Feedback - Belangers and PCM

[mjorgensen Woodhouse]

They have "packages" they are developing but have not pushed them yet. I have some of the stuff also and the new things they are doing will be super cool when they release it. ;-)

 

[seabass]

They have "packages" they are developing but have not pushed them yet. I have some of the stuff also and the new things they are doing will be super cool when they release it. ;-)

Come on Santa, can you give us a hint? Maybe in regards to $$$:HP?

 

[Malu59RT]

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for a big lopey cam. I've always wanted the car to rock back and forth and sound like the car could barely idle.

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[ACRsnake]

Can we even run Belangers on the 09 with no Mopar PCM ?

What about the kit released on the ACRx ? what headers did they use ?

 

[WILDASP]

They have "packages" they are developing but have not pushed them yet. I have some of the stuff also and the new things they are doing will be super cool when they release it. ;-)

Hmmm! The Viper world is suddenly overflowing with all sorts of good news! *salivates at the thought* Keep us posted, Mark!

 

[redtanrt10]

DP, as Dan said you get 40hp to the rear wheels and you definately feel them. The ECU gives 8-10 put what it really does is smooth out the power band and removes much of the drive by wire lag. If your a fan of decel popping, your gonna lose it with the ECU. If you can buy 93 then good for you, as he said we mix 91 & 100, and 100 is $8.99 at the closest place in the OC. Both these are great additions, worth the $$'s to me. The exhaust system is where you'll get different opinions. I have bellangers, no sound issues but I get a drone around 3K+ rpm that is really annoying. Dan has corsa's and he says no drone. Some folks like the stock to keep it quieter. All vipers are different but when we've put a bunch of gen IV's together at the dyno, stock system is about 10 hp lower at the wheels. The corsa vs. bellanger is a toss up.

Dan (viperX) likes the arrow intake and I'll probably get one soon. (He got it to finally make up the 5-10 hp that he always dyno's lower than me on similar set ups!). The intake is cheap HP. I think he has posted on the board about the oil breather set up he did. Surprising amount of oil lays in the intake, maybe his was agrivated by a ton of track miles?

Worth the money, you'll enjoy them both and Mark will do a great job setting the headers up correctly. I'd have him add the arrow intake while he has your viper.

 

[Art 138]

Boxer12,

Yes, you can run 91 octane gas with the Mopar race controller, no problem....but.... if you get even slightly aggressive with 91 in the tank, the computer will retard the timing a bit which reduces power. No big deal on the street, but when you take the car back to the track and use 93 or 95 (some blend of 100 and 91 in my case), it will take a while for the computer to advance the timing again and restore the power you had before. Again, no big deal.

DP and Kenric,

Arrow Race Engines, who is the company that rebuilds our engines under warranty, put together a C & C ported lower intake manifold for our cars. They will ship you the ported "lower", you remove your OE manifold, take the top apart from the bottom, install the new bottom onto your exiting "top" (they provide a new metal gasket) and ship your OE lower back to them as a core.

On my car, it added power mostly at the top of the rpm range, from about 4500 rpm and up where our cam is working and our cars' power curve tends to flatten out a bit. Car pulls hard to redline now.

We ran back to back dynos on a Gen IV without it and mine with it. Same day in 98 F heat. RWHP gain was 25 with no loss of torque. No change in everyday drive-ability.

This is a very nice, inexpensive mod. I think I paid $550.00 or something like that. I did the install myself - it was simple. Call Arrow and talk with Todd: 248-852-5151.

If there is a downside, it's that you will hit the rev limiter easier now than before!

Dan

So I would not have to remove my belanger headers???? On the rev limiter does it lower the RPM set by the Mopar PCM????

 

[mjorgensen Woodhouse]

So I would not have to remove my belanger headers???? On the rev limiter does it lower the RPM set by the Mopar PCM????

No need to remove headers, and he means it pulls harder up top so you will bang into the limiter easier. I have to ask Arrow though you may "need" the Mopar PCM to do the intake?

Arrow is not ready to release info on anything besides this at the moment. The CF closeout panel actually helps by directing all the air through the radiator thus reducing intake air temps allowing for more timing and power, $560

 

[1st Strike]

Is there a difference yes. Would I do it again, Yes. Does it compare to a super charger no way! I road race my ACR & a super charger is just to throttle sensitive.

 

[Viperless]

imho..yes to the headers..forget the pcm

Ditto. PCM did nothing for me power wise.

 

[Viper X]

"The CF closeout panel actually helps by directing all the air through the radiator thus reducing intake air temps allowing for more timing and power, $560."

Engine coolant temps are reduced by the closeout panel too. Nice if you are tracking your car.

