THIS WEBSITE is changing - want to be involved?

[Y2K5SRT]

Greetings!

We wanted to let everyone know that this very website is going to be changing soon. Your VCA National, Zone, and Regional Officers (led by Mr. Bob Carroll, National President), along with the VCA Web Committee, met extensively in Detroit last week. The results of which are as follows:

1. This site will be upgraded to the latest vBulletin software no later than March 31st. The current software is no longer supported and simply can't do what we (you) want it to do.

2. With that upgrade, the look and feel of the site will be changing as well. There will be more user options, seamless passwords (instead of one for the Classifieds, one for the Gallery, etc.), and revised forums. As many folks look through these forums based on the mechanicals of their model year, we are considering having forums for each generation of car rather that the two "catch all" forums we have for Vipers now (plus the "General Viper Discussions" forum).

3. We are going to be adding moderators for each of the forums. Right now Lee is working what seems like 24/7.

4. Last week we adopted the new website policies (which themselves were revised in November) and incorporated them into our bylaws. These policies provide a more defined approach to both using and moderating this website. These policies will be linked by a hotlink/button on every forum page so that you can always access them immediately. In the meantime you can read them here:
http://www4.forum.viperclub.org/showflat.php?Cat=0&Number=246224

5. Additionally, the website committee was reinforced and a National Officer appointed to serve on the committee, as well as the liaison for the rest of the National officers. More importantly, decisions regarding thread deletions, suspensions, and other "high impact" issues will be reviewed and voted upon by the committee. There will be no more decisions made by individuals outside of those "emergency" situations where a moderator clearly determines there is flagrant violation(s) of the website policies. That decision will then be reviewed by the committee and any further action determined at that time. Banning, suspensions, and other considerations will be made by committee.

6. The website administration and programming is being put out to bid effective immediately. Like the Viper itself, we want the very best "bang for the buck" for this site. We are determined to do so in all facets of the VCA, starting here. Jay Herbert is preparing the parameters of the duties here, as well as the programming needed. This will then be sent to interested parties so that they can submit a proposal, including Jay. The proposals will then be reviewed by the web committee and national officers. Consideration will be based both on experience and pricing. (Hint: If you don't have experience working with discussion forum software then you should sit this one out.) We hope to award an agreement on or before February 1st. As per the national bylaws, this will be a short-term contract, extending no longer than December 31, 2008. In the future we will be looking for competitive bids for merchandise, newsletter printing, etc.

As noted previously, we are seeking qualified individuals (or company) to make a proposal for the administration/programming for this site. This position will be addressing only the technical aspects of getting the site up to date (conversion), keeping it running smoothly, as well as possible future development projects within the timeframe of the agreement. Forum experience is a must, with vBulletin experience a plus. This position will NOT be involved in any of the "politics" moving forward. We will also be looking for individuals to assist with some of the different facets of the site, including the Gallery, Classified, etc. With the right programming in place those people will simply "moderate" those pages.

Whew! The bottom line is that we want your forum experience to be the best it can possibly be. This means not only the visual and functional upgrades to the site itself, but also "distributing the load" when it comes to moderating and running the site as a whole. The Viper Club of America is committed to improving your experience here and throughout all facets of the VCA membership experience. We hope you will enjoy and support our efforts.

Respectfully submitted,

Chris Marshall
VCA Web Committee Member
National Treasurer

PS. While we welcome your comments (this will be an unlocked thread for now), we ask that you help us focus on the future. As such, any negative comments regarding personnel or previous iterations of this site <u>will</u> be removed.

 

[luc]

More importantly, decisions regarding thread deletions, suspensions, and other "high impact" issues will be reviewed and voted upon by the committee. There will be no more decisions made by individuals outside of those "emergency" situations where a moderator clearly determines there is flagrant violation(s) of the website policies. That decision will then be reviewed by the committee and any further action determined at that time. Banning, suspensions, and other considerations will be made by committee.


Chris:

That is certainly a step in the right direction.

I hope that you also removed/modified the rule # 8 that call for the deleting/removal of any post asking why a thread and/or post was deleted or why someone was "punished".

If the comitte decide to impose sanctions or delete threads, a clear explanation of why such decision was taken should be clearly posted,at least in the Member's section only.

I'm glad that you're part of the web comitte, you've always been a great asset to the VCA and your fairness ,even and especially when disagreeing with someone,has always been much appreciated.

