Vipers get kicked in the.....

Newport Viper

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you know what's...Today's Orange Countys Register. Jan 27th.

Huge write up on the local Sat. am car show at Crystal Cove.

"But Crystal Cove is more for the croissant crowd."

Richard Schnyder, a movie studio executive from Laguna Beach, frowned at a fleet of high-powered but underwhelming Dodge Vipers.

" We're very cynical here," he said of Crystal Cove, " but not snobby."


OK, who handed this guy his ass...... on the drive home one day! :D



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GR8_ASP

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The guy quoted isn't the infamous EXECMALIBU is it? If so that would explain the negative Viper remark.
 

Vic

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I emailed the author of that article. "Underwhelming" was his description, so....

<snip>
Dear Sir,
In a recent article about the Saturday Crystal Cove get together, you made mention of the "underwhelming" Dodge Viper. I take exception to that comment, and challenge you to a contest of skill- Best lap time at track of your choice-
California Speedway, 1/2 oval, w/infield course
WillowSprings (big track)
Buttonwillow
You bring whatever it is you drive, I'll bring my Viper. Each driver does ten laps, best lap time wins the contest. To make it worth your while, I'll bet you $200. You put up $200, I'll put up $200. Third party holds the money, winner takes $400 home. That should cover the track fee. Contest offer good for 30 days. Weekday or Saturday club meet. Street tires only, no radical track alignments, stock motors only. Otherwise, the point of the contest is moot. Stock for stock is the issue here. I'll bet you have no idea what a stock Viper can do on the track.

Whatdaya say, Johnny? Up to the challenge?
<unsnip>
 

Chuck 98 RT/10

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Richard Schnyder, a movie studio executive from Laguna Beach, frowned at a fleet of high-powered but underwhelming Dodge Vipers.

" We're very cynical here," he said of Crystal Cove, " but not snobby."

But the "underwhelming" comment wasn't quoted.

Maybe it's the writer that hates Vipers?
 

Bad_Byte

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"But Crystal Cove is more for the croissant crowd."

" We're very cynical here," he said of Crystal Cove, " but not snobby."

OK, who handed this guy his ass...... on the drive home one day! :D

Crystal Cove is for the pickled ******, quiche eating, latte slurping, traction control worshiping, abs loving, knob polishing, sweater wearing snobs.

Anyone want to know how I really feel about it? :evilmad:
 

Vic

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Like Fisker? I thought it was pretty cool to see them Fiskers so early.
 

KWIK96

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I have not smoked him, but I did do one there last Saturday as I was leaving. Two geeks all prim and proper. I will look for Mr Dick next time.

I also don't like the dealers.

And Bad Byte, I might be all those things, but I don't have traction control.
 

DavidSB

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Re: Ferrari skilz video - anyone notice that the in-car video has the man going up and off the driver's side of the hood and the long shot replay shows the man going up and off the passenger side. Another cleaver (almost) internet work of computer art?
 

santo

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Re: Ferrari skilz video - anyone notice that the in-car video has the man going up and off the driver's side of the hood and the long shot replay shows the man going up and off the passenger side. Another cleaver (almost) internet work of computer art?

When the victim bounced off the driver side, the car was going in at a roughly 45 degree angle to the building. When the victim bounced off the passenger side, the car was going in at a 90 degree angle. Definitely not the same video footage at different angles.

Santo
 

WILDASP

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"But Crystal Cove is more for the croissant crowd."

" We're very cynical here," he said of Crystal Cove, " but not snobby."

OK, who handed this guy his ass...... on the drive home one day! :D

Crystal Cove is for the pickled ******, quiche eating, latte slurping, traction control worshiping, abs loving, knob polishing, sweater wearing snobs.

Anyone want to know how I really feel about it? :evilmad:
Judging from that write-up,you appear to have in your area a surplus of the species you mention above!We have a few of them down here,I'm sorry to say,but we usually just try to ignore them.I do like your description of the type;mind if I borrow it the next time one of these snobs annoys me? :D
 

Vic

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Re: Ferrari skilz video - anyone notice that the in-car video has the man going up and off the driver's side of the hood and the long shot replay shows the man going up and off the passenger side. Another cleaver (almost) internet work of computer art?

Huh! Thats very astute, Chris! I didn't notice that, until you pointed it out!

