Help on pricing my 96 GTS, may sell it.

Sybil TF

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I firmly believe the gen 2 viper will very much be the next 67-69 camaro in a decade or so. The gen 2 has a timeless style. Even Dodge is trying to revert back to gen 2 styling in the gen 5 body. The 69 camaro was cheap all day until people woke up and realized they will never top the original styling. It may take a while, but mark my words it will happen!

I didn't buy my car because of this reason though. I bought it because I wanted an exotic and a muscle car, and there is no other that accomplishes this more than the gen 2 viper!

Now your talking my language! Where I live there are not many Vipers and when I pull in somewhere it draws a crowd! That's what I like. If I want comfort I will drive my ChallengerSRT8 or Dodge Ram truck. Hot cabins in these cars are great for me since I am cold all the time and it feels comfy for me. Ac works great on mine. If you can't get out of this car without burning your leg you are too old or too fat!!!!!:)
 

PDCjonny

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Somebody somewhere will pay a good price for a low mileage B/W. The low mileage cars are getting rare. It just takes finding the right buyer.

I couldn't find "that guy" in a few months of advertising here, The Alley, cars.com, autotrader.com and large newspapers.
You know, the buyer who would pay me 50K for my Blue and White.
So I had to sell my pristine Blue and White with 15K on it for real world values, not what it "should" be worth in pie in the sky land.
And so will the OP. And so will you and all the other owners some day.
 

slitherv10

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I couldn't find "that guy" in a few months of advertising here, The Alley, cars.com, autotrader.com and large newspapers.
You know, the buyer who would pay me 50K for my Blue and White.
So I had to sell my pristine Blue and White with 15K on it for real world values, not what it "should" be worth in pie in the sky land.
And so will the OP. And so will you and all the other owners some day.

But you sold a 97..not the same:D
 

daveg

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Yes, they are except to '96 owners.
No one else cares.
Morning Jon,
In my case, before I was a 96 owner I didn’t care if it was a 96 or a 97 but after sitting down and thinking about it, I wanted the first year, totally original B/W GTS and not the second. To me its equivalent to buying a 64 ½ mustang and not a 65… I guess what I am saying is I “Cared” as you say BEFORE I purchased one and not after.

I happened to get even luckier by finding a low mile totally stock 96 (except for rear muffler delete) 80 miles away with VIN # 0033 (Larry Birds Number lol) My car even has the original tires (Ya, ya I know, they should be replaced)

For me, even as nice as your car is / was, I wouldn’t have looked at any of your for-sale-ads because of the year…
Also, there is something about the stripes going through the plate that seals the deal for me!!!
 
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PDCjonny

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Hi Dave
The point I was making really is that despite the '96's being the first year they do NOT bring any extra money given equal mileage.
I shopped extensively for one back in 2007 and compared many for sale. There was no difference in pricing between the two years.
People advertise that it's the first year of the GTS and that looks great but it doesn't translate to more money.
In fact being a year newer meant higher prices in some cases.

In my case I didn't care. But after reading about the improvements in the '97 (Forged nicer looking wheels not cast) as well as
improved weatherstripping and a few other things I was more than happy to get a '97.

Cya, I'm done with this thread..:)
Enjoy your car, just don't think it's a nest egg for your kids college ten years from now.
 

daveg

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Hi Dave
The point I was making really is that despite the '96's being the first year they do NOT bring any extra money given equal mileage.
I shopped extensively for one back in 2007 and compared many for sale. There was no difference in pricing between the two years.
People advertise that it's the first year of the GTS and that looks great but it doesn't translate to more money.
In fact being a year newer meant higher prices in some cases.

In my case I didn't care. But after reading about the improvements in the '97 (Forged nicer looking wheels not cast) as well as
improved weatherstripping and a few other things I was more than happy to get a '97.

