Jason Heffner
Enthusiast
This may not be my place to step in but aren't you exaggerating a bit? I saw the car in Florida and I remember the car running 13s. OK maybe that was a bad joke, sorry.
Warning about Elite Motorsports
- Thread starter lleone
- Start date
This may not be my place to step in but aren't you exaggerating a bit? I saw the car in Florida and I remember the car running 13s. OK maybe that was a bad joke, sorry.
99 R/T 10
Enthusiast
Oh Jason
lleone
Enthusiast
Scott? Where oh where have you gotten to?
BadVenm
Enthusiast
lleone,
Why have you not posted photo's and a list of what you found wrong like you first said you were going to?
You were pretty strong about doing it the very next morning. That has come and gone and you haven't posted anything yet.
Why have you not posted photo's and a list of what you found wrong like you first said you were going to?
You were pretty strong about doing it the very next morning. That has come and gone and you haven't posted anything yet.
lleone
Enthusiast
BadVenm,
I did not publish the address of the pictures for two reasons. The first was that Scott and I had spoken briefly and I am (still) awaiting his call back from the previous conversation. See my posts above for the details. The second reason was that I did not get the best of quality of pictures and I am bringing a different camera to the shop tomorrow. With the current set, I feel that without verbal or text explanations you'd wonder what you were seeing. I have not done text explanations because I believed I was going to have a chance to talk Scott through the pictures. That being said, the pictures are available at http://vipers.telperion.com. Check the time of your post versus the time of this post to verify that the pictures were there earlier today. I could not have done them so quickly. Click on any of the pictures for a fullsize image, but be warned that they are 1.5+ MB each.
Continued in the following post...
I did not publish the address of the pictures for two reasons. The first was that Scott and I had spoken briefly and I am (still) awaiting his call back from the previous conversation. See my posts above for the details. The second reason was that I did not get the best of quality of pictures and I am bringing a different camera to the shop tomorrow. With the current set, I feel that without verbal or text explanations you'd wonder what you were seeing. I have not done text explanations because I believed I was going to have a chance to talk Scott through the pictures. That being said, the pictures are available at http://vipers.telperion.com. Check the time of your post versus the time of this post to verify that the pictures were there earlier today. I could not have done them so quickly. Click on any of the pictures for a fullsize image, but be warned that they are 1.5+ MB each.
Continued in the following post...
lleone
Enthusiast
So BadVenm, that being said, I hope this satiates your need to call me out, regardless of my posts throughout this afternoon. Furthermore, here's the detailed list of what we have found:
- Debris in Exhaust Ports
- Oil Pan Gasket on upside down
- Pilot Brg Broken
- Oil line fitting is missing
- Spark plug from #10 is missing
- Water in Intake Ports
- Rusted Intake Valves and Seats
- Took two of us to turn the Crankshaft
- Very Dirty inside the Crankcase
- Still has scored Pistons (all except #10)
- Crankcase Bearing Surface is very rough
- Crankcase Bearing Spring is rolled over
At this point, either Scott has sent me the wrong engine or he has blantantly lied to me. I am awaiting his call to determine which.
To BadVenm specifically: If you do not think that I am a quality individual, I suggest you go back through this forum and reread all of my posts regarding Scott and Elite. I am sure that you will then realize, that I have been more than calm, rational, and impartial regarding these matters. You will also note that I have been trying to make productive posts regarding this (and analogous) situations. Reference posts involving Mark C. and Chuck B.
Please contact me directly if you have any further issues which I may clarify or resolve for you.
Sincerely,
Lou (aka lleone)
[email protected]
- Debris in Exhaust Ports
- Oil Pan Gasket on upside down
- Pilot Brg Broken
- Oil line fitting is missing
- Spark plug from #10 is missing
- Water in Intake Ports
- Rusted Intake Valves and Seats
- Took two of us to turn the Crankshaft
- Very Dirty inside the Crankcase
- Still has scored Pistons (all except #10)
- Crankcase Bearing Surface is very rough
- Crankcase Bearing Spring is rolled over
At this point, either Scott has sent me the wrong engine or he has blantantly lied to me. I am awaiting his call to determine which.
