Negative Tuner Experiences

[Marc Lublin]

To those who have read this thread yesterday, it was deleted because it wasn't all facts, there was some innuendo.


Please post any bad experiences you feel are worth mentioning, so that others can make more educated decisions about which tuners they would like to trust thier Vipers to.


Here are some of my facts.
On April 9, 2001, I received a call on my cell phone from John Hennessey. I have had no contact with him in almost a year. He simply said that he had been talking it over with his wife over the weekend and they decided that he didn't want there to be any Bad Blood between himself and anyone else out there. He said that he was going to Credit my American Express account for the full amount of $5715.00 the following day. Since that day I have probably called American Express about 30 times to see if the credit was posted. I have probably left over 20 messages and emails for John. I believe I received 2 emails back and 2 calls as well. Each time he apologized and said the credit would be processed right away. Still nothing. On Monday I sat on hold for 20 minutes waiting for John to pickup. I finally called back on another line and asked the secretary if he planned to pickup, (answer "no, he does not intend to pickup.") I promptly left him a voice mail and email saying I hoped that was just a mistake and to call me if it was. I heard nothing and then posted my update on the matter. Bear in mind that I have a copy of an email that he sent which can be traced telling me he is sorry for the problems, keep all the parts and he will be crediting my American Express account in full.

 

[C O D Y]

Wow, Marc you are very brave.

I'm not going to stand to close to you, because I don't want to be injured when the moderator gods strike you down.

Anyhow, I am really sorry to hear about your experience your John Hennessey. He has a truly wonderful product, however it can be very frustrating not to be able to even talk to someone when you have a issue. However, in johns defense, there are always two sides to every story...... maybe John cares to elaborate for us?

 

[Gerald]

Curious,

Why was Tony Estes' name at the end of that email in the beginning (before you edited it)??????? What's going on?

 

[zoomie]

" I almost didn't by my car because of the subjective feelings that I had after dealing with this particular dealership, and offline others(s) in Maryland voice similiar complaints. "

I for one, especially living in Maryland and looking for a Viper,
would like to know problems OR kudos with suppliers, dealers, tuners.. advertisers here or not.. even a private email if not posted here..

 

[RoyV101621]

I'll try this again. First post deleted.
You will find the things from SVS & Sean Roe, in fact most tuners, to be of outstanding quality. <FONT size="3">Always</FONT s> better than the take-off parts.

 

[painexpert]