Luc 00GTS

 

[Leslie]

the upgrades sound great Chris!

looking forward to seeing the new additions

 

[V10SpeedLuvr]

"we are considering having forums for each generation of car rather that the two "catch all" forums we have for Vipers now (plus the "General Viper Discussions" forum). "

I like the 4 seperate forum ideas. That way us Gen 1.5 guys can hang out in the Gen 1 forum and not hear Gen 2 guys crying how their power windows don't work. Then we can go to Gen 2 forum when we get tired of the Gen 1 guys saying their side exhaust sounds like a UPS truck

 

[pocketAA]

I would like to chime in on this subject because I offered to be of assistance to this site in regards to helping them setup their new forum. I was not going to do it for free and now you are looking to pay someone, most likely for more money than I would have charged. I would have done all the programming for a couple of free raffle tickets to the VCA cars that are raffled off.

I have been doing all kinds of web application programming for highly visible clients over the past 7 years. Most of the applications have been written in C#, asp.net, and SQL Server, but I have also done my fair share of sites in PHP and MySQL. Currently I work as a web application developer/administrator supporting an extranet site for a medical equipment manufacturer/consumer electronics company.

Anytime you try to change a third party forum program, such as vBulletin, you are going to run into issues because from what I understand it is a very indepth piece of forum software. You would be much better off having the individual develope their own forum software that you can specialize as you like without running into any road blocks.

That said, I would be willing to submit a bid for the work, but again it is going to be more than what I expected when I was first approached by viperclub.

 

[Daddy Long Stroke]

As long as the SEARCH funtion works again, I will be happy!

 

[Go Fast For Life]

Sounds like things are headed in the right direction!

 

[CitySnake]

To a certain extent, many of us have heard this all before.

HOWEVER, I was there this year (I mention this only because I savored the scent of change first hand.....and NOT because my presence had anything to do with the changes ahead )and the new national officers and most of the region presidents were ALL on the same page. Additionally, serious kudo's to Chris and Lee for FINALLY backing the rhetoric with action!

I truly believe that along with Spring will come change.

 

[DAMN YANKEE]

What an excellent Viper resource this is!

I would ask for very determined thought given to a total restructuring of the "technical" sections. The "Performance Modifications" and "Illustrated Upgrades" are under utilized and the vast majority of disciplined discussions occur outside these threads. Yes, there is a major "search function" problem, but a real repository of all the good info here will require the thoughtful restructuring of the TECH threads and the means to keep this information in order by major headings.

 

[Cop Magnet]

I, for one, think the upcoming changes are great! A few thoughts on the new forum guidelines:

1. All posts must conform to a standard that is acceptable in content to Prime Time Broadcast Network TV (TVPG http://www.tvguidelines.org/ratings.asp)

Here's the link (the parenthesis throw it off):
TV PG ratings

4. Posts disparaging any of the moderators or the administrator will be deleted.

Okay, it's your show. We all recognize that this is a private entity, and freedom of speech does not apply as liberally as it does elsewhere.

6. Speculative posts relating to future DCX products or other Viper related items will be subject to deletion.

Are you really saying that the type of post that starts "I heard GenIV will have 650 HP..." will be deleted? All the Crossfire posts? ME-412? Firepower?

8. Posts asking why a post was removed, and posts asking why a warning/strike/ban was or was not issued to a user will be subject to deletion. If a post was removed, a moderator felt it violated one of the policies.

Like #4, seems a little heavy-handed. We know it's not a democracy, guys, but being open about the behind-the-scenes thinking only serves to keep the members on your side. When things occur in relative secrecy, that's when suspicions arise.

15. If a post violates the Posting Policy and has been removed, the entire thread or topic will be subject to deletion.

The entire thread can be deleted because of one bad post??

And before you think I'm just complaining:

14. Any suggestions, ideas, or discussions regarding the VCA web site should be posted to the appropriate (web site suggestions) topic area. We welcome your input.

I want you to know that the vast majority of members very much appreciate the work the mods do in keeping the website up and running smoothly. As I said before, for many of us it is the major source of contact with other club members. Yes, it's about the cars and about actual driving, but in the snowbelt, or in rural areas, the web is all we've got for long stretches of time. Thanks again!

 

[Bleu Omdurman]

I'd be glad to help out. Just let me know what you want help with.