Have you ever seen that F355-vs-GTS video that has been circulating the net for about 2 years? The video shows a GTS and a Fuhwahwee on the Angeles Crest Hwy, and the GTS misses a trun and goes off a cliff. At first watching, it looks very real. After you watch it for a while, various questions pop up, like why was there a stationary camera rigid mounted at that particular turn, (out of hundreds of possible turns), why didn't the skid marks keep going, instead of ending at the edge of the pavement, why is there only one skid mark, instead of four, why does the billowing dust stop and shift, before the screaming woman appears, (indicating the clip is not sequential and chronological, but deliberately edited for maximum effect), etc, etc. Many people watch that vid and declare that they saw what actually happened, totally taken in by it. Very few watch it with a critical eye. We are trained to believe what we are told! (or see on video)

This F-car vid shares some of the same dubious elements, as you so accurately spotted. Good eye, Chris!
 

Vic

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Here is the journalists' response to my email I sent him.
<snip>
----- Original Message -----
From: "John"
To: "Vic"
Sent: Sunday, January 29, 2006 3:41 PM
Subject: Re: Your comment about the "underwhelming" Dodge Viper


Dear Mr. Rough,
Thanks for the message. Your offer is intriguing, but it wouldn't be much
of a contest, because I drive a 2000 VW Passat 4-cylinder 1.8 liter engine.
I think the Viper would kick my butt. However, I will forward your
invitation to Mr. Schnyder who is unimpressed with Vipers.


John
The Orange County Register
<unsnip>


Here is my response to him-

<snip>
John,
Thanks for your response.
My invitation was only to you, because "underwhelming" was not directly attributed to Mr Schnyder. I don't want to extend my invitation to just anyone, because there are certainly people who may own a newer car than mine, or may be professional racers or similar. My particular model Viper is getting old, its a 2001, and its performance capabilities are eclipsed by the current Viper, and also the current Z06 Corvette. Addtionally, when a challenge is issued to anyone who can hear it, "ringers" of all camps climb out of the woodwork. It is not my intention to swagger into a bar and declare that I can "whip the tar out of anyone in the place".

My challenge was aimed at you, and I was counting on my modest track experience to garner a win for the blue-collar home division. I also felt, from the tone of your comments about the Dodge Viper, that you probably had no idea of how well a Viper can do on the racetrack, and so I was confident of victory! I'm sure there are Ferrari drivers that could do better than me on the track, but these types usually have at least some respect for the capabilities of the Viper, and generally don't express themselves as you did. There is an unspoken awareness among racers, of each others' cars and their abilities, and "track rat"cognoscenti give credit where it is due. Even Viper owners give respect to the inexpensive Mitsubishi EVO, which, despite its ugly taxi-cab styling, has a low center of gravity, compliant suspension, and can run (stock) at Willow Springs just a few seconds behind the current Dodge Viper. If the Viper driver is not experienced, a competent EVO driver can beat him. Racers don't underestimate a car because of its cost or appearance, neither do they fear a competitor just because of his/her machinery. There is more to the driver's skills, than there is to the car, that is, until you get into the professional levels, where the drivers are more evenly matched, and the car's performance becomes more critical.

If you talk to My Schnyder again, you might mention that in the famous "Viper-Ferrari" wars, held annually many times at the Gingerman racetrack, no Ferrari ever won. Not even once. The attendees at these informal gathrings were not professional racing teams, just grass roots enthusiasts, with a passion for racing. With not a single victory to their credit, after a few years the Ferraris eventually quit coming! I don't think this is so much a reflection on Ferraris as such, as it is on Ferrari owners, who largely tend to be more reserved and less enthusiastic than Viper owners. If a statistical analysis were made, I think it would show that a far greater percentage of Viper owners regularly attend track events, than Ferrari owners do. For this reason, there are a higher percentage of great track-day drivers who own Vipers than Ferraris, lending a better talent pool to the Viper "nation". One notable example is the late Paul Mumford, who, in his very first Speed World Challenge GT race at Laguna Seca, took his Dodge Viper to first place, beating out seasoned and notable competitors such as Hans Stuck, Lou Giolatti, Max Papis, Angelelli, and all the other factory sponsored, big-budget teams. That was an amazing accomplishment for a self-sponsored rookie, and that is the kind of enthusiasm and passion for racing that many Viper owners share. Incidently, Vipers are assigned by the SCCA with very heavy balasts, and engine air intake restrictions, in order to make the competition between the various makes in WCGT appear even. It has been this way for a few years, unbeknownst to the viewing public. When you hang around with the racing crowd, info like this comes into focus, and we in the Viper nation are aware that the Dodge Viper would be out in front of the pack more if it were not for the handicap that is forced upon them to make the race interesting. No one out in TV land wants to watch a single file parade, and the advertising revenue would fail if the races were always a "lock" for any one make, and the outcome always assured. This is a matter of record, and the SCCA can be contacted to verify this common practice. Vipers have frequently been awarded the most weight of any make.

