Gen V ACR

[johniew398]

No disrespect intended for the new Gen V owners; but the money is in the bank for a new ACR. That may be foolish not knowing if
there is an ACR in the mill somewhere. Time will tell.

Of course with the TA's they are rolling out SRT wouldn't want to say anything if they were even thinking about an ACR right?

Right now debating and starting an initial discussion to take a Gen V and turn it into an ACR of my own design.

 

[ViperSmith]

Honestly, if I were SRT, I'd be waiting for Chevy to lift their skirt with the ZR1 before announcing the ACR and see what base figures I was competing against.

 

[ACRucrazy]

ACR needs some bomb suspension, tires and brakes more than it needs HP imo. All the reviews negatives are are on handling and braking. The HP is good, more would be better but I think money should be spent elsewhere first.

Suspension
Tires
Brakes
Weight
Horse power

 

[mnc2886]

My dream version of the Gen V ACR would be as follows;

Options Added to Base SRT

• Lightweight Carbon Racing Seats
• Alcantara trim (less weight than leather and looks good IMO) and Carbon interior/exterior pieces (especially the x-brace)
• Carbon Ceramic Brakes (The costs of these are getting down, probably $10k and it should be a bit less once you remove the cost of the stock rotors.)
• Aero Trim of the GT3R (Maybe even active aero - AeroMotions - good example of "cost effective active aero)
• Lightweight battery
• Center-lock lightweight wheels
• Unique Paint Scheme/striping (maybe like ferraritoviper's car or whatever SRT comes up with)
• Unique hood (little more aggressive than the SRT hood)
• Wide-body fenders
• Titanium Exhaust

Weight Loss

• Lightweight Carbon Racing Seats -30 lbs over stock seats
• Alcantara trim (less weight than leather and looks good IMO) and Carbon interior/exterior pieces (especially the x-brace) -10 lbs
• Carbon Ceramic Brakes -10 lb/corner
• Aero Trim of the GT3R (Maybe even active aero - AeroMotions - good example of "cost effective active aero)
• Lightweight battery -10 lbs
• Center-lock lightweight wheels - Probably won't get lighter than the current sidewinder wheels as those are extremely light already.
• Unique Paint Scheme/striping (maybe like ferraritoviper's car or whatever SRT comes up with)
• Unique hood (little more aggressive than the SRT hood)
• Wide-body fenders
• Titanium Exhaust -30 lbs

Pricing

• Lightweight Carbon Racing Seats -$3,000
• Alcantara trim (less weight than leather and looks good IMO) and Carbon interior/exterior pieces (especially the x-brace) -$11,500 (based on current carbon trim pricing + guess on alcantara
• Carbon Ceramic Brakes -$10,000
• Aero Trim of the GT3R -$10,000
• Lightweight battery -$300
• Center-lock lightweight wheels -$2,500
• Unique Paint Scheme/striping (maybe like ferraritoviper's car or whatever SRT comes up with) -$5,000
• Unique hood (little more aggressive than the SRT hood) $1,500
• Wide-body fenders $3,000
• Titanium Exhaust $2,000
• Estimated Price: $150,795 + $1,995 destination

I've thought about it a lot as I am sure some of you have.

What do you guys think?

 

[SilveRT8]

Lightweight carpeting on floor and trunk + radio delete could probably save some 40+ lbs ?
Aluminium frame ?

 

[jsd512]

If anyone thinks the ACR is going to be great, has a terrible surprise coming. Remember, this is Chrysler we are talking about, not Ferrari or McLaren. They are depleted, financially speaking. Plus, they simply do not have the engineering power to make the ACR great. They just don't have the money. I think we will see an ACR, it's just not going to be spectacular.

 

[ViperSmith]

If anyone thinks the ACR is going to be great, has a terrible surprise coming. Remember, this is Chrysler we are talking about, not Ferrari or McLaren. They are depleted, financially speaking. Plus, they simply do not have the engineering power to make the ACR great. They just don't have the money. I think we will see an ACR, it's just not going to be spectacular.

Yawn, your endless negativity here is old.

