Let's have a little contest!

[big-n-italian]

Re: Let\'s have a little contest!

joe, let me say that you have done an awesome job! most importantly, i really appreciate you putting up with me over the last few months. the project did take longer than i had hoped, but you were gracious enough to work with me on the final bill because of it and it is greatly appreciated. i KNOW you had alot more time in the project than what i was billed. i can not thank you enough. i hope to see you again in 2007 with other projects.

the car is a MONSTER. the sound is unreal. i just left jdocs house, and he can tell you that the car sounds like a jet fighter taking off a tarmac. you can hear this vortech COMING! the tune is perect. if the motor gets on the warm side, i can put the car in 6th gear as early as 55 mph without any problems. the car is as smooth as glass and the power is downright SCARY. you guys with HP over 800 are INSANE!

Joes final numbers: 726 HP, 746 TQ.

did i want more? sure. but as joe said, everything is stock, and he feels that this is a safe and reasonable tune. (for now).

i agree.

let me do the math either tonight or tomorrow and announce a winner, and tell them what they have won!

i will post pics in a few days after my baby gets a bath. she is very dirty. anyone see where the girl in the snoopy shirt went?

 

[jdoc7]

Re: Let\'s have a little contest!

John, it was great seeing your Viper for the FIRST time! The blower was definitely louder than my Roe. Caught my attention from a few blocks away! I'm glad it's back in your garage and hopefully we can get the hood on and meet up for a drive on Thursday. Looks like the potential winner was only off by 1 HP/1 TQ

 

[big-n-italian]

Re: Let\'s have a little contest!

before i forget, i would also like to thank everyone here for all your emails over the last few months concerning this project, esp AB and Joe Dell. you two guys are great and i owe you big time!

i would also like to thank everyone for their interest in the contest. this has been alot of fun!

i have a few more questions and a couple of other items to take care of, probably over the winter.

2007 IS GOING TO BE A BLAST!

the most important thing i learned was that you need a REAL VIPER TUNER for a project like this. you guys were right, originally my car was with the wrong person. joe took care of quite a number of things that were done by our "local guy". (i wont call him a VIPER tuner). and, i have a couple of other items that need taken care of still.

the first guy:
1. put a fan on my car without a shroud or even mentioned a shroud was needed. my car is currently running warmer than i would like and joe and i think that this is part of the problem. we are also questioning the capacity of the fan itself. i need to find out.
2. never noticed the wrong plugs in the car. were the plugs even pulled? who knows. joe said that in a SC car, the tips on the plugs i had in there could have broken off! SC cars and NA cars ARE NOT THE SAME ANIMALS!
3. had my A/F a mess as many of you saw. he told me my A/F was fine up to 4000 RPM and the car was driveable. it wasnt. i drove it about 10 minutes one day and it would buck bad at low RPM. i shut it down till joe took it. my car is as smooth as glass now at any speed, and can be driven in 6th gear as low as 55 MPH. UNBELIEVEABLE.
4. wasted my money making parts that didnt work. for instance, he made an elevated throttle bracket stand thingy (?) that in the end would not have even cleared the stinkin hood. paolo spotted that problem and sent the needed part. FOR FREE! THANKS AGAIN PAOLO!
5. damaged my car. i found a good size chip of paint missing one day on sills i just had painted. he offered to repaint the sill, but never found out how it happened. it was my conclusion that the "problem" still existed therefore, and i got the car otta there. that was the last straw.
6. was very sloppy. wires hanging all over the place and not tucked into looms for instance. looked TERRIBLE, esp on a VIPER! joe also did jdocs car, and EVERYTHING is NEAT AND ORDERLY including the wiring.
7. installed sensors in undesireable VIPER locations.

joe and i could go on.

LEARN FROM ME - MAKE NOTE:

***** these cars are too SPECIALTY to let any "general knowledge mechanic" work on them. YOU NEED TO FIND A VIPER SPECIALIST *****

and you need to be patient.

 

[big-n-italian]

Re: Let\'s have a little contest!

John, it was great seeing your Viper for the FIRST time! The blower was definitely louder than my Roe. Caught my attention from a few blocks away! I'm glad it's back in your garage and hopefully we can get the hood on and meet up for a drive on Thursday. Looks like the potential winner was only off by 1 HP/1 TQ

i havent looked yet, do you see a winner jeff?

 

[NHL2133]

Re: Let\'s have a little contest!

He's out there, and he drives a black Viper...
You don't need to do much math since he's only off by +1HP/-1TQ!

