Lighter and quicker than the current outgoing ACR

[PDCjonny]

C'mon Peter it's only been a year since they were there...
Not seeing any real upside to a Ring run with a Gen 5 non ACR coupe.
Won't sell anymore cars to the Porsche/Lambo/Ferrari crowd as most of them don't know the Ring from a hole in the ground.
And if it should not beat the current ZR1 time for whatever reason....oh boy that would be a bad bad thing.

And also it would solidify the Gen 5 has the first Viper Generation slower than it's predecessor.
Bad thing #2.

 

[v10enomous]

Without Aero and down force the Gen V will do well to match the 2008 ACR time. SRT should focus on marketing the 1/4 mile and top speed advantages along with comfort and civility until they come out with an ACR version.

 

[SnakeBitten]

C'mon Peter it's only been a year since they were there...
Not seeing any real upside to a Ring run with a Gen 5 non ACR coupe.
Won't sell anymore cars to the Porsche/Lambo/Ferrari crowd as most of them don't know the Ring from a hole in the ground.
And if it should not beat the current ZR1 time for whatever reason....oh boy that would be a bad bad thing.

And also it would solidify the Gen 5 has the first Viper Generation slower than it's predecessor.
Bad thing #2.

Lol yeah it's not that long ago they were there but it was more a private effort than a full on factory effort. I see your point. If they cant even beat the ZR1 time that would be very bad. But if Ralph and SRT are as confident in the next Viper as they seem to be then they should not be afraid of it not beating the ZR1's time. To not run it is like saying they aren't confident the new Viper can beat the old ZR1. Or shrewd marketing I'll give you that especially if they know it doesn't have enough to take out the Vette much less the outgoing ACR.

Hmmm. How bout this then. When the ACR drops take along a coupe with track pack, the new ACR and the next ACR-X and get a time for all models.

 

[bluestreak]

If (And only if) the Gen V is on Cups I think it can eek out a faster lap at a track or two if conditions are right. However on average I expect the ACR to handily beat it. As fast as the outgoing ZR-1 would be a huge step up from the Gen IV (non-ACR). And frankly anything slower than the fastest base Z06 (Z07) would be disappointing, and that is one FAST car. But it better have some sticky tires on it or you can forget about it. I don't think corsas will cut it.

With the expanded market though, I doubt SRT is as focused with the speed as they are the refinement, so these lap times may not be top priority for the base model but they cannot be ignored. Simple goal is to beat the Z06/ZR-1. Then the Gen V ACR can return with world **********.

 

[slitherv10]

with an est 3 second 0-62 miles/h It looks like it will eat up the quarter mile in est, 10.9-11.1 ...that will leave the 08-10 ACR's looking at the tail lights. As far as the track is concerned,,,,yes,..if its a winding road....aero will come to play,but,not in the straights and...how about an oval track? I wouldnt count your chickens till their hatched. As far as a GEN V ACR...neither of those cars or any other for that matter (if dodge is listening to all the broo hahah going on in the car blogs) will even come close.

Just my Opinion

 

[v10enomous]

The Gen V will pick up some time with superior acceleration and braking and maybe even flatter cornering with the added rigidity and maybe even better aero than a non-acr gen4. Is it enough to match an ACR... Probably not...

 

[bluestreak]

The Gen V will pick up some time with superior acceleration and braking and maybe even flatter cornering with the added rigidity and maybe even better aero than a non-acr gen4. Is it enough to match an ACR... Probably not...

Hard to imagine the Gen V having better braking with far less aero. Aero has a huge affect on braking.

In fact it's the main reason cars with aero are faster. They can make up speed lost on the straight in the braking zone, and then corner faster.

 

[Mike Adams]

I wonder what a gen iv ACR with different gear ratio would do at nurberg. I could see 355 gear picking up some time. SRT picked 355 for a reason.

 

[Solid Red 98]

The zr1 ran nurb in 7:19 and the porsche gt2 rs ran it in 7:18. Both cars do not have crazy wings and don't produce a whole lot of down force, so it's not hard to believe that the new gen v, with the track pack, will be that far off the 7:12 time of the outgoing acr. I guess between 7:14 and 7:16

 

[Bobpantax]

Hi Solid Red. Here is a photo of the front of the ZR1 that did the run. Note the front splitter. The stock Gen V coupe does not have one.

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Also note the photo of the GT2 that made the ring run. See below. It has both splitter and wing.

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Here is another photo:

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[Solid Red 98]

Hello bobpantax. Yes, the gt2 has quite a large wing and a decent sized front splitter, but they are no where near the size of the acr's and definitely don't generate anywhere near the downforce of the acr. While the gen v doesn't have a rear wing or splitter exactly, the new fascia has a substantially larger front lip than any previous, non-acr viper and the rear spoiler, as in previous vipers, generates downforce as well. I'd argue that the gen v produces very similar amounts of downforce to the zr1. Gilles and other engineers on the gen v have explained that aerodynamics and downforce were more of a focus in its design. So in short, I doubt a corvette zr1 has any aerodynamic advantage over the gen v. But that's just an educated guess. Time will tell.