Cya, I'm done with this thread..:)
Enjoy your car, just don't think it's a nest egg for your kids college ten years from now.
You may be right about the money, I have no idea because I had tunnel vision when I was looking…
My kid is going to Berklee, he can fend for himself, LOL….
Don’t blame you on bowing out…

Good Luck and health…
David
 

coupe

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ViperJon said:
Yes, they are except to '96 owners.
No one else cares.
As Dave mentioned, some people will hold out for the first of a breed, regardless of which owners are biased toward which years. The '96 is the first of its kind and the collector car industry has been proven time and time again that indeed people "do care."
 

Paul Hawker

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Some people want the 96 for reasons quoted, others want the 97 for the improved dash, sealing and wheels. Others do not care.

For the most part they bring the same money.

Everybody thinks their car is more valuable than the next guys, because that is the one that they earlier decided they wanted.

Same thing with options.
 

slitherv10

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Hi Dave
The point I was making really is that despite the '96's being the first year they do NOT bring any extra money given equal mileage.
I shopped extensively for one back in 2007 and compared many for sale. There was no difference in pricing between the two years.
People advertise that it's the first year of the GTS and that looks great but it doesn't translate to more money.
In fact being a year newer meant higher prices in some cases.

In my case I didn't care. But after reading about the improvements in the '97 (Forged nicer looking wheels not cast) as well as
improved weatherstripping and a few other things I was more than happy to get a '97.

Cya, I'm done with this thread..:)
Enjoy your car, just don't think it's a nest egg for your kids college ten years from now.


Well, it all seems to me ViperJon that a viper to you is just that. ...A viper..and a car to you ..is just that..a car. To others though,and history be told, a car of this stature as is the Viper, will hold its own in history and thus making models such as teh first year coupe B/W an icon and a collectable. If your holding on to a car of this stature for reason of putting your kids through college or retiring with the sale in 30 years, then the car is not enough for you as it sits and thus not worthy in hands like yours. I for one believe that when you buy a car, you buy it for what it stands for. Be it a first year of production,a color combo, exclusivety,etc etc...You feel special when you purchase a car like this and others, for what you, and only you, feel it stands for. Vehicles with history and backbone as is the 1996 B/W GTS will always be regarded as such and will own a place in Viper history. Wether you think it does or not. A 97 will never.
97 B/W were only produced because of the huge demand in the 96 and dodge saw a good thing when it hit them over the head with supply and demand for that car in that combo. Thus why in 97 the polished aluminum wheels were an extra cost as was the paint scheme that year. Otherwise, 97's came with the standard ( only for that year) grey dull wheels. Just because a car is updated does not make it "better" or more worthy. Most people dont see it that way. Not when your talking about a car that was and is today an Icon for what has become. If Dodge or SRT thought the way you did, they would not have made the 06 Limited edition B/W numbered cars to commemorate the 96 or the 2010 in that color combo...and...whats this??!! the 2013 is making that color combo a limited edition and only 150-200 will be made in that color dombo. I wonder why. In the words of Ralph Gilles, the new car was built around the 96 B/W, I wonder why...why not the 97...lol...you get my drift. If you don't ...well...have fun with the Lambo and one day...you might say...they were right. Not for the money, for the respect of this car.

Big block and convertible cars back in the day never got more money than did the coupes...no one wanted or cared for what those cars stood for. It showed in teh prices and in the demand back then. ...30 years later....they wish they bought that big block and or convertible back then. they wish they piked up the first year production cars. But some felt the same way you did and today, wish they either kept those cars or bought one and still had it.
 

Paul Hawker

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As this thread illustrates, the original B/W GTS was perhaps one of the most emotional Vipers of all time.

I can still remember when I first saw one. It was on a turntable at the San Diego Autoshow. That car simply sucked all the oxygen from the room.

There were more people standing around that car than all the other displays together.

This was the reincarnation of the Cobra Coupe/GT 40 and LeMans racers all rolled together, but with air conditioning, stereo, and power steering and full warranty.

It was, and still is an icon.

(Still don't bring any more money today than a 97)
 

AFL in NJ

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A few more pictures of Ed's '96.

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Regards,
Aaron
 

ViperSmith

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As someone who has never owned a Viper, but is in line for a Gen V - here are my opinions which ViperJon has hit on.