 

[big-n-italian]

Re: Let\'s have a little contest!

He's out there, and he drives a black Viper...
You don't need to do much math since he's only off by +1HP/-1TQ!

it looks like our winner is our soldier boy jim!

CONGRATS JIM!!

where did he go BTW? i missed him when he was in town.

 

[Joseph Dell]

Re: Let\'s have a little contest!

John -

Congrats! you are going to have your hands full for a while... Enjoy it! and just in time for the slightly cooler weather...

Keep us posted on that beast!

JD

 

[big-n-italian]

Re: Let\'s have a little contest!

if anyone wanted to see the dyno sheet, here it is.

 

[JUCD VPR]

Re: Let\'s have a little contest!

He's out there, and he drives a black Viper...
You don't need to do much math since he's only off by +1HP/-1TQ!

it looks like our winner is our soldier boy jim!

CONGRATS JIM!!

where did he go BTW? i missed him when he was in town.

WAHOO I WON!!!
Sorry i've been in transit back to New Zealand and right now i'm in the middle of being pulled out of New Zealand and sent to a crappy country to become the Assistant Detachment Commander!
Sorry about not meeting up, we had a bit of bad weather over the last weekend!

 

[VENOMAHOLIC]

Re: Let\'s have a little contest!

Darn, John, I was only over by 14 hp and 4 lbft. Ask yout tuner for that little extra tweak so I can win. I am seriously glad you are up and running again.

 

[big-n-italian]

Re: Let\'s have a little contest!

He's out there, and he drives a black Viper...
You don't need to do much math since he's only off by +1HP/-1TQ!

it looks like our winner is our soldier boy jim!

CONGRATS JIM!!

where did he go BTW? i missed him when he was in town.

WAHOO I WON!!!
Sorry i've been in transit back to New Zealand and right now i'm in the middle of being pulled out of New Zealand and sent to a crappy country to become the Assistant Detachment Commander!
Sorry about not meeting up, we had a bit of bad weather over the last weekend!

BTW where am i sending your prize jim? US or New Zealand?

 

[V10SpeedLuvr]

Re: Let\'s have a little contest!

I demand a recount. Does this smell like the FL election to anyone else? (just kidding!) Congrats Jim!

 

[cbarber]

Re: Let\'s have a little contest!

WOW ! Can't wait to see it John.
CB

 

[JUCD VPR]

Re: Let\'s have a little contest!

You can just send it to my home address and my parents can send it to me. I might be leaving New Zealand soon?
Hey what did i win anyway?

 

[hemibeep]

Re: Let\'s have a little contest!

WHY would someone named CHAD, talk about a FL election and demand a recount.?

I'm not going to say another word.

 

[V10SpeedLuvr]

Re: Let\'s have a little contest!

WHY would someone named CHAD, talk about a FL election and demand a recount.?

I'm not going to say another word.

Admit it, you were one of the people who didn't know how to vote aren't you?

 

[hemibeep]

Re: Let\'s have a little contest!

I have been known to vote like I bowl, too much force.
But that tends to rip the card and not leave HANGING CHADS....
Trust me FL is really trying to avoid two things:
1. another Voter issue.
2. hurricanes

 

[JUCD VPR]

Re: Let\'s have a little contest!

BIG~ I am also going to need help changin my avatar!

 

[big-n-italian]

Re: Let\'s have a little contest!

i have decided with a heavy heart to bring forward an update concerning the condition and the mostly unknown ongoing saga of my car. i am doing this update only because at this point i simply have no idea what to do and i am looking for help. i have never been put in this situation before, and quite frankly i am questioning myself now for feeling that my situation *****. if this situation is the norm and i am wrong, then LMK. but i am looking for advice on how to proceed and finally get my car fixed and running so i can enjoy the damn thing.

in the beginning of 2006, i took my car to a local tuner to install my one-off SVS-built supercharger system, and install a new water pump. the local guy turned out to be a complete disaster. besides the fact that the guy was lazy and simply did not know vipers, my car was damaged. something was obviously dropped on my freshly-painted drivers side sidesill, and whatever it was, it took out a nice chunk of paint. needless to say, i had enough of his BS, and got my car out of his shop. i quickly made an appt with Joe at PBJ, and joe picked up my car in mid july of 2006. two months later on Sept 20, i was told my car was done and it was ready for pickup.

