My Stock 06 Vert Does It Again With A New Best E.T. of 11.57 @ 122.41

[1BADGTS]

Some people can listen to reason and others cannot. I see exactly which side you are on. 'Nuff said

Dont take it like that my point is with ALL the runs EVER conducted by Vipers down drag strips one person Jamie Furman(in his supercharged Gen 2 ) has put a Viper making 550 hp to the tires in the 10s on Pilots thats it.No matter the track weather horsepower barometer ect.

 

[1BADGTS]

FWIW, Both E-Town and Atco (Both in NJ) prep their tracks very well, and yes, even on the Test 'n Tune nights when the 'slow cars' run.

In fact, Atco preps so well at times, that stock Vipers have snapped half-shafts and blown rear ends running on the stock RunFlats!

Very very true.All in all Atco may be faster than E-Town.

 

[vipeuup]

I wish you would get off your high freaking horse when you respond. It is very tiring. You want to give a teach that Evan is this that and the other. I don't give a rats ass. You avoided the meat of the response entirely. That is a moderate weather day at best, very few runs and with pre-conditions about how hard he could run it, and now stating that track conditions deteriorated drastically through the day and you calling it the best possible. Especially when you are telling someone who just showed a pretty good set of runs on a fast track at a much better density altitude and telling him he could not do it faster than Evan did it under the lmiting circumstances you previously described.

We have had some good posts back and forth but I do not pray to the god of Evan or anyone else. It is a freaking car. He is not the only human being who can drive a car to its potential.

And this is someone (Speedfreak) running these quick times in a gen3 Viper. I cant imagine if he owned a 08 Viper.

Joe aka 1BadGTS is just a troll.Not only does he kiss Evan Smith's pecker. He got owned in this thread. Not believing Norman's LPE built gen 2 Viper running 9's @ 145plus MPH. ALL MOTOR

http://forums.viperclub.org/rt-10-g...r-today-612-rwhp-619-rwtq-91-pump-gas-13.html

 

[1BADGTS]

And this is someone (Speedfreak) running these quick times in a gen3 Viper. I cant imagine if he owned a 08 Viper.

Joe aka 1BadGTS is just a troll.Not only does he kiss Evan Smith's pecker. He got owned in this thread. Not believing Norman's LPE built gen 2 Viper running 9's @ 145plus MPH. ALL MOTOR

http://forums.viperclub.org/rt-10-g...r-today-612-rwhp-619-rwtq-91-pump-gas-13.html

Hey computer racer. where you been (not at the track )Hiding like the teenerager BOY you are on the computer

 

[vipeuup]

Hey computer racer. where you been (not at the track )Hiding like the teenerager BOY you are on the computer

Go back to that thread troll. Bullet and a couple other guys asked you some questions. Yet you chickened out.

 

[1BADGTS]

Go back to that thread troll. Bullet and a couple other guys asked you some questions. Yet you chickened out.

Ill be back soon enough with a little something i will be more than happy to share with you

 

[vipeuup]

Ill be back soon enough with a little something i will be more than happy to share with you

yeah right.

 

[1BADGTS]

yeah right.

In time, until then iam sure with all your vast drag racing experiance and wins ect you will have something meaningful to add to THIS part thread.

 

[vipeuup]

In time, until then iam sure with all your vast drag racing experiance and wins ect you will have something meaningful to add to THIS part thread.

For you. Whenever it comes to the Z06. There are absolutley no exceptions. Which makes you a troll. Especially spewing your garbage on a Viper forum. In reality your dillusional, and a liar. Calling LPE's built Viper full of $hit.

 

[GR8_ASP]

BTW should your name indicator not say "previous Viper owner?"

 

[1BADGTS]

For you. Whenever it comes to the Z06. There are absolutley no exceptions. Which makes you a troll. Especially spewing your garbage on a Viper forum. In reality your dillusional, and a liar. Calling LPE's built Viper full of $hit.

Fool,i have NEVER OWNED a Z06 ,but have actually raced ,been involved i Mag tests with a few of them

 

[SnakeBitten]

So anyone that doesnt go along with the fantacy that Gen III Vipers are just as fast or just a "tad" slower than a C6 Z06's have no love for the Viper and are trolls Gotta love the reasoning ability and enthusiast spirit in here .

