K&N Air filters: hype?

[REDSLED]

I was under the impression that you didn't have to clean the K&N filters with every oil change. I like the 1,000,000 mile warranty myself. Never have to buy a filter ever again. For the cost of 2-3 filter replacements you could have the K&N's. Why continue to buy new filters if you don't have to?

 

[Ron]

<FONT face="Comic Sans MS">I have dyno'd with and without K&N's and they do add power versus foamed stock units, (approx 10 HP as I remember) but still curious as to what the Fram part number is?

tx</FONT f>

 

[JonB]

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Dr E:
I've noticed that almost everyone here replaces their stock filters with K&N's. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

yeah.........95% of us have been fooled!


Buy K+N.s Use K+Ns. Rotate 2 sets so you can clean at your convenience

 

[JonB]

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Dr E:
...BTW, Jon, you can't disagree that there's a lot of hype in the aftermarket performance goods market, can you?
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Most of the Hype stops at the door here.

Exception: droop-snoot intakes that **** hot air from behind the fan, defeat the NACA and turn it into a 100mph bug scoop that fills the V-10 valley with debris.

Keep the NACA. Use a Viper-specific, Viper rated filter that most race teams use: K+N

 

[Chuck 98 RT/10]

I agree that reusable filters are a PITA. It's worth it to spend $25 on throw-aways rather than cleaning and reusing. Who makes a paper filter?

 

[Steve 00RT/10]

Amsoil makes a filter specifically for the Viper. It's guaranteed for life. They cost less than $25 each. From the tests I've seen--they flow as well as the K&N's and have better dirt trapping ability. It is a little messy to clean and oil them(once a year), but if I'm keeping more dirt out of my engine--it's well worth it. As far as dyno gains, I think that a 10 HP difference could happen on any given day for a lot of reasons. I do know that 2 years ago my car dynoed 12 HP higher than the same year ACR with panel K&N's&3" TNT cat back exhaust, on the same machine on the same day. I had the stock 2.5" exhaust, Mopar tubes, and Amsoil filters. I guess that means I was 22 HP above the stock set up. I doubt it.

Steve

 

[badoursnake]

Chuck 98 RT/10:

I recently bought a set of Purolator paper filters which I had to order from the parts store. I don't have the part number handy but the place was able to look them up easily.

Badoursnake

 

[Newport Viper]

Try S&B filters www.roeracing.com

 

[MiamiJeff]

Why mess around

You must be registered for see images

to maybe save a few bucks when the K&Ns are tested, guaranteed, and are currently used by many Viper owners and by Dodge from the factory for all ACR Vipers?

Just call JonB (he's actually a VERY helpful smart aleck--unlike me---the bad kind of smart aleck) or go to his site at www.partsrack.com

 

[REDSLED]

It's easy as this....
1. Go to the store
2. Put each product in a different hand
3. Whoever has the best packaging, buy it!
You'll always find a zillion opinions on every product mentioned on this board, when the only one that TRULY counts is yours.
Congratulations on an incredible and wise purchase! Upgrading your viper and making it faster is one of the best things about Viper ownership. It never ends. There's always something else!
-Jonathan

 

[Ron]

<FONT face="Comic Sans MS">For what it's worth, my K&N HP variance was done during the same set of dyno pulls, at that same engine temp and with no other modifications. There was a series of 4 pulls and the three with no changes had a variance of +/- 2 HP then the K&N pull having a variance of approx. +10, bringing the peak RWHP to 435. (with K&N's, smooth tubes, rear muffler delete).

Perhaps the OEM filter was exceptionally dirty (about 1,200 miles on it versus the K&N with 8,000 miles), perhaps there was some other variance, but for me it's clear, the OEM filters are restrictive. Because I unscientifically believe that conventional pleated paper filter (foamless) flow almost as good "NEW" as the K&N's and because I unscientifically believe that paper will filter out smaller particles, I'd like to find a Viper specific paper filter.

Just my opinion..... </FONT f>

 

[GTS Bruce]

Here's a simple test I have done.Blow on a stock filter with your hand behind it and feel nothing.Blow on a K&N and feel your breath coming through.Which do you think your engine will **** better through?A little more dirt?Probably.Doesn't matter though at the low mileage that we put on them and the pristine conditions that most of us drive our cars in.Yes after hesitation I will post this no matter the **** and blow comments since I am confident and comfortable with my own hetro inclinations.Let the comments begin. Bruce

 

[Matt M PA]

I contacted K&N awhile back when this came up on the board before. Clean or dirty, K&N filters flow much better than a paper filter. Period. This is evidenced by Chrysler getting 10 more horsepower in an ACR when the difference is the filters and straight tubes. You will also hear it when driving the car. Also, a K&N filters out smaller particles than does a paper filter. I agree that many aftermarket items make claims that cannot be substantiated, but K&Ns filter better and flow better than a paper filter. Maintainence is no big deal, either. they only need to be cleaned on an infrequent basis.

