Power output

[I Ben Therbefor]

There's been a lot of talk about the Viper power output. Here's an engine for compairson. "Mays says the other V10 (they built two) is under the hood of an as-yet undisclosed Mustang. Feasibility testing?" The interesting aspects to this engine are packaging, weight and specific power output. Being a member of the modular family, putting it into production would not be expensive or difficult.

"The modern version of the Ford 427 concept’s power plant started off as a cloak and dagger “skunk works” project commissioned by Theodore, who wanted to know if it was feasible to craft an all-new, lightweight 427 cubic inch (7.0-liter) engine out of Ford’s highly flexible modular V-8 engine family. Ford’s Powertrain Research & Development answered the call and began working under the radar screen on a limited budget. The result shocked everyone.

The 427 engine produces a tremendous 590 horsepower at 6,500 rpm and 509 foot-pounds of torque at 5500 rpm. Remarkably, the engine is almost 70 pounds lighter than the 5.4-liter 32-valve Cobra R engine from the Ford Mustang. The 427 achieves this astonishing power-to-weight ratio through the following attributes:

Siamese bore aluminum V-10 engine block based on Ford’s modular V-8 DOHC engines
Ford-pioneered metal spray process to maximize the bore at 95mm
Newly designed lightweight forged aluminum pistons with a very short compression height
Aluminum cylinder head derived from the SVT Cobra R Mustang
New billet H-beam connecting rods and billet steel common pin crankshaft for increased strength without the need for a balance shaft
Lightweight hollow stem valves
The engine technologies were developed in Ford facilities between Detroit and Dearborn."

I have a suspicion that a 7 liter version of the hemi would easily out produce the 8.1 liter V-10 presently in the Viper. Or as one forum member has suggested, the real answer is a hemi V-10!

 

[Russ M]

Umm perhaps you should re-think your approach to this, the Viper v10 is REALITY, the Ford one is just in fantasy for now. When ford releases a v10 making the 590hp you say then your point may be valid but for now the only v10 ford ever produced makes much less power than the Viper.

Weight, how can a v10 version of the ford v8 be lighter? If it is part of the same family of engines with just 2 more cylinders. Which probably means 70lb's heavier rather than lighter.

Finally, the reason the Viper engine only (and I use the term only very loosely) produces 450hp is because that is more than enough to make the the down right king of speed. Ford or Chevy have not had anything that even comes close for 12 years. And before we hear the z word 1/2 sec in the qtr mile is not close in any book, just close enough in the mind of a zo6 owner.

 

[Y2K5SRT]

As long as we are talking "maybes", here is a post you may have missed about the much stronger V10 from Dodge:

http://vca1.viperclub.org/cgi-bin/ubb-cgi/postdisplay.cgi?forum=Forum14&topic=016206

In part it says, "the 8.1-liter V10 engine will be replaced in the next few years with a new V10 HEMI with power output expected in the 600+ hp range." 590 HP, yawn...

Chris

 

[George Murray]

70 LBs lighter than the Cobra R 5.4? Quite possible, if the Cobra R block is cast iron. I think it is, but I may be wrong. I've only seen one '00 Cobra R (liked it), but I don't recall asking what block material was used.

Ford's been teasing for years. Always a better, faster Mustang. They've gotten bestter and faster, but only incrementally, not dramataically. And it's taken years and years to do so.

I'd love to see Ford build that 427. It keeps the pressure on.

 

[Dixter]

I don't remember too much about this engine, but I was shown
a Ford engine in the crate that was around 427 cubic inches
that had hemi heads and double overhead cam... This was 1976

I never heard another thing about it... but I wonder if ford
would up the anti by offering their own version of a hemi engine
in the not too distant future.

 

[Frank 03SRT]

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Dixter:
... but I wonder if ford would up the anti by offering their own version of a hemi engine in the not too distant future.
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

---- let's see. First, they rip off the look of the Ram truck, next they propose a new Lightning to compete with the Ram SRT, not to mention the GT40, then a Hemi?? ----- it's highly likely!

 

[Frank 03SRT]

Stein,

I'm referring to Dodge being out front with the BIG RIG look that Ford flat ripped off some years back in it's 3/4 ton and larger trucks. So, what does Dodge do but try a separation from Ford by a more exaggerated Big Rig look for it's latest design. I wasn't really talking about the sport truck look. Frankly, the look of the Lightning is far from my favorite.

In my opinion, the main way Dodge and Chrysler survives is in their great design ideas and excitement generated. When these ideas succeed, other manufacturers feel free to develop similar marketing ideas. Some analogies to other manufacturer's current ideas and designs could be drawn to: the Viper's look and power, PT Cruiser, Dodge Ram Big Rig look, now maybe Hemi. It could be argued that there would be little current excitement in the truck world without Dodge and their Big Rig design. We would still be driving those ugly flat faced box-like trucks.

 

[Jay Herbert]

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Russ M:
Stein,

Which first sports truck did Ford invent? I am curious, since in my book the first sports truck and SUV was introduced by GMC in the form of Syclone/Typhoon.

I hope you are not implying that the lightning came before either of those.

And the GT40 at least in my book is on the exact same mission as the Viper, to generate dealer walk in traffic and offer brand bragging rights. If and when the GT40 will be released the comparison between it and the Viper will show exactly what Ford is going after.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Actually..... I might vote for the Dodge Little Red Express (1978-79) as the first "Sports Truck". It was the fastest American production vehicle in 1978.

 

[Russ M]

Stein,

Which first sports truck did Ford invent? I am curious, since in my book the first sports truck and SUV was introduced by GMC in the form of Syclone/Typhoon.

I hope you are not implying that the lightning came before either of those.

And the GT40 at least in my book is on the exact same mission as the Viper, to generate dealer walk in traffic and offer brand bragging rights. If and when the GT40 will be released the comparison between it and the Viper will show exactly what Ford is going after.

<FONT COLOR="#ff0000" SIZE="1" FACE="Verdana, Arial">This message has been edited by Russ M on 01-12-2003 at 12:21 PM</font>

 

[George Murray]

Yeah there was the LRT in '78 and '79.

Ford had some 351 "**" engines in some mid-80s Broncos and F-series trucks (basically a 4 BBL carb and otherwise stock..."5.8 ** V-8" labeled on air cleaner...engine was a dog compared to basic 302 EFI engines that came out in some Ford trucks in 1985).

Don't forget the 454 SS Chevy. I have a warmed-over one (it was a good deal, only reason I bought it, as I basically dislike anything Chevy). Mine will handily smoke any stock Dakota R/T (had one of those too - disappointing).

I'd have to go with Dodge on the LRT, which started it all. GMC upped the ante with the Syclone in the late 1980s, though.

I looked at some Ram 1500 HEMI quad cab trucks today. The regular cab short-bed ones are sold before they hit the lot. I may have to grab one of those...