It is a beautiful car, no doubt. I think the Gen II was what got me to "fall in love" with cars as a teenager. I drooled over them, I wanted one, badly. But hey, in 1998 I was 16! I've often pondered getting one, but never carried through.

I think the issue is, that the crowd that would be attracted to the Gen II in the used market (me) can afford the new Gen V. While the Gen II is still a beautiful beast, it simply doesn't have the modern creature comforts that you find in the market segment new Vipers compete with. Like it or not, most people don't find the Dodge Neon interior appealing.

There are a lot of vehicles, new and used, in that $50k market segment that are more appealing. It is simply a difficult segment to try and sell a 16 year old car in. $50k is a lot of cheddar for something that old.

Plus, those who still have nostalgia for the Gen II, who may have had an original one in 1996, I'd assume can afford the Gen V now as well too.

But, a beautiful car - I hope the thread starter can get something for it that makes him happy.
 

Sybil TF

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Hi Dave
The point I was making really is that despite the '96's being the first year they do NOT bring any extra money given equal mileage.
I shopped extensively for one back in 2007 and compared many for sale. There was no difference in pricing between the two years.
People advertise that it's the first year of the GTS and that looks great but it doesn't translate to more money.
In fact being a year newer meant higher prices in some cases.

In my case I didn't care. But after reading about the improvements in the '97 (Forged nicer looking wheels not cast) as well as
improved weatherstripping and a few other things I was more than happy to get a '97.

Cya, I'm done with this thread..:)
Enjoy your car, just don't think it's a nest egg for your kids college ten years from now.

For my own info since I own a 96, ( It is a girl thing, I'm nosy) Trying to learn as much as I can about these cars.

1) What is better or different on the dash of a 97 vs a 96? Is there a difference in appearance?

2) How are the rubber seals better? Higher quality? Thicker rubber?

3) How much better are the 97 forged wheels as compared to a 96? Are 97 wheels available aftermarket?
 
OP
OP
E

Edward 96GTS

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96 dash is painted hard plastic. 97 dash is molded vinyl.
96 w.s at base of exterior side glass is 2 piece, 97 one piece
96 wheels are cast, moderate polish on aluminum, 97 is forged, high polish.
Ed
 

klamathpro

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96 dash is painted hard plastic. 97 dash is molded vinyl.
96 w.s at base of exterior side glass is 2 piece, 97 one piece
96 wheels are cast, moderate polish on aluminum, 97 is forged, high polish.
Ed

I'm fairly sure the dash change was in 98'. I saw 96' and 97' with the same dash at events. My 98' has the textured finish, though not soft vinyl by any means, still hard plastic or hard vinyl.
And my 96' brochure shows forged rims as an option.
I think the only real difference is the white stripes don't go through the license plate. Mostly everything else is identical.
 

slitherv10

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As someone who has never owned a Viper, but is in line for a Gen V - here are my opinions which ViperJon has hit on.

It is a beautiful car, no doubt. I think the Gen II was what got me to "fall in love" with cars as a teenager. I drooled over them, I wanted one, badly. But hey, in 1998 I was 16! I've often pondered getting one, but never carried through.

I think the issue is, that the crowd that would be attracted to the Gen II in the used market (me) can afford the new Gen V. While the Gen II is still a beautiful beast, it simply doesn't have the modern creature comforts that you find in the market segment new Vipers compete with. Like it or not, most people don't find the Dodge Neon interior appealing.

There are a lot of vehicles, new and used, in that $50k

market segment that are more appealing. It is simply a difficult segment to try and sell a 16 year old car in. $50k is a lot of cheddar for something that old.Plus, those who still have nostalgia for the Gen II, who may have had an original one in 1996, I'd assume can afford the Gen V now as well too.

But, a beautiful car - I hope the thread starter can get something for it that makes him happy.

lol....its interesting to see how many different opinions there are and how everyone sees the same item.

