Dropping from third gear into second - What can you get away with?

[Rocketman66]

I usually run in 3rd gear on the city streets because I love the ability to step on the gas and move quickly. Yesterday I opened it up against a motorcycle and dropped it into second gear at about 50 mph. The rearend shifted sideways somewhat. What speeds can you get away with by shifting it into a lower gear to generate Horsepower?

 

[Viperzilla]

Match the throttle with the clutch, this way you don't catch the tires from "sleeping" then waking up w/ a spin. That's the only thing I can think of since I'm not an owner.

 

[genXgts]

At max RPM 2nd is good for right around 60, so your hitting right about the max at 50, to snick it down and get a solid 10mph (about a second?) before hitting third. Anything more than 50 and the shift down to second would be useless in my book and cost time!!

Get some Kumhos and you can come down to first on a full throttle snick and nary a chirp, it's nuts!!

 

[Vipersrule]

I took the advice from this board that 60MPH in second was good. Since then I've tried it several times - and it's amazing.

Just remember to rev your RPM's up in the 4000+ range before you drop into second.

But when you do - it's one heck of a hole shot. I've never had any problem with grip - and I have stock tires.

3rd is really good around 80MPH with the RPMs high as well. Anytime I'm over 60 I try to stay with third. But then I'm pretty conservative on the streets.

 

[Vipersrule]

At max RPM 2nd is good for right around 60, so your hitting right about the max at 50, to snick it down and get a solid 10mph (about a second?) before hitting third. Anything more than 50 and the shift down to second would be useless in my book and cost time!!

GenX - what gears are you running? I find that 60+ is still good in second for me - I'm not at max at 60. Somewhere around 70 I'm getting there.

Could it be different gears?

 

[genXgts]

Hey Rule I'll have to try and find the max speed at 6000, I thought it was right in the 60-62 range.

Moreso thought that from the wild 0-60 times that seem to range from 3.9 to 4.5 from the 'rags, thinking the slower guys banged into third to get such a cruddy time?

I'll add it to this thread when I get some info, as I run 3.07s.......

 

[Marv S]

You'll be past 80 mph in second before the rev limiter kicks in if you have stock 3.07 rear gear.

Even with 3.55 gear you'll be in the mid 70 range.

 

[Magicboy2]

With stock gearing, 2nd will take you significantly higher than 60 mph.

 

[nickdiaz]

Glad you asked that, Rocketman. I've only owned my new '02 RT/10 a little over a week, so I'm still getting the hang of things. I don't have much opportunity to leave the suburbs, so am usually driving about 45mph. I've been keeping it in 4th when cruising to keep the RPMs around 1500, then dropping it to 2nd when I need a power kick (although it accelerates from 4th in normal traffic just fine).

I've only seen the back end sway out like you're talking about when dropping to 2nd and going WOT from over 50mph. Never from 40-50.

I really need driving lessons or something to figure out the power control at each speed and RPM.

 

[Magicboy2]

The key is starting out gentle and learning the car's limits.

Here's how my 3-2 shifts go:

(say I'm at 45 mph or so)

-Clutch in
-Give the throttle a sharp tap to match the RPMs to where they will be when you hit second, which is probably ~4k in a stock car.
-Let the clutch out somewhat sharply. If you matched the RPMs properly, this should be nice and smooth. Foot is only on the gas lightly right now, just enough to keep the engine at speed.
-NOW you can get on the power. If you nail the gas, the rear tires will probably break loose, so squeeze your way up to full throttle more on the gentle side at first. Subsiquent times, as you learn the car's limits, you can get on it harder.

Also remember, if the rear steps out, it's cause you are either on a bad road, or becuase you didn't have the wheels pointing perfectly straight ahead. I've spun the wheels plenty of times, but because the front was well pointed, the rears just hopped and spun till I backed off.

Hope this helps.

 

[matt lankford]

i can go 59 in 1st. how are you maxing out 2nd at 60

 

[RockStar]

Please describe what happens when the rev limiter kicks in. I got stuck passing a car in 1st, and when I stomped on it (I was showing a cop friend of mine what it would do) the rpm's just died right before I shifted. I'm running 3:55 gears, and it was around 6000 when it choked up. Was this the limiter kicking in?

 

[Russ Oasis]

When the rev limiter kicks in it is like the gas was momentarily shut off. You probably hit it.

 

[MannyC]

Do the very early Gen I's have rev limiters too? I assume most sports cars would have them.

 

[ceieio]

For a 96 GTS:

335-35-17's,
2nd Gear ratio: 1.78
Axle Ratio: 3.07

60mph = 4200 RPM
78.5mph = 5500 RPM

Craig

 

[Paolo Castellano]

I usually run in 3rd gear on the city streets because I love the ability to step on the gas and move quickly. Yesterday I opened it up against a motorcycle and dropped it into second gear at about 50 mph. The rearend shifted sideways somewhat. What speeds can you get away with by shifting it into a lower gear to generate Horsepower?

