'96 overheated, oil creamy brown

[snakebitdave]

I just took my 96 out for the second time this year. I pulled up to a stop and noticed the fans came on and looked at the temp gauge only to see that it was pegged right.

When I accelerated the temp came back down to 200 degrees so I thought I had a low water issue. Upon checking the level in the overflow tank I found it to be between the low and high marks.

Then I noticed a creamy foam just under the dipstick so pulled that out to find the creamy color and that it was "overfull." There were no water bubbles on the dipstick. There was also foam under the fill cap.

I use the recommended Mobile 1 oil and just changed it last summer.

The car has about 6500 miles on it.

Any thoughts? Time for Tator's? Anybody know a good Viper tech near Grand Rapids Michigan?

 

[Lemon_Twist]

My 71 Cuda had the same symptoms when there was a crack in one of the cylinder head ports and coolant was leaking into the motor.

 

[RobZ]

Blown headgasket allowed coolant to mix with the oil. That is why it's overfilled and creamy in color. If you check it later after the engine has been shut off for awhile you will probably see the separation line between water and oil on the dipstick.


Rob

 

[99 R/T 10]

Edit: I assumed it was a 96RT/10, but Tom is probably right.

 

[Tom Sessions]

Timing cover gasket has failed. Not a blown head gasket.Some what of a common problem on the 96-98 engines.

 

[sniper1]

My 71 Cuda had the same symptoms when there was a crack in one of the cylinder head ports and coolant was leaking into the motor.

Blown headgasket allowed coolant to mix with the oil. That is why it's overfilled and creamy in color. If you check it later after the engine has been shut off for awhile you will probably see the separation line between water and oil on the dipstick.


Rob

Yep, probably a blown headgasket, you need to get with Daniel Lessr and get some replacement headgaskets. Get it torn apart quickly

Yep ! What these guys said !

 

[sniper1]

I just took my 96 out for the second time this year. I pulled up to a stop and noticed the fans came on and looked at the temp gauge only to see that it was pegged right.

When I accelerated the temp came back down to 200 degrees so I thought I had a low water issue. Upon checking the level in the overflow tank I found it to be between the low and high marks.

Then I noticed a creamy foam just under the dipstick so pulled that out to find the creamy color and that it was "overfull." There were no water bubbles on the dipstick. There was also foam under the fill cap.

I use the recommended Mobile 1 oil and just changed it last summer.

The car has about 6500 miles on it.

Any thoughts? Time for Tator's? Anybody know a good Viper tech near Grand Rapids Michigan?

What number car you got ?

 

[Tom F&L GoR]

do crackle test - put a drop of oil on tin foil, hold match underneath. if water present, the oil drop will crackle as water boils off. that would be bad...

 

[Viper Wizard]

Timing cover gasket has failed. Not a blown head gasket.Some what of a common problem on the 96-98 engines.

Tom is right!

 

[snakebitdave]

Thank you for your responses.

The last didgets of the VIN are 00113

I did the crackle test as Tom suggested and indeed heard the crackle "as the water boiled off."

The last timing cover I took off was back in the 60's. It was a Chevy 289 and had oil in it, not water. So, there is water inside the timing cover?

I'll call the Wizard to determine my course of action. My early '93 had a defective water pump gasket and allowed water into the oil while under warranty. I saw the Arrow rebuild invoice at over $15,000. OUCH!

The Wizard could do the 998 recall while he has the car.

Thanks again.

 

[sniper1]

do crackle test - put a drop of oil on tin foil, hold match underneath. if water present, the oil drop will crackle as water boils off. that would be bad...

Pretty cool, never heard of doing that.

 

[Dom426h]

I dont understand, Could someone please explain this situation in more detail?

I thought that the only thing a bad timing cover gasket would cause is a slight external oil leak. Which like a leaky oil pan gasket isnt realy a problem as long as its just a slight leak and you keep an eye on the oil level.

Where does the coolant come into the picture?
I thought there was only oil behind the Timinig cover to lubricate the chain...

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thanks

 

[AZTVR]

I think that the engine in my Viper looks just a bit different from that one....

I dont understand, Could someone please explain this situation in more detail?

I thought that the only thing a bad timing cover gasket would cause is a slight external oil leak. Which like a leaky oil pan gasket isnt realy a problem as long as its just a slight leak and you keep an eye on the oil level.

Where does the coolant come into the picture?
I thought there was only oil behind the Timinig cover to lubricate the chain...

