Hmmmm, words from Ralph

[emericr]

If that package already exists then SRT made a mistake not coming out with it.
I doubt anyone cares if the new snake were to **** gas like an Aventador if the performance was there.
I also would bet a good steak dinner that CAFE requirements was not a major concern for Ralph.
Ferrari may not be happy with an 800hp Viper but I think FIAT could care less if this means that Vipers would be a huge success and sell to the point of making SRT a viable business unit.

 

[chorps]

I don't know why you get so upset here. You've been disrespecting me since I started posting here and you don't seem to understand the advantages that a dohc would offer would more than surpass our current size engine even if it was down by 1.5L or so. It is the TRUTH! 50 lbs of extra weight is very easy to overtake when your making 100-200 more hp with a modern engine..
weight reduction is easy to do and most times even free.

How many DOHC Vehicles with 5 liter displacement or over have you own in the last few years of life?
Please let me know...

Dude, the only one who's been upset is you...you seem to think that I don't understand your idea...I fully get it, I just reject it. You seem to take that quite personally.

I don't want to say it, but this thesis of yours is simplistic and not well thought out. That's as far as I get 'disrespecting' you.

I'm not going to get into a slinging match with you about what I've owned or who's is bigger... I just think if you want to add 50 lbs of extra weight to the Viper engine, why would you make it bigger in size and smaller in displacement, and have to re-engineer the whole thing when you can just drop the compression and add some forced induction?

The bottom line is that the Viper program probably has a smaller budget for the entire car than it would take to engineer a new top end for DOHC.

 

[bcmarly]

You must be registered for see images attach

Don't know when the show is airing but it looks like Jay has a couple of flavors to chose from.

 

[ViperSmith]

I love the look of that yellow one

 

[Torquemonster]

Not true.

The lambo Aventador comes with a 6.5L DOHC engine with 700hp and it beats our viper pushrod with its big 8.4L.
So, yes, it is making more power than a 8.4L V10 even with only being 6.4L. Yes, it is expensive, yes, it is heavier but I asked this and will ask again to all of you:

Would you rather have an engine that is a 35-50 lbs heavier or so making 100-200 hp MORE with room to grow or the 35lbs-50lbs lighter one of 1989 that is already running on its limits?

The factory and engineers could fit a 7.5L, 7.8L or even 8.0L V10 DOHC in the viper. It would fit, it is just a matter of WANTING TO DO!

mnc2886 is correct in his post following this one of yours.

My opinion might not mean a thing but when asked by a supercar builder (Hulme) to come up with a recommended engine for their car (knowing they had been offered anything from the BMW line) both myself and a top car designer in the UK came to the same choice independently - the LS7. It beat the multi cam and valve BMW V8. V10, and V12 options hands down despite the obvious very attractive support from BMW. And all this for the very reasons already pointed out by mnc2886 - more cubic capacity for a given physical space and lower CG.

The old school OHV can get 30mpg at highway cruising from a 7 liter V8 and with a custom tune so can the 8.4L V10. That is the same engine that makes more torque than any other production NA car. It might be old school but it is solid and strong and not bad re efficiency. In fact it compares favorably with a lot of high tech engines with a far bigger budget, the gap is not as wide as you think. GM spent over 6 million man hours developing the combustion process for their DI V8, there is nothing old school about that.

In a racing situation top engine builders know they can get very competitive outputs from an all out OHV engine vs multi valve and cams. Try getting 1000hp from any of your favorite high tech V8-V12 engines NA. Can you find one? I can't, maybe I need to look harder? But I can show you an old school small block doing more than that on carbs and race gas a few miles from here. It spins to 11,000rpm too. 1000hp from bigger OHV engines is routine, pro stock is nearer 1500 NA, more for the mountain motors. Race engine builders know that in an all out effort, OHV is hard to beat. They lack the broader power band for sure, but when you have 8.4L that is hardly a problem is it? A race V10 with lumpy cam will still make more torque at idle than your average econo box at full noise.

Now re your Lambo idea: actually the V12 is 3.5"shorter, the same height, and nearly a FOOT wider - good luck fitting that. It is also lighter than the V10... but then it is a 60 degree engine which works well on a V12, not so recommended on a V10. Also, the Lambo V12 represents one of the ultimate supercar power plants designed for a market that expects to pay more for their car than most would for a house. For SRT to go there you are not talking about new heads, you are talking about throwing away the entire engine platform and starting from scratch, on a budget that could never be justified on a $100k car. You want a $600k Viper?