 

[BlknBlu]

my thoughts.

Lightweight rims and better tires.
Aero group that creates downforce.
shave some weight
Possible different hood that generates more air and downforce
Number the ACR's badging wise
Create a seperate Vin identifier for ACR's
unique paint schemes
Racing variation options or as a package.
even better handling suspenion

Bruce

 

[SnakeBitten]

If anyone thinks the ACR is going to be great, has a terrible surprise coming. Remember, this is Chrysler we are talking about, not Ferrari or McLaren. They are depleted, financially speaking. Plus, they simply do not have the engineering power to make the ACR great. They just don't have the money. I think we will see an ACR, it's just not going to be spectacular.

Same can be said about the last ACR. It didn't have anywhere near the typical supercar budget yet its dominance at tracks around the world, most notably the Nurbergring, is well known.

I wont count the engineering end of SRT out. Give them a proper budget and move out of the way Fiat. A small group of dedicated people can accomplish a lot with a little as evidenced by the last ACR. Its the other parts of SRT that makes me want to scream and pull my hair out. I think they can make a potent ACR even in todays world of McLaren P1's etc. Whether or not it will get the right tires, proper prep for testing etc is what I have little confidence in.

 

[sween]

I think Less weight and 700 hp would be perfect. I agree with viper smith though, I bet SRT is just waiting for Chevy to release the Z06 before they release the ACR. Many magazines have heard valid rumors that one is in production, there probably just waiting now to see what GM will do.

 

[mnc2886]

I think Less weight and 700 hp would be perfect. I agree with viper smith though, I bet SRT is just waiting for Chevy to release the Z06 before they release the ACR. Many magazines have heard valid rumors that one is in production, there probably just waiting now to see what GM will do.

That just simply isn't happening. If the car is to be out as a 2015 model, it is well under way. We don't know that it is a 2015 model though, but waiting for Chevy isn't happening as that would mean they'd be waiting until that car came out, then add another two years. SRT will just pay attention to the rumor mill and attempt to bring as much from the GTS-R over to the street platform as possible.

 

[kdaviper]

Lightweight carpeting on floor and trunk + radio delete could probably save some 40+ lbs ?
Aluminium frame ?

Simply replacing the steel with aluminum won't have any benefit, as steel actually has a slightly higher specific strength than aluminum. It would take a complete redesign of the frame to get any benefit of aluminum as far as weight savings (aluminum allows you to design things thinner in certain areas to save weight). IMO, aluminum frames are a gimmick... Hell the Gen IV ACR had a steel frame and it demolished cars with aluminum and CFRP frames or monocoques.

 

[TrackAire]

If anyone thinks the ACR is going to be great, has a terrible surprise coming. Remember, this is Chrysler we are talking about, not Ferrari or McLaren. They are depleted, financially speaking. Plus, they simply do not have the engineering power to make the ACR great. They just don't have the money. I think we will see an ACR, it's just not going to be spectacular.

My thoughts exactly. Lets face it, why would anybody even want a 2010 ACR when the McClaren, 458, Porches GT (fill in blank for their fastest beast of the week), Lambo, Pagani, Bugatti, and Koenigsegg are so much faster around the Ring

Honestly, I don't even think SRT knows where Germany is on the map

Some day, Dodge may send a car to the Ring to give it a shot.....hopefully they don't embarrass themselves too bad, being their first time and all.

Cheers,
George

 

[kdaviper]

If anyone thinks the ACR is going to be great, has a terrible surprise coming. Remember, this is Chrysler we are talking about, not Ferrari or McLaren. They are depleted, financially speaking. Plus, they simply do not have the engineering power to make the ACR great. They just don't have the money. I think we will see an ACR, it's just not going to be spectacular.

1. The previous ACR didn't have a big budget and it was awesome.
2.Most of the time spent on the Viper (internally) is from unpaid volunteers who do it for the passion.
3.The aero developement work has already been underway for quite some time (GTS-R racing program)
4. "great" and "spectacular" are completely subjective terms, and depending what your standards (or even feelings) are, you could be always right, or always wrong in this type of speculation.

