

Just checked a few video's on Youtube...they do sound awesome!

 

[FLATOUT]

Whipple has always been my favorite PD blower. The FGT guy seem to be happy with them.

 

[ViperGeorge]

Do you know who made this happen to the GEN IV and if he is on this forums?

That could open up the way for us gen 4 guys to know more about the procedure and make it possible to boost our cars and maybe even to modify the paxton kits to fit in the 8.4L motor.

I had thought it was Underground Racing that did the Twin Turbo install on a Gen IV. Seems to me that they had to use two Motec systems but the stock PCM controlled the variable valve timing. I think there is a thread on this site that has pics and describes the install. I'm too lazy to search for it but I'm sure its on here somewhere.

 

[challenger&viper]

It's been 4 years now since 08 viper came and we do not have any f/i unit to play with yet.

 

[treesnake]

It's been 4 years now since 08 viper came and we do not have any f/i unit to play with yet.

......



F/I is useless without being able to tune the car......

 

[Nine Ball]

Might as well close this thread. The project was stillborn and my contacts at Magnuson no longer work there.

 

[Sean Roe]

Hadn't been on the forums in a long time....
The guys at Magnuson, Jerry, Terry, etc, are great, but the Eaton 2300 is too small on the Gen3 and you can't do much to get enough pulley wrap. Tried it years ago. Takes a bigger compressor to feed the Gen 3 engine. An effective positive displacement system can be done, but you really need to change the hood to make enough room. I cut a hood out during testing, but I'm not in the bodywork manufacturing business.
All this takes is time and money.... how much do you want to throw at it? I threw $80K+ at it with technology available through 2008 and said enough. Wasn't quite 100% satisfied with the results and saw TT as an extremely efficient alternative, though costly. However, more compressors are available today than there were then and more machine shops are hungry, so...?
Regarding engine management on GenIV, that can be done and is available too. But, I didn't pull the trigger because others kept saying they had software coming out. "Why add a device when you can reprogram the PCM" was my thought. But, they never came out with anything and have since closed, so maybe it's time to do something.....
Not sure when on my 12-14 hour work days I'll have a chance to revisit this thread, but thought I'd throw a cent or two in.

Sean