I have been getting numerous requests via email from VCA members all around the country wanting to know about my experiences with Hennessey Motorsports.The following comments are from my own personal experience,one on one,with John/HMS.I had met John during some of the first Silver State Classic races in Nevada.I remember that he had the first Viper that I had ever seen while at one of the races.A few years later,in 1998,I purchased a Viper from Fitzgerald Motorsports in New Hampshire.When it was finally built it was drop shipped to a Dodge dealer in Houston near HMS.They picked up the car and converted it into a Venom 600.Larry Macedo was the service manager at the time(he has since left)and they had the car for about seven weeks.Everything went smoothly, communication was good and the car arrived safely.In October 2000 I wanted to upgrade the brakes and suspension and upgrade to the 650R.I called John again.He told me about some new heads that he had to make it a 700R.We discussed price and the car was picked up during the first few days in November.This experience with John /HMS was totally different than my initial one.The car was at HMS for 5 1/2 months!For the first 3 months I did not inquire because I did not want to be a "pest".When I eventually began to call the situation really became unpleasant for me.No phone calls were ever returned,no emails were addressed,nothing.When I was told that he will call me back in 20 minutes it never happened.Rarely,I was able to call him on his cell phone and actually speak with him and there were occasions(few) where his sister would put him on the phone or tranfer me to him.But the vast majority of the time(ie 99%) that I tried to contact him was a waste of my time and money(phone bill).To put it bluntly,their customer service is the worst that I have experienced from any business.They just did not seem to care about my car or my concerns.It was more of the "we will get to it when we get to it" type of attitude.VERY POOR COMMUNICATION!For the amount of money that I spent I should have been treated much,much better.Several times I would cancel appointments that I had made because John was going to call me at "such and such time".HE NEVER CALLED!Can you imagine how angry and frustrated I was?In addition, when my car finally arrived I immediately noticed four things.One,the car was dirty.This car should of been detailed professionally and to the "max".It took me several hours of clay bar,polish,etc. to get this car to look the way that it should of come from HMS and the way that it left me.This was a reflection of the way that my car was cared for at HMS.The second problem was the wheels.I had ordered HRE 545 wheels and they came with 546 wheels.When I called and finally did speak with John(can you believe it) he did say that he was sorry and would exchange them.But at this point I just wanted the "nightmare' to end and kept them the way they were.The dirty car and the wheel situation indicates to me just a lack of care, disinterest or poor organization.The third problem was that I was having some idle problems that were supposed to be addressed at HMS.Obviously, they were not.I took the car to my local Viper tech and he agreed that there seemed to be a problem.He spoke to John from the Dodge dealership(while I was there)and was going to send a part the next day.IT HAS BEEN THREE WEEKS AND STILL NO PART!!!The fourth problem are the rotors.My Viper tech feels that they may be warped.I personally spoke with Dave Tittle(Dilusi) concerning this and we will try to see if the problem goes away or if indeed the rotors are warped.This could of been prevented if after installing them the car was checked out properly.My own feeling is that the car was "whipped together" and sent back to me.Based on these dealings I could not, nor would not, recommend HMS any longer.HMS treatment of its customers seems to be quite erratic.Sometimes good,sometimes bad.When I spend money of this magnitude I need a business with more consistency.It is a real shame because John and HMS are capable of much better things! Robert Bien MD,Las Vegas NV

 

[sleepersn95]

I for one want to hear about positive and negative experiences with tuners, jiffy lubes, trak autos and dealerships (not)honoring warrenty issues. I use this site to post some tidbits and to learn from other peoples experiences.

From this site I learned a lot about being a viper owner, which in itself is not always a easything.

I almost didn't by my car because of the subjective feelings that I had after dealing with this particular dealership, and offline others(s) in Maryland voice similiar complaints. The reason I do not mention their name is because they don't advertise here. If they did I would put it in the open forum.

When we play with our toys we have a tendancy to spend a lot of money, and I would be po'ed if an advertiser on this site screwed me over. And I would expect that other members(VCA) should be po'ed at me if didn't explain my side as a warning. It would not be my responsiblity to try to explain someone else's point of view.


Please keep the forum as open as possible, may you could lock but not delete messages. Remember I made a $72,000 decision based off
the things I read here.

Thanks and keep up the great work!

S. Pope

 

[C O D Y]

Paging John? John Hennessey you have a call on line 2. John Hennessey line 2.

You have some of the best after market parts available for our cars. However, there are quite a few people that seemed to have difficulties dealing with you? Could you please step forward and give us your side of the story? Can this many unsatisfied customs be wrong?

 

[Marc Lublin]

Martin,
While I am also glad that you have had and continue to have good experiences with HMS I do not agree with all of what you say either for the above mentioned reasons and also these:

HMS sent me back my cylinder heads with used valves installed in them. This is not because he was busy or wearing many hats. Pictures were immediately taken and written documentation was received from a reputable head shop the following morning.

HMS boxed up a stock Chrysler cam in a Comp Cams box and sold it to me as an upgrade. Upon inspection and a phone call, Comp Cams verified that it wasn't their cam. When I spoke to John, he insisted 3 times that it is a Comp Cams cam. Then when I told him I spoke with Comp Cams and they said it was definately not theirs, there was a long pause and he told me it was a Chrysler cam and he put it in that box to protect it during shipping.

HMS charged my credit card for T & D rockers which I never received. I later purchased them directly from T & D.

These are just 3 clear cut examples of what HMS chooses to do not because John is very busy or lacks good customer service.

 

[Martin D]

Alright -

You got me there..... I guess I need to go check my Cam!

