304 New gen 5 Vipers on Autotrader for sale

[Policy Limits]

Hey if Detroit fails (again) perhaps they'll just get bailed out (again) Instead of going Bankrupt like we'd be forced to.

Hence, I certainly would worry about your own solvency exclusively since that too big to fail nonsense doesn't apply to the rest of us.

 

[kratedisease]

Hey if Detroit fails (again) perhaps they'll just get bailed out (again) Instead of going Bankrupt like we'd be forced to.

Hence, I certainly would worry about your own solvency exclusively since that too big to fail nonsense doesn't apply to the rest of us.

WAY TOO early to say Detroit failed again. The economy still ***** despite what the mainstream media says, and that would hold back people just throwing around money to buy a 100K car.

Believe me, the people who posted that Porsche dealers discount off sticker now are speaking the truth but this is only because of the economy. A few years back ( 2007-2008) people were paying over sticker on Porsche.

The Viper is selling. Its just that I believe most people expected 2013 Viper demand to outpace initial production initially on introduction ( during the initial "have to be first on the block" POP) before demand started to calm down. And I think that this is what is disturbing. At least that is IMO.

 

[BlueLIGHTNING]

There are cars sitting in dealers up here in Ontario and one is LE edition which supposedly only two came to Canada. Figured that would sell fast and they are asking $141,900 if I'm correct.

 

[ViperSmith]

From a number of Ralph's comments, it sounds like around 1500 a year is the breakeven point for a profit with around 2500 a year a maximum without really ramping up the production capability.

I thought it was more towards 800 to be profitable. But who knows. I have heard the figure been said, I can't seem to find it.

 

[ViperSmith]

Would love to own a new one, can't afford it. I do think the car is worth what you paid for, IMHO anyway. The Viper is worth 100-115K, not 143K listed in the rags or dealer stickers. So you can get discounts on Ferraris etc., good to know the Viper is not alone in that sense. I hope the Viper does catch on and that I am proven wrong. It just seems that the Viper is a mixed bag when it comes to reviews and perceptions. I am most certainly rooting for the success of the Viper.

Those with the tricked out GTS seem to love them. Seemingly many think it is worth the sticker.

I think the real issue is too many dealers ordered the GTS models. I think this is going to lead to lots of left over inventory. $100k cars aren't easy to sell, $140k cars are even harder. I think if more SRT were ordered, they maybe moving better. Dealers saw the expensive GTS as a get rich quick scheme, but didn't count on every other dealer around the country thinking the same.

Only ~170 SRT models (including the 100 red SRT + Track Pack) built is the issue.

 

[SRTviper]

Those with the tricked out GTS seem to love them. Seemingly many think it is worth the sticker.

I think the real issue is too many dealers ordered the GTS models. I think this is going to lead to lots of left over inventory. $100k cars aren't easy to sell, $140k cars are even harder. I think if more SRT were ordered, they maybe moving better. Dealers saw the expensive GTS as a get rich quick scheme, but didn't count on every other dealer around the country thinking the same.

Only ~170 SRT models (including the 100 red SRT + Track Pack) built is the issue.

If the GTS fully optioned was 125k excluding stryker paint it would be the first car that I would say doesn't need anything off MSRP and would be worth it. But it is 20k extra hence why it needs at least 10-20k discount which dealers are now starting to do. At least they are doing 5-10 which is a start.

The SRT at 97 probably should be dropped to more around 90 and I think at these price points the viper would have been out the door in every dealer lot not charging an ADM.

At 145k or more for stryker paint compromise needs to start going out the window. And the viper still has a lot of compromise compared to other comparable sport cars at that price point like an r8 for example.

 

[ViperSmith]

If the GTS fully optioned was 125k excluding stryker paint it would be the first car that I would say doesn't need anything off MSRP and would be worth it. But it is 20k extra hence why it needs at least 10-20k discount which dealers are now starting to do. At least they are doing 5-10 which is a start.

The SRT at 97 probably should be dropped to more around 90 and I think at these price points the viper would have been out the door in every dealer lot not charging an ADM.

At 145k or more for stryker paint compromise needs to start going out the window. And the viper still has a lot of compromise compared to other comparable sport cars at that price point like an r8 for example.

Please, link me to a dealer offering $20k off MSRP.

 

[Catwood]

I got a call from one offering $15K off if I'd step on a GTS....I passed on it. Had it been gray I'd have thought about it for 24 hours before I declined.

 

[PeerBlock]

Just looked on Autotrader for 2013 Viper.... a total of 304 for sale. A few weeks ago it was 240something Vipers for sale...... the inventory is growing.....