The Viper is a better car sticking to what is has got - a huge torquey OHV V10.... and I had the rights once for a 40V redesign of the Viper V10 (aftermarket). It made sense on paper at first but it just was never going to pay nor justify any cost vs benefit analysis. Move on or risk your own money proving everyone else wrong.

 

[V10lover]

If that package already exists then SRT made a mistake not coming out with it.
I doubt anyone cares if the new snake were to **** gas like an Aventador if the performance was there.
I also would bet a good steak dinner that CAFE requirements was not a major concern for Ralph.
Ferrari may not be happy with an 800hp Viper but I think FIAT could care less if this means that Vipers would be a huge success and sell to the point of making SRT a viable business unit.

They can't because it is not street legal. It is a dragracing only type of engine with 12.5:1 pistons, Nasty solid cam, off road exhaust, junked Gen 4 ecu for gen 3 one.
Basicaly it would never pass emissions if they tried that out of the assembly line especially with all the government B.S increasing year after year.
I think Ralph seems to be a great guy but he and all his team adopted the wrong strategy with the chosen, saturated engine. It is a sin to see a gorgeus car like that with that Pre-historic, dinossaur engine and with no options of Auto or semi-automatic transmission either.

Only way for us to have to reach the 700+ and pass emissions in my opinion would be with the modern engine. The SOHC would be a huge advantage already over the actually dinossaur and not be so so large as the DOHC... but hey, viper members love what they love, complain about losing races, records with the new car, but don't want to change..
D.I. would also be a BAND-AID to increase a few dozen ponies and an excuse to keep the old dinossaur alive longer as again, alsways to please that old viper crowd. That is what chevrolet is also doing with that pathetic new C7 car PUSHROD D.I.

I love my 10 acr and will keep on driving but I know its limitations on the street and drag race and also a few different road course tracks that don't favor the car.
With the Gen 4 and 5 your basicly everyones B**ch when you play against great modded cars and we also suffer because of the unlocked ECU.

Horsepower sells car and I completelly agree with you. Just look at the sucess that the gt500 is with it's 662 hp modern and state of the art hand built engine. That brick wall 60K car can almost hit 200 miles per hour. We are too low in HP, with an engine that doesn't spin that high and strong, no modern tranny option nor ECU tuning options. In other hands we are SCR**d. I love vipers and love how the gen 5 looks but will never buy a car only for looks.

 

[V10lover]

Dude, the only one who's been upset is you...you seem to think that I don't understand your idea...I fully get it, I just reject it. You seem to take that quite personally.

I don't want to say it, but this thesis of yours is simplistic and not well thought out. That's as far as I get 'disrespecting' you.

I'm not going to get into a slinging match with you about what I've owned or who's is bigger... I just think if you want to add 50 lbs of extra weight to the Viper engine, why would you make it bigger in size and smaller in displacement, and have to re-engineer the whole thing when you can just drop the compression and add some forced induction?

The bottom line is that the Viper program probably has a smaller budget for the entire car than it would take to engineer a new top end for DOHC.

You are like one of those people that will never try a certain type of food just because is healthy for you. You might look at it. You may understand that it is good for your body and functions. At the end, your talking smack about that food to everyone and also that tastes bad even though you never tried it.
With that being said, if I try to help you and recomend that food you get mad, really mad.

 

[V10lover]

mnc2886 is correct in his post following this one of yours.

My opinion might not mean a thing but when asked by a supercar builder (Hulme) to come up with a recommended engine for their car (knowing they had been offered anything from the BMW line) both myself and a top car designer in the UK came to the same choice independently - the LS7. It beat the multi cam and valve BMW V8. V10, and V12 options hands down despite the obvious very attractive support from BMW. And all this for the very reasons already pointed out by mnc2886 - more cubic capacity for a given physical space and lower CG.

The old school OHV can get 30mpg at highway cruising from a 7 liter V8 and with a custom tune so can the 8.4L V10. That is the same engine that makes more torque than any other production NA car. It might be old school but it is solid and strong and not bad re efficiency. In fact it compares favorably with a lot of high tech engines with a far bigger budget, the gap is not as wide as you think. GM spent over 6 million man hours developing the combustion process for their DI V8, there is nothing old school about that.