You must be registered for see images

I really hope you guys get your issues fixed. I would be no less upset if I had similar things happen to me. I guess I will just count my blessings.

By the way, Marc. Was the DC cam at least an upgrade?

Good Luck,

 

[John Stuttle]

I see there are allot of complaints about HMS here. But I have also seen a number of complaints about other vendors (read tuners) also. Shipping wrong parts, no parts, or duplicate orders is not good service! I, and many of you, have built these guys reputation up when they do this by saying how good they were at fixing the order! This is wrong. I see to many threads stating (blank) shorted this part but he was such a great guy to send it to me anyway. H*** you paid for it, you should have received it the first time without the extra phone calls or emails. Now I am beginning to realize that most of these "tuners" are just guys with viper experience trying to start or run business' selling parts with no real knowledge of the retail side, let alone inventory, order tracking, and fulfillment. Tuning cars and retailing parts are two different business. Those that succeed long term in the retail parts business will be the ones to master these systems, the others will remain "tuners" helping people build their cars.The thing we must realize at this point is this is probably as good as it gets for now. - john

 

[Marc Lublin]

Martin,
John said it was an upgrade, but after he lied to me about whose cam it was, his words didn't hold much merit with me.

 

[Martin D]

It is very unfortunate that some of you are having problems with HMS. In my recent extensive dealings with them I can see where maybe what John is lacking is a customer service manager.
It would seem to me that John has to wear many hats - and that at times, or even frequently he is overwhelmed. I am pretty sure that John gets dozens if not hundreds of calls a week. Now, this should not matter one bit to you guys at all. Obviously your issue, to you, is his most important. That is natural. I guess that the best thing you can do is vote with your Wallet and chose not to use HMS.

I know I stick up for John and HMS quite often. But, honestly they treat me right. As an example of how he treats me, I emailed him about an Idle issue I was having with my Venom 650R at about 11:00PM last night. He sent me a reply at 12:07am. Now I call that first class service. I would be glad to send anyone the Emails with time stamp confirmation. I don't know why I get treated this way. I can not imagine that I am the only one. Anyway, enough about my good fortune.

I suggest two things.

1. John, get somebody that is detail oreinted to handle your customer interface. You can not be all things to all people. And, contact these folks that have a beef and see if you can correct the situation.

2, Those of you that have had, and continue to have, bad experiences. Stop doing business with HMS.

I would be glad to offer my services as moderator if anyone is interested - and John was open to the idea.

Regards,

 

[GARY J]

I placed a $2500 order a month ago, and it may not be a venom 700 package but it's still important to me. My filters and smooth tubes arrived a week after the order was placed but I'm still waiting on the exhaust to get here. I called HMS every day last week several times each day. It's always the same. Either the girl with absolutely no answer to anything answers or there is no answer. I have left FOUR messages on John's voicemail. This is getting absolutely absurd. I'm a local business owner and if I ran my business like this I would go broke. I understand that John is a busy guy but for Gods sake get some useful people in there. Someone who can answer the simplest question like has the order been shipped or how much longer will it be until MY exhaust is made. I know it's a viper and I wouldn't have ordered the exhaust if I doubted the quality, but come on, we are paying, what, $1500 for a cat-back system or something like $2500 for headers. Take some of that and hire some people that can make the transaction easier on us, you know the people that put the food on the table, THE CUSTOMERS. Helluva tuner, lousy buisnessman!

 

[silverviper]

Wow. I was considering going to HMS for upgrades, but this line of discussion pretty much kills that idea. Thanks for the warning, I will vote with my wallet and go elsewhere.

 

[Gary Lashinsky]

How about other tuners other than HMS. Has anyone had a bad experience with LPE, TNT, SVS, etc? It would be good to hear about all, good or bad, not just HMS. It might help those who read this board to make a educated decision if they choose to do a tuner upgrade. BTW, Larry Macedo is in Orlando and can be reached at his shop at 407-366-0366. He is doing non-warranty Viper work as well as some performance upgrades and installations.