 

[Gerald]

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Dr E:
I've noticed that almost everyone here replaces their stock filters with K&N's. While I don't doubt that K&N's flow better, my experience has been that FRAM filters flow just as well, if not better, when clean. Anyone care to refute that? Assume that I don't care that I'd have to replace the FRAM's every so often (I'd prefer that than have to clean the filter every time . . . )
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

There's only one way to back that up. Dyno your car with your FRAMS then dyno it with K & N's. Post your results here when done.


Gerald

 

[GTS-R 001]

What is the issue? You guys all drive $60K -$80K cars, you all have spent from $10K to $40K on mods. If you don't like cleaning your K&N's, throw them away and buy new ones. These filters are the cheapest $ per HP mod you can buy.
Also factor in your yearly salary, if your making a few 100K a year you'll save money by buying new ones anyway instead of spending hours cleaning, or look at it as a hobby clean em and be happy.

 

[Neil - UK]

also noticed a slight change with the K&N's in engine note, the car also seem to rev to red faster although the euro air restritor did come out at the same time

 

[Joel]

The KN demonstrator unit I have in the shop compares airflow through KN with same size new paper element. KN causes less flow restriction, not a big difference, but every little counts

 

[AJ]

frams are known to flow actually the same or even a tad better than k&n.. i have a few dyno slips with doubtful results that point to that

ofcourse you have to clean and reoil the k&ns and they do become worse with time so my comparisons were done with brand new k&n and fram.

i myself would not have the same air filter in the car for 50k miles- cleaned and reoiled or not.

just my experience

alex
02 gts
few other cars

 

[LETHAL GTS]

I have been using K&N air filters for over 18 years. Currently I have them on all of my personal vehicles (soon to be on my fleet of 15 pickups). It increases my mileage by approx 10% on my 4x4 Chev. It made a difference on my Viper as far as acceleration. I find I notice a difference at mid through high RPM's.
Paper filters do the job fine, but the key to the K&N is that it uses more porous material (cotton) together with FILTER OIL. Filter oil is sticky as well as being oiled traps the fine particles instead of using finer openings in your filter media such as a paper filter does. The reason K&N suggest running the filter a little on the dirty side is because it creates finer openings in the filter media (finer openings, better cleaning, more restriction, less air flow).
Bottomline, keep K&N clean, don't drive in dusty conditions, filter stays clean, allows more air flow, more power!
K&N's pay for themselves in fuel savings alone. I prove it every time I fill up.
Now as far as fuel savings on a Viper? Who knows, I don't keep track, I just fill it up when it's time.
TJ

 

[Skip White]

Has anyone ever noticed what type of air filter is used on a moto cross bike? Its oil wetted foam not paper, nor cotton. I'm talking even in an all out racing event. The bikes hold up amazingly well for such an unbeivable amount of non stop dust. Let that be test enough. I asked a bike expert how long a moto cross bike would run with no filter at all, and he said about one race in dusty conditions and the rings would be gone. Yet they run most of the season before they need a top end done on them and dirt is not responsable for much of the problem. Think about that and you might not fear oil wetted filtration so much.

 

[Skip White]

One more thing, Wich oil wetted filter do you think would be easier to clean, the foam ellement or the gauss whith mesh screen? You can kneed the foam much easier than the K&N. You will get more dirt out of the foam than the mesh encased cotton.

 

[Skip White]

There might be a core of truth to the last reply. My dad is runing them in a 96 GTS with the BTR 200 shot of nitrous. I dont think this has ever happened.I will check his out. The Ams. filter is reinforced to prevent that. I certinaly have never heard of this hapening on any other car. By the way Ams.air filters are about half the cost of K&N. They say run them for about 10,000 miles and clean them. Since no one runs a Viper to many miles how about just replacing the with brand new ones at 5,000 or so miles. That way the integrity and performance of the filter are not affected by the cleaning proccess. I will say this much, Washable filters are not just a spap to clean and reoil, especially the K&N. I wonder if anyone ever gets them really clean. Ams. filter cost about $25.00 each.

 

[slaughterj]

On the K&N site, which I have posted about repeatedly on this site, they provide the following performance hints under the filter cleaning instructions section:

12. PERFORMANCE HINTS
1) Service every 50,000 -100,000 miles on street driven applications.
2) Service often in off-road or heavy dust conditions or when air filter reaches 18" of restrictions.
3) Let the dirt "build-up" work for you; it will not hurt the performance and actually help filter the air.

The link is at: http://www.knfilter.com/clningins.htm

Alternatively in their FAQ section, they say:

"20. How do I know when to clean the filter?

The general rule of thumb is that the filter needs to be cleaned when the dirt build up gets as thick as the wire mesh. The usual interval is 30,000 - 50,000 miles depending on driving conditions. We recommend that you check your filter about once a year in normal usage."


What I can't understand is, that if they say 50-100k (or 30-50k) before cleaning, why no one here ever seems to understand that

This is truly infrequent, basically never for some of you people!

 

[LETHAL GTS]

I don't know about others, I can only speak for myself, but I don't drive my Viper in dusty conditions. Occasionally I drive through a puff of dust, but that's about the extent of it.
Foam filter are designed for much dustier conditions such as moto-x.
I've been driving my RT/10 for 3 years with K&N's and about the only service I've had to perform is removing a few dragonflys and gr****oppers.
Now my 4x4, that's another story.
TJ