Gen 4 intake from K&N, 18HP....

[FikseGTS]

K&N has an intake system for the Gen 4 now, they say 18HP on their dyno, can't tell if their box seals against the hood?

» Dodge Viper Gen 4 Intake by K&N adds 18HP – 69-2527TTR


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[99 R/T 10]

The dyno graph looks wrong.................................

 

[TAILWAG]

wait a second...418rwhp from an 08'???????????????????

 

[ViperGeorge]

Why did they run it in 3rd? I thought dyno runs were normally done at whatever ratio is close to 1:1. That would be 4th in a Viper.

 

[gb66gth]

seems a bit pricey as well

 

[Art 138]

I would want to see more testing....but 18hp over stock on the intake would be nice.....it would appear that the box would have to seal against the hood for maximun effect....

 

[waltershu]

I'm going to have to see a fourth gear run,before i bite.

 

[FikseGTS]

those numbers are not peak, they are just showing the peak gain.... still, looks like a gen 3 dyno.....

wait a second...418rwhp from an 08'???????????????????

 

[Martin]

Perhaps they tested a 2008 car with a Gen II engine in it? Can't think of any other reason that graph would look the way it does. Maybe someone out there will look up the dyno graph they did on a Gen II and see if it's the same graph with different markups on it.

Edit: actually took a minute to click the link. Looks like the dyno is just plain off for whatever reason. Seems kind of weird that they wouldn't have done some troubleshooting to see what was going on. They're in the neighborhood of 100 hp short of where they should be at for that engine. If they're going to spend the effort to develop a performance part like this, and then spend the time to dyno test it, you'd think they would notice that the engine is putting out 100 hp less than it should. For me, a dyno graph of an engine that looks like it's all screwed up doesn't give me any confidence that the performance part will live up to the advertised claims. If they showed an engine that went from 560 rwhp to 580 rwhp, I'd be impressed.

 

[M_viper]

Isnt the K&N drop in intake filter better? and does any type of intake filter other then the stock gives an check engine light?

 

[VIPER GTSR 91]

Isnt the K&N drop in intake filter better? and does any type of intake filter other then the stock gives an check engine light?

Yes and No. I put the new K/N filter in my new 09 and no cel.

 

[FLL-B/W-GTS]

I have had the K&N drop in filter for 6 months in my Gen 4.Fits perfect,run great and no check engine light at all.

 

[Richie7]

The intake looks promising but I agree there are some issues with that dyno. Why run the dyno in 3rd gear instead of 4th? Could that have affected the dyno number? Also they used a Superflow dyno which could possibly read lower than other dyno's, but I can't see it being 80-100hp lower! Maybe the experts out there can give some insight. For $500+ bucks I want to be sure it is going to work.

 

[FLL-B/W-GTS]

I like the new system for the Viper.I had one like it for my C6 Z06.However,I think you may get a cel with the new system(Air Charger).I will wait for now,if it is reported no cel with 18 hp gain,I will get one asap.

2008 Viper Coupe
2009 Corvette ZR1

 

[99FRC]

Third gear? Looks good but I would like some more dyno runs in 4th gear.

 

[JonB]

IN STOCK at PartsRack, and below $500 VCA....[but not much below! MSRP is $799 !!!!!!!]

 

[Viper X]

We've done dyno days at DC Performance's the last three years.

Gen IV bone stock rwhp on DC Performance's dyno averages about 510. Granted, his dynojet dyno reads a bit lower than most by a few percentage points.

I would like to see more info on this product on a "known" dyno with a few "before and after" 4th gear pulls.

Dan

 

[mjorgensen Woodhouse]

The stock air box that SRT designed is sealed because it will work as a ram air affect at higher speeds giving you more HP than the dyno can show on the top end...with that said look at the rear and top of this set up and decide for yourself if it IS worth doing. Plus the TB's are very sensitive hence the flex hoses from the factory. This is just food for thought, mine will stay stock though.

 

[Newport Viper]

The stock air box that SRT designed is sealed because it will work as a ram air affect at higher speeds giving you more HP than the dyno can show on the top end...with that said look at the rear and top of this set up and decide for yourself if it IS worth doing.

Mark is that true of the Gen 3?

Here is the nice tight fit you get with the Gen 3 K&N set up.

 

[Skeeter Blanton]

I called K&N and asked what the torque figures were and their answer was "We did not dyno the torque figures"....

 

[SilveRT8]

I called K&N and asked what the torque figures were and their answer was "We did not dyno the torque figures"....

Geez!!! How amateur can this be?
My Grand Mother can come-up with better answers than this

 

[redtanrt10]

K&N has an intake system for the Gen 4 now, they say 18HP on their dyno, can't tell if their box seals against the hood?

» Dodge Viper Gen 4 Intake by K&N adds 18HP – 69-2527TTR


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Fikse,

Look at this picture, it seems like the cones are taller than the box so I can't see how it would seal against the hood?

http://www.knfilters.com/news/news.aspx?ID=2328

 

[TrackAire]

I'm really hoping that the K&N system can produce an additional 18hp....but I keep thinking at what cost?? I remember seeing tons of dyno graphs from multiple cold air intake companies for the SUV and Pickup market, especially when these things took off 7 to 8 years ago. What was interesting is many dyno charts saw a loss of power at 2000 rpm, and a gain at 4800 rpm for example. In reality, how many SUV's and 4wd trucks actually stay at those upper rpms for more than a few seconds? Most SUVs and trucks spend the majority of their time at the 2000 rpm range. Many of the all steel kits would get very badly heat soaked when in stop and go driving and give very sluggish performance until cooled off (ie, highway speeds).