 

[Art 138]

I spoke to Todd (Arrow) today and he said he can powder coat the bottom intake also (in addition to the porting)....in my case I am sending my OEM lower intake and prefer not to give up my core for a trade. During the discussion he was offering some add ons for 1,500 dollars but did not press him for info since I was not interested, now I am curious what he was referring to.....

 

[DPViper]

Ditto. PCM did nothing for me power wise.

What about the "better throttle response"? Did you notice any difference? Thanks

 

[TrackAire]

Guys, I can't find the reference to the CF closeout panel...what are you guys talking about and where does it exactly go?

Thanks in advance,
George

 

[mjorgensen Woodhouse]

Panel covers the area around the airbox and radiator on the top of the engine bay so no hot air can come up around the intake air.

 

[SilveRT8]

Panel covers the area around the airbox and radiator on the top of the engine bay so no hot air can come up around the intake air.

Seems expensive for some panels, but if it really helps, then maybe...
ARROW RACING ENGINES, LLC

 

[TrackAire]

Mark, thanks for the explanation...I like that kit. Just one more stocking stuffer for Xmas.

I do have a question regarding the air intake for the front brake ducts that enters through the front grill opening. Do you think that plugging this off will help with high aerodyamnics?

The reason I'm asking is what effect this would have on standing 1 mile type runs. Don't really need constant brakes like a road racer, just looking to eek out more speed and stability.

Thanks,
George

 

[mjorgensen Woodhouse]

A lot of top speed cars tape up every nook and crease across the car for speed. I don't think this is going to make a noticeable difference though, a splitter might though.

Mark, thanks for the explanation...I like that kit. Just one more stocking stuffer for Xmas.

I do have a question regarding the air intake for the front brake ducts that enters through the front grill opening. Do you think that plugging this off will help with high aerodyamnics?

The reason I'm asking is what effect this would have on standing 1 mile type runs. Don't really need constant brakes like a road racer, just looking to eek out more speed and stability.

Thanks,
George

 

[cheryl mccally]

Good upgrade.

Would recommend it to anyone wanting better performance and better throttle response.

Horsepower increase is more like 40 to 50 peak at the rear wheels and you will feel it. Torque increases about 20 to 30 at the rear wheels. Both hp / tq increase over the entire rpm band.

You can also add the ported intake manifold "bottom" from Arrow Racing. This will make more power too, perhaps 25 at the rear wheels at peak with no loss of torque (on my car) with the Belangers, K & N's and Mopar race controller.

As for finding gas, it can be a pain in some areas. I buy 91 at the gas station and then add about 5 gallons of 100 octane unleaded, which is available at many locations here in So Cal.

Go for it and don't forget the K & N high flow air filter.

Dan

Dan, tell me about the "bottom" available from Arrow Racing, please since I don't have one and this is the first time anyone has mentioned it.

 

[cheryl mccally]

Now that I have read further, Mark do you have all this stuff and do you recommend installing it?

 

[Viper X]

One more thing you guys should know. If you do the lower intake swap and have tracked your car, you will likely find a bunch of oil in your intake manifold.

I put together a "breather system with catch can" after seeing this. I think DC Performance has improved on it. It keeps all of that oil out of your intake and can't help but make power or more accurately, restore power lost due to oil in the intake.

Dan

 

[cheryl mccally]

Thanks for all the info Dan. It sounds like lots of $$$$ so I'm glad Santa hasn't been to Texas yet.

 

[SilveRT8]

One more thing you guys should know. If you do the lower intake swap and have tracked your car, you will likely find a bunch of oil in your intake manifold.

I put together a "breather system with catch can" after seeing this. I think DC Performance has improved on it. It keeps all of that oil out of your intake and can't help but make power or more accurately, restore power lost due to oil in the intake.

Dan

The breather and catch can are very popular mods on the 6.1 Hemi SRT8 engines, and something that I've done a few years ago on my Jeep. I was wondering why it was not mentionned here before, you'd be surprised the amount of oil it catches instead of returning it to the Intake and coating it.
Catch can installed in Jeep SRT8, the round can with 2 tubes next to the rad cap.

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[Viperless]

What about the "better throttle response"? Did you notice any difference? Thanks

mmm....perhaps a little. I have a '09 which is supposed to have an improved throttle over the '08 so maybe the difference isn't much if any with the Mopar PCM. Still doesn't feel right to me compared to a cable.

 

[Herc]

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for a big lopey cam. I've always wanted the car to rock back and forth and sound like the car could barely idle.

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Had an 04 that was built by Woodhouse that was just like that. Paxton and light weight
flywheel, don't think there were any other mods to the engine. I do miss that feeling.

Herc