To BadVenm specifically: If you do not think that I am a quality individual, I suggest you go back through this forum and reread all of my posts regarding Scott and Elite. I am sure that you will then realize, that I have been more than calm, rational, and impartial regarding these matters. You will also note that I have been trying to make productive posts regarding this (and analogous) situations. Reference posts involving Mark C. and Chuck B.
Please contact me directly if you have any further issues which I may clarify or resolve for you.
Sincerely,
Lou (aka lleone)
[email protected]
lleone
Enthusiast
For the rest of you... I am still hoping that Scott is able to resolve this situation and that we are able to remain amicable.
Lou
Lou
BadVenm
Enthusiast
All I get an inactive, blank page. No photo's.
I clicked all over the page thinking something will come up, but nothing.
I clicked all over the page thinking something will come up, but nothing.
Vic
VCA Venom Member
- Joined
- Nov 12, 2000
- Posts
- 6,764
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Good piece of humor there!
No offense to BIGBADCJ
lleone
Enthusiast
What browser are you running? Do you have any filtering software? Are you a dialup user?
Lou
Lou
lleone
Enthusiast
OK... watch the period which was included at the end of the link. The correct link is:
http://vipers.telperion.com
Lou
http://vipers.telperion.com
Lou
BadVenm
Enthusiast
Do be so paranoid, I'm not "calling" you out, nor do I question anything about your quality. I don't even know you, so how could I?
I'm just looking for info and facts.
I have money in Scott's hands for a motor he promised will run 10.5 second 1/4 mile times when complete.
I just want to keep an eye on what is going on and you said photo's were coming with written description, and I hadn't seen it yet, that's all.
lleone
Enthusiast
No worries BadVenm. Your wording seemed to discount the other posts I made today and I just wanted to be perfectly clear as to the matter of my actions.
Are we cool?
Lou
Are we cool?
Lou
BadVenm
Enthusiast
Yes, we're cool.
The photo's pulled up on the second link, thanks!
The photo's pulled up on the second link, thanks!
lleone
Enthusiast
No problem. I am also going to post the email exchanges if things get any hairier.
Lou
Lou
lleone
Enthusiast
OK, it's almost 10:30pm EST and no word from Scott yet. I have left countless voicemails (the shop, his home, and his cell) and emails.
I am going to bed. I'm sure the soap opera will continue tomorrow.
Until then, pleasant dreams all,
Lou
I am going to bed. I'm sure the soap opera will continue tomorrow.
Until then, pleasant dreams all,
Lou
01sapphireGTS
Enthusiast
Lou: In your estimation, how much will it cost (someone) to make everything right ? What kind of money are we talking about ? $200-$800 or a SUBSTANCIAL AMOUNT ? Just curious how bad, is bad ?
1TONY1
Enthusiast
Curious, who is looking at this for you ? Were you there during the teardown ? Heres a few wierd things I noticed on your list. Don't take this as a defensive post....these are just observations.
1. A Viper Gen2 oil pan gasket cannot be put on up side down or backwards and all the bolts go in, the front of the gasket has an oil passage and the bolt holes will not line up anywhere else. It is 99% idiot proof.
2. You mean the pilot bearing in the rear of the crank ? How would that get broken ?
3. I just assembled a Viper engine and I have no idea what a "Crankcase Bearing Spring" is ???
fuelman
VCA Venom Member
[quote
Do be so paranoid, I'm not "calling" you out, nor do I question anything about your quality. I don't even know you, so how could I?
I'm just looking for info and facts.
I have money in Scott's hands for a motor he promised will run 10.5 second 1/4 mile times when complete.
I just want to keep an eye on what is going on and you said photo's were coming with written description, and I hadn't seen it yet, that's all.
[/QUOTE]
This doesn't sound good, Badvenm if I were you I get the car or engine moved over to Macedo's shop in Orlando, it is only 1.5 hours away. He'll build your motor right. Good luck Lou!
Do be so paranoid, I'm not "calling" you out, nor do I question anything about your quality. I don't even know you, so how could I?
I'm just looking for info and facts.
I have money in Scott's hands for a motor he promised will run 10.5 second 1/4 mile times when complete.