Lets breakdown the ignorance in here. Lots of you dont believe Furmans or Smiths runs in bonestock Z06's because they are waaay above what everyone else is getting out of there Z06's and you suspect they are modded. Yet here is Speedfreak kicking everyones numbers in a Gen III by faaaar yet it is roundly accepted and not questioned wether he is really stock or not as some of you continually do to the Z06 runs by the aforementioned. [BTW I completely believe Speedfreak as I always believed the gen III had more potential than the 12's most run just said this to show the toxic levels of bias some have towards the Z06]

Secondly Speedfreaks runs are incredible for a bonestock Gen III and represent the absolute best for the Gen III with a 11.5 @ 123mph. Lets be absolutely clear that 11.5 is close to average times from a "good" driver in a C6 Z06 and that 123mph is at least 2-3mph off the normal Z06 run with a "good" driver all things being equal. A great driver like Speedfreak/Furman et al in a Z06 would easily best the Gen III's 11.5 @ 123mph. Thats facts folks and not up for debate by any sane, unbiased, normally functioning human being with his/her mental faculties intact. Equal drivers the Z06 will romp. As noted though if a guy like Speedfreak is in a Gen III the Z06 driver better be on his game or will lose the 1/4 mile et wise. Suffer no delusions though about what would happen on a highway roll stock to stock.

Yes its Viperforums but we are supposed to be adults not children that cant reason or accept reality even if it doesnt jive with what some of you want to hear. Maybe there should be a Romper Room subforum for those that want to stick their head in the sandbox like an Ostrich and pretend the Gen III's are the Z06's accelerative equal. Roadcourse is anyones game between these two but straightline belongs to the Z06 by a fair margin.

 

[1BADGTS]

BTW should your name indicator not say "previous Viper owner?"

Sorry pal got an 09 on the way (it will be my fifth in 16 years of owning Viper ).Iam pleased to report as soon as it comes in (like the other 5) it will be run .As a matter of fact this June Mopar Nats at Englishtown(they may even use VHT on the track lol) i plan to have Jamie Furman running both his Z06 and my 09 that day so i can report the results.Out of curosity how many Viper have you owned the past 16 years?

 

[1BADGTS]

So anyone that doesnt go along with the fantacy that Gen III Vipers are just as fast or just a "tad" slower than a C6 Z06's have no love for the Viper and are trolls Gotta love the reasoning ability and enthusiast spirit in here .

Lets breakdown the ignorance in here. Lots of you dont believe Furmans or Smiths runs in bonestock Z06's because they are waaay above what everyone else is getting out of there Z06's and you suspect they are modded. Yet here is Speedfreak kicking everyones numbers in a Gen III by faaaar yet it is roundly accepted and not questioned wether he is really stock or not as some of you continually do to the Z06 runs by the aforementioned. [BTW I completely believe Speedfreak as I always believed the gen III had more potential than the 12's most run just said this to show the toxic levels of bias some have towards the Z06]

Secondly Speedfreaks runs are incredible for a bonestock Gen III and represent the absolute best for the Gen III with a 11.5 @ 123mph. Lets be absolutely clear that 11.5 is close to average times from a "good" driver in a C6 Z06 and that 123mph is at least 2-3mph off the normal Z06 run with a "good" driver all things being equal. A great driver like Speedfreak/Furman et al in a Z06 would easily best the Gen III's 11.5 @ 123mph. Thats facts folks and not up for debate by any sane, unbiased, normally functioning human being with his/her mental faculties intact. Equal drivers the Z06 will romp. As noted though if a guy like Speedfreak is in a Gen III the Z06 driver better be on his game or will lose the 1/4 mile et wise. Suffer no delusions though about what would happen on a highway roll stock to stock.

Yes its Viperforums but we are supposed to be adults not children that cant reason or accept reality even if it doesnt jive with what some of you want to hear. Maybe there should be a Romper Room subforum for those that want to stick their head in the sandbox like an Ostrich and pretend the Gen III's are the Z06's accelerative equal. Roadcourse is anyones game between these two but straightline belongs to the Z06 by a fair margin.