The 96..not 97 or 98...is what started the ball rolling for the Viper...in my opinion and seems like SRT's as well, as Ralph did state the 2013 car was designed around the 96..thus the limited edition blue and whites for 2013....anyway...this car was never built and does not and willnot ever be looked at as a creature comfort car even if they have added all the hoopla to it in 2013, most arguments still veered aside form all the comfort of the 2013 and still focused on the Hp and performance aspect of the car. Buyers of teh 2013 model are not buying this car for its creature comforts. If SRT was hoping that the comforts was what was going to make them rich and sell alot of these cars, they are in for a big surprise,but,they are too smart for that and know that the Viper buyer and enthusiast such as you and me and most on this site,are looking for the performance aspect as I said earlier. The 1992 Viper got its recongnition from the performance aspect, the raw uncompromised power it had over any other car in the world at that time. Corvettes best produced 375 Hp (ZR1).
The 1996 GTS took that 1992-1995 car, to another dimension. MORE HP and More Performance. Exactly what everyone was looking for and exactly what it delivered at that time. Once again crowned king of the road..not the Vette or any other car once again. The Blue and white could only be ordered if you owned a viper beofre and got a coupon from Dodge at that time that you could bring to the dealer to order you one. Thats was special !

To answer some of the other posters questions : The weatherstriping was upgraded in 97...big deal!..the wheels on the 97 did become forged but were offered as an option (extra $) for the polished version,whereas the 96 ws standard. The dash in both cars is teh same...no difference from what i know. The color is also different, the blue 96 is more lighter and metalic than the 97...if you order 96 paint for your 97...it will not match. The 97's were just a way that dodge saw a money grab as there was so much demand for the 96 Blue and whites that they charged for certain options in 97 and brought out another roughly 500 97 cars in that color combo. Thus why the low production numbers for the 97. Admitingly the 97 wheels do hold better when pushed to higher limits. But, there wouldnt be too many people out ther putting 700hp on the motor and not putting different wheels on the car at that time. Who would keep 97 17" wheels on a built up car anyway,,,I have not seen too many yet. Most opt for 18" ccw or OZ's for racing and others like me opt for the looks and go for 20 inch set ups. So the wheels being "better" was irrelevant in my opinion.

Vipersmith: you say that there are much more appealing cars at 50k....name a few..if so,...than a viper lover your not. When Viper is truly in your blood..there is no compromise. Especialy at 50K maybe at 150k...you might opt for a GT40 but that is even out of reach as tehy go for over 170K. You also stated that someone who is in the market for a Gen2 could afford a new one...lol...ya ok...I have 50K to spend but could go 130 if need be...lol..comon thats silly...when your in the market for a 50K car..than that is what you can afford. If not...then your one cause for the landslide in the USA(buying something you cant realy afford).
Example....you buy a Gen 2 car for say 40K, put another 10- 50 thousand in upgrading the motor ( NA,supercharged,twin turbo), interior , wheels,suspension,etc and for under 100000, you have a car that has the creature comforts (that you like),and the performance that teh new 2013 couldnt compete with and...you have the classic Gen2 body style that the new car in my opinion does not compete with ..yet. I have done some mild mods on my car including the daytona package from autoform and when i drive up to lambos ferraris vettes and the like that have the "creature comforts", they don't hold a candle to this car. Not just in my opinion , but the crowds or passerbys that are looking and comparing....and..to top it all off...I spent half if not more than half of what they did. Bang for your buck is what they call it.

The old classic BB cars of the late 60's and early 70's such as the mustangs,vettes,cudas,challengers,and especialy the AC Cobra ( whichis what this car was commemorating), did not have any creature comforts and fetch big dollars. The first year and Icons of those cars, such as the superbees and Cobras and certain color combos of those cars, fetch even more money. This is all to say if money is what your after in this investment. I say no,,,youll never make this car an investment. The argument here is that wether this car is to be respected as were certain classics of those times. I say yes!! Too bad many of you don't see teh forest through the trees...yet...but you will as time goes on. SRT did and has ( 2013 Limited Edition Blue and Whites).
 

