EPA to Automakers: The Horsepower War is Over.

[2002_Viper_GTS_ACR]

EPA to Automakers: The Horsepower War is Over. | Autopia from Wired.com

So wait a minute, all this yelling and screaming about the demise of the Viper is because in TWELVE years the Auto Makers have to get up to an average of 35 MPG ??

Ok, this doom and gloom bull**** was blown way out of proportion.

I thought it was in 2 years.. not 12 !!

We have another 12 years of bad gas milage and huge power to look foward to, no?

Seriously though, its also stating that its the AVERAGE, so unlike the vettes, the Vipers dont constitute anywhere near a % point to the total production of Dodge/Chrysler, so even if they kept making horrible gas milage numbers, who cares, they contribute SOOOO little to the average it wouldnt matter.. THE SAME CANT BE SAID ABOUT THE VETTES!!


Long live RADICAL and NON-STATUS-QUE VIPERS!!!


Ok, now someone can correct me...

Thanks,

Jon

 

[Tusc]

I didn't read the article, but am going by what you said. So does this mean we may still have the domestics like the Viper.... but no longer have access to brands such as Ferrari or Aston-Martin?

 

[lankhoss]

EPA to Automakers: The Horsepower War is Over. | Autopia from Wired.com

So wait a minute, all this yelling and screaming about the demise of the Viper is because in TWELVE years the Auto Makers have to get up to an average of 35 MPG ??

Ok, this doom and gloom bull**** was blown way out of proportion.

I thought it was in 2 years.. not 12 !!

We have another 12 years of bad gas milage and huge power to look foward to, no?

Seriously though, its also stating that its the AVERAGE, so unlike the vettes, the Vipers dont constitute anywhere near a % point to the total production of Dodge/Chrysler, so even if they kept making horrible gas milage numbers, who cares, they contribute SOOOO little to the average it wouldnt matter.. THE SAME CANT BE SAID ABOUT THE VETTES!!


Long live RADICAL and NON-STATUS-QUE VIPERS!!!


Ok, now someone can correct me...

Thanks,

Jon

Vettes actually get decent gas mileage though....so it's not like they're really going to ruin the average, either. I know the advertised mileage on the C6 Z is 16 city/26 highwa y.....not sure about other Vettes, but I'd imagine slightly better than that?

 

[Asp Man]

Zr-1 will reportedly (per Autombile Magazine) have a gas guzzler tax, the first one levied on the 'vette, when it debuts.

 

[dodgefever]

My first take on this is by 2012, the average in the manufacturers stable had to be 35 MPG. But, by 2020 or 2025 ALL cars had to be 35 MPG. Is this correct?

 

[chimazo]

The 2008 Dodge Challenger has already been added to the EPA site and is reported to get 13 mpg city and 18 mpg on the highway, so Dodge better hope they won't sell too many (with #'s like that, I don't think they will once the nostalga wears thin).

 

[Vic]

"Status-quo"

12 years until the new mileage req's? Thats a long time to revel in reckless abandon. Luv it!

 

[plumcrazy]

this BS makes me wanna go chop a tree down..........
or go hunting for black bear

 

[lankhoss]

Well, you know every vehicle on the road right now could get much better gas mileage without sacraficing horsepower

 

[Snakester]

It has been this way for YEARS, whether it's been government mandated safety equipment, gas mileage, or smog compliance.
The automakers will whine and complain, and threaten to kill off their best cars rather than simply innovating better solutions to meet the long term goals.
I do hope that the EPA has the sense to average the gas mileage based on the percentage of vehicles sold.
The problem has never been low volume high performance cars.
It's the fact that the majority of new cars sold are actually trucks today. Sold as SUVs, pickups, or crossovers.

They just need to cut back on the truck production, add multiple diesel engine options to all of their cars and trucks (except of course the Viper).
And add in more plug-in electric city cars like the Volt for commuter and short trip needs.

That's a tiny price to pay to keep cars like the Viper that promote automotive passion and excitement.

 

[Asp Man]

The 2008 Dodge Challenger has already been added to the EPA site and is reported to get 13 mpg city and 18 mpg on the highway, so Dodge better hope they won't sell too many (with #'s like that, I don't think they will once the nostalga wears thin).

True for the SRTs, but a 3.5L, or even 5.7L, will get much better mileage. Heck, I can squeez 28-29miles/US gallon from my 5.7L Magnum, that's about 33/Imp.gallon (does that count?).

 

[black mamba1]

What I love about capitalism and democracy is that the people rule. Americans will never stand for this. We will pay a gas guzzler tax, we will have limited production runs for high hp cars....but we will never stand for the removal of our big block v-8's and v-10's.

We will throw the ******** out of office that try to take our muscle cars from us!
Our cars vanishing will never happen....not in my life time.

 

[Chuck 98 RT/10]

I thought it was 202x too. By then gasoline will be diluted with ethanol or something so the 35mpg will be easy to meet.

 

[chimazo]

True for the SRTs, but a 3.5L, or even 5.7L, will get much better mileage. Heck, I can squeez 28-29miles/US gallon from my 5.7L Magnum, that's about 33/Imp.gallon (does that count?).