What are you waiting for? Go buy one then I'll consider being your friend on friendster.

 

[Hemotoxic]

​

The one from criswell belonged to a 75 year old man who said it is too much car for him. And no they do not offer test drives on a used viper I already asked

I'm sure you did. sheesh.

Will somebody puh-LEEEZE give this man a test drive so his life can be complete?

 

[chorps]

I got a call from one offering $15K off if I'd step on a GTS....I passed on it. Had it been gray I'd have thought about it for 24 hours before I declined.

15k off MSRP or 15k off an inflated +ADM price?

 

[kratedisease]

What are you waiting for? Go buy one then I'll consider being your friend on friendster.

PeerBlock I want to be your friend.... we can drink Hateorade together....

 

[kratedisease]

Those with the tricked out GTS seem to love them. Seemingly many think it is worth the sticker.

I think the real issue is too many dealers ordered the GTS models. I think this is going to lead to lots of left over inventory. $100k cars aren't easy to sell, $140k cars are even harder. I think if more SRT were ordered, they maybe moving better. Dealers saw the expensive GTS as a get rich quick scheme, but didn't count on every other dealer around the country thinking the same.

Only ~170 SRT models (including the 100 red SRT + Track Pack) built is the issue.

Yes, That seems to be a correct evaluation of the situation. I agree totally.

 

[kratedisease]

PeerBlock, you are very popular. PeerBlock, I want to be your friendster. Peerblock, I will only buy a Viper if it is exactly like yours. PeerBlock, is your Viper stryker red ? and PeerBlock, what color interior do you have ? PeerBlock, what options do you have. I want to buy a Viper that is exactly like yours. I want to be popular like you....PeerBlock.

PeerBlock, I went to two local dealers to view the car in person and I found a few things that I did not like about the new Viper...

1) when I sit in the drivers seat ( SRT and GTS both) my shirt gets creased in the back. This is unacceptable.

2) The engine compartment of both cars I viewed had some dust in the engine compartment. Again unacceptable.

3) When I looked inside the gas filler door I noticed that the paint inside the fuel filler neck was unevenly sprayed in texture. This is totally unacceptable. OMG, what would the gas attendant think about me if he also noticed it.

If Chrysler would address these issues I would then consider buying a New 2013 Viper .

 

[SADVIPER]

There are cars sitting in dealers up here in Ontario and one is LE edition which supposedly only two came to Canada. Figured that would sell fast and they are asking $141,900 if I'm correct.

Ralph got his disturbution and forecast wrong.

 

[PeerBlock]

PeerBlock, I went to two local dealers to view the car in person and I found a few things that I did not like about the new Viper...

1) when I sit in the drivers seat ( SRT and GTS both) my shirt gets creased in the back. This is unacceptable.

2) The engine compartment of both cars I viewed had some dust in the engine compartment. Again unacceptable.

3) When I looked inside the gas filler door I noticed that the paint inside the fuel filler neck was unevenly sprayed in texture. This is totally unacceptable. OMG, what would the gas attendant think about me if he also noticed it.

If Chrysler would address these issues I would then consider buying a New 2013 Viper .

1) Why are you wearing a shirt? Shirts are for *******.

2) Clearly you're single or your bromeo would clean up the dust for you.

3) Nothing a can of krylon can't fix.

You better not wait too long or you're going to end up with a C7 and then nobody will like you.

 

[Nine Ball]

Glad to see PB playing along now

I agree with an earlier statement, dealers should have stocked up on SRT and SRT + Track Pack cars, instead of GTS models. I'd have left the GTS to custom orders only, for those guys who are used to ordering their Ferraris/Lambos/Porsche just the way they want them. You rarely see fully loaded 911's on the lot, but they are more than happy to show you the catalog of parts you can pick to order one. The SRT cars are easily good enough to let shoppers know if they want a Viper, or not.

 

[SRTviper]

I'm sure you did. sheesh.

Will somebody puh-LEEEZE give this man a test drive so his life can be complete?

yes puh LEEEEZEEEE lol

 

[kratedisease]

1) Why are you wearing a shirt? Shirts are for *******.

2) Clearly you're single or your bromeo would clean up the dust for you.

3) Nothing a can of krylon can't fix.

You better not wait too long or you're going to end up with a C7 and then nobody will like you.

PB, I think everyone is happy that you finally removed stick that was stuck inside your *****...... and .......I would never use Krylon on a Viper.

I use paint protection film inside my fuel filler so that the gas nozzle does not scratch the black paint inside the fuel filler neck. Don't You ???

