Clutch gone and almost through front fence.

[NZGTS]

So I was backing My 97 GTS out the driveway this morning to take it to storage, I was slipping the clutch to keep the speed down and then BANG the pedal went to the floor and the clutch engaged fully. I took off and only a full force foot on the brake and a quick hand to turn off the key saved me from shooting through my old mans front fence,
I assumed the slave had popped but there was no puddle of fluid under the car, I then jacked it up and removed the inspection cover, apart from a couple of drips there was no brake fluid around. Lots of meat left on the friction plate, and the master cylinder is still full.
I just did a search and found that the master push rod likes to jump off the pedal. What do you guys think????
On the inspection I found that these slaves are the release bearing/slave combined type. so would need to remove gearbox to inspect further.
On that one how are you supposed to bleed this type of slave????

I cannot check the pushrod as I am about to fly out on honeymoon so will have to wait till I am back.

All opinions and help would be appreciated.

thanks

 

[hou99gts]

Sounds like your birdcage broke, it attaches the clutch pedal arm to the slave cylinder. Follow the clutch pedal up to the slave cylinder inside the car to see if it is still attached. Mine has broken twice.

 

[V10SpeedLuvr]

Sounds like your birdcage broke, it attaches the clutch pedal arm to the slave cylinder. Follow the clutch pedal up to the slave cylinder inside the car to see if it is still attached. Mine has broken twice.

Very possible. Mine has broken twice as well (once while driving down the road). Its only a $5-6 part. Buy 1-2 spares incase it breaks again. It an easy 2 min fix. Part # 4643 448. Tator's Garage. Chuck used to stock them, but not sure about now

 

[99 R/T 10]

Sounds like your birdcage broke, it attaches the clutch pedal arm to the slave cylinder. Follow the clutch pedal up to the slave cylinder inside the car to see if it is still attached. Mine has broken twice.

Does somebody have a diagram of the part? First time I have heard of this breaking. Initially, I would have said the slave cyl. gave out.

 

[Phun70]

I'm fairly certain that chuck still has these, I just got one from him not long ago.

 

[V10SpeedLuvr]

Does somebody have a diagram of the part? First time I have heard of this breaking. Initially, I would have said the slave cyl. gave out.

Pics courtesy of Tom, F&L GoR in the thread where I asked about mine breaking:

 

[DanielR]

That birdcage does like to break and should be an easy fix, but keep reading just in case it is the slave.

What was the status of the clutch pedal after you cut the ignition. Is the pedal still on the floor or were you able to pump it and build pressure again?

If you just jacked up the front of the car; the fluid that would normally drip may have run back into the bell housing.

You do have to pull the transmission to physically inspect the slave cylinder and throw out bearing.

I had a similar issue a few months ago. I was backing out of the garage and the clutch pedal just went to the floor. I had to use the brakes/e-brake to stop, then cut the ignition. I pushed the car back into the garage and got it in the air. There was no puddle of fluid on the floor, but a drop was forming next to the inspection cover. I removed it and the inside of the bell housing had a small pool of fluid. I got the car back down on the floor and let it sit overnight thinking maybe I just need to bleed the slave. I found a 3-5 inch pool of fluid under the car the next morning and knew my slave was probably bad.

I called Chuck Tator and he said that sometimes the slave will do this in cold weather when the car sits for a long time (2+ weeks). He said to try pumping the clutch to build pressure and see if the problem persists. He also said that the slave could be going bad.

I just decided to replace the slave, clutch, and install a chromoly flywheel.

Here is what I found when I pulled my transmission to inspect the slave. Definitely a leaking slave cylinder.

You must be registered for see images attach

 

[NZGTS]

Cheers for all the replies, I will get checking as soon as I land back in New Zealand from honeymoon(if I am not worn out he he)

I am hoping it is the birdcage as the pedal just dropped to the floor. It comes back up but no pressure. and cannot pump anything up.

however Using a inspection mirror my slave does look very similar to the one you have shown in the pic. black and wet. However no fluid in belhousing and I checked under the car where It happened and no fluid.

Please let it be the birdcage!!!.


Is that a bleeding adapter I see in the pic(top formed pipe coming from inbehind slave) can you access this through the belhousing? sorry I did not have a good enough look when I was under the car.

 

[DanielR]

Is that a bleeding adapter I see in the pic(top formed pipe coming from inbehind slave) can you access this through the belhousing? sorry I did not have a good enough look when I was under the car.

Yes, the bleed valve is above the hydraulic line and is accessible through the bell housing.

Someone else may know for sure because I have never had the birdcage failure, but I think if the rod came off of the clutch pedal it would stay on the floor and not return to the normal position.

 

[jdeft1]

Pics courtesy of Tom, F&L GoR in the thread where I asked about mine breaking:

Thanks for reposting these Chad. I like Tom's fix and intend to do the same to mine soon.... I really hate special, hard to find plastic fasteners etc.. when a solid, can-do piece of metal and a commonly found clip will suffice.

On another note... The view of that slave cylinder makes me hope mine lasts alot longer. What a PIA to deal with.

CONGRATS, NZGTS.... The first step is the easiest. (This coming from a married man of 15 years..)

 

[hou99gts]

Yes, the bleed valve is above the hydraulic line and is accessible through the bell housing.

Someone else may know for sure because I have never had the birdcage failure, but I think if the rod came off of the clutch pedal it would stay on the floor and not return to the normal position.

You are correct, when the birdcage breaks, the pedal stays on the floor.

 

[NZGTS]

jdeft1 cheers for the congrats, however already had a fight and it was over the clutch crapping itself.