 

[mnc2886]

I just want SRT to at least show teaser shots already...

 

[hawkeye]

I would say, ideally, it goes on an almost unhealthy diet (think, 360 Challenge Stradale vs. regular 360), and has GTS-R-based Aero, best cup tires available (I don't care what Fiat/Pirelli has to say about it), and a ton of hours tuning the car for road course work. This formula will yield the desired results. Add lightness and aero and watch it just thrash a good chunk of the more civilized competition...

 

[madninjaskillz]

My thoughts exactly. Lets face it, why would anybody even want a 2010 ACR when the McClaren, 458, Porches GT (fill in blank for their fastest beast of the week), Lambo, Pagani, Bugatti, and Koenigsegg are so much faster around the Ring

Honestly, I don't even think SRT knows where Germany is on the map

Some day, Dodge may send a car to the Ring to give it a shot.....hopefully they don't embarrass themselves too bad, being their first time and all.

Cheers,
George

I lol'd. Well played.

 

[Martin]

The question I keep asking myself is if they'll add a new engine option for all cars, and make that engine option standard on the ACR (direct-injected). I would think that would be a big-buck option if they do it in low numbers, but would make financial sense if they make the new engine available on all the cars. Being direct injected will also make it easier to pass emissions - so I'm guessing that's something they're thinking about, too. They're doing great things with the engine management system on the port injected engines of today, but direct injection provides so much better control of the fuel delivery that they can probably loosen up some of the other sensor CEL points and still pass emissions.

If they do release the new engine, and the suspected TR6070 tranny on the car, they may just make the ACR the debut car for the Gen VI series and go for the big-bang release. Then, release a lower priced "base" version of the Gen VI that still has the engine/tranny, and a lot more luxury, but doesn't have the ACR craziness.

I've never quite gotten why car companies release models the way they do today. In the past, it made sense for non-specialty cars - you release a base version first, and then you keep adding new upgrades to keep the market flowing. Or, you release something that doesn't have any big options (the way they did it with the Gen I and Gen II) and people grab whatever they can because they're all basically the same. These days, especially with a car like today's Viper, hard-core early buyers are picky, they know exactly what they want, and they are willing to wait for it if it isn't available out of the gate. So, companies release a car, and it's a crap-shoot whether the dealer purchased and optioned cars will sit on the lots or fly out the door.

So we have a situation where base models get released first, and then those models either sit around or they get devalued when the upgrades come out. Seems to me that it would make more sense to release the ultra high-end first, generate crazy buzz, and then bring the masses in with a more affordable version that rides on the media attention and buzz of the initial release.

 

[SilveRT8]

The question I keep asking myself is if they'll add a new engine option for all cars, and make that engine option standard on the ACR (direct-injected). I would think that would be a big-buck option if they do it in low numbers, but would make financial sense if they make the new engine available on all the cars. Being direct injected will also make it easier to pass emissions - so I'm guessing that's something they're thinking about, too. They're doing great things with the engine management system on the port injected engines of today, but direct injection provides so much better control of the fuel delivery that they can probably loosen up some of the other sensor CEL points and still pass emissions.

If they do release the new engine, and the suspected TR6070 tranny on the car, they may just make the ACR the debut car for the Gen VI series and go for the big-bang release. Then, release a lower priced "base" version of the Gen VI that still has the engine/tranny, and a lot more luxury, but doesn't have the ACR craziness.

I've never quite gotten why car companies release models the way they do today. In the past, it made sense for non-specialty cars - you release a base version first, and then you keep adding new upgrades to keep the market flowing. Or, you release something that doesn't have any big options (the way they did it with the Gen I and Gen II) and people grab whatever they can because they're all basically the same. These days, especially with a car like today's Viper, hard-core early buyers are picky, they know exactly what they want, and they are willing to wait for it if it isn't available out of the gate. So, companies release a car, and it's a crap-shoot whether the dealer purchased and optioned cars will sit on the lots or fly out the door.

