New AEM Infinity 10 ecu?!

[Moundir]

http://fsrmotorsportcreations.rpmware.com/aem-infinty-10

Looks very promising and comparable to the motec, and pectel systems for a fraction of the price! This is especially great for us gen 4 guys!

Anyone know when it's going to be released? I know that it's been in beta testing for at least a few months. So does that mean its close to being out? Anyone heard anything from anyone in the know? Damn AEM is keeping a tight lid.

 

[Viper Specialty]

Have known about this for a long time now. Still in beta last I checked. The problem will be the same as anything else- wiring harnesses and integration. Contrary to popular belief, Pectel is NOT that expensive for the ECU itself, it is making it work in the application and sensor costs that drive the cost way up. Infinity-10 will have the exact same hurdles to overcome. The fact is, when you have 6K in harnesses, sensors, connectors, etc... whether you have a 3K or a 4K ECU is a tad arbitrary... you just go with what you like.

 

[Moundir]

Dan, I keep hearing 4-5k range for the full system for the viper and $2500 for the supra

 

[Viper Specialty]

Dan, I keep hearing 4-5k range for the full system for the viper and $2500 for the supra

That is entirely dependent on what configuration, model, options, sensor types, etc. you choose. If you want a bare-bones setup for any controller, no extra bells and whistles, etc... you can set a Pectel up the same way. All stock sensors, Bosch wideband instead of NTK, no wheel speed sensors or brackets, no fancy extra options, etc. either ECU can run the exact same type of integration. As I have said, the ECU's themselves are not the only reason everything is expensive, it is a combined package with "might as well" philosophy. Think about it... if you drop 3-7K on an ECU with a ton of features and tidbits... would you really scrape the bottom of the barrel on everything else to make it work on the car? Wiring, harnesses, install, connectors, sensors etc are all just like anything else- you get what you pay for. If you want cheap, you get finicky, slower sensors with shorter lifespans, noisy unshielded wiring harnesses that can cause anomalies and problems on their own, unreliable connectors and sealing, etc.

Expect to see a total cost difference roughly equivalent to the ECU cost difference for the basic hardware, assuming apples for apples.

 

[Tiago]

I wouldn't buy another AEM product if my life depended on it. JUNK!!!

 

[Moundir]

I wouldn't buy another AEM product if my life depended on it. JUNK!!!

How do you like your pro Efi setup? Can that setup work on a gen 4? The new AEM is supposed to be the bomb, and nothing like their old system! Time will tell!

 

[kllymartin]

Pectel > *

Especially when you figure in the costs.

 

[Dan Cragin]

There are many new systems on the market, as Dan has stated, integration is the biggest factor. Many thing things need to be considered when making the jump to a new engine management system. First off these systems will not pass any emission test and should not be considered for any build that can be easily tuned with the stock engine controller. For high HP, forced induction systems, and motorsports applications where data logging and altitude mapping are needed, these control systems are awesome.

In order for these systems to work correctly, integration is paramount. Everything must work with the vehicle Can-Bus system so the body controller and other vehicle control systems can work correctly. A motorsports-mil spec wiring harness needs to be engineered, drawn out, documented, tested and installed. Even when this is done just right, there are numerous hoops to jump through to get varies things to work right. Once completed many hours of dyno testing are required to map the system correctly. When done properly these systems are golden, but understand that the factory spends thousands of hours testing and developing calibrations, the best of tunes on aftermarket system still have small driveability and altitude change issues.

Hope this helps,

 

[Tiago]

How do you like your pro Efi setup? Can that setup work on a gen 4? The new AEM is supposed to be the bomb, and nothing like their old system! Time will tell!

I like it so far, car runs better then it ever did with the AEM.

 

[John Reed]

I am testing my Viper kit for AEM Infinity-10 now:

http://johnreedracing.com/dodge/96-06-dodge-viper-aem-infinity-10-pnp-kit/


Dan is right, it is not just the cost of the ECU that is a factor. Most ECU companies feature a select few hardware layouts, and unless it is a high volume market, leave the individual vehicle integration up to their dealers (or the owners themselves). I have been doing PNP kits for Vipers for a long time, and I have kits built around the Pectel and MoTeC which are two of the most well regarded ECU on the market and they work awesome. The fact remains that they are not within the reach of every budget (including most Viper guys), and my excitement surrounding the AEM Infinity-10 is that I can bring a kit to market that is priced more in reach with my average customer, and also brings to the table some of the features that previously were only available in high end ECUs. The ECU package itself is very capable, compact in size making placement easy, sealed for environmental conditions and the software is very clean/easy to use (with a lot of back end flexibility for advanced dealers to use).