 

[Policy Limits]

Only 13 2013 models listed on Dupont Registry inventory. One 2014 list though not sure if that's a typo

 

[ACR steve]

Its funny how people say its not worth the money? I am not sure what is today but the one thing I can say is a light weight car that is all carbon fiber skinned except alum doors,640 hp v10, leather interior sourced from Ferrari manf. and very very low production is to me an insane deal at $110,000 -$140,000

 

[ACRucrazy]

Glad to see PB playing along now

I agree with an earlier statement, dealers should have stocked up on SRT and SRT + Track Pack cars, instead of GTS models. I'd have left the GTS to custom orders only, for those guys who are used to ordering their Ferraris/Lambos/Porsche just the way they want them. You rarely see fully loaded 911's on the lot, but they are more than happy to show you the catalog of parts you can pick to order one. The SRT cars are easily good enough to let shoppers know if they want a Viper, or not.

Agreed.

SRT > GTS

 

[SRTviper]

Its funny how people say its not worth the money? I am not sure what is today but the one thing I can say is a light weight car that is all carbon fiber skinned except alum doors,640 hp v10, leather interior sourced from Ferrari manf. and very very low production is to me an insane deal at $110,000 -$140,000

You're forgetting about the refinement factor. And adjustability that comes at that price point. This car lacks that. So if it had for example fully adjustable shocks not just normal and firm and say an adjustable exhaust or some more tech then it would be worth the 140k. It is soley 140k because Chrysler cannot manufacture it a more efficient way. I'm sure if they could charge less and still make a hefty profit they would love to (I'm guessing and giving them the benefit of the doubt) and rub it in GM's face and all zr1 owners but they can't. Hell even ford can't. The 2013 shelby had maybe 3k worth of actual changes put into it between 2012 and 2013 yet Ford charged 6k for the changes and it is higher production than the viper.

GM changed the entire corvette and hardly changed anything. That is good manufacturing.

 

[Nine Ball]

You're forgetting about the refinement factor. And adjustability that comes at that price point. This car lacks that. So if it had for example fully adjustable shocks not just normal and firm and say an adjustable exhaust or some more tech then it would be worth the 140k. It is soley 140k because Chrysler cannot manufacture it a more efficient way. I'm sure if they could charge less and still make a hefty profit they would love to (I'm guessing and giving them the benefit of the doubt) and rub it in GM's face and all zr1 owners but they can't. Hell even ford can't. The 2013 shelby had maybe 3k worth of actual changes put into it between 2012 and 2013 yet Ford charged 6k for the changes and it is higher production than the viper.

GM changed the entire corvette and hardly changed anything. That is good manufacturing.

You simply do not get it. Like I've said before, not a Viper guy. You are assuming all car brands think the same way. If that were so, there would be 6-cylinder Ferraris out there, robot-built in mass numbers, and then the cost of the 458 would be under $100K because they sold 30,000 of the lesser models to cover the development costs.

That isn't what Ferrari wants. They do appreciate exclusivity and being hand assembled. SRT does also. Have you toured the Corvette and the Viper plants? There is an entirely different dynamic between the two. The two cars get compared a lot, but they are not the same, and do not have the same goals. Corvette churns out 20,000+ per year, and uses the cheaper base models to subsidize development of the higher performance models. If they only made the ZR1 (which is $130K new) then it would also be a much more expensive car without the base models. The LS V8 engines also benefit from development budgets found within the 1/2-ton trucks, Camaros, SUV's, and even the CTS-V. We do not want a Hemi V8 powered Viper. NO thanks!

Vipers are assembled by hand, not by robots. The assembly line consists of rolling the car from bay to bay, and using simple 2-post lifts to get them up. The Viper builders are proud of this. What other US sportscars can claim this hand-built status? It is the same process Lambo and Ferrari use.

I do not want to see 20,000 Vipers built per year. I do not mind paying more for a little exclusivity and resale. Most owners here would agree with this.

 

[ViperSmith]

Half the fun of a Viper is you never see them on the road.

It has been in the last two years I've seen two Vipers driving around (of any iteration) driving around.

I passed six Corvettes driving to the mall today.

I could have purchased a more "refined" 991S for the price of my SRT. But Porsches are a dime a dozen as well, but due to their refinement, they lack passion to me.

 

[ViperSmith]

Glad to see PB playing along now

I agree with an earlier statement, dealers should have stocked up on SRT and SRT + Track Pack cars, instead of GTS models. I'd have left the GTS to custom orders only, for those guys who are used to ordering their Ferraris/Lambos/Porsche just the way they want them. You rarely see fully loaded 911's on the lot, but they are more than happy to show you the catalog of parts you can pick to order one. The SRT cars are easily good enough to let shoppers know if they want a Viper, or not.

