What is top NA HP these days?
- Thread starter Tom and Vipers
- Start date
Of course you right those 4 Straight Mopar atl titles my car won mean Nothing (who cares if i beat a hundred or so other Modded NA cars to win them )you know more than i do not having EVER won anything in a Viper in your life.The problem with these threads is that some people used to have a Viper a very long time ago and they think that means they know everything there is to know, when in fact THEY DO NOT.
Ricketts
Enthusiast
And ANOTHER NA engine TOPIC ruined BY Mr CAPITAL letters HIMSELF.................
kcobean
Enthusiast
The insults and name calling need to stop gentlemen. Discuss facts, opinions, whatever, but be polite, or we will have no choice but to lock the thread and any follow on threads that stem from it with the same nasty participants.
got one
Enthusiast
So...to bring this back to the point, it looks like we are hitting some really aggressive NA HP numbers. This is great news. I would LOVE to get more street reliable NA HP from my Gen 1...so please keep with the info coming (minus all the 1/4 mile stuff).
99VPRGTS
Enthusiast
Yes I do, you again make yourself look bad. You don't know me but you automatically assume I don't know what I'm talking about? LMAO I'm going to leave this one alone. This is all you can say in a response to my statement? YOU are the one that doesn't know what you are talking about. Cars can trap several MPH difference based on just DA alone. Get some education.
Sigh, you do enough in this quote also to make yourself look bad but I'll comment anyway. It's simple physics. I know enough about Vipers and racing at the track in general to make me just as knowledgable as you...and from what I can tell, much more.
Wow...again, this is coming from a guy that hasn't owned/raced a Viper in years. Sorry but, the racing world has changed in that last 10 years. If you don't think a car that picked up 80 RWHP, better tune, better powerband, and probably better weather and DA; can't pick up 7 MPH...then you need help and are not educated at all when it comes to the science and physics of racing. Guess all that racing didn't teach you squat huh?
I'm done, this guy is way to ez..
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99VPRGTS
Enthusiast
To get the power to over 600 RWHP in a GEN I...you are going to have to do a lot to get it there N/A. Sell it and start with a GEN II
got one
Enthusiast
To get the power to over 600 RWHP in a GEN I...you are going to have to do a lot to get it there N/A. Sell it and start with a GEN II
would...but i honestly like the looks of the Gen 1 more than the Gen 2...so Gen 1 it is...so, it can't be that much more to get there right?
99VPRGTS
Enthusiast
You might want to check with the GEN I guys because they will have more info than me on the motor. I know that the GEN II motor is different and a much better platform to build.
Yes I do, you again make yourself look bad. You don't know me but you automatically assume I don't know what I'm talking about? LMAO I'm going to leave this one alone. This is all you can say in a response to my statement? YOU are the one that doesn't know what you are talking about. Cars can trap several MPH difference based on just DA alone. Get some education.
Sigh, you do enough in this quote also to make yourself look bad but I'll comment anyway. It's simple physics. I know enough about Vipers and racing at the track in general to make me just as knowledgable as you...and from what I can tell, much more.
Wow...again, this is coming from a guy that hasn't owned/raced a Viper in years. Sorry but, the racing world has changed in that last 10 years. If you don't think a car that picked up 80 RWHP, better tune, better powerband, and probably better weather and DA; can't pick up 7 MPH...then you need help and are not educated at all when it comes to the science and physics of racing. Guess all that racing didn't teach you squat huh?
I'm done, this guy is way to ez..
On Badgt's defence he did drive a Gen4 - he said
Yes, I know, you ask what that has to do with anything - truthfully I don't know. But he often tells me I know nothing because I live in canada and turned down the opportunity to drive a Gen4. Don't want to drive a Gen 4. I like my Sapphire Gen 2.
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gotone.
- watch for a Gen 2 engine. -
The Gen 2s came with a race block because the first standard blocks had many problems. Since there was no problems with the GTSR blocks, they became the standard engine blocks.
They're not too expensive and an excellent base to build hp with.
Ted
99VPRGTS
Enthusiast
Haha. Yes, I like your Sapphire Gen II as well . BTW what other supporting mods do you have that got you to 720 with your ROE? I am thinking about putting a paxton or ROE on my car.
gotone, RTTTTed is spot on about the motor. I remember now, that a buddy of mine was telling me the exact same thing about the GEN I blocks (his name is 99RT/10>S) on here.