i rented a car from my local airport, and drove (3) hours to the st louis airport to drop off the rental car. i dropped the car off, and took a cab to Joes shop. joe was nice and told me all about the car. he proceeded to tell me how much he worked with me on the price because it took so long. i was also told however, that the car was running hot for some reason. it ran hot on the dyno and ran hot during the street test. luckily it was a cool sept day, and he told me it should be just fine to drive the car home. i do however, need to get the car back to the shop because he was questioning the aftermarket fan installed by the first guy, and whether or not the fan needed a shroud, etc. so, i left, and luckily made the (3) hour trip unscathed. but the car lasted only about two days, and the blower belt broke. i called joe right away, and he told me that he would be able to get to my car in (2) months, and we made another appt for November.

well, during this time i decided to look into the problem of the car suddenly running hot. to my suprise, my car had no antifreeze, or very little. when the water pump was replaced at the first shop, the car was not refilled with antifreeze. the first guy didnt spot it, Joe didnt spot it. the car was practically empty. i filled the car, found no leaks, and the problem was better, but not solved because of a poor aftermarket fan and no shroud installed by the first guy. fixing that problem now.

i also looked into the belt-breaking problem. a simple straight edge test shows me that the pulleys are not lined up, and need to be shimmed in order to be lined up properly. instead of checking and solving this problem, joe fabricated a pulley that pushed the belt into place, which eventually tears the belt edge up and causes the belt to break.

so anyways, here we are. it is almost april. the car is STILL waiting to be fixed. joe has fabricated some kind of device that tightens the SC belt. he never told me how the device works, nor can i figure it out, so i am unable to fix the car myself. emails have gone unswered, as have phone call messages to the shop. the last time i talked to joe, he told me that he was coming to get my car after the last bad snow storm we had broke. he had a car to fix and return to chicago, and he would come by to pick my car up on the way back. that was more than a month ago. if he does ever get my car in the shop, it could be yet another two months - june? add two months for repairs - august/sept, and at best i have 30-60 days to enjoy the car this year with the SC unit on it. keep in mind that i may have driven my car (5) days now in (16) months!

or, maybe i am being blown off? i really have no idea at this point.

i do know however, that i have paid Joe alot of money. and like a contractor who has an incomplete or messed up job at my house, i feel Joe should fix the job in a timely fashion, or, issue me a partial refund, voluntarily or otherwise. and if that contractor didnt come back to fix the job after almost (7) months now, (Sept to April), i feel i have the right to be upset. no?

so what should i do? what would you do? do i have reason to be upset? do i simply give up and move on, and find another person to help me with this? tell me your thoughts because right now i have none and am completely out of them. i am tired of thinking about it.

 

[KingSnake97]

Re: Let\'s have a little contest!

big-n-italian when you get in contact with him and when hes done with my car it's up to you but I have no problem taking your car down when I pick mine up. The only problem is I left my trailer at his shop it was faster for me to drive home back to Chicago, but if you two can agree for a rental trailer that i can leave in ST. louis after taking it down I have no problem. He will maybe be done with me a couple of weeks. let me know.


Turan

 

[dyeguy]

Re: Let\'s have a little contest!

You have every reason to be upset. It's not hard to believe that even a very qualified, reputable tuner could have a problem like this from time to time. What's hard to believe is that they feel it's OK to put you on the back burner after you have already paid them and the car doesn't work as promised. I had a similar situation with an 05 Mustang that I put a supercharger on. I got frustrated waiting for the original shop to do anything about it so I did take it somewhere else and had to pay to have it made right but it was worth it for me to have it fixed and stop getting blown off. Mustangs are a little easier to find qualified shops to work on though. Sounds like you really need to find a way to convince Joe that your car should be his top priority right now. I appreciate the way you are going about it not saying anything about it til now but sounds like you have tried contacting him to no avail and maybe airing it on the forum could help motivate Joe at this point to make things right. Sorry about your situation. We go through alot of crap to make our cars run the way we want them to don't we?

 

[JUCD VPR]

Re: Let\'s have a little contest!

Man your still having problems BIG? WT F?

I don't think Joe is blowing you off, i believe he is just super busy. heck i try to call him just to order some BFG drag radials and can't get ahold of him lol.