So we have a situation where base models get released first, and then those models either sit around or they get devalued when the upgrades come out. Seems to me that it would make more sense to release the ultra high-end first, generate crazy buzz, and then bring the masses in with a more affordable version that rides on the media attention and buzz of the initial release.

Well said !

 

[VENOM V]

My dream version of the Gen V ACR would be as follows;

Options Added to Base SRT

• Lightweight Carbon Racing Seats
• Alcantara trim (less weight than leather and looks good IMO) and Carbon interior/exterior pieces (especially the x-brace)
• Carbon Ceramic Brakes (The costs of these are getting down, probably $10k and it should be a bit less once you remove the cost of the stock rotors.)
• Aero Trim of the GT3R (Maybe even active aero - AeroMotions - good example of "cost effective active aero)
• Lightweight battery
• Center-lock lightweight wheels
• Unique Paint Scheme/striping (maybe like ferraritoviper's car or whatever SRT comes up with)
• Unique hood (little more aggressive than the SRT hood)
• Wide-body fenders
• Titanium Exhaust

Weight Loss

• Lightweight Carbon Racing Seats -30 lbs over stock seats
• Alcantara trim (less weight than leather and looks good IMO) and Carbon interior/exterior pieces (especially the x-brace) -10 lbs
• Carbon Ceramic Brakes -10 lb/corner
• Aero Trim of the GT3R (Maybe even active aero - AeroMotions - good example of "cost effective active aero)
• Lightweight battery -10 lbs
• Center-lock lightweight wheels - Probably won't get lighter than the current sidewinder wheels as those are extremely light already.
• Unique Paint Scheme/striping (maybe like ferraritoviper's car or whatever SRT comes up with)
• Unique hood (little more aggressive than the SRT hood)
• Wide-body fenders
• Titanium Exhaust -30 lbs

Pricing

• Lightweight Carbon Racing Seats -$3,000
• Alcantara trim (less weight than leather and looks good IMO) and Carbon interior/exterior pieces (especially the x-brace) -$11,500 (based on current carbon trim pricing + guess on alcantara
• Carbon Ceramic Brakes -$10,000
• Aero Trim of the GT3R -$10,000
• Lightweight battery -$300
• Center-lock lightweight wheels -$2,500
• Unique Paint Scheme/striping (maybe like ferraritoviper's car or whatever SRT comes up with) -$5,000
• Unique hood (little more aggressive than the SRT hood) $1,500
• Wide-body fenders $3,000
• Titanium Exhaust $2,000
• Estimated Price: $150,795 + $1,995 destination

I've thought about it a lot as I am sure some of you have.

What do you guys think?

Excellent post! Well thought out. I'd mortgage the kids and sell the girlfriend to buy that car, LOL

 

[Nine Ball]

My thoughts exactly. Lets face it, why would anybody even want a 2010 ACR when the McClaren, 458, Porches GT (fill in blank for their fastest beast of the week), Lambo, Pagani, Bugatti, and Koenigsegg are so much faster around the Ring

Honestly, I don't even think SRT knows where Germany is on the map

Some day, Dodge may send a car to the Ring to give it a shot.....hopefully they don't embarrass themselves too bad, being their first time and all.

Cheers,
George

LOL! Quit making sense.

More horsepower doesn't mean faster lap times. Better to drive 500 hp all-out, than pedaling 700 at part throttle. Someone else mentioned a 7-spd trans for the ACR? Longer and heavier than the 6-spd. If anything, the ACR only needs a 5-spd trans. DCT option would be nice. If it doesn't make it faster or lighter, don't add it.

 

[SADVIPER]

If anyone thinks the ACR is going to be great, has a terrible surprise coming. Remember, this is Chrysler we are talking about, not Ferrari or McLaren. They are depleted, financially speaking. Plus, they simply do not have the engineering power to make the ACR great. They just don't have the money. I think we will see an ACR, it's just not going to be spectacular.

Next time befor you'd like to sound like a "know-how" google your idea before typing, much safer.