My thoughts exactly.At this point in time the best Z06s time (Furman )is 6 tenths faster than an 11.5(and that 11.5 was run at a sea level track so that BS excuse used on another thread is out the window here ) thats a fact.Speadfreak made a great run and fully drove the Gen 3 to its potential and that potential is over half a second slower than the fastest posted Z06 run to date.A half a second in a drag race is over 5 car lengths difference between the two.Now we are hearing well if he was in a Gen 4 he probably easily would run an 10.8, really .One guy in the history of Viper (Jamie Furman again )has put a Viper with only 550(exactly what a Gen 4 makes ) to the tire (car trapped at 131 )in the 10s on Pilots.One guy .Some years at at the Mopar Nats at E-Town 75-100 Viper owners would show up to race and not one ever came with a half second of Smith or Furman same car ,same power level.Thats another fact.These people sit at home and throw hypotheticals(which for the most part become nothing more than excuses) up on their computer screens (tracks at sea level ,air density ect )but NEVER appear at the track.

 

[SnakeBitten]

Sorry pal got an 09 on the way (it will be my fifth in 16 years of owning Viper ).Iam pleased to report as soon as it comes in (like the other 5) it will be run .As a matter of fact this June Mopar Nats at Englishtown(they may even use VHT on the track lol) i plan to have Jamie Furman running both his Z06 and my 09 that day so i can report the results.Out of curosity how many Viper have you owned the past 16 years?

You are a multiple Viper owner but yet you are labeled a troll . Puhleeese get this on video when you guys do it up. Would love to see Speedfreak take a few passes in one as well. Between Speed/Smith/Furman we could well have 3 10 sec passes bonestock.

 

[Speedfreak]

Wow guys a guy goes racing for a couple of hours and comes back to his thread to have everything having been debated but world peace. LOL. Easy boys were all in this to have a good time. Snakebitten and 1BadGTS are on point that in a STOCK to STOCK run with the best drivers behind the wheel of a GEN III and Z06 the Z will win. Now I do disagree as to how much that loss will be. My best time was not run in nearly as favorable weather conditions Furman had for his record run and so an 11.5 is not the best this car will run in my opinion. As I stated previously it is probably a high 11.3 or low 11.4 with great weather, track prep and flawless driving. But as I stated myself, I still lose to Furman every time by 3 tenths.

But also to recap if we take both cars and mod them similarly (tires, exhaust, computer tune, throttle body, cam, etc.) and give them full traction I believe the Viper wins easily and that is a matchup I would love to run. Think about it this way. I CANNOT EVEN POWER SHIFT 1-2 IN A DRAG RACE or I LOSE TIME in a STOCK configuration. I am sure Furman is banging the hell out of all 4 gears in his. So one way to look at it is the full potential of a Gen III viper modded is higher than a Z under the same rules because now all the built in handicapping that favors the Z is gone!!! Even if we just gave both cars drag radials the gap would probably close a bit more.

Also the Gen IV car is a very different animal. I saw my first one run last night with Ray W. All the power is there but the dam drive by wire and computer are a major restraint. When you punch it off the line IT does not deliver full throttle power like a Gen III does. The computer modulates the power level on its own despite driver input and brings it gradually. This takes a very valuable driver skill advantage out of driving the car in my opinion. So while I wish it were true, with this disadvantage alone, I think turning any 10.8s in a Gen IV in stock form is nearly impossible. You must have ALL the power of the car when you want it. A second brain (computer) in the car counteracting what you tell it to do screws everything up.

 

[Speedfreak]

Last night was a lot of fun and Ray W is a great guy and viper lover. Was really nice to hang out with someone while racing. The weather conditions were not as good (70's and DA of about 700 feet). I only planned to take 2-3 passes because my clutch is on the way out. I continue to refine this car though and still posted my second best time of 11.67 @ 121.42 with a long cool down before and 1.83 60'. This DA corrected is an 11.56 @ 122.4 so theoretically a slight improvement over my previous run. I tried to ice pack the car out on one of the staging lanes off to the left of the main lanes to try and get the power up but they said no. The track was much busier.

I took it to the pits and iced it about 40 minutes and took it straight into the left lane for the run hoping to maybe break my other time. I only had one car ahead of me. But bad luck hit and the rail dragster in front of me sprayed oil all over the track and I didn't get to run. Bummer.