There are great everyday Ferrari drivers also, I have driven with some of them. The group I went out with, go so far as to indentify themselves as, and I quote, the "Ferrari DRIVERS club", to differentiate themselves from the typical Ferrari owner. By their own admission, they recognize that most Ferrari owners are timid about their car's capabilities, and don't know how to drive them properly near their limits of performance. By and large, they tend to be a country club set, and Ferrari ownership often revolves around the golf course, show and shine events, and their cars are usually relegated to being garage-queens.

Mr Schnyder's attitude towards Vipers likely stems from the pride and power that money brings, and his disdain for Vipers probably parallels his disdain for those who are less monied than himself. This kind of smug conceit is endemic in automobiledom, since the beginning of the motoring era, and is neither surprising nor unique. (Or even interesting).

If I am wrong about his class conciousness, then maybe merely thinks Vipers are too "plasticy" and crude, and I can't defend that, for its true, Vipers are not leather trimmed, lack cup holders, and won't impress the valet at the Jonathan Club.

What they are, are tremendously fast, great performing sports cars, that run with, or better than, much of the world's best. For comparatively little money, they perform as well or better than cars costing far more. In fact, if I were a Ferrari owner, (with the exception of the $675K Enzo), I would feel really angry if my high dollar exotic were to get beat on the strip or track by a "lowly" Viper. I would have to console myself with talk of the Ferrari's superior reputation, my superior social status, or some such thought.

Its great that journalists like yourself share the lofty and edifying opinions of citicens such as Mr Schnyder with the general public. Maybe you would like to also include the opinions of Viper owners, who represent the first American sports car to win division at Le Mans, and FIA champions? We're easy to find.

regards, Vic
<unsnip>
 

Vic

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Seems our journalist friend has extended my challenge to persons whom it was not intended for. I got this email from some stranger-

<snip>From: <[email protected]>
To: <[email protected]>
Cc: <[email protected]>
Sent: Wednesday, February 01, 2006 4:55 PM
Subject: Re: RE: Your comment about the "underwhelming" Dodge Viper


> Vic, I was forwarded you challenge to defend your Vipers Honor. I think Vipers ****. I accept your challenge. I have only 3.8 liters, no tubos, and radial tires. Put your money where your mouth is on March 22 at California
Speedway. Chris O'Donnnell
<unsnip>

I answered back that my challenge was not given to anyone but the journalist. (I'm confident I can beat at least that guy! heh heh!) If these guys start climbling out of the woodwork, maybe I'll have to get one of our track rat buddies to do a stand-in for me. If people wanna accept a challenge that was not given to them, then they can race against one of our Viper track stars who didn't issue the challenge, like John Dearing, Jonathan Martinez, Joe Bregante, etc! Whats good for the geese is good for the gander.
 

WILDASP

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Beautiful,Vic!I do hope he passed that along to the snob who made the remark!Why don't you see if you can arrange for his His Arrogant Pomposity,Mr.Schnyder,to come on here and share his witnesed track times(if any)with us peons.That should give us a good laugh!Highly doubtful he would do so,though-I doubt his oh-so-busy social calendar would permit,not to mention the loss of social status which would ensue from any mingling with the commoners! :evilmad: (expletive deleted PR**K!)
 

Chuck 98 RT/10

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Vic, I was forwarded you challenge to defend your Vipers Honor. I think Vipers ****. I accept your challenge. I have only 3.8 liters, no tubos, and radial tires. Put your money where your mouth is on March 22 at California
Speedway. Chris O'Donnnell

Don't sweat it Vic. It's an admission by the journalist that he doesn't know squat about how to drive a car. Happens all the time. He had to call in his boyfriend with the 1500 lb open-wheeler to run you.
 

KWIK96

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Don't worry about them Vic.
The journalist is just sucking up to the horse crowd.
I try and park as close to the horse crowd as possible, just because I know they hate it.
Best thing to do is go there in greater numbers, get right up their noses.
 

Vic

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Thanks for the support, guys!

Good idea, Newport! I'm in, as long as I don't have to work this Saturday.
 

KWIK96

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I am working away at the moment in Spartanburg. I'm in after I return 3rd March.
 
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