I am sure you have seen this, quoted from Autoblog.com:

"It looks like the Hemi engine, an icon for the Chrysler Corporation, won't be included in forthcoming applications due to changing fuel economy standards. Rising gas prices have already hurt sales of vehicles featuring these engines, causing Chrysler to cut back production. Now co-president Jim Press has declared, "The Hemi is not the powertrain of the future."

 

[GTSRboy2000]

The EPA isnt very smart. The EPA probably does give a hoot if they Kill the entire sports car industry, and didnt think about how LITTLE of an effect it will have on the envirment. I hate trash like this, save the fuel requirments for mass produced cars.

 

[black mamba1]

Trust me, we have nothing to worry about. Basic American loves such as hunting (screw the Vegans), fishing, sports, strip clubs, gambling, and sports cars WILL NEVER disappear from the American scene. I dont care what law they pass. They will never take away our muscle cars.

Never.

 

[Phoenix SRT]

I thought it was 202x too. By then gasoline will be diluted with ethanol or something so the 35mpg will be easy to meet.

How does adding ethanol increase gas mileage? It's my understanding that ethanol blends decrease mileage because ethanol contains less energy than gasoline. Running E85, for example, decreases mileage by 10 or 15%. That's what I read, anyway.

 

[Camfab]

Autoblogs are like local news shows, just looking for sensationalism (ratings). Believe me, as long as you continue to buy Vipers, they'll make them. Ethanol does lower fuel mileage vs. gas.

 

[Chuck 98 RT/10]

How does adding ethanol increase gas mileage? It's my understanding that ethanol blends decrease mileage because ethanol contains less energy than gasoline. Running E85, for example, decreases mileage by 10 or 15%. That's what I read, anyway.

It's in the details and the definition of "fuel". If the law specifically states "35 miles per gallon of gasoline" then gasoline diluted with some other fuel will stretch the distance per gallon of gasoline. After all, it is the oil products that are of concern here.

If the definition of "fuel" is not clearly defined then how is this law applied to solar fueled or battery fueled cars? How is a gallon of solar fuel measured?

 

[2001 GTS]

Why can't they just build both??

 

[dave6666]

this BS makes me wanna go chop a tree down..........
or go hunting for black bear

This is a thread about efficiency. Run the bear up a tree and then cut the tree down silly.

 

[mike & juli]

I thought it was 202x too. By then gasoline will be diluted with ethanol or something so the 35mpg will be easy to meet.

Hess around the corner from us has a sign that says "This fuel MAY contain up to 10% ethanol"...how's that for even having a CHOICE?!! We don't go there to fuel up the cars.
We'll see what the trend does....juli

 

[Affatica]

I am sure you have seen this, quoted from Autoblog.com:

"It looks like the Hemi engine, an icon for the Chrysler Corporation, won't be included in forthcoming applications due to changing fuel economy standards. Rising gas prices have already hurt sales of vehicles featuring these engines, causing Chrysler to cut back production. Now co-president Jim Press has declared, "The Hemi is not the powertrain of the future."

I don't understand why they would do that though. Even the new Dodge Durango has the e85 hemi engine with multi-displacement. And the 2009 Durango will have the hybrid hemi. Seems with all the new available technology, they should be able to keep these engines around and continue to find ways to improve mpg.

 

[Nsane1]

I agree with all the comments here, however, the reality is, we reached a tipping point last year in the 40% runup of oil (and those that have it hate us), and all the press around warming. So now, all of us are greatly outnumbered. We can thump our chests and get on our soap boxes as much as we want, but let's admit it, we're mostly in the bubble, and heavily out numbered. One more nail in the coffin for the viper IMO, looks like we'll have to move to Ferraris or some other small-batch maker. Geez, they're killing the Hemi? That makes me sad, but times do change... We'll have to wait for the next technology to get mature before they start to "abuse" it by making 1000hp hydrogen cars...

 

[dave6666]

...by making 1000hp hydrogen cars...

That will make traffic accidents exciting!

 

[2002_Viper_GTS_ACR]

This is a thread about efficiency. Run the bear up a tree and then cut the tree down silly.

Ok, now this was just straight funny.... loved it.


Like how the article picks the ACR Viper as its moniker of Gas Guzzlers?? lol..

Also Vic, thanks for the correction, I’m an IT guy, so ‘que’ is a word I use all the time in tech talk.. ‘quo’ .. not very often… Plus I can’t spell, so that helps too ..


Jon

 

[ViperTony]

That will make traffic accidents exciting!

yeah...nothing quite like an high-pressue hydrogren tank rupturing. While the death rate will go up I'm sure that will be quickly overshadowed by the high fuel efficiency numbers.

 

[Disturbed]

They will always find reasons to stop manufactures from selling sports cars. But it will always be the sports car that saves the auto industry. It's part of the circle of life.

 

[TedK]

What, me worry? Already have a deposit on my next car.........

Tesla Motors

 

[Affatica]

What, me worry? Already have a deposit on my next car.........

Tesla Motors

At least they are able to build a website. Hopefully they will be able to do the same with the car someday.