Ray and I watched some racing for a while and he worked on dialing in his car. I think he turned a couple of 11.5s with a mild launch feeling her out. There is a lot more there but that computer is a pain. After about 1.5 hours of cool down we lined up for a grudge match. He was going to really go after it on that run and I was pretty sure to be handily spanked. I gave my best go and turned an 11.69 @ 121.22 with a .041 light but Ray lost traction at the line and didn't get to really go after it so I prevailed. I had to go but Ray stayed awhile longer an so I think he turned some even better numbers but don't know. Hope he will post his results and observation.

 

[GR8_ASP]

1Bad please count how many freaking posts you have made about Evan and the drag racing capability of the Z06 here on the Viper web site. I think it is well into the hundreds, probably constituting the majority of your 1600 posts. I do not care if you owned a million Vipers you seem to buy them only to discredit them. Strange desire. Why not buy a Corvette, or maybe many of them, and tout your wares where they belong.

Same to all the others that seem to act like buzzards waiting for a post to mention that Corvette or Z06 word/name and come down to feed. Get a life and go to a place where you are welcome. Your anti-venom is not wanted here.

 

[Ray W]

Speedfreak, good to meet and run with you. Made only one more pass 11:62 @ 126mph. The way I drive looks like 11:50's consistantly and maybe with total disregard for the clutch and drivetrain there is an 11:20 in there somewhere.

 

[SnakeBitten]

Same to all the others that seem to act like buzzards waiting for a post to mention that Corvette or Z06 word/name and come down to feed. Get a life and go to a place where you are welcome. Your anti-venom is not wanted here.

Oh please Only a close minded person would see someone mentioning "facts" as "buzzards waiting". If you continue to see some wrong headed assumptions being continually brought up in thread after thread then those with first hand knowledge, like the ones mentioned, will continue to "try" to straighten the errant thinking. Nothing more nothing less. Get off your soapbox and open your mind.

 

[SnakeBitten]

Wow guys a guy goes racing for a couple of hours and comes back to his thread to have everything having been debated but world peace. LOL. Easy boys were all in this to have a good time. Snakebitten and 1BadGTS are on point that in a STOCK to STOCK run with the best drivers behind the wheel of a GEN III and Z06 the Z will win. Now I do disagree as to how much that loss will be. My best time was not run in nearly as favorable weather conditions Furman had for his record run and so an 11.5 is not the best this car will run in my opinion. As I stated previously it is probably a high 11.3 or low 11.4 with great weather, track prep and flawless driving. But as I stated myself, I still lose to Furman every time by 3 tenths.

Well said and very plausible. I can see the 11.5 and the mph being improved under the same conditions as the Furman run. Would love to see you get a chance to run your car on that track under those conditions. My bet is you would gain a mph or two as well with the -da as Im sure that helped the Z06 trap 128-129 mph. Im thinking all things equal you could probably hit an 11.4x @ 124-125mph at that track under those conditions. That would put things into perspective as, before your runs, all we had were 11.7's at best to compare against the loads of low 11 Z06 times out there. Your efforts are a game changer for this debate in terms of the gap between these two stock to stock

But also to recap if we take both cars and mod them similarly (tires, exhaust, computer tune, throttle body, cam, etc.) and give them full traction I believe the Viper wins easily and that is a matchup I would love to run. Think about it this way. I CANNOT EVEN POWER SHIFT 1-2 IN A DRAG RACE or I LOSE TIME in a STOCK configuration. I am sure Furman is banging the hell out of all 4 gears in his. So one way to look at it is the full potential of a Gen III viper modded is higher than a Z under the same rules because now all the built in handicapping that favors the Z is gone!!! Even if we just gave both cars drag radials the gap would probably close a bit more.

I see what you are saying but there are two variables that you didnt mention that could weigh heavily in this scenario. Weight and gearing advantage of the Z06. Viper should make more power mod for mod but the Z06 seems to keep the gap close because of the weight and gearing advantage. I think it could be erased with just a gearing change to the Viper though. No need to lighten.

.

