Mopar oil filter don't fit

[nutkees]

Just bought myself a new oilfilter @ the dealer.

Its a Mopar filter, but during installation came to find out it won't fit, see pictures. Is it because its the wrong filter or is there something strange with my car, recall perhaps?

My old filter AC Delco fitted just fine, but is also a little shorter in lenght.

Whats your opinion?

Pics

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[mjorgensen Woodhouse]

That is the right filter, recall could be wrong, we would need to see a broader shot of it.

 

[Steve-Indy]

Well, I see it's a 1999 GTS from your old posts...frame been damaged ?

Define Mopar filter by part number, please. If yours was the old, black filter ( I THINK that the part number was 05281090 )...I have discarded
all of them so I can't compare that one to the two mentioned below.

For what it is worth, I just put a new-in-the-box 05037836AA next to a new-in-the-box 05037836AB filter...and they appear to be exactly the same height and diameter.

Fortunately, we have a filter expert here who may jump in with better info while I keep looking for other filters..like the Mobil M-204 that I have used on our Gen I, II, III Vipers for years.

Afterthought: Are you SURE that ALL of the old gasket was removed before you installed the new filter??


Our 1999 ACR used the 05037836AA without problems...though I have not tried the new updated 05037836AB as yet.

 

[2000_Black_RT10]

First thought being the condition of the motor mounts or different?

 

[Mad Max]

I just installed the 05037836AB filter on my 98 GTS this past weekend and had no issues. It had the stock motor mounts then. I just finished installing the 2 front Woodhouse mounts and will install the Woodhouse trans mount tomorrow after work. Can you send a couple of more pictures maybe from a differnt angle?

Brent

 

[Viper Parts of America]

It appears that car has not had the 999 recall performed as the original frame crossmember gussets are still in place at the frame rails (house-shaped bracket at lower left). Instead there should be a reinforcement plate riveted on the left side of the picture. This is a picture I shot a while back of the recall plate mounted corrected on the left:

You can also see that there appears to be a slightly larger opening for the filter than what is shown in the original post. While it seems unlikely that the diagonal brace was moved or re-welded, the angle of the photo does make it look shorter in the original photo with less space to move the filter. Note the position of the bolt by the filter in both photos. If there was no frame work done then it would seem that motor mounts could be a contributing factor.

 

[flatblack]

First thought being the condition of the motor mounts or different?

^This is what Im thinking as well. Over the weekend I installed a new Mopar filter from the local auto parts store, and it went in with no problem. I dont have the part # or anything right now but I could try to get it some time tomorrow for you, if it'll help. But again, it went in no problem and wasn't sitting anywhere close to the crossmember as appears in your pic.

 

[Camfab]

Well first off, you can see in the picture that the oil pan is off the car. It looks like the oil filter is sitting on the frame. There certainly more going on here than is being revealed. Looks like the frame has seen some Dukes of Hazzard jumps........

 

[nutkees]

Thanks for the replies,

In seeing the picture of Viper parts, its seems that my oil filter is further forwards. My filter can't rotate because it hits the front crossmember. Thats strange right? Note that my filter is still a few centimeters from complete mounted.

I just shot another picture, maybe that will reveal more info? Looking at my headers, the engine can't go much further backwards, maybe a little higher, suggesting that it could be the motormounts? How can I tell.

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[nutkees]

O, I only took the oilpan of for inspection an cleaning.

I also noticed a bend airconditioning line, What the hell happend to it?

 

[Fatboy 18]

That AC Hard line is bent! You should get yourself a replacement one.

There seem to be a lot of scrapes under that frame cross member too?

The 999 Recall has not been done on that frame either!
http://www.viperclub.org/howto/service-bulletins/pdf/RC_99902.pdf

Your Motor Mounts look stock. Stock mounts have a metal plate top and bottom with a tab on the side of them. The only thing I could think of is to loosen the motor mount nuts AND transmission mount and raise the engine slightly to get the filter out.
But something is wrong! Has the car ever been in an accident?

You could try raising the engine a few Millimeters slightly to see if there's a split in the engine mounts before loosening them

 

[Steve-Indy]

Looks like many suspect some form of frame damage and/or motor mount prpblems.