. BTW what other supporting mods do you have that got you to 720 with your ROE? I am thinking about putting a paxton or ROE on my car.gotone, RTTTTed is spot on about the motor. I remember now, that a buddy of mine was telling me the exact same thing about the GEN I blocks (his name is 99RT/10>S) on here.
Haha. Yes, I like your Sapphire Gen II as well
QUOTE]
A paxton is "Oh, this is fast" at 600rwhp. A 600rwhp Roe is "holy sh_t. I need some better tires". The torque on my 600rwhp Roe was 644rwtq. It felt like full power at 2,000 rpm. The Paxton is like a na engine and builds power with the rpms while the Roe is like Nitrous Oxide and is all there with the touch of the throttle. (Sorry Plum)
I have a Macedo built 9-1 forged piston, 708 cam, TNT 1.7 -1 rockers, Macedo custom air intake box and tubing, Roe TBs, water/**** inj., vac crank system, wires, Vec 2/3, MSD BAP, Walbro 255 fuel pump, TNT headers, no cats and Corsa track exhaust, alum flywheel and Tiranium axles. When I was waiting for Sean Roe to mail me his Vec to borrow - I noticed that I had a headgasket seeping slightly so I called JonB and got a set of top end gaskets. I pulled the heads and spent a few days porting and polishing them and the intakes of the Roe intake manifold. I plan to finish the instal on my Nitrous system this summer. Not planning to use it, but since installing PS2s I have enough traction that I could probably use a little Nitrous.
Ted
99VPRGTS
Enthusiast
Yeah that is why I was leaning towards a ROE...the fun to drive factor sounds better!
Those are impressive numbers and the sauce will put some serious power down...it will also be good if you run across some TT cars on the highways
Those are impressive numbers and the sauce will put some serious power down...it will also be good if you run across some TT cars on the highways
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TexasPettey
Enthusiast
The biggest deltas between a Gen2 & Gen1 for N/A HP are:
- Compression is 0.5 lower on a Gen1
- Throttle body openings are 56mm on a Gen1 vs 62mm on a Gen2
- Computer is OBD-1 on a Gen1 and likely requires an aftermarket computer to tune well (I say likely because I thought I saw one tuner that could tune Gen1 without an aftermarket)
- Airbox is different (unclear if this is a restriction or not vs the Gen2 airbox)
You can get Gen1 heads ported to be very close to Gen2 flow numbers. Gregg Good did mine and got 305CFM on intake vs a 320CFM for his work on Gen2 heads. The 305CFM number is much higher than a lot of other heads you see out there.
CAMs are a direct match between the two. You'll want a new high HP NA CAM in either case.
Since you already have headers and exhaust and smooth tubes, you're going to be in the exponentially increasing $/HP range. The next steps would be a computer/tune & rockers & throttle bodies. Then CAM and Head work. Without doing work to increase the compression, you'll be at a loss vs the Gen2 camp for the same $ figure.
I'm right around 500RWHP without bumping the compression and with a 708 CAM.
Yeah that is why I was leaning towards a ROE...the fun to drive factor sounds better!
Those are impressive numbers and the sauce will put some serious power down...it will also be good if you run across some TT cars on the highways
The first car I even drove that I figured had enough power and probably didn't need anymore unless runing DRs or slicks was my 01 GTS. 10.5 on PS1s. The huge torque causes some serious 'issues' with vehicle control and although I've driven street racers all my life, this is not the amount of hp I recommend to any except serious adrenaline junkies. That being stated, since I'm going to finish my 100+Nitrous install, I risk Death and Destruction again (or just plain joy of being alive?). I think that 99% of people would be more than satisfied with a 600rwhp Roe or a 750rwhp Paxton.
Fun factor is a 550rwhp roe or 650rwhp Paxton. &00+ Roe or 750rwhp Paxton is WAY beyond fun. Dangerous for most, but pure adrenaline if you're mind is bent that way.
Ted
I was told that a hundred shot would produce about 150rwhp on a 10# boost engine because of the intercooling effects of the Nitrous. Don't know and I'm not sure where to go to get a Vec tune in Wstrn Cda. Maybe a 700mile drive to Davenports in Calgary? But I havn't heard of any Vec tunes from there that are happy tunes yet.