 

[Marc Lublin]

Gary,
I started a positive tuner thread at the same time as this one and people should definitely post on it. We do want to hear about problems with other tuners. My guess is that most of the major problems out there have been with Hennessey.

 

[C O D Y]

I would agree with Chris, the Northern California VCA floor mats are some of the best on the market.

The only other turner I've had experience with is Doug Levin. By far he is the one of the best and most knowledgeable in the market. I can be one of the hardest customers to make happy when it comes to my automobiles, and Mr. Levin well surpassed my expectations. Furthermore, I would even go as far as to label myself an "internet whiner", because I will do my home work prior to any transaction by talking to previous customers. And at the point completion if the work is unsatisfactory for me I will let everyone know.

I thank everyone for their honesty on this post. In the past I too was save many headaches from making the wrong decision, just because people like yourself posting true experiences with turners or vendors. If tuners or vendors can't make the customers they have satisfied, then they certainly will not get my business.

Last off, I do want to say something about the PartsRack. I have only completed one purchase from them, and everything I've heard about JonB and Dan are true! They are knowledgeable, fast and truly care about customer service. The PartsRack as earn excellent marks by my standards, and deserves all the thank yous that seem to get posted every week. There is a reason they have so many satisfied customers.

 

[Marc Lublin]

I'm glad that everyone is continuing to post on this thread. Lets try to keep to the topic though. The thread has been closed once because it merged with the positive tuner experience post. Let's keep it to negative tuner experiences and post our good experiences about tuners on the positive thread. That way this will not get shut down and other members can enlighten us on their experiences.
Thanks,
Marc

 

[unclgreggy]

If hennessey had $22,000 of my money and didn't return it I'd be at his door step with a couple of "friends" to make sure that he was in the mood to start writing a check. it's not even funny. this guy gets all the press a person could dream of and then jerks people around. it's not right and he needs to shape up or ship out.

 

[FikseGTS]

I have had my Viper for over a year now... and have been lurking and posting on this board for longer than that.....

just from what I have read here.... I wouldn't order anything from HMS.... too many VERY similar stories about HMS... bad communication... the worst part is the flat out lying that has been suggested on multiple occasions...

this board will not put him out of business.... there are TONS of Viper owners that will never visit this site.... but all the bad press here certainly can't help..... at least some of us will have the data to make an informed decision when it comes to aftermarket Viper products...

please keep the experiences coming.... good, bad, neutral, whatever...


Brooks


http://viper.miamisci.org

 

[Gerald]

With all these negative things regarding the Tuner in question. How is he ALLOWED to advertise on this site? With this site KNOWING that these actions are continuing, who is really at fault? Shame on the VCA or this board for continuing to let the co. in question advertise on this site until all the money, cars or parts are returned. But we ban ppl by speaking their minds?

It just doesn't make sense.

?

 

[Y2K5SRT]

John (Stuttle) - You had mentioned that those tuners/suppliers that screwed up an order initially, but then corrected it, should still be held accountable. I disagree. Customer service is the name of the game. If anybody sends me the wrong part, even for my dishwasher, I sigh and let them know. If they procrastinate or tell me tough luck, then I am upset. If they sincerely apologize and send the correct part out right away, I consider them to be OK. Everybody makes mistakes now and then, even the "golden boys" out there. As long as it is the exception rather than the rule, I consider it a normal part of doing business in any area. My company is one of the best in its field for customer service, but I still find myself apologizing to customers occasionally for something we screwed up. It happens. We get it resolved immediately and always make sure to stay in regular contact until it is fully corrected to the customers satisfaction.

I had a "problem" with an order for floor mats. The ones I received did not have the cut out for the rear hatch release on the driver's side (on the newer GTS'). I was not upset, just a little bummed that I couldn't use them right away. I contacted the vendor and they immediately apologized (profusely) and sent me out the correct mat. They told me to just keep the one that didn't fit, even though they could undoubtedly sell it to someone else. To this day I would recommend them above all others for floor mats ( Northern California VCA ). THAT is customer service.

Chris

 

[C O D Y]

NEVER once did anyone question your ability as a tuner or if you were a good father. Rather I keep reading the same complaints, customer service and where's my money / products.

