luc
Enthusiast
Where is the \"VCA mistake\" thread gone?
Magic Wand at work ?
Luc.00GTS
Magic Wand at work ?
Luc.00GTS
Where is the "VCA mistake" thread gone?
- Thread starter luc
- Start date
Fred(DrivingSchool)Kinder
Enthusiast
Re: Where is the
Correct!
Correct!
Supercharged Vipermad
Enthusiast
Re: Where is the
That is the wrong place fot it. So, what you are saying is that if one wants to know the good AND the bad about the VCA they need to pony up the $$$ first? This may have been the wrong forum...but at least it was more right than hidden in a private area...with a controlled audience.
That is the wrong place fot it. So, what you are saying is that if one wants to know the good AND the bad about the VCA they need to pony up the $$$ first? This may have been the wrong forum...but at least it was more right than hidden in a private area...with a controlled audience.
luc
Enthusiast
Re: Where is the
Tony:
I couldn't agree more with you.
I'm sure peoples are smart enough to know that the ONLY reason the thread was moved to a "safer" (meaning as Tony said,with a lot smaller controlled audience)location, is because it was critical of the way the VCA is run at the national level by a "old boys network".
Would the thread have been praising the same "old boys network", it will have never been moved.
The thread was making some allegations that the "old boys network" were trying to remove/make his re-election almost impossible, a very well known regional officer,with a reputation of hard work,honesty,and often critical of the way the VCA is run at the national level,by using some arcane and complicated "election rules" and to replace him by a "yes man".
A petition was also part of the thread and obviously, removing this thread from the most visited sections of this web site, do nothing to help it.
The thread also explained how the "old boys network" control the election of the national officers.
To make an analogy with the ways the VCA President ant top officers are elected,will be like if the President of the US, instead of being elected by the majority of the US citizens (members for the VCA) was choosen by a few senators/congressmans/lobbysts (spel?) after a lot of back room dealing.
Will potential new VCA members be interested in the way the VCA is run before paying their due ?
Luc 00GTS
PS: As you can see, I have been around for quite a while and i decided not to renew my membership of few years ago after a very sad episode of "Magic Wand" were ANY threads even SLIGHTLY critical of the way the VCA was run, was deleted,without any explanations nor reasons by the "**** censors"
Tony:
I couldn't agree more with you.
I'm sure peoples are smart enough to know that the ONLY reason the thread was moved to a "safer" (meaning as Tony said,with a lot smaller controlled audience)location, is because it was critical of the way the VCA is run at the national level by a "old boys network".
Would the thread have been praising the same "old boys network", it will have never been moved.
The thread was making some allegations that the "old boys network" were trying to remove/make his re-election almost impossible, a very well known regional officer,with a reputation of hard work,honesty,and often critical of the way the VCA is run at the national level,by using some arcane and complicated "election rules" and to replace him by a "yes man".
A petition was also part of the thread and obviously, removing this thread from the most visited sections of this web site, do nothing to help it.
The thread also explained how the "old boys network" control the election of the national officers.
To make an analogy with the ways the VCA President ant top officers are elected,will be like if the President of the US, instead of being elected by the majority of the US citizens (members for the VCA) was choosen by a few senators/congressmans/lobbysts (spel?) after a lot of back room dealing.
Will potential new VCA members be interested in the way the VCA is run before paying their due ?
Luc 00GTS
PS: As you can see, I have been around for quite a while and i decided not to renew my membership of few years ago after a very sad episode of "Magic Wand" were ANY threads even SLIGHTLY critical of the way the VCA was run, was deleted,without any explanations nor reasons by the "**** censors"
Janni
Enthusiast
Re: Where is the
Actually - it's very distinctly VCA business, solicits requests for VCA member signatures, discusses VCA business, etc. It belongs there.
Actually - it's very distinctly VCA business, solicits requests for VCA member signatures, discusses VCA business, etc. It belongs there.
Supercharged Vipermad
Enthusiast
Re: Where is the
I almost agree Janni. While it is clearly VCA business much of the discussion could very well affect some of the people like Luc...though the only way he'll get to know the outcome is to drop the $$$ so he can get in there.
That being said, I doubt it was a crystal clear case of the thread NEEDING to be in there...so the default action should have been to just leave it, IMHO of course.
Obviously, those who have decided to "leave the fold" are now out of the loop...so any of their issues are hidden, and they have no voice.
One could argue they could have a voice if they ponied up the $$$....but who, in their right mind, would re-join an organization without FIRST having/seeing some dialog concerning why they laft in the first place?