I think it'll make more than that. And the torque will be off the hook. Ask 99RT/10. He's run nitrous on his Roe car.
got one
Enthusiast
Swapping motors might just be a bit complex (becuase the computer and such would go with it?)...
Chris, are we still talking about reliable HP gains here? You know me and my driving style/mileage...I would need reliable HP vs. simply Dyno HP
Yours seems to be pretty darn reliable and 500HP sounds like fun...what were your TQ numbers again?Swapping motors shouldn't be difficult. The computer needs reprogramming no matter what you do. More hp needs more fuel. Cam needs more fuel, better heads - more fuel. Newer engine has better heads and everything and needs more fuel. Use a vec, or whatever you'd use to tune with heads.
Although the Gen 2 computer is so much better than the gen 1 it is worth changing for it's own advantages.
Ted
Although the Gen 2 computer is so much better than the gen 1 it is worth changing for it's own advantages.
Ted
TexasPettey
Enthusiast
Swapping motors might just be a bit complex (becuase the computer and such would go with it?)...
Chris, are we still talking about reliable HP gains here? You know me and my driving style/mileage...I would need reliable HP vs. simply Dyno HP
I wouldn't spend the $ to swap a motor unless you had one that was already blown. I was thinking more along the lines of a Gen2 being a better starting point for invasive mods.
My setup is very reliable, although I just had a lifter fail. So, my heads will have to come off. With your driving style, I don't think there'd be any concern. Even with a couple of track events per year, the setup would be really solid.
LPDesRoche
Viper Owner
REALLY then explain why MY GEN 4 has one of the fastest recorded times EVER for a stock Viper 11.3 at close to 130 (only a year and a half ago )Since you claim to have raced VIPERS list the titles YOU CAR HAS WON.Yes I do, you again make yourself look bad. You don't know me but you automatically assume I don't know what I'm talking about? LMAO I'm going to leave this one alone. This is all you can say in a response to my statement? YOU are the one that doesn't know what you are talking about. Cars can trap several MPH difference based on just DA alone. Get some education.
Sigh, you do enough in this quote also to make yourself look bad but I'll comment anyway. It's simple physics. I know enough about Vipers and racing at the track in general to make me just as knowledgable as you...and from what I can tell, much more.
Wow...again, this is coming from a guy that hasn't owned/raced a Viper in years. Sorry but, the racing world has changed in that last 10 years. If you don't think a car that picked up 80 RWHP, better tune, better powerband, and probably better weather and DA; can't pick up 7 MPH...then you need help and are not educated at all when it comes to the science and physics of racing. Guess all that racing didn't teach you squat huh?
I'm done, this guy is way to ez..
99VPRGTS
Enthusiast
Every post you make further makes you look silly. First off, were talking about a GTS N/A trapping 141. Second, again, there are so many factors that go into running at the track. Third, considering the fastest bone stock as gone 10.9, which is almost half a second faster than you, I wouldn't say you are one of the fastest. Also, this has nothing to do with titles. You won those 11 years ago...the fastest thing out there driving on the streets had 800HP. Fourth, I never claimed that I raced anything (even though I have). Knowledge of engineering, physics, DA, track conditions, power bands in N/A vs F.I. vs Supercharged vs Turbo cars, launching parameters, tire size, tire type, and finally, track prep. You seem to not have very good knowledge of any of this. If you did, you should know that a car that has picked up 80 RWHP, a better tune, leading to a better powerband, and most likely improved track conditions, can pick up 6-7 MPH and roll over 140. Stop comparing old school **** dude. No one cares about your worked motors with 150 shots from 10 years ago. The entire scope of racing has changed. Bacak then, a mid 9 in a fully streetable car was about the fastest in the world. This guy is funny ahahahahFastMatt
Enthusiast
My Stock bottom end 2001, striker heads/cam car trapped 130mph at 3600ft in altitude on 91 pump gas. on 19" street tires.
C.Hermsen
Enthusiast
I'm not following this thread too close, but I'm just wondering how anyone with such horrible spelling and a CAPS lOcK obsession can be taken seriously?
LPDesRoche
Viper Owner
Very nice!!
