ACR whoops F430 and CRUSHES ZR-1 in new C&D road course test.

[1BADGTS]

If you have some "insider info" that's one thing. But for people to just start making outlandish claims that they pulled out of their rearends, then act like they're 100% sure that's the case is laughable.

And unless you are witholding more info, your statement is still not conclusive. They may have been having problems with the car, or there could be other reasons it was pulled. I went and personally looked at 3 ZR1's at a local dealership.....all 3 had coolant leaks. Of the 2 ZR1s I read about being dyno'd, one had clutch slip. There might be tons of problems with the ZR1's right now.

Doubt it was mechanical since Chevy showd up with more than one car. ZR-1 Cars were running strong and timed by Chevrolet for a few laps then SUDDENLY pulled off as heat of day rose .May be on a sidenote in the article- one Chevrolet engineer told a writer having power issues with the weather and supercharger

 

[SnakeBitten]

Word for word i was told the ZR-1 was in fact at the test(even ran a few laps )then mysteriously pulled off the track by Chevrolet as the daytime temps heated up -90 plus.Iwas told this along with the results mid in August.(I even went so far as to share the results with a few VCA members i knew would not go public )

Makes sense to me. SC car in 90+ degree weather = heat soak and lackluster lap times. Remember the GT500 in the first Lightening Lap test from 2 years ago? Suffered heat soak so bad it was barely running faster than the LL3 300hp cars.

Good marketing move by GM to pull the ZR1 if this is true. This was a very fast field this year. 4 cars destroyed the previous lap kings record. The ZR1 would have to be on top of its game in this field or else look like overpriced tupperware. I for one want to see it perform at the top of its game. Hopefully there will be a fall or winter comparo test with the usual suspects and the ZR1.

 

[1BADGTS]

Identical thing happens to the Ford GT as well.On a hot day dyno between the 1 and 4 pulls they lose over 75 horsepower to the tire.A lot of guys roadracing them are pulling the blowers for this reason.

 

[Grant]

Identical thing happens to the Ford GT as well.On a hot day dyno between the 1 and 4 pulls they lose over 75 horsepower to the tire.A lot of guys roadracing them are pulling the blowers for this reason.

I've never seen a water/air intercooler work as well as a bigass front-mount air-air unit. Intake temps on the terminator mustangs can easily hit 150F, even with lowish ~15 psi of boost. If I owned a ZR1, I'd consider going to a centrifugal setup with a FMIC.

 

[1BADGTS]

Makes sense to me. SC car in 90+ degree weather = heat soak and lackluster lap times. Remember the GT500 in the first Lightening Lap test from 2 years ago? Suffered heat soak so bad it was barely running faster than the LL3 300hp cars.

Good marketing move by GM to pull the ZR1 if this is true. This was a very fast field this year. 4 cars destroyed the previous lap kings record. The ZR1 would have to be on top of its game in this field or else look like overpriced tupperware. I for one want to see it perform at the top of its game. Hopefully there will be a fall or winter comparo test with the usual suspects and the ZR1.

Exactly the GM engineers and inturn marketing people know the cars forte is 0-150-0 not the Lightening Lap conducted in the summer heat(these guys are not stupid -they knew in this particular test the ACR beat them).The last thing they wanted was a bad showing (alot of sales are determined from magazines BRAGGING RIGHTS )to directly coincide with the cars public intro

 

[Grant]

Exactly the GM engineers and inturn marketing people know the cars forte is 0-150-0 not the Lightening Lap conducted in the summer heat(these guys are not stupid -they knew in this particular test the ACR beat them).The last thing they wanted was a bad showing (alot of sales are determined from magazines BRAGGING RIGHTS )to directly coincide with the cars public intro

You've also got to consider the tires, which are often more important than power. Pilot Sport Cups eat 90F weather for breakfast, lunch and dinner. I'd be surprised if PS2s worked nearly as well in the heat.

I'd really like to see some logs and a tune from a ZR1, to see what the intake temps are hitting, and how the ECU reacts to that. Coolant temps can also be an issue; before adjusting fueling-coolant temp tables in the ECU, my heads/cam C5 started to knock around the 215F mark.

 

[1BADGTS]

I've never seen a water/air intercooler work as well as a bigass front-mount air-air unit. Intake temps on the terminator mustangs can easily hit 150F, even with lowish ~15 psi of boost. If I owned a ZR1, I'd consider going to a centrifugal setup with a FMIC.

Definately my buddy runs a Roe on his Gen2 and the intake air temps reach 165 degrees .Our engine builder warns him all the times about roadracing the thing in the summer Gm figures how many people are going to roadrace this car.They will market the thing as the greatest thing out there from 0-150-0

 

[SnakeBitten]

Exactly the GM engineers and inturn marketing people know the cars forte is 0-150-0 not the Lightening Lap conducted in the summer heat(these guys are not stupid -they knew in this particular test the ACR beat them).The last thing they wanted was a bad showing (alot of sales are determined from magazines BRAGGING RIGHTS )to directly coincide with the cars public intro

Right but I dont think GM would mind losing on track to the ACR as they can use the "racecar vs GT car" escape clause. Remember they didnt even mention the Viper as a competitor to there ZR1 as its a GT car. But to lose to the GTR would have been crushing. As the heat rose that senario began to look like a very real possibility. I think they were more scared of losing to the much cheaper and less powerful GTR than the Viper. Nothing to gain from that risk.