Also the Gen IV car is a very different animal. I saw my first one run last night with Ray W. All the power is there but the dam drive by wire and computer are a major restraint. When you punch it off the line IT does not deliver full throttle power like a Gen III does. The computer modulates the power level on its own despite driver input and brings it gradually. This takes a very valuable driver skill advantage out of driving the car in my opinion. So while I wish it were true, with this disadvantage alone, I think turning any 10.8s in a Gen IV in stock form is nearly impossible. You must have ALL the power of the car when you want it. A second brain (computer) in the car counteracting what you tell it to do screws everything up.

That *****. Jorgensen mentioned about an ECU that has taken care of that albiet this would then be a modded Viper. Wish it came from the factory like this.

 

[GR8_ASP]

Oh please Only a close minded person would see someone mentioning "facts" as "buzzards waiting". If you continue to see some wrong headed assumptions being continually brought up in thread after thread then those with first hand knowledge, like the ones mentioned, will continue to "try" to straighten the errant thinking. Nothing more nothing less. Get off your soapbox and open your mind.

No "Oh Please" to yourself. This thread was specific to a Gen III drag racing discussion until vultures turned it into another (one of way to many) Z06 discussions. Thinking that this place needs discussion police to keep us from thinking that anything can be as quick as a Corvette or as Evan Smith is ridicuolous. And I think that you and 1Bad are the ones with the constant soapboxing.

Repeat after me: No car is faster than a Z06, ever. No person on earth is as quick, anywhere or anytime than Evan Smith. That make you happy?

If you doubt me just do a search here for 1Bad and his posts. I would bet over 50% mention the Z06 or Evan smith.

 

[SnakeBitten]

No "Oh Please" to yourself. This thread was specific to a Gen III drag racing discussion until vultures turned it into another (one of way to many) Z06 discussions. Thinking that this place needs discussion police to keep us from thinking that anything can be as quick as a Corvette or as Evan Smith is ridicuolous. And I think that you and 1Bad are the ones with the constant soapboxing.

Repeat after me: No car is faster than a Z06, ever. No person on earth is as quick, anywhere or anytime than Evan Smith. That make you happy?

If you doubt me just do a search here for 1Bad and his posts. I would bet over 50% mention the Z06 or Evan smith.

Alright Ill bring the mood down from a boil as this looks like it can get out of control fast. 1Bad can speak for himself but I dont think his motivation, nor mine, is about the Z06 or Evan Smith being the bestest, fastest etc. I think we are both just trying to show the true potential of the Z06 vs the true potential of the Gen III without disrespecting either cars capabilities. Some guys continue to think the Z06 is not as fast as many have gotten em hence the repeated Evan Smith, Furman mentionings that have finally grated a few nerves . But I can see where some may take it the wrong way.

We should be able to discuss facts without getting emotional even if our car is on the losing end. I like Speeds attitude and his willingness to push the Gen III bonestock platform where no one else before dared or cared to push it. Z06 guys seem to be rabid track rats[I mean that in a good way] as compared to most of Viper owners now. Back in the Gen II days it seems like alot of owners were tracking in the same manner and the posts reflected it. Not so much now. More Corvette owners so naturally more of them track so more of them are probably better 1/4 miling there car than Viper owners.

 

[Darbgnik]

Not to pick a fight, but I have to agree with some, that all drag threads always turn into a Viper vs Z06 debate. Why always the Z06? Why not have people jump on here and say "That's great Speed, but the LP-560 is faster." or "Ya but it will never be as fast as my GT-R."
Why always the Z06? And why is everyone so sore about it? And no I don't believe the origin or price point matters in the debate, as one looks as common as a Mustang(albeit a very fast Mustang), and the other is more rare(looking).
Again it always seems as though the same people drop in with the same stories(true or not),and again I'm not vested. I am now reserved to believe that some people like to argue, and will feel better about themselves if they feel they've annoyed someone they will never meet. As the old saying goes, "Everyone's a tough guy on the phone." I guess the same could be said about forums now.
Personally I don't come on here to argue, if I were looking to pick a fight I'd pick one with someone a lot closer to me. But then again, I think that separates the men from the boys.
Sorry, I'll get off my soapbox now.

