Borla or Corsa for my completely stock 02 RT/10?

[jbs45]

I don't want a really loud system. Just something that says "yea, I'm here.." I would like more of a throaty sound than anything else. Also, I don't want something that is loud while driving down the highway at cruising speeds either.....

 

[Steve 00RT/10]

Best thing to try first is the rear muffler delete. Any good muffler shop can do this for $50-$100 dollars. Mine cost $30 6 yrs ago. 2-18" (or so) pieces of pipe in place of the mufflers. It took my muffler shop just over a half hour start to finish. ..Put the stock tips back on. Definite improvement in sound for very little money. From there you can decide if you need more. The next step would be to get rid of the resonators in the side sills and run straight pipe through there too. You don't have to spend big dollars to make a Viper sound a lot better than stock.

Steve

 

[Camfab]

I have the Corsa, and it pretty much does exactly what you described with no resonance. The tips are like jewelry, very nicely made and polished. Borla has many followers here as well for less money. Either way, a huge improvement over stock.

 

[jbs45]

Will deleting the resonators in the side sills make it too loud in the cockpit while going down the road at crusing speeds?

 

[Steve 00RT/10]

Will deleting the resonators in the side sills make it too loud in the cockpit while going down the road at crusing speeds?

I can't speak to that. I took the back muffler off in 2000 and then went way beyond that the next year. I like DEEP and LOUD. I do think you might get the sound you want by just taking the back muffler off. It's a good place to start. Side sills have to come off to get rid of the resonators. There are some on this forum who have removed the resonators and muffler. One thing to remember...at cruising speed and 5th--especially 6th gear......they're all relatively tame---even the full Belanger I have.

Steve

 

[Mr Hemi Head]

Define LOUD.

The meaning is different for each of us. To help with your decision go to a VCA meet and listen to the variety of systems.

BTW owned a stock 70 Hemi Challenger/SE (yellow) in the early 80s.

 

[jbs45]

I think I will try the rear muffler delete. I would like to get some highly polished, crome tips though. Is this possible?

Mr. Hemi Head, you should have at least kept one of your HEMIs to compliment your Snake!

 

[Knight Viper]

Random Tech makes a nice version also...Their high flow cats combined with the cat-back system works very well, I do get the “resonation” but if I don’t want to hear it, I just go up a gear. As said before it's all in what you like. I believe you can get this set up for about the same cost as just the cat-back from the other manufactures, John B. from Parts Rack could tell you.

 

[George Murray]

Oh, God...HEMI cars. Had a '68 Charger (real J code car) I sold 5 years ago. Talk about bad timing to sell, before the market went ape-$*%$. Also had a '71 hemicuda (clone), originally an in-violet (plum crazy in Dodge-speak) 383 4 BBL Gran Coupe. I spent 6.5 years restoring that Charger.

I also miss my '71 Panther Pink Challenger convertible, cloned to an R/T (no R/T verts that year), with 500+ HP 440 in it.

Yeah, it sorta ***** to just have to rely on Vipers for motoring fun ;-)

 

[JonB]

I don't want a really loud system. Just something that says "yea, I'm here.." I would like more of a throaty sound than anything else. Also, I don't want something that is loud while driving down the highway at cruising speeds either.....

The above is a pure DEFINITION of the Corsa system, and no other. Period.

Want Drone?: Delete rear muffler. That = 2 piano-wire long runs of straight pipe, and unblended exhast notes, directly below the rear hatch well. The rear glass reflets the sound to your ears. Ice Pick in ear vs Corsa.

 

[PDCjonny]

Jon B is right. When I was shopping for my cat back system a few years ago, he told me to go with the Corsa if you want a nice sound, but NO drone at highway RPM. I bought my Corsa from him, and never regretted it. It has a very nice idle (especially with the lumpy cam in the '98) sounds loud at wot but you can also play the radio when your cruising and carry on a conversation.

Edit: I am referring to my GTS of course, not the RT/10.

 

[Steve 00RT/10]

Want Drone?: Delete rear muffler. That = 2 piano-wire long runs of straight pipe, and unblended exhast notes, directly below the rear hatch well. The rear glass reflets the sound to your ears. Ice Pick in ear vs Corsa.

Sorry to disagree. I can't speak for the rear muffler delete for a GTS as Jon refers to above, but there was absolutely nothing offensive to the muffler delete on our RT/10. The car in question on this thread is a RT/10. I, and many others, found the sound much improved with the rear muffler gone. Huge improvement over stock and practically zero cost to give it a try. IMHO, a lot of the 'special sound' achieved by the various systems has a lot more to do with the mufflers than the pipe itself. The pipe can basically only fit in there one way from the front to the back. If you must have a 'blended' sound, throw a couple of Belanger mufflers on there. They are Walker Dynomax Race Bullets. About $40 bucks each.