Anyway this problem needs to be fixed. I don't think Joe should refund you any money, but i do think he needs to fix it. I believe if parts are needed to fix it then you should be the one paying for them. It's not Joe's fault the car is overheating, buy a fan shroud and have him install it. Get some shimms and have them installed also IF thats what you think is needed to fix it. If that dosen't work then you need to pay him for whatever is needed to do to fix the car, obvisouly this isn't a regualr ol SC system otherwise there wouldn't be any of these problems. I think Joe has done a good job trying to get this beast fixed, he had it fixed for a while and now it's reverted back to it's old ways. This $hit happens when you modify cars, their are ALWAYS problems and it take time to work through them. Look at your POST at the top of this page about how GREAT the car was running and how good of a Job he did. Lets revert away from trying to tarnish anyones name. Joe is a great tuner and one of the BEST viper tuners out there and his work shows. He's not only a great tuner, hes equally a great guy!

If you have to then trailer your own car down there if he's to busy to come get it, just keep calling him and your bound to cath him or one of his employees.

Good Luck big, i hope you get this sorted out, yes you have a right to be pissed but i don;t think it's Joe's fault, i think it;s that damn SC'r

 

[treesnake]

Re: Let\'s have a little contest!

BNI
I think I remember when your car got to STL. It was described as needing a tune and a fuel issue. When it got there nothing worked at all. There were all kinds of "fabricated" parts. Please tell the WHOLE story behind your car. I stop by PBJ at least twice (or more) a week. There is always a "modified" car in there that "needs a few minor repairs". These cars are usually S/c or turbo cars that the installer has given up on and told the customer that there weren't any other options. AFTER THE INSTALLER MAKES THE BIG MONEY SELLING THE PARTS. Joe is then left tryng to figure out the original installers "idea" that obviously didn't work. He then tries to make something out of the mess.

I remember very well when your car came down. Joe was in the middle of working on my car. He stopped to fix a "few small problems" on your car. It was a major overhaul and took considerably longer due to amount of work needed just to get your car to start. Didn't he need to build a complete fuel system also? My car took over a year and I live here. I know Joe and his family personally and it still took this long. On the business side, I BOUGHT ALL MY PARTS FROM JOE Over $25,000.00 in parts alone and it took a year.

Joe will not let you down. Like I told you earlier in this thread, there were alot of people ahead of you when you brought your car down last time.

It is very simple, YOU WILL NEED TO WAIT YOUR TURN. Next time, it might help to be honest about what your car needs done.

 

[Sleekride]

Re: Let\'s have a little contest!

As a legitimate business/contractor and the importance of maintaining such a status in the eyes of present and future customers, a business/contractor who did not delay in accepting payment for services should therefore not delay in providing the service. Yes, I do understand that he already did provide an initial service. I believe that it now becomes more important for both the business and customer to make their experiences grow since that one customer can ultimately be responsible for an unknown amount of positive future business. In short, if he didn't hesitate to take your money he shouldn't hesitate to fix your car. ANY EXCUSE DUE TO SCHEDULE IS UNACCEPTABLE....... short of a life altering event. This is merely my opinion and everybody knows what opinions are like!

 

[big-n-italian]

Re: Let\'s have a little contest!

BNI
I think I remember when your car got to STL. It was described as needing a tune and a fuel issue. When it got there nothing worked at all. There were all kinds of "fabricated" parts. Please tell the WHOLE story behind your car. I stop by PBJ at least twice (or more) a week. There is always a "modified" car in there that "needs a few minor repairs". These cars are usually S/c or turbo cars that the installer has given up on and told the customer that there weren't any other options. AFTER THE INSTALLER MAKES THE BIG MONEY SELLING THE PARTS. Joe is then left tryng to figure out the original installers "idea" that obviously didn't work. He then tries to make something out of the mess.

I remember very well when your car came down. Joe was in the middle of working on my car. He stopped to fix a "few small problems" on your car. It was a major overhaul and took considerably longer due to amount of work needed just to get your car to start. Didn't he need to build a complete fuel system also? My car took over a year and I live here. I know Joe and his family personally and it still took this long. On the business side, I BOUGHT ALL MY PARTS FROM JOE Over $25,000.00 in parts alone and it took a year.

Joe will not let you down. Like I told you earlier in this thread, there were alot of people ahead of you when you brought your car down last time.