I just want to keep an eye on what is going on and you said photo's were coming with written description, and I hadn't seen it yet, that's all.
[/QUOTE]
This doesn't sound good, Badvenm if I were you I get the car or engine moved over to Macedo's shop in Orlando, it is only 1.5 hours away. He'll build your motor right. Good luck Lou!
1TONY1
Enthusiast
I " think " the engine has been shipped back and forth to NuuYoke.
Lou is a stand up guy who didn't even know me and offered to help me get a job in Upper NY! I don't even pretend to know what's going on here, other than to hope that everything works out for Lou and his car!
Best of Luck Lou!
Jay K.
Best of Luck Lou!
Jay K.
Tony:
Don't you think that the pilot bearing could easily get damaged when pulling the engine. Some people pull the engine with the trans in place and also put it back the same way. That damage might not be done by the engine builder, but, by the individual who pulled the engine.
What bothers me is a crank that doesn't easily rotate, water in the engine and galled bearings. This engine could easily need a complete rebuild. It looks like he fixed the damage from the wrist pin and ignored the damage caused by the debris from the wrist pin. It also looks like someone let residual water leak into the valve area, that is sloppy. Someone is to blame, but, the question is, who.
By the way the bearing spring is located under journal number thirteen and it is used to drop the crank one degree off of true horizontal.
Don't you think that the pilot bearing could easily get damaged when pulling the engine. Some people pull the engine with the trans in place and also put it back the same way. That damage might not be done by the engine builder, but, by the individual who pulled the engine.
What bothers me is a crank that doesn't easily rotate, water in the engine and galled bearings. This engine could easily need a complete rebuild. It looks like he fixed the damage from the wrist pin and ignored the damage caused by the debris from the wrist pin. It also looks like someone let residual water leak into the valve area, that is sloppy. Someone is to blame, but, the question is, who.
By the way the bearing spring is located under journal number thirteen and it is used to drop the crank one degree off of true horizontal.
SilverBlueGTS
Enthusiast
- Joined
- Jul 19, 2004
- Posts
- 62
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That sounds like some pretty good wisdom. Maybe a local Viper owner can go over to Scott's place and get your motor and take it to somebody like Macedo who is competent and can be trusted.
It would probably relieve Scott in a way, as this would be one less project has has to complete and can try to find time to call a few people back.
John Thompson
SilverBlueGTS
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Without question, Illeone needs to have his motor inspected, repaired and put back together by and engine shop used to doing Viper work. Either Heffner or Macedo come to mind and are in the eastern US.
2MANYTOYS
Enthusiast
Sounds like you need a lawyer.
Do you know any????
Man this really really *****. I won't be buying anything else from Elite. Too risky.
SilverBlueGTS
Enthusiast
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- Jul 19, 2004
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CJ - not trying to bring up a sore subject, but do you mind giving any details on how many time your motor failed or how many motors you went thru with Elite?
JT
JT
garolittle
Enthusiast
This is sad.
lleone
Enthusiast
Jack B - thanks for explaining about the spring.
As for the Pilot bearing, it was fine when we shipped the engine to FL.
1Tony1 - as for the gasket, I saw it with my own eyes. I know the pictures are a bit fuzzy, but if you look at the full size images, you can that is on upside down.
As for the shop, it is Extreme Performance in Webster NY. Ray Piloto and John Bosch. They have worked on several of cars including my heavily modified S4 and my previous Viper (which I greatly regret selling).
I was there when the engine was crated and there when we unpacked it.
As I said above, it looks like either Scott sent me the wrong engine or he's lying to me about rebuilding it.
Lou
As for the Pilot bearing, it was fine when we shipped the engine to FL.
1Tony1 - as for the gasket, I saw it with my own eyes. I know the pictures are a bit fuzzy, but if you look at the full size images, you can that is on upside down.
As for the shop, it is Extreme Performance in Webster NY. Ray Piloto and John Bosch. They have worked on several of cars including my heavily modified S4 and my previous Viper (which I greatly regret selling).
I was there when the engine was crated and there when we unpacked it.
As I said above, it looks like either Scott sent me the wrong engine or he's lying to me about rebuilding it.
Lou