Steve

 

[RoadiJeff]

The guy I bought mine from left everything pretty much stock except for a Corsa cat-back exhaust. He said the stock exhaust sounded like a UPS truck and the Corsa gave it a nice deep tone but not too loud. He was right.

I sometimes think it's a bit on the loud side on the rare occasion I drive it to work and have to back up the driveway at midnight or 4:00 a.m. when I work overtime. I've asked several neighbors and none have said they could hear it.

I was considering a Roe SC but they say you have to change to high flow cats and that adds to the noise level. With the Corsa currently at just the right sound I'm not sure I want to mess with that.

 

[ghayes420]

I had the same thing done to my Gen 2. My guy let me hear the Corsa and then let me hear the new Borla. Borla recently released a new exhuast for the Viper that is better that the older revision. The Corsa sounds rather high and very European to me. The Bolra was much deeper and had a better roar when pushed. I ended up getting the Borla with high flow cats and muffs. I like the sound, my wife enjoys the sound as well. Cruising on the highway is fine. My $0.02

 

[jk]

I did mine in a stages. First was the Corsa catback, which gave me a much improved throaty sound over stock without drone and with great looking tips. Next came the Belanger headers. Volume went up a bit and the tone deeper. Finally, I did the Random Tech hi-flow cats, which made it much louder. Now it is right where I like it.... I think over time you grow accustomed to the volume level and then want a little more. You certainly can do this in steps until you find what you like.

 

[Mccarlin]

I've never been a fan of the Corsa because its a higher pitches raspy kinda exhaust and i dont care for it. The borla is much deeper and agressive sounding, at least to me it is. I love my borla.

 

[DAMN YANKEE]

jbs45 just PMed you, if you didnt get it, please PM me with your email.

 

[jbs45]

Man, you all give some excellent advice! Once again, I have said it many times, but viperclub.org is awesome!

I think I will start with the rear muffler delete. But I would also like to add some polished chrome tips at the same time. Has anyone done this?

 

[Steve 00RT/10]

I've never been a fan of the Corsa because its a higher pitches raspy kinda exhaust and i dont care for it. The borla is much deeper and agressive sounding, at least to me it is. I love my borla.

I agree. The Corsa at idle is quite raspy. It sounds better at WOT. Some like raspy. I like deep and rumble. Sound is a very subjective thing. You really do have to hear the different systems in person to know which you prefer. I still think it's the mufflers that make the sound---not the pipe. The rear muffler delete is the best way to dive into this. I will venture a guess that you can achieve a very similar Corsa,Borla,or Belanger type sound by using the mufflers each system packages with their product.

Steve

 

[2MANYTOYS]

My Corsa sounded very tame. Then I added the Balengers made a big difference. I also have the old style Borla. I like the sound it's definently deeper but it does have some drone with it. Personally I like it though. Both are good systems. The Corsa looks far better though.

 

[Casey]

Borla is what I had, and I really liked the sound of it. Much more so than the Corsa for my ears.

 

[Robert Dyck]

Yes I have. I eliminated the rear muffler and had some really nice 4" tips installed. The tips fold down to a 3" diameter. Don't know what the brand is, but they are very high quality.

I left the stock resonators in the sides, and added Roe's 2.5" high flow cats.

The car is fairly quiet at idle, but can get loud when you get on it. At crusing speed I think it sounds good, not too loud but not real quiet either.

 

[JKVIPER]

I had both the borla and corsa on a GTS. Really liked the corsa over the borla.

The Borla just had so much drone I could not enjoy the car. I thought the corsa was perfect.

 

[Triple7]

My first Viper was a '99 GTS coupe that had an early style Borla exhaust. I drove that car on road trips up to 11 hours. If you are ********* enough to enjoy a Viper on an 11 hour drive, the drone won't bother you. The Borla is deep and throaty compared to other systems I've heard at events I've attended. I enjoyed the sound of the car way more than any disc I could have shoved into the CD player. I plan to install a Borla (early version) in my recently purchased '01 GTS.

 

[Mopar488]

If you do the muffler delete, is there a problem with back pressure? Do you just cut the pipes in front of the muffler and add the straight pipes and tips out? My car is bone stock and I would like to be able to return it to stock if I go this route and wanted to go back to stock.