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[SSGNRDZ_28]

I believe ZR1 actually produces a net lift at speed; third party test results showing this can be found here:

http://forums.corvetteforum.com/c6-z06-discussion/2822030-airflow-downforce-on-stock-z06-2.html

So the Gen IV and V actually produce more downforce than the existing ZR1.

One thing the ZR1 has is the MRC dampers which cannot be discounted as a major handling advantage.

 

[bcmarly]

While comparing the Gen V to the current ZR1 you have to keep in ming that the ZR1 has a very long fifth gear and sixth gear is strictly an overdrive gear. So although the ZR1 posted a 7:19 around the Nurburgring, it never got above 183 mph on the back straight away (6:30 mark on). http://www.autoblog.com/2011/06/09/2012-corvette-zr1-shaves-six-seconds-off-its-ring-time/ By contrast the Lamborghini Avetador hit 204 mph in the same section of the race track; it has a true fifth, sixth and seventh gear. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iPsz8HjGLd0 The Gen V will also have true fifth and sixth gears and should easily best the ZR1 on the back straight away. All three cars have power to weight ratios of 5.3-5.4.

 

[v10enomous]

...and all 3 cars have different placement of the drive train components so it should be every interesting.

While comparing the Gen V to the current ZR1 you have to keep in ming that the ZR1 has a very long fifth gear and sixth gear is strictly an overdrive gear. So although the ZR1 posted a 7:19 around the Nurburgring, it never got above 183 mph on the back straight away (6:30 mark on). http://www.autoblog.com/2011/06/09/2012-corvette-zr1-shaves-six-seconds-off-its-ring-time/ By contrast the Lamborghini Avetador hit 204 mph in the same section of the race track; it has a true fifth, sixth and seventh gear. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iPsz8HjGLd0 The Gen V will also have true fifth and sixth gears and should easily best the ZR1 on the back straight away. All three cars have power to weight ratios of 5.3-5.4.

 

[ViperSmith]

I'd hope that the "Easter Egg" track outlines hidden throughout the interior is a hint that it is going to run over records. Seems like a gutsy statement to mold into your vehicle if it can't.

But, I guess, time shall tell.

 

[SnakeBitten]

I'd hope that the "Easter Egg" track outlines hidden throughout the interior is a hint that it is going to run over records. Seems like a gutsy statement to mold into your vehicle if it can't.

But, I guess, time shall tell.

This is exactly how I feel. All the hype with the track outlines etc it better be able walk the walk. Prove it with a factory Ring run. If they are afraid of not beating the ZR1 then they don't have confidence in their own product. Btw the ZR1 is not on the same level as the gen iv ACR. Various Track times prove this. So it shouldn't have to take a Gen V ACR to beat a ZR1. The Gen 5 GTS with track pack Better be able to or what's the point? Just my humble opinion.

 

[BigDawg]

Don't forget the ACR was an off the shelf car with no forced induction, making it MUCH harder to cheat. The ZR1 and GT2 and GTR can all easily be tweaked to give them an advantage.

 

[shooter_t1]

Don't forget the ACR was an off the shelf car with no forced induction, making it MUCH harder to cheat. The ZR1 and GT2 and GTR can all easily be tweaked to give them an advantage.

Best to leave the "who cheated" talk and accusations to Porsche and Nissan. Much wiser course for all.

 

[VIPER GTSR 91]

The gen V will be quicker than the current ACR stock for stock at least in a straight line but its all about the driver for the best road course times between the two cars.......

 

[SnakeBitten]

Looks like their is a new player in the Nurburgring lap times list. The Porsche 918 Proto just did a 7:14 same as the LF-A. The article I read seemed to discount the ACR because it used track compounds instead of street tires like the LF-A etc...I always thought Cups were street tires lol...I know what they mean but they never hit the Porsche GT2 or the Vette for using the same tires. They always seem to use it against the ACR though...

It would be nice to see the time an SRT Viper could run in all configurations.....Time and money says that probably wont happen though. Whenever the next ACR bows its monstrous head Im sure there will be a few cars that it will have to dethrone. Seems like the mfg Ring times are heating up. The major sportscar mfg's are taking to the track for the record more often now.

 

[v10enomous]

But they don't discount the Porsche for being a prototype

Looks like their is a new player in the Nurburgring lap times list. The Porsche 918 Proto just did a 7:14 same as the LF-A. The article I read seemed to discount the ACR because it used track compounds instead of street tires like the LF-A etc...I always thought Cups were street tires lol...I know what they mean but they never hit the Porsche GT2 or the Vette for using the same tires. They always seem to use it against the ACR though...

It would be nice to see the time an SRT Viper could run in all configurations.....Time and money says that probably wont happen though. Whenever the next ACR bows its monstrous head Im sure there will be a few cars that it will have to dethrone. Seems like the mfg Ring times are heating up. The major sportscar mfg's are taking to the track for the record more often now.