It is very simple, YOU WILL NEED TO WAIT YOUR TURN. Next time, it might help to be honest about what your car needs done.

well, i knew eventually someone would try and make me look like a bad guy.

first of all, i dont mind waiting my turn. i got used to it in the navy. but i was told i had a turn in November. and here it is now almost April. i can understand how problems can can up, but (6) months? there is something more here than "something came up". if i dont have a turn in November, then fine. but i dont want to hear i do, then get drug out with excuses over the next (6) months about why it didnt happen. maybe i am wrong, but i know that i cant run MY business like that.

furthermore, i know my setup is unique. however, how was i suppose to be honest with anyone concerning what my car needed when i knew nothing about the setup in the first place? if i had all the answers i certainly wouldnt have to take the car to anyone else now would i? sorry, but supercharged vipers are new to me.

maybe i am being unreasonable. i really dont know. what i do now, is how hard it is to buy a car like this, only to watch it sit.

 

[Da1cop]

Re: Let\'s have a little contest!

I can assure you that your car was taken to the right place! Not many tuners would take on this project in the first place. If this is a one off why didnt you have the designer do it(SVS). I bet I know why, they were probably twice as expensive. Joe has had some serious family medical issues. I know that this isnt your problem but this isnt the place to bad mouth him.

 

[big-n-italian]

Re: Let\'s have a little contest!

I can assure you that your car was taken to the right place! Not many tuners would take on this project in the first place. If this is a one off why didnt you have the designer do it(SVS). I bet I know why, they were probably twice as expensive. Joe has had some serious family medical issues. I know that this isnt your problem but this isnt the place to bad mouth him.

i can not find anywhere where i bad mouthed Joe, and as i mentioned before, this IS NOT my intent. i am merely telling my side of the story and looking for advice and answers. if there were medical issues, then there is one answer that nobody seems to know about but yourself. it always boils down to communication doesnt it?

 

[PBJ]

Re: Let\'s have a little contest!

John,
I just got a text about this. Here is a little info for you...over the last 5-6 months my father had a stroke which put him into a condition where he doesn't even know who I am, my mother in law was put into hospice and passed away, and my son has been off and on sick with a breathing disorder that my doctor can't figure out. I also had 2 close friends pass away...all of this added together has made my marrige and home life a complete disaster. I have had to shut the shop down seval times to take care of all of this of this time frame. I am a one man show, I don't have any other employees. My front guy went back to school and I let my other employee go for poor work quality. So, it is just me who answers the phone, orders the parts, works on the cars, bills out tickets, delivers cars all over the united states....nobody else, just me. I am really sorry that I haven't got back to you fast enough. I am working 12-14 hour days seven days a week trying to catch up. I am doing the best I can do....I am sorry but my family comes before anything else and recently that has been the case. I understand you are upset, I don't think I screwed you on the work that I did for you already....I took somebody elses kit that didn't work the minute it was put on and made a whole lot of pieces to try to make it work. I didn't have any problem with you making payments to me when you didn't have enough money to pay the bill, how about a little understanding while I am going through some tough family times. I have every intention on repairing and resolving your issues, I even told you I would pick it up when I delivered a car close to you in Chicago, well it isn't finished yet either....you are not the only one waiting. I am sorry again.
Joe

 

[big-n-italian]

Re: Let\'s have a little contest!

joe, you are correct for putting your family first and i really do still appreciate how much effort you put into my car last year. but like i said before, it always boils down to communication doesnt it? thank you.

 

[treesnake]

Re: Let\'s have a little contest!

" joe, let me say that you have done an awesome job! most importantly, i really appreciate you putting up with me over the last few months. the project did take longer than i had hoped, but you were gracious enough to work with me on the final bill because of it and it is greatly appreciated. i KNOW you had alot more time in the project than what i was billed. i can not thank you enough. i hope to see you again in 2007 with other projects.

the car is a MONSTER. the sound is unreal. i just left jdocs house, and he can tell you that the car sounds like a jet fighter taking off a tarmac. you can hear this vortech COMING! the tune is perect. if the motor gets on the warm side, i can put the car in 6th gear as early as 55 mph without any problems. the car is as smooth as glass and the power is downright SCARY. you guys with HP over 800 are INSANE!

Joes final numbers: 726 HP, 746 TQ.

did i want more? sure. but as joe said, everything is stock, and he feels that this is a safe and reasonable tune. (for now).

i agree.

let me do the math either tonight or tomorrow and announce a winner, and tell them what they have won!"



Take the date and signature away and these two posts sound like diferent cars and diferent situations. Don't think I would slam the guy that fixed the problem. (according to the above post)IMHO I would go after the guy that made the big money and sold you the parts and original install. Sorry this just bothers me a little because my car (and a lot of other cars) was delayed while yours was being worked on.

Not that it matters to you right now but I do sincerely hope you get you car going.