RPM1st2nd3rd4th5th6thGear

RPM 1 2 3 4 5 6
2000 19 29 39 51 69 102
2100 20 30 41 53 72 107
2200 21 31 43 56 76 112
2300 22 33 45 58 79 117
2400 23 34 47 61 82 122
2500 24 36 49 64 86 127
2600 25 37 51 66 89 132
2700 26 39 53 69 93 137
2800 27 40 55 71 96 142
2900 28 41 57 74 100 147
3000 29 43 59 76 103 153
3100 30 44 61 79 106 158
3200 31 46 63 81 110 163
3300 32 47 65 84 113 168
3400 32 49 66 86 117 173
3500 33 50 68 89 120 178
3600 34 51 70 92 124 183
3700 35 53 72 94 127 188
3800 36 54 74 97 131 193
3900 37 56 76 99 134 198
4000 38 57 78 102 137 203
4100 39 59 80 104 141 208
4200 40 60 82 107 144 214
4300 41 61 84 109 148 219
4400 42 63 86 112 151 224
4500 43 64 88 114 155 229
4600 44 66 90 117 158 234
4700 45 67 92 119 161 239
4800 46 69 94 122 165 244
4900 47 70 96 125 168 249
5000 48 71 98 127 172 254
5100 49 73 100 130 175 259
5200 50 74 102 132 179 264
5300 51 76 104 135 182 269
5400 52 77 106 137 186 275
5500 53 79 108 140 189 280
5600 54 80 110 142 192 285
5700 54 81 111 145 196 290
5800 55 83 113 147 199 295
5900 56 84 115 150 203 300
6000 57 86 117 153 206 305
6100 58 87 119 155 210 310
6200 59 89 121 158 213 315


There you have it!==> From a roll, always try to be around 4500 RPM to start.

 

[George Murray]

Paolo - Why am I hitting only 314 MPH at 6200 in 6th? Too many burnouts?

 

[Viperzilla]

Do the very early Gen I's have rev limiters too? I assume most sports cars would have them.

Superbar, I think all "modern day" cars have them. My '91 Mazda 323 hatchback has a rev limiter. It was pretty scary when I hit it in 3rd at about 65-70 trying to pass someone on a one lane-each way road before becoming mangled with a Chrysler 300M. I made it barely.

When the rev limiter kicks in it is like the gas was momentarily shut off. You probably hit it.

Russ is correct. For more detail, all the rev limiter will do is shut the gas off for a split second and your revs will drop and pick right back up if you don't let off the gas.

Top speed in 1st gear in a Viper is about 60 (as you can tell by Paolo's graph).

 

[slaughterj]

6200 59 89 121 158 213 315

Hmm, I seem to need to shift to 5th at around 145mph, am I just being conservative??

 

[Mike 99ACR]

Just make sure your pointed straight.

 

[Jerry Scott[CO]]

Kip Partridge makes a modified stock shifter that helps prevent the 3 to 2 shifting error when you want 3 to 4. He adds more spring force to the left gate so that it is more difficult to errantly shift from 3 to 2. I have one and it works very well on the track. He can modify your unit or do an exchange. His phone is: 303-697-5821. E-mail me for a picture of the shifter.
Jerry Scott

 

[Viperzilla]

from original poster: Yesterday I opened it up against a motorcycle and dropped it into second gear at about 50 mph. The rearend shifted sideways somewhat. What speeds can you get away with by shifting it into a lower gear to generate Horsepower?

He meant to shift from 3rd to 2nd. No flame.

Kip Partridge makes a modified stock shifter that helps prevent this shifting error.

 

[Paolo Castellano]

6200 59 89 121 158 213 315

Hmm, I seem to need to shift to 5th at around 145mph, am I just being conservative??

Slaughter, I was lazy this morning. I just typed in the tire size and let the calculator use the manufacturer's referenced tire diameter for overall diameter. The manufacturer's size listed in the specifications is a little higher than It actually is. The orbital gears page gives it 25.4" overall diameter which makes for 6250 58 86 118 154 208 308. I find the tire size is more like 25.9" if the speedo is accurate for 100 MPH in 6th being 2000 RPM and 4000 RPM in 4th at 100.6200 59 87 120 156 210 311 is with 25.9" overall diameter. I have shifted at around 150 into 5th before when racing a bike.

 

[Paolo Castellano]

Paolo - Why am I hitting only 314 MPH at 6200 in 6th? Too many burnouts?

George, You are only hitting 314 MPH because you are changing hands and losing a stroke! I don't know what else to tell you!