 

[Speedfreak]

Well said and very plausible. I can see the 11.5 and the mph being improved under the same conditions as the Furman run. Would love to see you get a chance to run your car on that track under those conditions. My bet is you would gain a mph or two as well with the -da as Im sure that helped the Z06 trap 128-129 mph. Im thinking all things equal you could probably hit an 11.4x @ 124-125mph at that track under those conditions. That would put things into perspective as, before your runs, all we had were 11.7's at best to compare against the loads of low 11 Z06 times out there. Your efforts are a game changer for this debate in terms of the gap between these two stock to stock



I see what you are saying but there are two variables that you didnt mention that could weigh heavily in this scenario. Weight and gearing advantage of the Z06. Viper should make more power mod for mod but the Z06 seems to keep the gap close because of the weight and gearing advantage. I think it could be erased with just a gearing change to the Viper though. No need to lighten.



That *****. Jorgensen mentioned about an ECU that has taken care of that albiet this would then be a modded Viper. Wish it came from the factory like this.

Snake, I mentioned the gear change (which you are right about) in an earlier post and would be included in the mod to mod comparison I am speaking of. And the weight aspect as well. My feeling is that with a 3.55, DR and lightening the car with factory options (which frankly shouldn't even be considered a mod if I can order it with the car e.g. wheels, rotors, etc.) makes a Gen III a very tough competitor with the MODDED Z. And this is how all the Zs are running anyway. They all have DRs or aftermarket tires on them. So my goal is to make it apples to apples and go out and really show the GEN III at its best on a modded to modded basis. With 60-80 lbs. shed with wheels, brakes, etc. Good traction and a gear (3.55) that is more suited to the car I think with my STOCK motor I will **** all over alot of Zs with engine mods, DRs etc. I see them run all day out there. The ones I watch (modded) turn 11.3 to 11.7. I am in the middle of that right NOW without tires, gears or anything else. But again in fairness I am driving my car better than they are with the mods, etc. they have. If Jamie shows up and climbs in that 11.31 car I watched, uh, I think there will be a slight improvement (being facetious and LOL) and its a different ball game.

I don't know enough yet about the Gen IV but I am inclined to believe a modded gen III making the same horsepower makes a better drag racing platform because of the lack of computer interference. Thats why guys like Black Mamba with 528 RWHP need to put some DRs on that car and see what it will do. Or let me have a go at it. I think everyone would be surprised at how hard it would run.

In strickly stock to stock comparison the Z simply has too many advantages over the viper. But the ultimate potential of the two cars modded, IMO, definitely goes to the Viper. Since virtually all the Zs I see are allready modded then that is how we should play when we race them. Then it is a whole new ballgame.

 

[SnakeBitten]

Not to pick a fight, but I have to agree with some, that all drag threads always turn into a Viper vs Z06 debate. Why always the Z06? Why not have people jump on here and say "That's great Speed, but the LP-560 is faster." or "Ya but it will never be as fast as my GT-R."
Why always the Z06? And why is everyone so sore about it? And no I don't believe the origin or price point matters in the debate, as one looks as common as a Mustang(albeit a very fast Mustang), and the other is more rare(looking).
Again it always seems as though the same people drop in with the same stories(true or not),and again I'm not vested. I am now reserved to believe that some people like to argue, and will feel better about themselves if they feel they've annoyed someone they will never meet. As the old saying goes, "Everyone's a tough guy on the phone." I guess the same could be said about forums now.
Personally I don't come on here to argue, if I were looking to pick a fight I'd pick one with someone a lot closer to me. But then again, I think that separates the men from the boys.
Sorry, I'll get off my soapbox now.

Speaking for myself, Im no e-**** nor a **** in real life. No punk either but thats besides the point. ill avoid a fight if I can in most circumstances. I think its the nature of the internet in that its easy to misunderstand where someone is coming from with just words to guage the person by. Im really starting to believe that english isnt the most communicative language to get your point across as Ive heard often.

Lots of these stupid e-fights wouldnt happen in real life, not because of anyone being scared face to face, but because you can read the persons face and intent in what they are saying. Im with you on not knowing why the Z06 keeps getting brought up I usually post after its already gone in that direction. I think Ill just avoid em from now on as it does tend to turn into a largely pointless fratricidal debate.