In a racing situation top engine builders know they can get very competitive outputs from an all out OHV engine vs multi valve and cams. Try getting 1000hp from any of your favorite high tech V8-V12 engines NA. Can you find one? I can't, maybe I need to look harder? But I can show you an old school small block doing more than that on carbs and race gas a few miles from here. It spins to 11,000rpm too. 1000hp from bigger OHV engines is routine, pro stock is nearer 1500 NA, more for the mountain motors. Race engine builders know that in an all out effort, OHV is hard to beat. They lack the broader power band for sure, but when you have 8.4L that is hardly a problem is it? A race V10 with lumpy cam will still make more torque at idle than your average econo box at full noise.

Now re your Lambo idea: actually the V12 is 3.5"shorter, the same height, and nearly a FOOT wider - good luck fitting that. It is also lighter than the V10... but then it is a 60 degree engine which works well on a V12, not so recommended on a V10. Also, the Lambo V12 represents one of the ultimate supercar power plants designed for a market that expects to pay more for their car than most would for a house. For SRT to go there you are not talking about new heads, you are talking about throwing away the entire engine platform and starting from scratch, on a budget that could never be justified on a $100k car. You want a $600k Viper?

The Viper is a better car sticking to what is has got - a huge torquey OHV V10.... and I had the rights once for a 40V redesign of the Viper V10 (aftermarket). It made sense on paper at first but it just was never going to pay nor justify any cost vs benefit analysis. Move on or risk your own money proving everyone else wrong.

I am not a fan of the BMW engine. Never have been. I am simply comparing the ohv and DOHC or SOHV with the same or close cubic inches to prove which one makes more power and is more efficcient. That is all, no big story here.

Regarding GM, there is only one way to refer to the 5.5L C7 project. Pathetic! LS7 was good in 2007-10, we are in 13, the world needs to evolve so who cares about c7 beating c6z06 either! I could care less about a 13 car beating on a 07 car. Who cares about miles per gallon on sports cars either, I know I don't.
GM should be spending its millions of man hours developing an ENTIRE NEW ENGINE and not that Cam in block, pushrod BAND-AID. Man, oh man, Hundresds of millions of dollars to do D.I on that engine and go from 436HP to 450HP = Failure. Visit the corvette forums and lots didn't like that and that crowd deserved it its new engine not that old design to please the nostalgia old crowd = again failure.

I don't need to prove anything or anybody wrong. I am just a humble guy but also can RECOGNIZE and UNDERSTAND when something AGED and had its GLORY DAYS but those my friend, are over. The results with the new car are out there and they speak for themselves.

A lumpy cam or high HP OHV 8.4L will never pass emissions nor would ever get close to be released. On the other hand with a smaller 8.0 or 7.8L you reduce the carbon foot print to please the government just to start with and then after you have 4 cams with the DOHC Vs 1 on the OHV so you can have the ignition timing much more precisely and also high rpm power PASSING EMISSIONS. I tis the reality of every day driving and not the reality of a 1000hp OHV that races for 7-8 seconds in three quarter mile passes and go back to the trailler or tow truck because can barely idle and be driven on the street. I love that 1000 crazy cam you mentioned but not practical. Not anymore. Not for D.D. Not out of the box.

You like the new car and you go and place your 140K order for your new pushrod engine vehicle. It will look good outside but under the hood you will be driving with something that is not the top prime for sports cars engines at the moment. As far as the OHV had it is glory days it is going to dye and hey, I had many cars with the OHV design but they just don't cut it anymore for me and for many many others.. In other words I own my last one.

Do you really think if Ralph had called Sergio aside right before the new gen 5 was approved as a new project and said:

-Sergio, I would like to have your permission to take the viper drivetrain to the next level. Like all the rest of the world is mainly using it, That will include a modern engine with a little less cubic inch and also an option for an auto transmission. These will be our two main things on the next car and it may need to have the frame relocated in oreder to fit the new engine and the otional transmission there.W have the technology and man power, skills and knowledge to do it. The car may take up to 3- 3 1/2 years to come to life instead of 2 years but we won't let ANYBODY DOWN. The old crowd will love once they drive it. The new crowd will all give it a shot once they pop up the hood and have another option for the transmission.
The rest will also come together but these are the TWO PRIORITIES since the vipers a sports car and intended to go fast.