 

[DMan]

My dream version of the Gen V ACR would be as follows;

Options Added to Base SRT

• Lightweight Carbon Racing Seats
• Alcantara trim (less weight than leather and looks good IMO) and Carbon interior/exterior pieces (especially the x-brace)
• Carbon Ceramic Brakes (The costs of these are getting down, probably $10k and it should be a bit less once you remove the cost of the stock rotors.)
• Aero Trim of the GT3R (Maybe even active aero - AeroMotions - good example of "cost effective active aero)
• Lightweight battery
• Center-lock lightweight wheels
• Unique Paint Scheme/striping (maybe like ferraritoviper's car or whatever SRT comes up with)
• Unique hood (little more aggressive than the SRT hood)
• Wide-body fenders
• Titanium Exhaust

Weight Loss

• Lightweight Carbon Racing Seats -30 lbs over stock seats
• Alcantara trim (less weight than leather and looks good IMO) and Carbon interior/exterior pieces (especially the x-brace) -10 lbs
• Carbon Ceramic Brakes -10 lb/corner
• Aero Trim of the GT3R (Maybe even active aero - AeroMotions - good example of "cost effective active aero)
• Lightweight battery -10 lbs
• Center-lock lightweight wheels - Probably won't get lighter than the current sidewinder wheels as those are extremely light already.
• Unique Paint Scheme/striping (maybe like ferraritoviper's car or whatever SRT comes up with)
• Unique hood (little more aggressive than the SRT hood)
• Wide-body fenders
• Titanium Exhaust -30 lbs

Pricing

• Lightweight Carbon Racing Seats -$3,000
• Alcantara trim (less weight than leather and looks good IMO) and Carbon interior/exterior pieces (especially the x-brace) -$11,500 (based on current carbon trim pricing + guess on alcantara
• Carbon Ceramic Brakes -$10,000
• Aero Trim of the GT3R -$10,000
• Lightweight battery -$300
• Center-lock lightweight wheels -$2,500
• Unique Paint Scheme/striping (maybe like ferraritoviper's car or whatever SRT comes up with) -$5,000
• Unique hood (little more aggressive than the SRT hood) $1,500
• Wide-body fenders $3,000
• Titanium Exhaust $2,000
• Estimated Price: $150,795 + $1,995 destination

I've thought about it a lot as I am sure some of you have.

What do you guys think?

I don't think we'll see anything close to this, only because, based on the TA, all this wouldn't be needed to hit the target perf leel they'll shoot for. Depending on the ZR1, the only issues to deal with are really aero, perhaps some power, and possibly ceramic brakes. Let's face it, take the TA, add ceramic, a wing & cannards, and throw in 40rwhp and it's pretty insane.

BTW, titanium exhaust for my Ninja sport bike was $2,000, I think we're looking a bit heftier than that for the viper, unless you're just talking catback, then sounds right.

 

[The_Greg]

For some reason, I just really like the idea of active aero. Always has been a interesting thing to me (after all, I am an engineer) The Gen IV ACR was very sucessful - follow that recipe! They will want to sell GT3-R's so don't expect the Gen V ACR to be a spec racer all set up for track-only use... That's not what I want it to be either. I want it to be the fastest (around a track) version of a road Viper!

As for aluminum frame, won't happen. The thing about steel frames, and why the Gen V has a steel frame, is that it can be fixed and repaired (multiple times). This is great news for racers! Puncture one spot on a carbon monocoque car and its basically totalled. I imagine aluminum is somewhere in between steel and carbon as far as track repairability... Even welding aluminum can be a pain. You'd need great experienced welders and sometimes you have to heat your pieces.. Things that are not that easy to do in the time you have between practice and the race, in some cases. Also as kdaviper said, you can actually make better structures with steel sometimes.

 

[V10lover]

Car needs 3 things to beat everybody:


1) 7.5L -8.0L V10 DOHC Engine with 11-13:1 compression with direct injection. Slightly smaller engine than the actual 8.4L pushrod to save or at least keep the same weight at the front end of the car. 7.5L V10 with Direct injection and high compression that revs hard to 6800 rpms is an easy 700-800HP and no sweat to pass emissions.