I think I am most excited about the Gen4 kit, which I am starting on right now. That kit will not be too much more expensive than the Gen2/Gen3 Infinity-10, and that will be huge in that market compared to what we have been able to offer in the past.

I know some of you had issues with your V1 AEM, and while I can't change that (I have had to deal with it myself), AEM as a company has made some huge strides with the release of the Version 2 EMS. I use them a lot in a wide variety of vehicles and I have not experienced a single hardware failure. The Infinity hardware has been rock solid through the beta process (when you might actually expect to have issues), and it also benefits from being just a single hardware platform (versus 20+ that you get when each box is made to be an individual PNP unit).

 

[treesnake]

I am testing my Viper kit for AEM Infinity-10 now:

http://johnreedracing.com/dodge/96-06-dodge-viper-aem-infinity-10-pnp-kit/


Dan is right, it is not just the cost of the ECU that is a factor. Most ECU companies feature a select few hardware layouts, and unless it is a high volume market, leave the individual vehicle integration up to their dealers (or the owners themselves). I have been doing PNP kits for Vipers for a long time, and I have kits built around the Pectel and MoTeC which are two of the most well regarded ECU on the market and they work awesome. The fact remains that they are not within the reach of every budget (including most Viper guys), and my excitement surrounding the AEM Infinity-10 is that I can bring a kit to market that is priced more in reach with my average customer, and also brings to the table some of the features that previously were only available in high end ECUs. The ECU package itself is very capable, compact in size making placement easy, sealed for environmental conditions and the software is very clean/easy to use (with a lot of back end flexibility for advanced dealers to use).

I think I am most excited about the Gen4 kit, which I am starting on right now. That kit will not be too much more expensive than the Gen2/Gen3 Infinity-10, and that will be huge in that market compared to what we have been able to offer in the past.

I know some of you had issues with your V1 AEM, and while I can't change that (I have had to deal with it myself), AEM as a company has made some huge strides with the release of the Version 2 EMS. I use them a lot in a wide variety of vehicles and I have not experienced a single hardware failure. The Infinity hardware has been rock solid through the beta process (when you might actually expect to have issues), and it also benefits from being just a single hardware platform (versus 20+ that you get when each box is made to be an individual PNP unit).

There are a lot of comments and opinions on this subject...

If you want to put faith in only one of the statements....


This is the man to listen to....!


Thanks John and thanks for your help with my stuff....

 

[Moundir]

Sweet, the the gen1-2 system is done alreay and only the gen 4 remain!! ​FINALLY!!!

As far as traction control is concerned, can the 4 wheel kit be used with the Viper or only the 2 wheel kit? How do the two differ since the Viper is rear wheel only anyways?

 

[John Reed]

Thanks John and thanks for your help with my stuff....

Always glad to help, though I am not connecting the screen name to a person very well! You can PM me if you prefer, to jog my aging memory....

Sweet, the the gen1-2 system is done alreay and only the gen 4 remain!! ​FINALLY!!!

As far as traction control is concerned, can the 4 wheel kit be used with the Viper or only the 2 wheel kit? How do the two differ since the Viper is rear wheel only anyways?

Gen2/3, the Gen1 will remain as it is now for me on a case by case, custom installed basis.

Either kit can be used with the Viper. The two wheel kit would consist of a front and rear speed sensor and TC will be a function of the difference between the two. The four wheel kit is more than double the price, because 4 speed inputs is part of AEM's advanced tuning package. I have typically only used two on most average street cars and it works great. The four speed sensor setup is going to be what the ******** track guys would want, to further optimize the setup and also protect against potential sensor failure (never seen it myself).

A point to note, the 4 wheel kit will be cheaper on the Gen4 as that kit will include the advanced tuning package due to DBW and variable camshaft features.

 

[Paolo Castellano]

John could you elaborate on exactly the ~5K PNP AEM Infinity 10 will be lacking as compared to a Pectel or MoTeC?? I mean if, for ~5K PNP, it can do front vs rear wheel traction control based on wheel speed slip percentage as well as all the other more standard tuning duties that is expected from all the upper echelon ECU's, what is it missing? What am I missing?

I guess I am not understanding where Dan is coming from....... He is making it seem that once you add all the sensors to the "Bare Bones AEM Infinity 10" you will be at a price similar to the Pectel or MoTeC? I thought the Infinity-10 will do almost all the same stuff as the MoTeC and Pectel at a fraction of the price. I thought that was the whole idea.....