Voodoo Rob

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I bought a 97 b/w because I wanted that particular car. Now I come to find out the blue in 97 is a shade different! Its a worthless p.o.s .and I will be listing it on Craig's list looking to trade out for a record collection and a mountain bike. The Viper is low production across the board. Gold wheels, plastic dash, round shift knob, dash plaques, stripes thru the plate, etc are all fun facts but the only fact that matters is you know what you have and when you go to sell it you are realistic for what it is.
 

daveg

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I bought a 97 b/w because I wanted that particular car. Now I come to find out the blue in 97 is a shade different! Its a worthless p.o.s .and I will be listing it on Craig's list looking to trade out for a record collection and a mountain bike. The Viper is low production across the board. Gold wheels, plastic dash, round shift knob, dash plaques, stripes thru the plate, etc are all fun facts but the only fact that matters is you know what you have and when you go to sell it you are realistic for what it is.
To some people having the first year may matter (like myself) but others could care less (such as yourself) In my opinion, it may matter more as these cars
get older but time will tell. looking at history, a 63 split window Corvette is more desirable today that a 64 non split… That stripe through the plate just could be that split!
If I HAD to take a guess it will matter. Regardless, the two are beautiful. Going back to what this whole thread is even about, it seems like a 96 or a 97 brings roughly the same price…. As I am writing this anyways..
 
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MtnBiker

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Let me make myself clear.. I never said what Jon's Viper should sell for or what it’s worth… I
  1. Nearly stated that I believe the car will go up in time….
  2. I stated the reasons why I purchased my car
  3. I stated I don’t give a rat’s ass about heat and where it blows from and the sills getting a bit warm.
  4. I stated that driving the Viper is like driving a Cadillac compared to what I use to / still do and love to drive!
To me, the Viper is a modern day Muscle car and that’s what I love about it. I love the go kart feel, the raw horsepower and the style, not its “Luxury or lack of Luxury items” I am a Vette guy and have been for decades and I could have gone out and purchased practically any comfy new / newer Corvette I wanted but did I, Negative…. I love what the Viper was built for and what it represents….

From another former Vette guy I agree. Love this car!!!!!!!!!!!
 

slitherv10

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To some people having the first year may matter (like myself) but others could care less (such as yourself) In my opinion, it may matter more as these cars
get older but time will tell. looking at history, a 63 split window Corvette is more desirable today that a 64 non split… That stripe through the plate just could be that split!
If I HAD to take a guess it will matter. Regardless, the two are beautiful. Going back to what this whole thread is even about, it seems like a 96 or a 97 brings roughly the same price…. As I am writing this anyways..

Seeing as I have written novels in the last few replies, I will make this one short...


What he said ^^^^^^ :headbang:
 

PDCjonny

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Seeing as I have written novels in the last few replies, I will make this one short...


What he said ^^^^^^ :headbang:

Tell yourself whatever you need to to justify owning two old cars.
It's a million dollar car .....to you...thats great.
In the real world, it's a 35-40K car. And dropping every day.
But you don't live in the real world.
 

daveg

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Tell yourself whatever you need to to justify owning two old cars.
It's a million dollar car .....to you...thats great.
In the real world, it's a 35-40K car. And dropping every day.
But you don't live in the real world.
I'm not going to get anything for my car... Chances are, it will never be for sale.... In my lifetime anyways. So your car fetched way more than mine ever will...
 

PDCjonny

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Not knocking the car Dave, enjoyed and drove one for many years.
But Slithers bashing of the SAME car made in '97 along with his delusional perspective on what a '96 is worth is borderline psychotic.
If this was the case, a first year '92 roadster would be priceless instead of a 30K car. Hell, thats 20 years old the first year!

They made 2128 Blue and White Coupes in 96-97. There are SO many out there they will never be a rare collectable car.
The price they sell for is the only barometer to use. Not pie in the sky value 20 years from now..lol....
 

daveg

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Not knocking the car Dave, enjoyed and drove one for many years.
But Slithers bashing of the SAME car made in '97 along with his delusional perspective on what a '96 is worth is borderline psychotic.
If this was the case, a first year '92 roadster would be priceless instead of a 30K car. Hell, thats 20 years old the first year!