Trevor

 

[jaydoc1]

I would like to chime in on this subject because I offered to be of assistance to this site in regards to helping them setup their new forum. I was not going to do it for free and now you are looking to pay someone, most likely for more money than I would have charged. I would have done all the programming for a couple of free raffle tickets to the VCA cars that are raffled off.

I have been doing all kinds of web application programming for highly visible clients over the past 7 years. Most of the applications have been written in C#, asp.net, and SQL Server, but I have also done my fair share of sites in PHP and MySQL. Currently I work as a web application developer/administrator supporting an extranet site for a medical equipment manufacturer/consumer electronics company.

Anytime you try to change a third party forum program, such as vBulletin, you are going to run into issues because from what I understand it is a very indepth piece of forum software. You would be much better off having the individual develope their own forum software that you can specialize as you like without running into any road blocks.

That said, I would be willing to submit a bid for the work, but again it is going to be more than what I expected when I was first approached by viperclub.

Yeah, I'd have to totally disagree with this. Most every well-run, enjoyable, highly functional, user-friendly forum I belong to is a vBulletin forum. I think moving to a vBulletin format is the best thing that could happen to this site. Yes there are some good UBB forums out there, but you tend to hear a lot of the some complaints that you hear here. vBulletin forums just run and look cleaner/better.

I (and most anyone else here I imagine) could direct you to dozens of superlative vBulletin powered forums.

 

[DAMN YANKEE]

Are you a Not For Profit? Please let me know.

 

[JDR]

Our 10 year old software company builds six and seven-figure websites, and sure the VCA could get married to a programmer (or company) and have them build you a completely custom forum... but why re-invent the wheel?

The forums we've worked with all provide source code... and a good programmer that uses source control and structured bolt-on/bolt-in programming methods can enhance an existing application with much less effort. Plus, when they kill themselves on the track, someone else can pick up the reigns...

You just can't expect someone to "learn" how a custom forum was built, let alone how to enhance it without the documentation you get with off-the-shelf forums.

Long story short - don't advertise for a hobbyist masquerading as a pro - contact vBulletin direct and get some recommendations. They know who's good at modifying their product, 'cause that level of person has a direct relationship with them. If you don't need customization, go down the list and talk to OTHER BIG vBulletin site owners - they'll tell you who they're happy with and WHY they like them.

Don't mess around with volunteers or low-ballers, please.

-John

I would like to chime in on this subject because I offered to be of assistance to this site in regards to helping them setup their new forum. I was not going to do it for free and now you are looking to pay someone, most likely for more money than I would have charged. I would have done all the programming for a couple of free raffle tickets to the VCA cars that are raffled off.

I have been doing all kinds of web application programming for highly visible clients over the past 7 years. Most of the applications have been written in C#, asp.net, and SQL Server, but I have also done my fair share of sites in PHP and MySQL. Currently I work as a web application developer/administrator supporting an extranet site for a medical equipment manufacturer/consumer electronics company.

Anytime you try to change a third party forum program, such as vBulletin, you are going to run into issues because from what I understand it is a very indepth piece of forum software. You would be much better off having the individual develope their own forum software that you can specialize as you like without running into any road blocks.

That said, I would be willing to submit a bid for the work, but again it is going to be more than what I expected when I was first approached by viperclub.

Yeah, I'd have to totally disagree with this. Most every well-run, enjoyable, highly functional, user-friendly forum I belong to is a vBulletin forum. I think moving to a vBulletin format is the best thing that could happen to this site. Yes there are some good UBB forums out there, but you tend to hear a lot of the some complaints that you hear here. vBulletin forums just run and look cleaner/better.

I (and most anyone else here I imagine) could direct you to dozens of superlative vBulletin powered forums.

 

[Y2K5SRT]

John -

All EXCELLENT points! We basically have three goals in mind when it comes to this site, and in this order:

1. Drastically improve the user experience. This site has grown a bit "tired" in both appearance and function. There are many other forums out there that are far more feature-rich with a much better interface. We want our visitors to have a lot more interaction at this site and provide a much better look and feel overall.

2. Improve the functionality from an admin standpoint. Most forums are run by volunteers, with paid programmers used during the initial installation/conversion and for the occasional upgrade. Today's available software, such as vBulletin, is very reliable and easily maintained by folks like our moderators.