I can't wait for you to get the PNP done for the Gen 4! Do it!

 

[Viper Specialty]

John could you elaborate on exactly the ~5K PNP AEM Infinity 10 will be lacking as compared to a Pectel or MoTeC?? I mean if, for ~5K PNP, it can do front vs rear wheel traction control based on wheel speed slip percentage as well as all the other more standard tuning duties that is expected from all the upper echelon ECU's, what is it missing? What am I missing?

You are missing the types of integration and the primary market of Pectel/Motec compared to AEM. All of the race based systems that they are directly compatible with, and the powerful software that they use are going to be quite a bit different than an AEM product. Does this matter to all users? Nope. But it is a major difference none the less overall.

I guess I am not understanding where Dan is coming from....... He is making it seem that once you add all the sensors to the "Bare Bones AEM Infinity 10" you will be at a price similar to the Pectel or MoTeC? I thought the Infinity-10 will do almost all the same stuff as the MoTeC and Pectel at a fraction of the price. I thought that was the whole idea.....

Both controllers have compatibility with similar sensors, wiring harnesses, etc. If you use X form of integration, the only variable is the ECU itself. However, if you start to make it a "native" application, meaning you start to bias the AEM towards the "AEM street" sensors and components it was designed to work with, and start to use the "Pi/Motec Race" sensors and components that the Pectel/Motec apps were designed around, the price point starts to split off. It all depends how you configure it, but assuming apples to apples, the ECU price is the primary price difference.

But yes, if you took an Infinity-10, and added all of the bells and whistles to it, a similar harness, same sensors, same options as the Pectel kit, sure, expect the price difference to be the same as the difference in price between raw ECUs.

 

[Paolo Castellano]

You are missing the types of integration and the primary market of Pectel/Motec compared to AEM. All of the race based systems that they are directly compatible with, and the powerful software that they use are going to be quite a bit different than an AEM product. Does this matter to all users? Nope. But it is a major difference none the less overall.





Both controllers have compatibility with similar sensors, wiring harnesses, etc. If you use X form of integration, the only variable is the ECU itself. However, if you start to make it a "native" application, meaning you start to bias the AEM towards the "AEM street" sensors and components it was designed to work with, and start to use the "Pi/Motec Race" sensors and components that the Pectel/Motec apps were designed around, the price point starts to split off. It all depends how you configure it, but assuming apples to apples, the ECU price is the primary price difference.

But yes, if you took an Infinity-10, and added all of the bells and whistles to it, a similar harness, same sensors, same options as the Pectel kit, sure, expect the price difference to be the same as the difference in price between raw ECUs.

Dan, I have already read what you posted on this topic.

I was hoping for a response from John Reed as he makes PNP for all three ECU's being compared here.

All I am asking is if I understand correctly if the Infinity 10 PNP for ~5k will allow the Gen 4 to be tuned for what most of the guys who drive their cars on the street and 1/4 mile and want wheel speed slip percentage based traction control.

99% of all potential customers for Gen 4 TT builds do not need all of the other pie in the sky stuff that makes the standalone ECU and all associated accessories cost 10-20K. Here is a link to the cost of the Gen 2-3 plug and play AEM Infinity-10: http://johnreedracing.com/dodge/96-06-dodge-viper-aem-infinity-10-pnp-kit/

I doubt there is anything this can't do for the guys who want to drive their Gen 4's on the street and dragstrip. Like I said before, IMHO, this will be more than adequate for 99% of Gen4 TT builds!

The AEM Infinity 10 is a game changer bringing affordability to the Gen 4 Guys to finally get an ECU that can do what's necessary when compared to the higher end units.

If Pro EFI made a PNP for the Gen 4, it does all the Pectel and MoTeC does and more. I bet the PRO EFI would be in the same price range as the Infinity-10 for PNP as well.

John, do you, have you or would you do a PNP for PRO EFI?

 

[John Reed]

Dan, I have already read what you posted on this topic.

I was hoping for a response from John Reed as he makes PNP for all three ECU's being compared here.

All I am asking is if I understand correctly if the Infinity 10 PNP for ~5k will allow the Gen 4 to be tuned for what most of the guys who drive their cars on the street and 1/4 mile and want wheel speed slip percentage based traction control.

99% of all potential customers for Gen 4 TT builds do not need all of the other pie in the sky stuff that makes the standalone ECU and all associated accessories cost 10-20K. Here is a link to the cost of the Gen 2-3 plug and play AEM Infinity-10: http://johnreedracing.com/dodge/96-06-dodge-viper-aem-infinity-10-pnp-kit/

I doubt there is anything this can't do for the guys who want to drive their Gen 4's on the street and dragstrip. Like I said before, IMHO, this will be more than adequate for 99% of Gen4 TT builds!