Here's a couple of questions maybe some experts on the forum can answer for me.

How would it be best to measure the performance gain of something like this using a dyno...average power gain under a specific rpm range (for a Viper, maybe between 3000 and 6000 rpm)? Peak numbers can be munipulated so easy on a dyno, I don't think it's fair to claim a performance increase just because you picked one narrow range on a dyno curve. You may have lost a lot more outside that specific point on the curve (hopefully not).

Would a better test be a rolling start from 20 mph in second gear to 120 mph timed run? I would think this would give better real world results in proving if my is Viper faster with the K&N or not.

Last question, I know that many of our computer systems "self learn" for optimum performance. Is there a possibility that the computer will allow a K&N system (or any other type of cold air kit) to actually make more power than stock at first, but then after re-adjusting the air flows, density, etc start to end up back to stock hp levels after 100 to 200 miles of driving? In other words, if the stock system supplies the needed cfm 98% of the time, would changing the cfm flow rate at specific rpms fool the computer into making additional hp for a short time until it re-learns the flow patterns? (I hope this makes sense)

I really hope the K&N deal is for real...there are just so few products for the GEN IV motors. It's one thing to spend the money and not get any performance improvement (I think we've all done that with one product or another), but totally unacceptable to actually lose performance. I just want to have more facts and proof before I take the plunge.

Cheers,
George

 

[CitySnake]

For what it's worth, the SRT Engineers, when asked directly about the new intake, made it abundantly clear that the GEN 4 OE intake had been re-engineered to maximize HP & TQ. That was their same answer when asked if an aftermarket intake/filter might help (as it has helped with previous generations).

 

[Catwood]

I called K&N and asked what the torque figures were and their answer was "We did not dyno the torque figures"....

Per K&N site

K&N’s Research and Development Department tested a 2008 Dodge Viper 8.4-liter V10 on our in-house dynamometer. Results showed horsepower increases throughout the RPM range with a shocking peak horsepower gain of 18.69 horsepower @ 5,300 RPM! 69-2527TTR provides improved performance with attractive red powder coated aluminum intake tubes to match the 2008 Viper’s valve covers.


Since TQ equals HP at 5250RPM then about 18.868 of TQ

 

[JonB]

For what it's worth, the SRT Engineers, when asked directly about the new intake, made it abundantly clear that the GEN 4 OE intake had been re-engineered to maximize HP & TQ. That was their same answer when asked if an aftermarket intake/filter might help (as it has helped with previous generations).

CITY... that engineering comment was in-re the KN FILTER, not this new FIPK kit.

I shared the new kit info with SRT (unofficially) and they also poo-poohed the kit a bit(unofficially.)

The kit is GORGEOUS and some folks would want it for cosmetics, even if it made NO HP. I cannot beleive that KN would falsify these claims, since KNs owner has a couple cars and tracks them.....

Initial tuner dynos DO show the HP [with the hood open,] but the HP gain drops as the hood closes. ZERO MPH. FANS CANNOT ACHIEVE COLD AIRFLOW with a floor-fan! And the adaptive nature of the PCM needs 4-6 drives to learn the new flow! So we have to trust KN til the drag-results and SOTP results are verified....

INSTALLED:

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[SilveRT8]

Correct me if I'm wrong but this system seems to take air ONLY from the hood scoop opening.
It was discussed before that the Gen 4 takes most of it's air from the front grille and only a small part from the hood scoop when I had previously removed the rain deflector from the hood scoop and was getting a cel light at WOT.
I would like to get more proof on this system, before making a buying decision, as last year I bought the KN flat filter (RX8 type)and smooth tubes and saw a drop of power and torque on the dyno.

 

[mjorgensen Woodhouse]

Correct me if I'm wrong but this system seems to take air ONLY from the hood scoop opening.
It was discussed before that the Gen 4 takes most of it's air from the front grille and only a small part from the hood scoop when I had previously removed the rain deflector from the hood scoop and was getting a cel light at WOT.
I would like to get more proof on this system, before making a buying decision, as last year I bought the KN flat filter (RX8 type)and smooth tubes and saw a drop of power and torque on the dyno.

The box stock is sealed around the hood opening. The Comp Coupes were designed to use the fascia openings for air not the street car. I have had my rain deflector out since day one and never have had a CEL.

 

[TrackAire]

Well I can't say if it will work as well as it looks, but Kudo's to K&N for making a very nice looking kit and spending the money to do a GEN IV kit when they did (dyno test was back in March IIRC)....at that time who knew if there would even be a future Viper.

Hopefully more vendors will follow through with more aftermarket performance parts for the GEN IV.

Cheers,
George

 

[Richie7]

Do you have to take out the rain defector for this intake system? That deflector seems so restrictive that it wouldn't matter what filter you had in there.
I hope this system works but I will wait to see a real dyno done the right way.. no 3rd gear pulls, no mysteriously missing torque curves...