I doubt he would't be approved to do that.
This little budget thing I am starting not to believe on that anymore.. Look at the car.. Super expensive Carbon everywhere, ferrari/ lambo interior / japanese car type of dashboard and gauges, tons of different wheels, funny cross brace, koenigsegg headlights, etc... Small budget , no, I don't think so. Less guys, less on that and more on the MOTOR!

 

[chorps]

You are like one of those people that will never try a certain type of food just because is healthy for you. You might look at it. You may understand that it is good for your body and functions. At the end, your talking smack about that food to everyone and also that tastes bad even though you never tried it.
With that being said, if I try to help you and recomend that food you get mad, really mad.

Oddly enough, you're the only one that is talking smack and you label everyone else who disagrees with your poorly thought out diatribes.

 

[Jack B]

Please go back and read all your posts (226 negative posts defending your negative position) and try to understand how repetitive the underlying theme is.They all become so boring, trite and predictable. Little if anyone pays any attention to your rants. As was stated multiple times by others, why are you even on this forum and please, it is not for the good of anyone or anything.

The worst things about your posts is that they make this forum personal, petty, political and anti-productive to the good of the viper. I apologize for my mini-rant, but, IMHO you are best served to be elsewhere.

I am not a fan of the BMW engine. Never have been. I am juts simply comparing the ohv and DOHC or SOHV with the same or close cubic inches to prove which one makes more power and is more efficcient. That is all, no big story here.

Regarding GM, there is only one way to refer to the 5.5L C7 project. Pathetic! LS7 was good in 2007-10, we are in 13, the world needs to evolve so who cares about c7 beating c6z06 either! I could care less about a 13 car beating on a 07 car. Who cares about miles per gallon on sports cars either, I know I don't.
GM should be spending its millions of man hours developing an ENTIRE NEW ENGINE and not that Cam in block, pushrod BAND-AID. Man, oh man, Hundresds of millions of dollars to do D.I on that engine and go from 436HP to 450HP = Failure. Visit the corvette forums and lots didn't like that and that crowd deserved it its new engine not that old design to please the nostalgia old crowd = again failure.

I don't need to prove anything or anybody wrong. I am just a humble guy but also can RECOGNIZE and UNDERSTAND when something AGED and had its GLORY DAYS. The results with the new car are out there and they speak for themselves.

You like the new car and you go and place your 140K order for your new pushrod engine vehicle. It will look good outside but under the hood you will be driving with something that is not the top prime for sports cars engines at the moment. As far as the OHV had it is glory days it is going to dye and hey, I had many cars with the OHV design but they just don't cut it anymore for me and for many many others.. In other words I own my last one.

Do you really think if Ralph had called Sergio aside right before the new gen 5 was approved as a new project and said:

-Sergio, I would like to have your permission to take the viper drivetrain to the next level. AS all the rest of the world is mainly using it, That will include a modern engine with a little less cubic inch and also an option for an auto transmission. These will be our two main things on the next car and it may need to have the frame relocated. The car may take up to 4 years to come to life instead of 2 but we won't let ANYBODY DOWN. The old crowd will love once they drive it. The new crowd will all give it a shot once they pop up the hood and have another option for the transmission.
The rest will also come together but these are the TWO PRIORITIES since the vipers a sports car and intended to go fast.

I doubt he would't be approved to do that.
This little budget thing I am starting not to believe on that anymore.. Look at the car.. Super expensive Carbon everywhere, ferrari/ lambo interior / japanese car type of dashboard and gauges... Small budget , no, I don't think so. Less guys, less on that and more on the MOTOR!

 

[V10lover]

Oddly enough, you're the only one that is talking smack and you label everyone else who disagrees with your poorly thought out diatribes.

You wanna prove that the old is better than the new and modern when it is not. You are the one that label yourself as a person that doesnt wanna learn. On top of that you disrespect the ones that have a different opinion than you do. That = failure.

 

[V10lover]

Please go back and read all your posts (226 negative posts defending your negative position) and try to understand how repetitive the underlying theme is.They all become so boring, trite and predictable. Little if anyone pays any attention to your rants. As was stated multiple times by others, why are you even on this forum and please, it is not for the good of anyone or anything.

The worst things about your posts is that they make this forum personal, petty, political and anti-productive to the good of the viper. I apologize for my mini-rant, but, IMHO you are best served to be elsewhere.

You seem to care too much about me. That is too bad, I am here to stay. I am a viper owner.