The AEM Infinity 10 is a game changer bringing affordability to the Gen 4 Guys to finally get an ECU that can do what's necessary when compared to the higher end units.

If Pro EFI made a PNP for the Gen 4, it does all the Pectel and MoTeC does and more. I bet the PRO EFI would be in the same price range as the Infinity-10 for PNP as well.

John, do you, have you or would you do a PNP for PRO EFI?

The whole goal with this program is to bring an ECU package to market that has all of the features the average "street" Viper owner wants/needs, at a price point that isn't much higher than past AEM units. It is also one of the most powerful ECU's coming out, features a very compact footprint (easy to mount), the software is easy to use and the features are only going to keep growing on it (some of which can be developed by dealers such as myself to fit a market need). All my Viper kits are spec'd roughly the same in basic trim, so if you have looked at the website the price differences you see is basically the difference in hardware costs between the various ECU platforms I offer for the Viper.

 

[Paolo Castellano]

The whole goal with this program is to bring an ECU package to market that has all of the features the average "street" Viper owner wants/needs, at a price point that isn't much higher than past AEM units. It is also one of the most powerful ECU's coming out, features a very compact footprint (easy to mount), the software is easy to use and the features are only going to keep growing on it (some of which can be developed by dealers such as myself to fit a market need). All my Viper kits are spec'd roughly the same in basic trim, so if you have looked at the website the price differences you see is basically the difference in hardware costs between the various ECU platforms I offer for the Viper.

Upon initial release, is the AEM Infinity 10 going to offer flex fuel and 2-wheel slip percentage based traction control? Or will that come later? The reason I ask is because I have read conflicting information on this subject, Thanks!

 

[John Reed]

To clarify, what you are buying is not the option to do traction control (two sensor) or flex fuel. You are simply buying the sensor kits, which I make plug and play to be easier. You are certainly able to put your own sensors or stuff on the car as long as they are compatible.

The 4 wheel TC kit is more expensive because it is four PNP sensors AND also unlocking the advanced tuning package for Infinity-10.

Flex fuel and 2 wheel TC are standard and are in the software currently.

 

[Kill-Zone]

is the same infinity box good for Gen 2 and Gen 4/5?

I assume there is a wiring harness difference and such.

I have a Gen 2 now that I want to add a power adder to and wouldn't mind getting a Gen 5 when they finally figure out a price and few other details.

 

[Moundir]

So is this damn thing ready yet for the viper?

 

[Viper Specialty]

No. No Viper firmware yet.

 

[MTGTS]

Went to PRI today and stopped by the AEM booth. When this comes out it should really be the choice for most Viper folks. (Although I did also hear that Motec is coming out with a similar cheaper setup as well.) They showed me all the features that this will be capable and in the hands of a competent tuner will really be a powerful tool. John Reed is suppose to be dyno testing a car Monday with an Infiniti setup. It is a 2006 and John will be making a the harnesses for this unit which most everyoen already knew. Hopefully things start happening soon.

 

[Moundir]

Went to PRI today and stopped by the AEM booth. When this comes out it should really be the choice for most Viper folks. (Although I did also hear that Motec is coming out with a similar cheaper setup as well.) They showed me all the features that this will be capable and in the hands of a competent tuner will really be a powerful tool. John Reed is suppose to be dyno testing a car tomorrow with an Infiniti setup. It is a 2006 and John will be making a the harnesses for this unit which most everyoen already knew. Hopefully things start happening soon.

Does this mean the firmware is done for the viper? Tell us more about the motec please! This is getting interesting

 

[MTGTS]

Does this mean the firmware is done for the viper? Tell us more about the motec please! This is getting interesting

The Motec unit is a lot further away from completion then the AEM but it is in the works. I didn't stop at the Motec booth as I had already passed it when I was told about the units by one of their dealers. John Reed will have the most info on the AEM unit as he is testing it out tomorrow on the dyno from what I was told.

 

[ACRucrazy]

Is this for 03/06 only? 08-10 also?

 

[Moundir]

Any word if John Reed dynoed the car as scheduled?

 

[challenger&viper]

Santa will bring us an ECU this christmas !!

 

[MTGTS]

Any word if John Reed dynoed the car as scheduled?

Not sure. I don't know if he has an account here but he does over on the "alley"

 

[Will at RSI]

The Gen 4 is not complete and there is not an ETA for its completion.