BTW wish they had the GT2 and LP560 in there as well...

 

[1BADGTS]

Right but I dont think GM would mind losing on track to the ACR as they can use the "racecar vs GT car" escape clause. Remember they didnt even mention the Viper as a competitor to there ZR1 as its a GT car. But to lose to the GTR would have been crushing. As the heat rose that senario began to look like a very real possibility. I think they were more scared of losing to the much cheaper and less powerful GTR than the Viper. Nothing to gain from that risk.

BTW wish they had the GT2 and LP560 in there as well...

Could very well be .Its all about marketing in reality a loss to any of the above coinciding directly with the cars introduction (cars released to the public last weelk mag released this week )is not going to help sales.Magazines(esp bragging rights ) can DIRECTLY affect auto sales

 

[avilab]

With regards to the ZR1, it is what it is. Maybe the engineers recognized a good possibility of being embarrassed, so pulled the car. Run what you brung, GM.

I just wish that mags would have the cajones to call it like it is. Currently, the ZR1 can do no wrong according to all the popular mags (gracing the front cover of pretty much all of them right now), but no one, I mean no one, will bad mouth them since GM evidently still pays decent advertising dollars. I just want one popular mag to say "You're better off buying a naturally aspirated Viper ACR, and you'll save a few bucks at it, and be King of the Hill (or Ring)". Just give credit where it's due is all I'm saying. Yet these same rags currently rate the ACR as 'unrealistic as a street car' and 'too beastly' to win comparo's, even though it's dominated on more and more tracks.

 

[Warfang]

If you have some "insider info" that's one thing. But for people to just start making outlandish claims that they pulled out of their rearends, then act like they're 100% sure that's the case is laughable.

And unless you are witholding more info, your statement is still not conclusive. They may have been having problems with the car, or there could be other reasons it was pulled. I went and personally looked at 3 ZR1's at a local dealership.....all 3 had coolant leaks. Of the 2 ZR1s I read about being dyno'd, one had clutch slip. There might be tons of problems with the ZR1's right now.

Not outlandish if you know how the industry works... which you obviously don't.

 

[Warfang]

Doubt it was mechanical since Chevy showd up with more than one car. ZR-1 Cars were running strong and timed by Chevrolet for a few laps then SUDDENLY pulled off as heat of day rose .May be on a sidenote in the article- one Chevrolet engineer told a writer having power issues with the weather and supercharger

That's a HUGE maybe. But maybe since you've outed the quote, the mag might be compelled to put it in. My guess is they'll conveniently forget the ZR1 was there.

Chevy should include a thermometer that says FAST when cool and SLOW when hot.

 

[Warfang]

Exactly the GM engineers and inturn marketing people know the cars forte is 0-150-0 not the Lightening Lap conducted in the summer heat(these guys are not stupid -they knew in this particular test the ACR beat them).The last thing they wanted was a bad showing (alot of sales are determined from magazines BRAGGING RIGHTS )to directly coincide with the cars public intro

Hey... I thought you said in another thread the editors and writer are above doing all that? I mean if they didn't give a rat's @$$ about ad dollars, wouldn't announcing that the ZR1 chickened out be an interesting read for the readers? Something tells me there will be many covers of ZR1 0-150-0 bragging rights accompanied by many GM ads.

 

[avilab]

Exactly, mags won't bite the advertising hand that feeds them.

 

[1BADGTS]

I was told GM gave no official reason for pulling the cars off the track.Unofficially an engineer told a writer (dont know if that was on the QT and inturn published )that the weather was causing them issues.

 

[1BADGTS]

Guys i realize the entire issue revolves aroung hearsay between writers of different magazines but in this particular case (and quite a few others over the years )the test results came out exactly the way i was told they would be a few months ago .

 

[SylvanSRT]

i think that the Mosler is just fantastic !

 

[1BADGTS]

Hey... I thought you said in another thread the editors and writer are above doing all that? I mean if they didn't give a rat's @$$ about ad dollars, wouldn't announcing that the ZR1 chickened out be an interesting read for the readers? Something tells me there will be many covers of ZR1 0-150-0 bragging rights accompanied by many GM ads.

It all depends on what engineer was there with what writer (alot of them develop personal relationships working together over the years.)

 

[Disturbed]

I think the most surprising result is the Chevy Cobalt SS Turbo. Beat the Evo, Audi S5, G37 Sport and WRX STI. First by far in it's class. How is that even possible?

Yea...and it's FWD too! The cobalt SS is a great car.

 

[418viper]

Don't know where they came up with 62,000$ for the Z51, just picked up a brand new one with GM supplier for just over 41,000.

Don't quite understand why they use the 4.2 mile course instead of the 3.7 mile course.
The big cube cars would really stretch their legs on the shorter course !

 

[SnakeBitten]

Don't know where they came up with 62,000$ for the Z51, just picked up a brand new one with GM supplier for just over 41,000.

Don't quite understand why they use the 4.2 mile course instead of the 3.7 mile course.
The big cube cars would really stretch their legs on the shorter course !

In the very first Lightening Lap 2 years ago they said they chose the 4.2 mile circuit as its the closest thing to the Nurburgring with its turns and elevation changes that we had stateside. I cant find the article but I believe that was the reasoning if memory serves.