So.repsectfully...I'll agree to disagree with you.
I almost agree Janni. While it is clearly VCA business much of the discussion could very well affect some of the people like Luc...though the only way he'll get to know the outcome is to drop the $$$ so he can get in there.
That being said, I doubt it was a crystal clear case of the thread NEEDING to be in there...so the default action should have been to just leave it, IMHO of course.
Obviously, those who have decided to "leave the fold" are now out of the loop...so any of their issues are hidden, and they have no voice.
One could argue they could have a voice if they ponied up the $$$....but who, in their right mind, would re-join an organization without FIRST having/seeing some dialog concerning why they laft in the first place?
So.repsectfully...I'll agree to disagree with you.
kcobean
Enthusiast
Re: Where is the
From an 'outsiders' point of view of that thread, I have to say that it made me want to run far and fast from the organization at the national level. The VCA seems corrupt and myred in progress crushing politics. That's not recreational in my book, and recreation is what this car is all about. However, I think for $100 or $125 / year, I'll join just because from what I've seen so far, I really like the folks in my region. And heck, I've practically lived on this web-site ever since I made the decision to purchase a Viper. I'm willing to kick in a few bucks to help keep things running. $10/month isn't going to break the bank.
I guess if you look at this as a "public forum", the thread shouldn't have been moved so that the public can learn about the organization (good or bad). If you look at this as a private forum owned by the VCA, then any information posted here is subject to VCA discretion. In either case, I'm glad I got to read as much as I did of that thread before it got moved.
From an 'outsiders' point of view of that thread, I have to say that it made me want to run far and fast from the organization at the national level. The VCA seems corrupt and myred in progress crushing politics. That's not recreational in my book, and recreation is what this car is all about. However, I think for $100 or $125 / year, I'll join just because from what I've seen so far, I really like the folks in my region. And heck, I've practically lived on this web-site ever since I made the decision to purchase a Viper. I'm willing to kick in a few bucks to help keep things running. $10/month isn't going to break the bank.
I guess if you look at this as a "public forum", the thread shouldn't have been moved so that the public can learn about the organization (good or bad). If you look at this as a private forum owned by the VCA, then any information posted here is subject to VCA discretion. In either case, I'm glad I got to read as much as I did of that thread before it got moved.
Warfang
Enthusiast
Re: Where is the
I pretty much put up the $$$ to contribute to the website. Like you, I spend enough time here to warrant paying for my use of bandwidth. The extra benefit is that it keeps the intellectually-challenged from pulling out the "Well, I'm right because I'm a member and you're not," card. The skip barber discounts are nice too. I've never been much of a follower, so never really cared to join clubs. It always get political, corruption always ensues, and whiners will always surface. I'd rather do my own thing with a couple guys I can honestly call friends.
I pretty much put up the $$$ to contribute to the website. Like you, I spend enough time here to warrant paying for my use of bandwidth. The extra benefit is that it keeps the intellectually-challenged from pulling out the "Well, I'm right because I'm a member and you're not," card. The skip barber discounts are nice too. I've never been much of a follower, so never really cared to join clubs. It always get political, corruption always ensues, and whiners will always surface. I'd rather do my own thing with a couple guys I can honestly call friends.
Janni
Enthusiast
Re: Where is the
the difficulty is - that things like the financials - which ARE finally getting published will NEVER be placed in the non-VCA section and are communicated via VCA Notes - so non-members won't ever get to see them - but can see all the dissent. Not sure that's a fair sided fight.
Disenfranchised members could and should contact their local VCA president to discuss any issues and they can be forthcoming about any concerns they have. And of course - all the national officers contact info is published - so specific concerns by these prior members can be addresed directly and answered before they spend their hard earned money again.
Not sure airing dirty laundry without a ton of history and the ability to respond serves a *new* member, at all.
the difficulty is - that things like the financials - which ARE finally getting published will NEVER be placed in the non-VCA section and are communicated via VCA Notes - so non-members won't ever get to see them - but can see all the dissent. Not sure that's a fair sided fight.
Disenfranchised members could and should contact their local VCA president to discuss any issues and they can be forthcoming about any concerns they have. And of course - all the national officers contact info is published - so specific concerns by these prior members can be addresed directly and answered before they spend their hard earned money again.
Not sure airing dirty laundry without a ton of history and the ability to respond serves a *new* member, at all.
luc
Enthusiast
Re: Where is the
Janni:
I have ben around long enough to know that what matter is not what peoples say but what they do.
Times and times again the "control freaks" mostly some at the national level, have shown that they don't respect dissenting views and act as if the VCA is their personal property instead of belonging to the members.
