Run Craps VS Non Run Craps, I see no difference !! on a Paxton Car

[2002_Viper_GTS_ACR]

Just another FYI. I have finally gotten a chance to pound on my new NON run crap tires and on my paxton car, I couldnt see any dicernable difference OTHER then warm up time. Non run craps take a little less time to "warm up", but once both tires get hot, they seem to grab (actually non-grab) relatively the same. No decernable difference on a paxton. Zen Garage has said it was night and day, and I say on a paxton car its pretty much unnoticable.

I wouldnt replace tires or swap out run craps just to gain that insignificant "traction benefit," more then anything, I would simply buy which ever tires were the cheapest at the time of purchase (which will always be the non run craps).

Jon

 

[Casey]

Thanks for the info Jon, I have already been thinking of changing out the Run Flats when my car arrives.
I guess I won't worry about it for now!

 

[JWALK35]

They wear quickly on a road course. And when the edge goes it peels badly and quickly. Saw a set go that way a week ago at Gingerway. J

 

[2002_Viper_GTS_ACR]

They wear quickly on a road course. And when the edge goes it peels badly and quickly. Saw a set go that way a week ago at Gingerway. J

Funny, I cant remember the user, but someone here is a huge proponet of the run craps for use on a road course. So it might be a hit or miss thing, or a driver level issue.

Jon

 

[zen garage]

They wear quickly on a road course. And when the edge goes it peels badly and quickly. Saw a set go that way a week ago at Gingerway. J

Funny, I cant remember the user, but someone here is a huge proponet of the run craps for use on a road course. So it might be a hit or miss thing, or a driver level issue.

Jon

or maybe you ave no freakin clue what you are talking about? It wouldnt be the first time would it?

and the other thing you asked about...838 delivered

 

[GR8_ASP]

I switched non run flats. They did out perform the run flats but only because they were new and replaced hardened and worn tires.

 

[valentine_viper]

They wear quickly on a road course. And when the edge goes it peels badly and quickly. Saw a set go that way a week ago at Gingerway. J

Funny, I cant remember the user, but someone here is a huge proponet of the run craps for use on a road course. So it might be a hit or miss thing, or a driver level issue.

Jon

The first time I road raced my Viper (with stock run-flats) I was pretty impressed with how the tires performed. Grip and stability were surprisingly good and I could get quite a bit of exit speed out of the turns. They did feel a bit greasy when they got hot (it was over 90 degrees that day), but after four 20 minute sessions, no bad surprises. But the second time (about 10 degrees cooler out), after the shoulders were worn and the tread blocks were starting to roll a bit from my previous road race sessions, the car became much more prone to snap oversteer and I had to be way more conservative on exit speed. Spun it into the grass one time. When it let go, there was no warning. My overall opinion of the runflats is that they are not well suited to road racing since they do not perform well after light to moderate wear.

I haven't tried non-runflats. Anyone have any direct feedback how they work on a road course?

 

[Hiss]

Thanks for info Jon.

So much I have got to learn on vipers(I am learning fast-with vca help) but with my run flats I experienced awful wheel hop and hard ride. I changed to the nrf Pirelli's-no wheel hop but you can make them spin under hard wot especially if not warmed up. The ride is so much smoother. Sticky tire. It is probably my butt giving me wrong info but viper seems quicker. Could be the less tire weight.

Came in one of getting michelin nrf.

By the way Jon your gts with silver stripes looks great. Was looking for that color but too good a buy to pass up on the blue/silver.

 

[Viperfreak2]

The run flats are dangerous on a cold winter day. My non run flats ride so much smoother, I sometimes feel like I'm in a Ford GT. Flame suit on.

 

[2002_Viper_GTS_ACR]

All Good feedback. Looks like experiences vary, and thats the point of this forum. I'll have to save my judgement for road course usage until a later date. For now, I am fine running either set.

BTW, switching manufacturers isnt a relivant comparison to what I was trying to do. I just wanted to give feedback on the same tire company, with the same compound with same tire size, and what the outcome was. Heck im sure there are definitly better tires out there then michellin pilot sports, but I just wanted to give my feedback on the 2 versions of the ps that they have.

Thanks folks,

Jon

 

[ILLSMOQ]

I noticed the "snap over steer" with the runflat pilots sports. They just let go - almost unpredictable. Not so much on the non run flat pilot sports. Grip felt the same to me. Also at equal air pressure the run flats felt stiffer.

 

[ViperJohn]

Aren't the non-run flats a little lighter than the run-flats? Did you notice any difference in how the car rides? Especially over imperfections and bumps in the pavement.

 

[2002_Viper_GTS_ACR]

Aren't the non-run flats a little lighter than the run-flats? Did you notice any difference in how the car rides? Especially over imperfections and bumps in the pavement.

I know they are "heavier" so in theory, straight line performance could be better from the loss of weight, but probably very negligible. However, on a paxton car, I find that I get BETTER accelleration when I have 1/2 a tank to 3/4 of a tank, because the weight helps to plant the tires (both run craps and non run craps)

As far as a difference on driving over imperfections, not really and trust me in chicago we have a TON of them. In a viper they all ****.. lol.

Jon

 

[Viper X]

When new, the run flats are almost OK for what they are. After a few heat cycles at the track or a few thousand miles, they get harder and harder. Age takes their toll on both, but it seems to favor the non-run flats.

There is a noticeable difference between the two. I would say that feedback from the tires is quite a bit better with the non's as well.

I have found that the non-run flats work better than the run flats in every way, unless you get a flat!

In addition, the PS2's are better all around than the regular Pilot Sports, IMHO. They are now or will soon be available in Viper sizes - 18's at least or so I have been told.

 

[ViperJohn]

Aren't the non-run flats a little lighter than the run-flats? Did you notice any difference in how the car rides? Especially over imperfections and bumps in the pavement.

I know they are "heavier" so in theory, straight line performance could be better from the loss of weight, but probably very negligible. However, on a paxton car, I find that I get BETTER accelleration when I have 1/2 a tank to 3/4 of a tank, because the weight helps to plant the tires (both run craps and non run craps)

As far as a difference on driving over imperfections, not really and trust me in chicago we have a TON of them. In a viper they all ****.. lol.

Jon

I just thought it might improve the ride quality since you would have less unsprung mass on the suspension. I noticed the difference in my car when I replaced the heavy factory rims with SSR's. I figured the straight line difference to be negligible.

 

[Nader]

that is definitely true. I noticed a huge difference is ride quality and handling with the lighter set of HREs and non run flats. Big difference in weight.

 

[2002_Viper_GTS_ACR]

that is definitely true. I noticed a huge difference is ride quality and handling with the lighter set of HREs and non run flats. Big difference in weight.

This whole thing is getting blurred. Now we are talking lighter tires and lighter rims. I simply wanted to do a 1 to 1 comparo between stock rims and stock tire sizes, but between the 2 different versions available by the oem. Oh well..


Jon

 

[Viperfreak2]

As my Uncle **** always used to tell me:

"you can't always get what you want"