I gotta be repetitive to make my self clear because many don't seem to understand what I am saying or they pretend they don't. they make fun about me, they disrespect me, they send me *** calling me names and offending my family.

Yeah, I read a lot of your posts too and while you have a few good ones lots are reported towards you and your big EGO. It must be quite an experience for lots on this forum have to deal with your attitude since the year of 2000. Maybe you should be going elsewhere...

Nobody here could expose one single advantage but weight with the old engine. \\
Actual engine doesn't work well anymore. DEAL WITH IT! I have a different opinion than you do. DEAL WITH IT.

I am not disrespecting anybody and that was not the intention of my posts. I just don't like when my favorite car in the world is starting to lose badly on the track and at the streets and the crowd is not supportive of a big change.

 

[madninjaskillz]

They can't because it is not street legal. It is a dragracing only type of engine with 12.5:1 pistons, Nasty solid cam, off road exhaust, junked Gen 4 ecu for gen 3 one.
Basicaly it would never pass emissions if they tried that out of the assembly line especially with all the government B.S increasing year after year.
I think Ralph seems to be a great guy but he and all his team adopted the wrong strategy with the chosen, saturated engine. It is a sin to see a gorgeus car like that with that Pre-historic, dinossaur engine and with no options of Auto or semi-automatic transmission either.

The technology exists right now at SRT to make an 800hp engine and pass emissions based on this V10 block. Believe it.

 

[Torquemonster]

The technology exists right now at SRT to make an 800hp engine and pass emissions based on this V10 block. Believe it.

I believe that.

The Lotus developed ZR1 32V Vette was quite an engine in its day, but would not hold a candle to the LS7 or any Viper from Gen 2 up. In an engine that spends most of its time under 6000rpm OHV rules for a given space to fill and weight. End of story. Those that will not buy that are Euro journalists and their wide eyed readers who don't realize that the only reason their fairy tale cars win on the track is when the rules restrict the air intakes on the OHV engines or force them to add ballast. Uncork a GTS-R and weep. The so called high tech engines only beat OHV at rpms well past what is practical for street engines. True story

 

[madninjaskillz]

I believe that.

The Lotus developed ZR1 32V Vette was quite an engine in its day, but would not hold a candle to the LS7 or any Viper from Gen 2 up. In an engine that spends most of its time under 6000rpm OHV rules for a given space to fill and weight. End of story. Those that will not buy that are Euro journalists and their wide eyed readers who don't realize that the only reason their fairy tale cars win on the track is when the rules restrict the air intakes on the OHV engines or force them to add ballast. Uncork a GTS-R and weep. The so called high tech engines only beat OHV at rpms well past what is practical for street engines. True story

Preach on, brother torque. Not that we are going to change any minds on the interwebs, but it's nice to have voices of reason as to why this type of engine/car exists and is so viable.

 

[Mopar Boy]

I love the look of that yellow one

Well spoken sir!

Yeah, I read a lot of your posts too and while you have a few good ones lots are reported towards you and your big EGO.

You may want to retract that one..... I have been lucky enough to meet Jack at a few shows while down in Ohio..... yeah, I think you have read him wrong.

 

[-nighthawk-]

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Don't know when the show is airing but it looks like Jay has a couple of flavors to chose from.

I'm really looking forward to that episode, here's an amazing snapshot from the video which was posted on Jay Leno's Garage Facebook:

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I'm hoping they have a proper picture of that as a wallpaper, as it's my favorite yet.

 

[ViperSmith]

Anyone know when Jay "Canadian Tuxedo" Leno's Garage episode will air?

 

[Dom426h]

deleted......

 

[Torquemonster]

Preach on, brother torque. Not that we are going to change any minds on the interwebs, but it's nice to have voices of reason as to why this type of engine/car exists and is so viable.

lol, fact is NA 2V and OHV can make 3hp per cubic inch. Let's put that in to perspective: One of the finest 32V quad cam V8's ever made is the Toyota 4L found in the Lexus since the early 90's. A gem of a motor that responds to mods and goes forever. To match 3hp per cube NA it'd have to make 720hp. Go find me one that can, even with billet everything.