If the pedal stays down when the birdcage bit snaps that means the slave must be a shagged.... Craaapp well that means it will have to wait a year for me to get back from work,(I work overseas) I will put it into storage and get a new slave ordered.

It looks like the Gearbox is not to hard to drop though. any tips would be appreciated.

Thank god I got all the wedding pics done with it and it did not crap itself while driving my Bridzilla around

 

[MADMAX]

jdeft1 cheers for the congrats, however already had a fight and it was over the clutch crapping itself.

If the pedal stays down when the birdcage bit snaps that means the slave must be a shagged.... Craaapp well that means it will have to wait a year for me to get back from work,(I work overseas) I will put it into storage and get a new slave ordered.

It looks like the Gearbox is not to hard to drop though. any tips would be appreciated.

Thank god I got all the wedding pics done with it and it did not crap itself while driving my Bridzilla around

There's some good gearbox removal advice in here, if I do say so myself.
http://forums.viperclub.org/illustr...placement-including-pilot-bearing-96-gts.html
You should be able to do your replacement without TOTALLY removing the gearbox from the car - unbolt it and slide it back in the transmission tunnel instead - loads of room - much easier to do than taking the gearbox out completely.

 

[Fatboy 18]

Nice write up Ade, I guess I could get you to help out when it comes to changing out mine

 

[Black Moon]

That birdcage does like to break and should be an easy fix, but keep reading just in case it is the slave.

What was the status of the clutch pedal after you cut the ignition. Is the pedal still on the floor or were you able to pump it and build pressure again?

If you just jacked up the front of the car; the fluid that would normally drip may have run back into the bell housing.

You do have to pull the transmission to physically inspect the slave cylinder and throw out bearing.

I had a similar issue a few months ago. I was backing out of the garage and the clutch pedal just went to the floor. I had to use the brakes/e-brake to stop, then cut the ignition. I pushed the car back into the garage and got it in the air. There was no puddle of fluid on the floor, but a drop was forming next to the inspection cover. I removed it and the inside of the bell housing had a small pool of fluid. I got the car back down on the floor and let it sit overnight thinking maybe I just need to bleed the slave. I found a 3-5 inch pool of fluid under the car the next morning and knew my slave was probably bad.

I called Chuck Tator and he said that sometimes the slave will do this in cold weather when the car sits for a long time (2+ weeks). He said to try pumping the clutch to build pressure and see if the problem persists. He also said that the slave could be going bad.

I just decided to replace the slave, clutch, and install a chromoly flywheel.

Here is what I found when I pulled my transmission to inspect the slave. Definitely a leaking slave cylinder.

You must be registered for see images attach

By the looks of the tip of your input shaft you have bigger problems than a leaking slave cylinder or is that white grease????

 

[Black Moon]

Pics courtesy of Tom, F&L GoR in the thread where I asked about mine breaking:

Ace Hardware has them if you're in a hurry and don't want to wait on shipping.

 

[DanielR]

By the looks of the tip of your input shaft you have bigger problems than a leaking slave cylinder or is that white grease????

That is the first question Chuck Tator asked as well. It is just grease from the pilot bearing which I replaced while I was in there. I assure you, the input shaft was smooth and shiny after cleaning it.

You must be registered for see images attach

 

[Black Moon]

That is the first question Chuck Tator asked as well. It is just grease from the pilot bearing which I replaced while I was in there. I assure you, the input shaft was smooth and shiny after cleaning it.

You must be registered for see images attach

Scared me for a minute.

 

[MADMAX]

Nice write up Ade, I guess I could get you to help out when it comes to changing out mine

No problem Mark, so long as we don't need to go anywhere near that cross-member again, unless it's with one of these.

[media]http://www.madontools.com/images/stihl-ts410-300-300.jpg[/media]

 

[Black Moon]

Good write up but I would let motor and transmission angle down slightly and remove the transmission out in a straight line. Not keeping the tranny in line with the motor/pressure plate could cause damage on the way out. If you are changing clutch I guess it's not that important. Same with installation, tranny needs to slide straightt in keeping it centered to avoid contact with the pressure plate/clutch. Once the splines on the input shaft go thru the clutch you could cause some problems by bending or angling it up or down.

 

[slysnake]

I cannot check the pushrod as I am about to fly out on honeymoon

Where are your priorities man!

 

[KNG SNKE]

Man you sure polished that shaft.

That is the first question Chuck Tator asked as well. It is just grease from the pilot bearing which I replaced while I was in there. I assure you, the input shaft was smooth and shiny after cleaning it.

You must be registered for see images attach

 

[NZGTS]

Great Write up it will sure come in handy when dropping the gearbox.

Here is a pic of what it looked like at the wedding, the girls limo made it a MOPAR Heaven weading

 

[NZGTS]

well that pic did not come out how I wanted it to. try this.

You must be registered for see images attach

 

[Next Phase]

Subscribed.

 

[BlackSnake99]

Subscribed.

To a two year old thread?

 

[dave6666]

Who would want to miss your comments?

 

[Nitro187]

yeah... was it the birdcage? Now i'm friggen curious.... damnit.

 

[DrumrBoy]

Pics courtesy of Tom, F&L GoR in the thread where I asked about mine breaking:

OK so the birdcage is driving me insane. I think the large pin on my pedal linkage has had the "head" break off of it......the large pin over which the rod end goes is just a cylinder.....it has no d*ck head for the birdcage to grab. I'm done with this plastic pox on humanity.

Gotta try the fix pictured above.....has anyone reading taken this part out of the car? Its hard enough to see in there (I still haven't taken the seat out....shame on me) but I'm sure it'll be easier to attack if I'm mentally prepared for which fasteners I gotta undo than if I go in blind.

Any descriptive assistance is appreciated.