 

[cayman]

Cat delete here. I still have the stock mufflers and resonators and the sound is just right for me. When I installed the Roe SC, as mentioned before you have to do something with the stock cats. Either replace them with high flows or delete them altogether. I opted for the latter as my state doesn't check for emissions. Plus, I always figured I could go back and install high flows if it came down to it. There was a thread some time ago when someone experimented with different combos of component deletes like muffler delete only, cat delete only, muffler and cat delete with only the resonators, etc. Cat delete only was the conclusion for what was perceived by the individual doing the experiment as being the best sounding.

 

[DAMN YANKEE]

Spent a good part of yesterday speaking wit the head of tech development for Corsa. Couldn't have been a nicer, more informative (and informed) guy.

Like many, I too am strugging with two issues.

1. The need to seriously consider high-flo cats to take care of the heavier heat load of a new 5 lbs Roe blower. Chuck Tator, whom I regard as an informed and reasonble person has suggeted that at 5 lbs, and with the manner that I drive (light), the stock cat will work fine.

- Sean Roe, who I consider and informed and reasonable person, says that I should definatley get a hih flo system in there to avoid any chance of scorching the sills. Even a slow driver can, under the right circumstance get those sills so hot they discolor or worse.

2. I would like a slightly beefier sound but have zero interest in more noise in the cabin than I already have.

- The stock exhaust has resonance.

I learned the folliwng from my conversations with Corsa.

- Corsa spends huge amounts of time tuning their exhaust to meet the very narrow intersection point between IMPORVED PERFORMANCE (flo) and IMPORVED SOUND (interior and exterior). Folks, in the Viper, with a V10 that window is very very small. Corsa thinks they nailed it and state that they are the only company that can make the scientifically backed claim that they get great flo at the lowest overall resonance and best frequency sound.

- Know this...They also are clear that their system MAXIMIZES the above sweet spot for a STOCK CAT. 2 1/2" in, 2 1/2" absolutely stock cat. With a stock at, Corsa is of the mind that have a perfect balance of performance and sound.

- Corsa also knows very well that that performanc-sound inersection requires by definition a "technical" resonance (his words). Pressed to explain, they are clear, Corsa's exhaust have a definate and purpseful frequency in the range that would (to my ears) suggest the more race, more metallic Formula Series, higher frequency note. When pressed, Corsa also knows that in the absence of that intersecton you end up with a more muddy, more uneven, more baratone (my words) lower rumble, less defined, louder frequency (insert all the other brands, minus perhaps the sole provider of exhaust systems in non-stainless steel, Belanger). Belanger's all steel system has the higher frequencies as well, but is ot as specifically tuned for sound.All the major brand exhaust systems effectively deliver the flo required.

- Corsa's system IS luder with a high-flo cat, but *(IMPORTANT)* the cermaic high-flo cats are significantly quieter than the metal cats. Corsa has tested mos of the high-flo cats and they do not see failures with ceramic cats (good brands like Random) even in their heavy induction (750 hp+) engines.

- Do not stuff or put in-line any muffler, insert, baffle, etc. on a Corsa system unless you want to greatly effect the purposefully improved flo.

- All the systems that use packing or baffles can (the packed systems will) change over time as the heat and exhaust clogs/blows out the packing.

Hope this helps.

 

[Landman]

I can only give my opinion with headers included. I started with a 00GTS and put the full B&B system on it front to back, including high flow cats. I loved it! It sounded mean as hell, but I couldn't hear myself think even cruising on the highway. I loved it, but it was loud in the drivers seat. I now have an 02GTS with B&B headers again, but cat-back I have the Borla with muffler delete in the rear and I love it. It is still loud, but the noise goes more out the back. I'm not sure why, but this car is much quieter inside while cruising. WOT it's still loud, but that's what I want. People definitely know I'm coming.

 

[Steve 00RT/10]

Good info Dan. Sounds like the Corsa may very well work for you. I still think, at the end of the day, everyone's sound taste is different. You really have to hear these things in person. Sound files don't really do the trick. SS doesn't really come into play for a Viper as far as longevity goes. 99% of all Vipers never see bad weather/salt. SS holds more heat in as well which can cook things a little faster. I have both Belanger and Corsa systems and prefer the deeper sound rather than the higher pitched raspier sound of the Corsa. I have had to replace my Belanger mufflers once after 30,000 miles or so. As for performance, I'm guessing there may possibly be a 5-10 HP difference between all of them. Some would say losing the rear muffler will give you 5 HP. If I were picking a system, I would lose the HP to get the sound I wanted. Except for bragging rights on a dyno, this is not a power adder you would ever feel. For a slightly beefier sound, the muffler delete is the way to go for starters. Minimal dollars and a half hour job at a good shop. The sound is a deeper one.

As for the side sills, Before the SC and before the Belanger exhaust sans cats, we scorched / bubbled the driver side sill a little right at the back end the very first year we had the car---totally stock.

Steve