With big engines and the latest state of art wedge heads, the torque curve is unbelievable. Check this out Reher Morrison 762 - all NA, on gas and carbs, with a massive stroke that should destroy the top end due to friction, yet does not because old school is not old school for those that know how:

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With modern injectors and software that puppy could idle and pull your doors open from the moment you stepped on it. More than that, the higher torque and lower rpm of the typical OHV engine has far longer life potential than its high winding high tech cousin that must rpm to the moon to get ahead of it. Higher RPMs on smaller weaker parts is what is on offer from a performance multi cam and valve engine. Live and let live each has its place

 

[JAY]

This sounds like the Carol Shelby and Enzo Ferrari BATTLE , on the Race Tracks from the 60's , and we ALL Know who one that one !!!........lol ! It almost Bankrupt Ferrari ...lol !

lol, fact is NA 2V and OHV can make 3hp per cubic inch. Let's put that in to perspective: One of the finest 32V quad cam V8's ever made is the Toyota 4L found in the Lexus since the early 90's. A gem of a motor that responds to mods and goes forever. To match 3hp per cube NA it'd have to make 720hp. Go find me one that can, even with billet everything.

With big engines and the latest state of art wedge heads, the torque curve is unbelievable. Check this out Reher Morrison 762 - all NA, on gas and carbs, with a massive stroke that should destroy the top end due to friction, yet does not because old school is not old school for those that know how:

You must be registered for see images attach

With modern injectors and software that puppy could idle and pull your doors open from the moment you stepped on it. More than that, the higher torque and lower rpm of the typical OHV engine has far longer life potential than its high winding high tech cousin that must rpm to the moon to get ahead of it. Higher RPMs on smaller weaker parts is what is on offer from a performance multi cam and valve engine. Live and let live each has its place

 

[Jack B]

Let me preface this post by saying it will be my last related to you, it is obvious you thrive on the controversy you try to create. A little insight, with great certainty the majority of the people on this forum feel the same as I do about your repetitive/negative soapbox type of post, all 229 of them.

As a group the viper community is extremely fair and perhaps you have been served an injustice. Perhaps I owe you an apology, you have that chance. I had a proven group of viper enthusiast prepare a test for a professed lover of the V10, especially a current viper owner and acknowledged enthusiast of the viper platform. It is a well know fact that the above described should answer yes to at least 50% of the following questions, let us know what your grade is. If it is over 50% I will offer an apology for my inaccurate assessment of your intent.

Please note, this test only pertains to negative enthusiasts that profess to own a viper and profess to love the V10,

1. A member of the VCA national.

2. A member of the local VCA chapter.

3. A Venom member of the VCA.

4. Has visited the Connors assembly plant.

6. Has visited the Chelsea proving grounds.

7. Has been to a minimum of one VOI events.

8. Has been to a minimum of two regional VCA events.

9. Have at least one friend in the VCA (other than a relative).

10. Has helped one VCA member with a viper problem.

11. Has created one innovation to help the viper community.

12. Has made one technical post to help the viper community.

13. Has created one technical white paper that is included in the how-to section of this forum.

14. Modified the engine and/or body to create a better or faster car - in other words a hands on person that has built what he drives. The converse is another vca member did it.

15. Represented the viper in any formal race against another platform and made the viper community proud.

16. Has purchased viper aftermarket parts from a minimum of three supporting vendors.

17. Has participated in a minimum of two VCA sponsored speed events.

18. Has participated with the viper in a minimum of one car show with the viper and prepared the car by himself.

19. Has a positive rep rating on the Alley.

20. Has an ego.

As stated, an apology will be offered if you score a minimum of ten "yes" 's, otherwise my assessment was correct and you do not belong on this site.

You seem to care too much about me. That is too bad, I am here to stay. I am a viper owner.

I gotta be repetitive to make my self clear because many don't seem to understand what I am saying or they pretend they don't. they make fun about me, they disrespect me, they send me *** calling me names and offending my family.

Yeah, I read a lot of your posts too and while you have a few good ones lots are reported towards you and your big EGO. It must be quite an experience for lots on this forum have to deal with your attitude since the year of 2000. Maybe you should be going elsewhere...

Nobody here could expose one single advantage but weight with the old engine. \\
Actual engine doesn't work well anymore. DEAL WITH IT! I have a different opinion than you do. DEAL WITH IT.

I am not disrespecting anybody and that was not the intention of my posts. I just don't like when my favorite car in the world is starting to lose badly on the track and at the streets and the crowd is not supportive of a big change.

 

[VCA Forum Staff]

Thread has pretty much run its course, and as it is no longer on the original subject...