Gen 1 head gaskets at 80,000 miles

Tom F&L GoR

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Lots of stories about Gen 1 head gaskets - not if, but when. These were removed at ~80,000 miles for a camshaft change. They look ugly where they were exposed and where they are not supported by metal on both sides, but no signs of imminent failure. I'm sure they would have lasted many more miles.

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Before you ask, DEX-COOL for the last 60,000, which is when I bought it.
 

V10SpeedLuvr

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My original gaskets were replaced under warranty (at either 12k or 22k, cant remember), but were replaced before the new MLS style came out, so i still have the old style gaskets :curse: BUT, I now have 62k on the car and no signs of problems yet. <fingers crossed>
 

ryan94rt10

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hey tom

your a lucky man...mine went out at 10000 miles...only at 13000 now,i think it has to do with the amount of time the car sits, b/c i have heard of more guys, with higher miles, having their gaskets for way longer than the low milage gen 1's...just my 2 pennies!
 

EllowViper

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Wow. Looks like something salvaged off the Titanic. Pretty cool seeing what's actually transpiring between the head and the block circa 80K miles. Great post!!
 

Bill B

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I'd be willing to bet that the gasket failures are less the material (I'm not defending the crappy material) and more the the mating surfaces. Proper deck, torque ect.. I have no hard evidence of this just when I did mine my machinist noticed the discrepancies. Discuss among yourselves. :2tu:
 

JonB

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As usual, I read EVERY post by Tom FLOGoR. There are not many folks here that can show this old sled dog sumthin new. Thanks Tom. {I'm glad I dubbed thee long ago! }

Remember the REST OF THE STORY:

The gaskets failed due to CYLINDER LINER CREEP.

Dodge became aware of this as '93 cars added miles. (At one time in '94 I had the highest mileage privately owned RT/10 in Dodge warranty records! [Al F. told me] )

Most owners drove FEW miles.....and it took almost 2 YEARS to discover the numerous problems emerge, and I.D. that flaw, which impacted and damaged (weak) gaskets. RDCs began in late 1994 to improve 'creep'and the gaskets lasted longer on 95 cars. It was fixed by 96. Thos cars warranteed with the "OLD" gaskets are probably going to be OK becasue the CREEP issue was fixed.

Those owners who faithfully torqued cylinder heads of 92-95 every 3000 mi or so prolonged the inevitable. I bet Tom HAS torqued his heads on occasion. Those owners who were repaired with OLD gaskets should definitely TORQUE THE HEADS every 5000 mi or so...

History Class DISMISSED....because I feel old and need to rest now!
 
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Tom F&L GoR

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Sorry, for the sake of completeness, I never re-torqued the head bolts. I've been torqued before, though. I checked the previous owner receipts (in French, since it came from Canada) and there were no garnitures de culasse listed either. I know I'm going against convention and thinking that the "problem" doesn't happen 100% of the time.
 

V10SpeedLuvr

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It was fixed by 96. Thos cars warranteed with the "OLD" gaskets are probably going to be OK becasue the CREEP issue was fixed.

Thanks Jon! Best news I've heard all day

Those owners who were repaired with OLD gaskets should definitely TORQUE THE HEADS every 5000 mi or so...

Thanks again Jon. I'll add that tidbit to my memory databank
 

dansauto

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As usual, I read EVERY post by Tom FLOGoR. There are not many folks here that can show this old sled dog sumthin new. Thanks Tom. {I'm glad I dubbed thee long ago! }

Remember the REST OF THE STORY:

The gaskets failed due to CYLINDER LINER CREEP.

Dodge became aware of this as '93 cars added miles. (At one time in '94 I had the highest mileage privately owned RT/10 in Dodge warranty records! [Al F. told me] )

Most owners drove FEW miles.....and it took almost 2 YEARS to discover the numerous problems emerge, and I.D. that flaw, which impacted and damaged (weak) gaskets. RDCs began in late 1994 to improve 'creep'and the gaskets lasted longer on 95 cars. It was fixed by 96. Thos cars warranteed with the "OLD" gaskets are probably going to be OK becasue the CREEP issue was fixed.

Those owners who faithfully torqued cylinder heads of 92-95 every 3000 mi or so prolonged the inevitable. I bet Tom HAS torqued his heads on occasion. Those owners who were repaired with OLD gaskets should definitely TORQUE THE HEADS every 5000 mi or so...

History Class DISMISSED....because I feel old and need to rest now!

This has been dicussed before. and you are not entirely correct, in fact you are only about 25% correct. Yes during the first few years the headgaskets were leaking and Arrow indicated that it was to due to the cylinder lining creaping. BUT if the liners were going to creep they would have done so the first 10K miles not on cars 10 years old with 20K miles. Also metal core gaskets will not prevent the failure if the liners creep. I have seen first hand evidence of this. The issue is really that the fiber gasket will fail due to the constant expanding and contracting of the block to head mating surface. It also does not help when the cars do not get driven a lot and the gasket "dries out". Then when the car is driven the dry gasket can not take the pressure in combination with the thermal expansion. Chrysler had this same issue with the 95-00 Neon's. You are correct regarding torqing the heads, and you should still do this with the steel core as well as torquing the intake.
 
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Tom F&L GoR

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One on the roller lifters stopped rolling when a few of the needles from the bearing fell out. (Be very wary of something that sounds like a belt squeal that doesn't go away.) The replacement lifters are for a V6, so they're not high-perf parts to start with.
 

GR8_ASP

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Tom, most important aspect is regular coolant chnages or additive pack renewal. Corrosion is the enemy with those gaskets.
 
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Tom F&L GoR

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As mentioned, I put a DEX-COOL antifreeze in the car when I bought it and did not change it for the next 60,000 miles. Gaskets looked fine.
 

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