 

[Stealth]

Porsche 918 is $800k-$1mil isn't it?

I think earlier ZR1s had regularly spaced 5th and 6th gears. In any event, there is a new C7 ZR1 on way.

Does Gen IV (which I own) have downforce at speed or just reduced lift?

The winning combination on the Ring (assuming proper power and weight and excellent suspension) would likely be great gearing, some downforce, but not so much that top speed is unduly restricted. AWD is another factor.

I am all for integrated aero (like most Ferraris) which supplies appropriate downforce, etc. without big wings and splitters which are not ideal for the road. I chose my Gen IV Coupe because at the time I was not crazy about having a big wing and splitter for the 99.98% of driving my car sees.

Finally, each road course is different. Downforce useful on a local HPDE that is 2 miles long, may be different than downforce which is useful for the Ring which is much longer than 2 miles and has longer straights. Some cars now use "active aero."

 

[bluestreak]

Looks like their is a new player in the Nurburgring lap times list. The Porsche 918 Proto just did a 7:14 same as the LF-A. The article I read seemed to discount the ACR because it used track compounds instead of street tires like the LF-A etc...I always thought Cups were street tires lol...I know what they mean but they never hit the Porsche GT2 or the Vette for using the same tires. They always seem to use it against the ACR though...

It would be nice to see the time an SRT Viper could run in all configurations.....Time and money says that probably wont happen though. Whenever the next ACR bows its monstrous head Im sure there will be a few cars that it will have to dethrone. Seems like the mfg Ring times are heating up. The major sportscar mfg's are taking to the track for the record more often now.

That's nonsense, in today's world, pretty much anything going fast has R-compound in the tire somewhere. The ZR-1's tires are called PS2's but they are sticky as heck, a hybrid tire. Same for the GT-R, which have been tested back to back with R888's and run as fast or faster than the Toyo's. The Porsches all run a Porsche specific MPSC, and the Corvette Z07 ran MPSC too. There is nothing to discount about the tires on the ACR, anyone who does so is clueless.


I will add that I think there is 0 chance the Gen V is faster on the ring. It doesn't need to be. The ACR has a big gap on the competition, there is no need for SRT to set the bar too high with the track pack when they can milk it like everyone else does and make some money. Even slightly slower puts the non ACR Gen V ahead of all of it's real competition ( GT2, ZR-1, Z07, GT-R, 458). The LFA was a nurburgring package at a cool 445k with wings and such on it and didn't even beat the Gen IV ACR (granted it wasn't on R-compound rubber like the rest, so it will be a force if they decide to add some).

Don't be surprised if it's significantly slower than the ACR.

 

[Bobpantax]

I wonder what the total population of Viper owners is who use their cars on a road course. Many of the ACRs seem to be owned for show and not go. Is anyone aware of any stats?

 

[steve911]

Because of a negative perception by many that tracked car is a beat up car, I don't know if everyone that has tracked their car would admit it...

 

[ACRucrazy]

As far as gen 5 ACR goes, I'd like to see MCS come equipped from factory. Much superior than KW and it often gets swapped out. I'd think active aero is in the future. The Dart and RAM already have it. Quaife should be included and of course, wheels/tires/brakes. CF interior bits would be nice, light weight cf seats and dash pieces instead of expensive leather and ******** again as an option please. Also I'd like to see a rear wing that doesn't hold water like the Gen IV...

 

[Paul Hawker]

Bet when the Gen V ACR is released, all these discussions will be mute.

Those that think the Gen V with street Pirelli's and no aero, will be faster on road racing tracks than a Gen IV with wings and Michelin Cups will need to prove it first before making forum claims.

 

[kdaviper]

How about some actual information on performance:
According to a recent Top Gear interview with Ralph, the Gen V is 4 mph faster in the slalom tests... It's not much, but it is a number... and there's not a lot of those floating around when it comes to performance.
http://www.topgear.com/uk/car-news/new-srt-viper-ride-ralph-gilles-2012-9-18

 

[SnakeBitten]

How about some actual information on performance:
According to a recent Top Gear interview with Ralph, the Gen V is 4 mph faster in the slalom tests... It's not much, but it is a number... and there's not a lot of those floating around when it comes to performance.
http://www.topgear.com/uk/car-news/new-srt-viper-ride-ralph-gilles-2012-9-18

Thanks for the link. Nice read. Its 4 mph faster than the Gen IV regular coupe and not the ACR I'm assuming. And Im sure its with the regular tires. Imagine the Gen 5 ACR with the softer rubber then. Cant wait for the numbers.

 

[shooter_t1]

Bet when the Gen V ACR is released, all these discussions will be mute.

Those that think the Gen V with street Pirelli's and no aero, will be faster on road racing tracks than a Gen IV with wings and Michelin Cups will need to prove it first before making forum claims.

^^^This^^^