As posted above, I asked an oil filter industry expert to comment on tthe filters themselves and received his reply:

"No measurable difference exists between the 836AA and 836AB filters on height
and diameter. The Mopar 05281090 "Black Filter" measures just a few thousandths
different in height, this is likely just the normal stack up of manufacturing
tolerances.

Could it be the threaded stud has backed out of the
mounting base? I don't know if that model Viper has the stud peened in place,
or could have a wrench hex on the stud.

From the filter info supplied it
is doubtful this is due to slight differences in filter tolerances."

 

[nutkees]

@fatboy

The car hasn't been in an accident, and the scrapes are there because I did a sort of Gumball Run in 2011 and the roads in France, Belgium and Spain aren't very smooth so to say ;-)

I also drove my car off the racetrack end of last year and the gravel is not good either!

Still lost on why the filter don't fit.

I also am replacing that bent airco line, any idea how to get it out of there? Its really tight and I can't get it out from underneath the car.

 

[nutkees]

Well first off, you can see in the picture that the oil pan is off the car. It looks like the oil filter is sitting on the frame. There certainly more going on here than is being revealed. Looks like the frame has seen some Dukes of Hazzard jumps........

Note that the filter is only 1 turn on and then hits the framerail. I already took the old one off, but that one was shorter than the new one from Mopar. If I could place the filter it will sit a lot higher than in the picture.

 

[Voodoo Rob]

Check the engine mounts!

 

[Fatboy 18]

That's all I can think of too!

As for the oil in your engine,...........I guess that's what you call a Dry Sump

 

[Steve-Indy]

The "check the engine mounts" group are probably on the right track.

I will admit that out 1996 RT/10 (Gen I motor on Gen II suspension) has become a slight "pain in the asp' when changing the oil filter. On Gen I cars, one removes the oil filter, then passes it rearward until one can tease it out between the frame and the oil pan. After about 5 years of routine street driving (non-track) and about 8,000 miles, it became impossible to remove or install an oil filter in the above described fashion. NOW, I put that Viper on a 4 post list, then jack up the right front slightly to facilate filter removal and installation...passing the filter laterally through the suspension for removal. Motor mount has not collapsed but engine has changed its relationship...with the passanger side creeping UP a little narrowing the gap between the frane and oil pan slightly. I have seen tracked Gen II's where the right sided exhaust migrated over time to the very top of the sidesill requiring re-settling the enging in the mounts. Having helped change a couple of motor mounts, I'm stalling any necessary "fix" on our 1996...until forced into it !!

 

[Voodoo Rob]

Get the engine and trans poly mounts from Wood house and be done with it. Its not a big deal to do plus the drive line feels more planted, because it is, and you will notice shifts are easier and solid. Worth the time and money. Plus your oil filter will go on easier!

 

[nutkees]

Also seen a picture from some else his viper and it seems my engine is indeed mounted lower then his. Will order the mounts asap!

Is there also anyone who can advise me what to use to clean up the frame? Something like hammerite maybe. love the look of the viper in that other picture!

Is is still possible to get the recall done now, or do you need to pay for it after so many years?

 

[Steve-Indy]

IF you were here, you could get the 999 Recall done for free. A kit has to be ordered...and an EXPERIENCED Tech must do the work with the specified welder...taking care NOT to put the brackets in the wrong location (formerly mis-labeled as to right and left) which could block access to the oil filter.

I know that our UK brothers will chime in here with more useful information for your circumstance.

 

[Fatboy 18]

Any Updates? Did you try and raise the engine slightly?

 

[nutkees]

Any Updates? Did you try and raise the engine slightly?

Not Yet,

First try to get that **** ac line out of the way, without any luck!! grrrrr.


Then need to clean the oilpan and gaskets, mount them en then I can raise the engine slightly.

Any idea where I can get the Woodhouse mounts? The site of them don't list them anymore?

 

[Mad Max]

The Woodhouse mounts are now sold at this website: http://www.snakeoylproducts.com/home.php?cat=284 I couldn't find the either and I emailed Woodhouse and that is what they told me. I ordered them from that site and have them and have installed them. They are what everyone says they are. Big improvement worth doing.
Fairly easy to do.

Good luck!
Brent

 

[Big Al]

Your new filter might be one of those counterfeit parts that are flooding the market.

 

[LifeIsGood]

Your new filter might be one of those counterfeit parts that are flooding the market.

Would you elaborate on this please...what parts? Where are they being sold?