Yes, it could be argued that the thread belong in the "members only" section of the web site but the fact remain that it was moved in order to decrease it's exposure, ONLY because it was critical of the way the VCA is run, you know as well than I do that a thread praising the VCA leadership will have NEVER been moved from the most visited section of this site.
That is the issue, not were do the thread belong.
Luc.00GTS
PS: It is also customary when a thread is moved, to leave a post in the section the thread was originaly posted indicating it's new location.
I don't believe that it was done this time. do you know why?
Beside the "excuse" that it was an oversight?
Janni:
I have ben around long enough to know that what matter is not what peoples say but what they do.
Times and times again the "control freaks" mostly some at the national level, have shown that they don't respect dissenting views and act as if the VCA is their personal property instead of belonging to the members.
Yes, it could be argued that the thread belong in the "members only" section of the web site but the fact remain that it was moved in order to decrease it's exposure, ONLY because it was critical of the way the VCA is run, you know as well than I do that a thread praising the VCA leadership will have NEVER been moved from the most visited section of this site.
That is the issue, not were do the thread belong.
Luc.00GTS
PS: It is also customary when a thread is moved, to leave a post in the section the thread was originaly posted indicating it's new location.
I don't believe that it was done this time. do you know why?
Beside the "excuse" that it was an oversight?
who\'s running against Chris?
So some actually believe the VCA was trying to replace Chris with a “yes man” by not sending Chris a notice of the deadline date? I want to know who that “yes man” is. Also, don’t you think that if a petition was being circulated for signatures that SOMEONE would have called Chris and said “ Hey Chris, I hear the Yes Man is running for your DAL position”. There goes any chance of sneaking that date by Chris. Let’s see who signed the petition for the Yes Man and understand who all is involved in this cover up.
More than anyone here (‘cept maybe Bill P), Chris could shoot out an e-mail with a petition attachment to the people in his Zone the day the thing was due and have 25 signatures in less than an hour.
Allegations that the Good Old Boy network at the VCA were trying to take actions that would replace Chris with a “yes man” are unfounded. It just stirs up paranoia and charges of corruption that comes each election cycle.
Between elections there are long board meetings and lots of messages, and really long conference calls where the Regional Presidents and National Board discuss club business - sometimes agreeing and sometimes not agreeing - but hopefully putting egos aside when they are on the dissenting side of something and moving on for the best of the club. It’s what they are elected to do.
So some actually believe the VCA was trying to replace Chris with a “yes man” by not sending Chris a notice of the deadline date? I want to know who that “yes man” is. Also, don’t you think that if a petition was being circulated for signatures that SOMEONE would have called Chris and said “ Hey Chris, I hear the Yes Man is running for your DAL position”. There goes any chance of sneaking that date by Chris. Let’s see who signed the petition for the Yes Man and understand who all is involved in this cover up.
More than anyone here (‘cept maybe Bill P), Chris could shoot out an e-mail with a petition attachment to the people in his Zone the day the thing was due and have 25 signatures in less than an hour.
Allegations that the Good Old Boy network at the VCA were trying to take actions that would replace Chris with a “yes man” are unfounded. It just stirs up paranoia and charges of corruption that comes each election cycle.
Between elections there are long board meetings and lots of messages, and really long conference calls where the Regional Presidents and National Board discuss club business - sometimes agreeing and sometimes not agreeing - but hopefully putting egos aside when they are on the dissenting side of something and moving on for the best of the club. It’s what they are elected to do.
luc
Enthusiast
Re: who\'s running against Chris?
Marv:
You must have misread the thread/post, the petition was IN favor of Chris.
Marv:
You must have misread the thread/post, the petition was IN favor of Chris.
Re: who\'s running against Chris?
Ok, Thanks luc,
I was under the impression the allegation was that the VCA had someone else getting lined up for Chris's DAL spot and was hoping Chris and no one else would think about the deadline date so the Yes Man would squeeze Chris out. That all seemed like quite a reach.
Ok, Thanks luc,
I was under the impression the allegation was that the VCA had someone else getting lined up for Chris's DAL spot and was hoping Chris and no one else would think about the deadline date so the Yes Man would squeeze Chris out. That all seemed like quite a reach.
DEVILDOG
VCA Member North TX
Re: who\'s running against Chris?
The cockroaches heading for the darkness. How long before this thread disappears?
The cockroaches heading for the darkness. How long before this thread disappears?
DEVILDOG
VCA Member North TX
Re: Where is the
Cockroaches.
Cockroaches.
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