 

[Speedfreak]

Not to pick a fight, but I have to agree with some, that all drag threads always turn into a Viper vs Z06 debate. Why always the Z06? Why not have people jump on here and say "That's great Speed, but the LP-560 is faster." or "Ya but it will never be as fast as my GT-R."
Why always the Z06? And why is everyone so sore about it? And no I don't believe the origin or price point matters in the debate, as one looks as common as a Mustang(albeit a very fast Mustang), and the other is more rare(looking).
Again it always seems as though the same people drop in with the same stories(true or not),and again I'm not vested. I am now reserved to believe that some people like to argue, and will feel better about themselves if they feel they've annoyed someone they will never meet. As the old saying goes, "Everyone's a tough guy on the phone." I guess the same could be said about forums now.
Personally I don't come on here to argue, if I were looking to pick a fight I'd pick one with someone a lot closer to me. But then again, I think that separates the men from the boys.
Sorry, I'll get off my soapbox now.

VERY GOOD POINT and funny you bring it up because my new target is the Mustangs!!! I see alot of GT500s, etc out there in numbers and the like to talk trash. LOL. I have beaten two already and was still sorting out my combo. I think the Z gets so much attention because the corvette/viper competition has been at the heart of the development enhancements in these cars for 10 years now. And that is something we all forget. Do you really think we would have the Gen IV and ZR1 but for this grudge match. We should all be celebrating as without it we'd still have a 400 HP viper and 350 HP corvette ten year later!!!

 

[SnakeBitten]

Snake, I mentioned the gear change (which you are right about) in an earlier post and would be included in the mod to mod comparison I am speaking of. And the weight aspect as well. My feeling is that with a 3.55, DR and lightening the car with factory options (which frankly shouldn't even be considered a mod if I can order it with the car e.g. wheels, rotors, etc.) makes a Gen III a very tough competitor with the MODDED Z. And this is how all the Zs are running anyway. They all have DRs or aftermarket tires on them. So my goal is to make it apples to apples and go out and really show the GEN III at its best on a modded to modded basis. With 60-80 lbs. shed with wheels, brakes, etc. Good traction and a gear (3.55) that is more suited to the car I think with my STOCK motor I will **** all over alot of Zs with engine mods, DRs etc. I see them run all day out there. The ones I watch (modded) turn 11.3 to 11.7. I am in the middle of that right NOW without tires, gears or anything else. But again in fairness I am driving my car better than they are with the mods, etc. they have. If Jamie shows up and climbs in that 11.31 car I watched, uh, I think there will be a slight improvement (being facetious and LOL) and its a different ball game.

I don't know enough yet about the Gen IV but I am inclined to believe a modded gen III making the same horsepower makes a better drag racing platform because of the lack of computer interference. Thats why guys like Black Mamba with 528 RWHP need to put some DRs on that car and see what it will do. Or let me have a go at it. I think everyone would be surprised at how hard it would run.

In strickly stock to stock comparison the Z simply has too many advantages over the viper. But the ultimate potential of the two cars modded, IMO, definitely goes to the Viper. Since virtually all the Zs I see are allready modded then that is how we should play when we race them. Then it is a whole new ballgame.

Agreed. Cant wait to see your results. Will be eye opening in the least. I always felt the Gen III should have had shorter gearing since it came with larger circumferance tires then the Gen II's. I too have always thought the Viper is the superior and stouter platform. Can you get these runs on vid next time? Timeslips are nice but nothing like seeing it in its entirety.

 

[Speedfreak]

Something else I forgot to mention. The infamous red ZR1 was out last night again. Ray and I watched him turn a 10.98 at 135 on slicks. But his first launch the car took off 10 feet and stalled. He had to back up and try again. I am wondering if this car is also a drive by wire platform like the Gen IV. Someone please advise. It seemed to demonstrate some of the same issues Ray and I were talking about with his gen iV, meaning engine doesn't do what the drivers throttle action does. This could explain why this car seems like such an under performer as well. With that trap, this thing should be deep in the 10's and HE HAS all the traction he needs. Food for thought.

 

[vipeuup]

Oh please Only a close minded person would see someone mentioning "facts" as "buzzards waiting". If you continue to see some wrong headed assumptions being continually brought up in thread after thread then those with first hand knowledge, like the ones mentioned, will continue to "try" to straighten the errant thinking. Nothing more nothing less. Get off your soapbox and open your mind.

Do a search. 1BADGTS posts are about 80% Viper bashing. Just because he owns Vipers. Doesnt mean anything.