3. Reduce our costs. While we certainly don't want to play with "low ballers" based on price alone, we most definitely want to work with experienced programmers that can offer what we need for a reasonable cost.

With such an incredible depth of VCA member professions out there, we believe that there are some qualified folks out there that would like to provide their expertise back to the club. Not only for the website, but for merchandise, marketing, printing, event promotion, etc. We have a largely untapped wealth of talent, many of which would be delighted to provide it back to the club. Thus our original solicitation.

All that said, we have received our fifth and final website bid as of this morning. The National Officers have met via conference call to discuss the various proposals. We will be making our recommendation to the Web Committee in the next 24 hours to get any additional commentary or suggestions. We then hope to announce the decision within the next seven days after working out the details.

We greatly appreciate your feedback and support!

Chris

Our 10 year old software company builds six and seven-figure websites, and sure the VCA could get married to a programmer (or company) and have them build you a completely custom forum... but why re-invent the wheel?

The forums we've worked with all provide source code... and a good programmer that uses source control and structured bolt-on/bolt-in programming methods can enhance an existing application with much less effort. Plus, when they kill themselves on the track, someone else can pick up the reigns...

You just can't expect someone to "learn" how a custom forum was built, let alone how to enhance it without the documentation you get with off-the-shelf forums.

Long story short - don't advertise for a hobbyist masquerading as a pro - contact vBulletin direct and get some recommendations. They know who's good at modifying their product, 'cause that level of person has a direct relationship with them. If you don't need customization, go down the list and talk to OTHER BIG vBulletin site owners - they'll tell you who they're happy with and WHY they like them.

Don't mess around with volunteers or low-ballers, please.

-John

 

[Supercharged Vipermad]

Bump

 

[plumcrazy]

lol

 

[ViperJames]

hahah...at least nobody got hurt.

 

[PDCjonny]

Fix the search. There is a wealth of older information totally unobtainable presently. No good.

 

[DodgeViper01]

Fix the search. There is a wealth of older information totally unobtainable presently. No good.

Could not be said better. The search used to be great but now it is almost impossible to get back to threads over a year old.

 

[CitySnake]

I was also wondering where we were with this decision. Any update?

 

[big-n-italian]

I was also wondering where we were with this decision. Any update?

go here

 

[CitySnake]

I was also wondering where we were with this decision. Any update?

go here

Got it!

Thanks Big!

 

[C O D Y]

I was wondering how long it was going to take you to bump this thread.

I hope all is going well with the site update.

Bump

 

[Supercharged Vipermad]

We hope to award an agreement on or before February 1st. As per the national bylaws, this will be a short-term contract, extending no longer than December 31, 2008.

"Short-term" gets shorter every day.

HI C O D Y!!!!

 

[Y2K5SRT]

Actually, here is the latest and greatest with only minor editing (we have one other agreement still pending):

1. On February 21st we awarded an agreement to convert the discussion forums to a gentleman that runs other automotive vBulletin sites. We heard back from him on the 25th that he would begin work (no contract requested or signed) and received our first "update" on his progress on March 10th. We did not hear from him again until March 26th, at which point he resigned due to family obligations. The conversion work was not completed.

2. On March 2nd we entered into a contract with Diversified Programming of New Hampshire to provide a more "official" conversion, including complete website design. We asked the vBulletin programmer to report directly to Diversified, as we felt there would be better accountability. Diversified has been AWESOME to work with to date and has come up with some great concepts for the site. When our original programmer resigned on March 26th Diversified had another vBulletin guy lined up. That guy has proven to be not only a **** at this stuff, but is confident that we could convert this entire site from UBB (current software) to vBulletin as soon as THIS Friday night - April 6th. Not bad considering our original goal was March 31st and we lost almost two months in the process.

Again, due to other pending agreements I can't get into much else, however I can tell you that ALL parties involved, from the VCA National officers to the current site admin to Diversified Programming all have the best interests of the VCA in mind. We will provide a complete update after this last agreement is put into place. We believe everybody (no exceptions) will be very happy with the direction the site and the club are taking.

Respectfully submitted,

Chris

Web Committee
National Treasurer

PS. Thanks for the bump Tony!

 

[Hostile]

Chris
Thanks for the update.As for"everyone" I'm watching. :didn't
want you to miss I was just kidden.

Skeeter