2) DCT 6 spd. transmission. Don't need more than that.

3) Find a way to put all that power to the ground with suspension, chassis and tires upgrades. If still does not work and the car is facing serious traction issues after that then they would need to consider a way develop an intelligent AWD to transfer 10% of the traction to each front wheel, keeping that 20% on front and 80% on the rears when most traction is needed in racing.


If they make 1, 2 and 3 work together I will buy the car. If 1 + 2 is adopted I will still buy the car since I love RWD. If only 2 or 3 is chosen together or separately I won't buy the ACR and would be keeping mine.

The car needs to Evolve to be able to fight with the hyper technology of the other exotics and supercars. Saving weight only is not going to cut it specially in a straight line where the car will be losing race after race, after race... That's the reality of the facts.

Making the interior/exterior look nicer and saving weight with carbon fiber was only a minor help in boosting performance in order to beat the rivals as we already know... DID NOT convinced us.

 

[johniew398]

LOL! Quit making sense.

More horsepower doesn't mean faster lap times. Better to drive 500 hp all-out, than pedaling 700 at part throttle. Someone else mentioned a 7-spd trans for the ACR? Longer and heavier than the 6-spd. If anything, the ACR only needs a 5-spd trans. DCT option would be nice. If it doesn't make it faster or lighter, don't add it.

I agree on the 5-spd trans. I rarely use 6th gear and only above 80. The new vetoes have 7-sods; but who cares, doesn't mean anything unless you care about mpg which I don't in these cars. When I care about mpg I drive my Abarth.

 

[Martin]

Agreed on the transmission - I think the only time I used sixth gear was when I was driving 600 miles in one day through the desert and I wanted to save gas. The TR 6070 is a stout transmission, though, and doesn't weigh much more than the TR 6060 - so I wouldn't really care one way or another if they implemented it. It might actually be a good thing if they could bring the higher gears closer together and leave gear 7 for the gas-mileage test.

I don't know about the rest of the world, but I'm going nuts not having an ACR to play with on the weekends... I'd be really excited to hear that there's a Gen V ACR coming out - and hopefully it's something really special. The wish lists above are good ones - I'd love to see a stripped down, race ready, no frills, insanity machine come out. I'm personally put off by all the electronics and luxury in the Gen V - it looks cool, and I'm sure passengers are impressed by it, but I don't drive these cars in order to play with a touch screen or sit in a nice leather interior that I have to worry about maintaining.

 

[elanderholm]

If anyone thinks the ACR is going to be great, has a terrible surprise coming. Remember, this is Chrysler we are talking about, not Ferrari or McLaren. They are depleted, financially speaking. Plus, they simply do not have the engineering power to make the ACR great. They just don't have the money. I think we will see an ACR, it's just not going to be spectacular.

Also, when did it become rocket surgery to make a car fast on track? To make it all things is much harder, but if there goal is to make it as fast as possible on the track that's actually much easier and cheaper than making something best daily driver car and best track car. It will do fine.

The bar has been raised a lot though in the last few years if you are talking about million dollar cars in terms of track prowess. It would have to made on a different chassis, etc.

 

[Martin]

Also, when did it become rocket surgery to make a car fast on track? To make it all things is much harder, but if there goal is to make it as fast as possible on the track that's actually much easier and cheaper than making something best daily driver car and best track car. It will do fine.

The bar has been raised a lot though in the last few years if you are talking about million dollar cars in terms of track prowess. It would have to made on a different chassis, etc.

Exactly - and considering the Gen IV ACR was an absolute rocket on the track, I'd think the Gen V would be an even better platform as it's superior in many respects. The Gen IV was even pretty docile and drama-free on the street - other than me constantly being worried about hitting the front splitter on driveways, or scratching the rear diffuser when exiting sharp transitions... All that worry for nothing - all it took was a deer to come out of nowhere and turn my ACR into an absolute mess Maybe for the best - I never would have sold that car, I loved it too much. Now, I've got a spot in my garage to replace it with a new ACR - and hopefully not ****** that one.