So you're telling us the customer service is going to get worse? And if we don't like it, we can take our business elsewhere. That might be hard to do if you have our money.

If you're going to respond, please address the issues at hand.

 

[TOOOFST]

John H.? Are U responding to the POST,or just advertising?

You must be registered for see images

You must be registered for see images

 

[painexpert]

John,after reading your response to these complaints,I must say that I am really surprised and disappointed with what you had to say.First,you blame Marc Lublin for "trying to start a riot".John,if you had any insight you would realize that it is YOU who are inciting this so called "riot".This is your fault,nobody elses.If you would treat others as you would like to be treated then none of this would ever surface.You state that "rocks are being thrown at you from our keyboards"This is the only way that information seems to get to you.Your comments stating that you are not easy to get on the phone,that you are not able to return emails and phone calls,that you are not adding any more staff to help you,that you are now closed on Friday,and finally that if we decide to take our business elsewhere(its OK with you),means only one thing.YOU DO NOT GIVE A SH*T!!You also stated that you respect us all.That can not be true because when you respect someone you do not make comments like you did in your post nor treat people like you have.My initial post was made in a manner consistent with constructive criticism.I thought that hopefully you would realize how unhappy many of us have been with your customer service and make changes,but from your response I now realize that you have missed the point completely!Bob

 

[Marc Lublin]

John,
I am making these statements from behind the keyboard for 3 reasons.
1. If I tried to contact you by phone or email, I most probably would not get through to you for over a week, if at all.
2. If I do happen to get you on the phone, I believe you truly don't care and would say anything to get me off your back whether it's the truth or not.
3. It's not just me I'm fighting for, (American Express and or the courts should take care of that) I am also trying to inform the public. I have posted online to reach everyone I can and let them know to be careful. If I can stop one person from going through what I have had to endure, it will make me happy.

The fact that you have been in business for 10 years and have achieved all your accomplishments is great. I do think you have done a lot for the Viper world. No one here is complaining that you are a bad marketer. You do have a knack for getting you stuff in the press. In fact, you did manage to take a negative tuner thread, where most people are talking about problems with you and your company and turn it into a little bit of an advertisement. This doesn't explain the unsatisfactory rating you currently hold with the Better Business Bureau. We know how long you are in business, but could you post how long you have had this rating?

You also haven't addressed other concerns. What you have done to me (you can read above, if you have forgotten) equates to stealing. This really has nothing to do with how busy you are and that you cannot always answer a call that day. I have emails from many others as well with the same issues. Please let these other members know if you would like me to post a copy of your email to me almost a year ago stating, you are sorry and to please keep any parts you sent me and that you are crediting my American Express account in full? Or maybe the email from 2 months ago which also states that you will be refunding my account? As of 6/11/01 @ 8:40am American Express still shows no credits from Hennessey Motorsports.

Like Bob and the others stated: Your response shows that you just don't care and probably don't get it!

 

[Dante'00ACR]

I can't believe there are still people that are inquiring about HMS after all the people that have gotten scammed. Maybe 5 years ago he would have been worth looking into, but come on people, you would have a better chance on seeing your money again if it was invested in a nigerian growth fund. He won't rob guys like SW and a few others from the deep south, but if your not friends with him look out. I don't know how he sleeps at night.

Dante

 

[painexpert]

I have just spoken with John on the phone concerning some issues with my car and "customer satisfaction".I tried to impress upon him the fact that a good product(as I believe he has)without good customer relations is a doomed product!John really does understand and know these Vipers very well(mechanically,upgrade-wise,etc.)If he can add great customer followup along with consistency,and I believe that he is quite capable of doing so,then he will be much more successful than he ever thought possible.John,you have made mistakes(we all have)but your reputation can be once again "on top"!The ball is now "in your court".I hope that you "rise to the occassion" Robert Bien

 

[AviP]

What's with the useless demographic explanation about Vipers and their owners? I don't see John solving anybody's problem. I smell lawsuit.