You must be registered for see images

thanks

 

[Dom426h]

TVR, please post a pic of the vipers timing cover if you would like to contribute, i couldnt find one...

 

[AZTVR]

TVR, please post a pic of the vipers timing cover if you would like to contribute, i couldnt find one...

Sorry, that was a poor attempt at humor on my part. I figured that someone more expert would come along shortly. I believe that the passage between the thermostat ? and the water pump goes through the timing cover. I think that I have marked it in the picture below. If the timing cover gasket around it leaks, the coolant can go either into the chamber where the timing chain is, or to the outside of the cover. Here's the only photo I could find fairly quickly.

 

[Sweet Ride]

Sorry, that was a poor attempt at humor on my part. I figured that someone more expert would come along shortly. I think that the passage between the thermostat and the water pump goes through the timing cover on the upper pass. side. If the timing cover gasket around it leaks, the coolant can go either into the chamber where the timing chain is, or to the outside of the cover. Here's the only photo I could find fairly quickly.

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Bingo!!! Well said. The water pump mounts directly to the timing chain cover as well, so there is coolant movement through the timing chain cover. If I remember correctly, the two large holes on the front of the block in the picture are coolant passages as well. When mine failed and leaked, it leaked to the outside on the driver's side coolant passage.

 

[AZTVR]

Here's a better photo from Camfab's gallery. I hope that I never have to go that deep into my engine ! It's a compact design; but, not very good from a failure mode standpoint.
Large image: motorswap_035 - ViperClub Photo Gallery

 

[bluesrt]

better drain that stuff,may have destructed the bearings in lower endnot to be negative,just a thought to be ware of

 

[triplexotica]

Hot and creamy? That could be a good thing... Wait we're talking about your car right?


That doesn't sound good.

 

[NukedGTS]

Sorry, that was a poor attempt at humor on my part. I figured that someone more expert would come along shortly. I believe that the passage between the thermostat ? and the water pump goes through the timing cover. I think that I have marked it in the picture below. If the timing cover gasket around it leaks, the coolant can go either into the chamber where the timing chain is, or to the outside of the cover. Here's the only photo I could find fairly quickly.

Don't take it to heart, Dom tends to get a little sensitive when he's on the receiving end.

 

[Dom426h]

Thanks for the pic!! I see where you marked the coolant passage. Now the 2 circular passages to the left/right of the cam, they are also for coolant?

 

[Dom426h]

still ridin' on twenties i see

 

[Dom426h]

Is this something that can be regularly checked befor it becomes a problem like the OP's?

Would it be good advice for 96-98 oweners to do the "tinfoil test" every oil change or pour in a jar to see if any coolant separates to the top?

 

[GTSPOWERED]

I had the same thing happen tp my 1997 GTS. The gasket was replaced and checked all the bearing (all were ok) flushed out the motor 3 times with fresh oil and have put several thousands of miles on over the last 4 years.

 

[Bolt]

Sounds like timeing chain cover gasket does the oil look like this?

Here is a pic of what the timing chain cover looks like when it blows out.

I was able to save my motor. Did not have to tear it down. Flushed it out good and cleaned the valve covers good, dropped the oil pan. My bearings where OK. I did a flush with marvel mystery oil.

Good luck

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.

 

[Tom F&L GoR]

Folks, drain and refill; then drive for 60 minutes minimum to heat the oil over 212F. The water will boil off. The oil in the crankcase should then be in good, dry condition.

The glycol of the antifreeze is not oxidatively stable; will want to make goo, and is also corrosive to bearings. All engine oils have additives to prevent oxidation and corrosion. If you want, make the repair to the gasket, buy cheap 10W30 Walmart mineral oil and do the one-hour drive. Then flush (save for use in your lawnmower) and refill with your favorite brand.

6500 miles total? Wow, I thought the Gen 1 head gaskets were an issue...

 

[PDCjonny]

I have had both timing chain cover gaskets go on my '97 and '98, and had both fixed by Chuck.
I did not have any oil contamination visible, just leaked to the outside.

 

[plumcrazy]

same here, chuck fixed mine as well. that was 35K miles before i blew my engine up but THAT had nothing at all to do with it.

 

[dave6666]

6500 miles total? Wow, I thought the Gen 1 head gaskets were an issue...

Garage Queen related kinda thing maybe?

 

[snakebitdave]

Bolt, that is exactly what the oil looks like. Thanks for the pictures; that explains how water gets into the timing cover.