I'd be curious to see if for the 2nd wave it switches to SRTs being ordered.

But hey, I sort of like the fact a whole 70 or so SRT outside of the reds were built.

Curious to see what resale ends up being on these a year or two down the road (not that I plan on selling anytime soon)

 

[SRTviper]

You simply do not get it. Like I've said before, not a Viper guy. You are assuming all car brands think the same way. If that were so, there would be 6-cylinder Ferraris out there, robot-built in mass numbers, and then the cost of the 458 would be under $100K because they sold 30,000 of the lesser models to cover the development costs.

That isn't what Ferrari wants. They do appreciate exclusivity and being hand assembled. SRT does also. Have you toured the Corvette and the Viper plants? There is an entirely different dynamic between the two. The two cars get compared a lot, but they are not the same, and do not have the same goals. Corvette churns out 20,000+ per year, and uses the cheaper base models to subsidize development of the higher performance models. If they only made the ZR1 (which is $130K new) then it would also be a much more expensive car without the base models. The LS V8 engines also benefit from development budgets found within the 1/2-ton trucks, Camaros, SUV's, and even the CTS-V. We do not want a Hemi V8 powered Viper. NO thanks!

Vipers are assembled by hand, not by robots. The assembly line consists of rolling the car from bay to bay, and using simple 2-post lifts to get them up. The Viper builders are proud of this. What other US sportscars can claim this hand-built status? It is the same process Lambo and Ferrari use.

I do not want to see 20,000 Vipers built per year. I do not mind paying more for a little exclusivity and resale. Most owners here would agree with this.

No my friend, it is not being a viper guy. lol you simply don't understand econ 101. You're also forgetting aston martin and maserati use the same process for the same money but you get lots of refinement. The only reason maserati can give you ferrari gear for cheaper is because of the better manufacturing that ferrari gave them.

Why do you think the GTS leather only cost 7500 to upgrade? Because they learned the better skills from Ferrari. They even said it themselves they went into the factory for ferrari/maserati and learned. Knowledge creates efficiency which means they can charge less for manufacturing which equals better manufacturing. The next thing you need to learn which is said many times is economies of scale. And bulk buying. Both viper and GM get their carbon fiber from Plasan. Plasan is known for manufacturing high high high quality carbon fiber for very cheap. But obviously GM gets a bigger discount than say SRT due to the sheer bulk of carbon fiber GM uses over SRT.

There is so much math and statistics and economics involved in all of this that someone with zero knowledge no offense who thinks it is because they do this for the "viper faithful" is someone who has the knowledge of a caveman when it comes to this field. At the end of the day it is this, can they make money? Can they produce this as cheaply as possible but keep it within certain quality constraints? The whole car making process is this is our budget now what is the highest quality we can get for that budget and how much extra will our buyers pay. Then what comes into play is what the market can produce which at the end of the day like I keep saying, GM has the advantage over SRT and as I keep saying THAT IS OK. The majority of buyers are not cross shopping the zr1 with the viper, SRT knows this. And so does GM.

SRT wants to pull people who buy ferraris, lambos, aston martin, mercedes amg, bmw m, and porsche into this car. And they are succeeding. That is why you see so many GTS vipers on the lots of dealers. It is not just because they want to make more money but this GTS model is the whole reason the viper will attract more attention. Not because of the same base SRT mentality that the viper loyal want and it is that same small demographic that caused the viper to die out in the first place.

 

[SRTviper]

Half the fun of a Viper is you never see them on the road.

It has been in the last two years I've seen two Vipers driving around (of any iteration) driving around.

I passed six Corvettes driving to the mall today.

I could have purchased a more "refined" 991S for the price of my SRT. But Porsches are a dime a dozen as well, but due to their refinement, they lack passion to me.

^1 this is the appeal of the viper. And everyone knows this. This is why I am interested in the first place. It is something you really don't see. Even in our area.

 

[DMan]

Do we know the invoice to MSRP gap on SRT & GTS?

Hearing dicounts ranging from $5-20k, I'm wondering what's in the MSRP that dealers have to play with.

 

[Nine Ball]

I understand econ 101 just fine. There are also two ways to look at supply vs demand. Some prefer to keep supply low, in order to (hopefully) increase demand (and pricing). Some prefer to produce mass quantities and flood the supply, to keep pricing low. If it is a good product, it will still be in demand (hopefully).

The Viper is the first example. Low hand-built supply, and priced accordingly. You saying Chysler "can't" produce things as efficiently as GM or Ford is just silly. Have you ever seen a Ram truck? How about a Dodge Dart? They can do that stuff, if they want. They choose not to do it with the Viper, never have. This is what you've not come to understand.