They made 2128 Blue and White Coupes in 96-97. There are SO many out there they will never be a rare collectable car.
The price they sell for is the only barometer to use. Not pie in the sky value 20 years from now..lol....
Point well made about the 92’… but in my opinion, 20 years is not old enough. When I am speaking, I am thinking 40 years old… I look at 60’s and very early 70’s cars and man, I wish I had some of mine back!!! The prices although “soft now” will even go higher on these cars when this Damn Economy turns around but that’s a different topic…

I think your statements are spot on (as we are writing this today) But, in my opinion, 20 years from now, a 96 will probably be more collectable and I am only basing that on history.
Can I guarantee that, hell no. Heck, if you talk to my wife I am always wrong… LOL….

I know you’re not knocking the car(s) if you didn’t like them, you would not be on this board!

Lastly, have you ever noticed I never say what they will be worth??? Man I wish I had a crystal ball…
 
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slitherv10

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Not knocking the car Dave, enjoyed and drove one for many years.
But Slithers bashing of the SAME car made in '97 along with his delusional perspective on what a '96 is worth is borderline psychotic.
If this was the case, a first year '92 roadster would be priceless instead of a 30K car. Hell, thats 20 years old the first year!

They made 2128 Blue and White Coupes in 96-97. There are SO many out there they will never be a rare collectable car.
The price they sell for is the only barometer to use. Not pie in the sky value 20 years from now..lol....

Who is bashing the 97...I am merely sticking to the thread and the original posters question. A 1996 Viper is a first year car. A 1997 is overstock. A first year car in the future...not now...you think I don't see the numbers they are fetching presently between teh 96 and 97 ? Yes they are similar. Your confusing the argument, the 1996 in the future may and in my opinion will be worth more than a 97. If history prevails it will . I am not saying it is a great car compared to its predecessors. I am merley stating the fact that this car should be respected alot more today than it ,unfortunatly is.

As for your numbers...they produced way more mustangs and vettes back in the 60's and 70s. Certain ones like the big blocks and first years, engine size and models...fetch much more than their standard versions....and...thus answers your next question where as teh 1996 Blue and white coupe compared to the 1992 is that the 92 has become unpractable( no top,no widows,no air..etc) so is shunned apon by many people who want a driving car and not just a item for future collectability. You cannot compare teh 92 to a 96...the 96 is a drivers car and has all the amenities that you would need for a daily driver..ie air,windows,etc. to top it all off it also has more Hp which in the future will bring more appeal. As did the classic BB cars.
Yes your numbers may be right as to the production numbers...but,,, how many of the @1500 Blue and whites are left. How many were salvaged from owners who did not respect the car. How many were written off by insurance companies for mere fron end or rear end dings because of the high cost of parts and labour at that time ? I would say if half of those cars are still around i would be surprised. In 15-20 more years..how many more will be gone?...were talking the future here..not today as you are. If your selling your car as you did today,,,then yes they are a loss and are worthy of what someone is willing to pay for them today. But, were talking the future of this car and all that was said.
I am not borderline psychotic on this car, i am just stating an opinion which holds some truth and history. this again is not only my opinion but SRT's as well as they have once again, respected and commemorated the 1996 Blue and white in the new 2013 car. I wonder why ? Why not commemorate the 97 since it is newer and a better car as you say. Why? because that is just it....it is the first year of production and the Viper that has set the standards for the rest...it was not the 92...it was not the Gen 3 or the 2010 ACR..it was the 1996 that gave birth and recongnition to those cars and obviously (2013 limited edition) the present and the future of SRt and the Viper.

Again to you its obvious the Viper is just another car or toy to you. thats fine...you got yourself a Lambo now to enjoy..and after taht..what next?...whatever floats your boat at that time. I for one am a die hard Viper fan and will show it by supporting and defending it when need be.

There you made me write another novel...after you said you were done with this thread...:D
 
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