Gen V & Challenger Hellcat

[STL RT/10]

So it appears to be official that the 2015 SRT Challenger Hellcat will have 600 HP+. What does everyone make of this? I almost expect the "refresh" for Viper to have to include a power increase now. I know they are completely different cars, but HP is a major factor regardless. I cannot imagine a Viper only having less than 40 HP over a Challenger. This will be interesting.

 

[Bubba 2.9]

I have a 2014 GT500 with 740 at the wheels. I love the 2013 Viper. It uses the power so much more efficiently than my GT500. Sometimes as car guys we all read too much and get caught up in the numbers. My Viper has got plenty of grunt. I don't feel like the Viper is lacking anything having less hp than my GT500. The car is fn awesome. JD

 

[fuelman]

The Challenger will weigh in above 4000 lbs, even with the same HP, it won't beat a Viper, but I bet it is gonna do incredible burnouts...

 

[Bobpantax]

Having recently parted with my supercharged, diff and suspension modified Challenger ( an incredible car), I can assure you that the cars are apples and oranges. The Challenger now, and for 2015, will weigh more than 4000 pounds. Even if the Hellcat has more than 640 HP, it's weight to HP ratio will be considerably higher than the Viper's and the Hellcat will not keep up with a Gen V on a road course. While the Hellcat will handle well for a car of its size on a road course (as stated in the video), its primary mission is great straight line drag strip performance,which will be easy to obtain with the eight speed auto transmission, some drag radials and a well prepped drag strip. The goal was to beat the Mustang GT500 and the Camaro Zl1 at the drag strip and it will be exciting to see that happen.

 

[bluesrt]

yep yep yep

 

[PeterMJ]

Having recently parted with my supercharged, diff and suspension modified Challenger ( an incredible car), I can assure you that the cars are apples and oranges. The Challenger now, and for 2015, will weigh more than 4000 pounds. Even if the Hellcat has more than 640 HP, it's weight to HP ratio will be considerably higher than the Viper's and the Hellcat will not keep up with a Gen V on a road course. While the Hellcat will handle well for a car of its size on a road course (as stated in the video), its primary mission is great straight line drag strip performance,which will be easy to obtain with the eight speed auto transmission, some drag radials and a well prepped drag strip. The goal was to beat the Mustang GT500 and the Camaro Zl1 at the drag strip and it will be exciting to see that happen.

Ford did not bump power on Shelby until GT was no longer produced. GM kept the hp lower on supercharged versions of Camaro and CTSV than on ZR1. Marketing is not about facts, it is mainly about perception. By all accounts, Viper should gain a supercharger, either across the board or at least as a version replacing the GTS. This would be a smart thing to do and would definitely motivate people to buy Viper and let it survive. At least IMO, Hellcat is a very catchy name for a car, bad boy image for sure. Outrageousness and insanity can sell cars in the Viper league considerably more effectively than refinement. Even history of Viper itself demonstrates it quite well.

 

[DMan]

We all know this is apples and oranges. It's not like the GT500 puts the smack down on F & L cars because it makes gobs more HP & TQ. Look at the anemic TQ numbers from a Porsche Turbo S by comparison, yet look at the 10 sec quarter of the Porsche vs the slip sliding GT500. I wouldn't be surprised by some modest uptick but they've already said with legailities and tech, the V10 is near it's peak ability already. MOPAR may offer a SC, but factory, I dunno bout that ever happening. And I have a '14 GT500 with 700rwhp, ad that's the type of power it needs, aka modifications including tires, to get into respectable low 11 sec runs, the stock tire setup on a GT500 is just stupid, it's like driving in the rain in terms of traction. I just swapped my stock wheels back on for the weekend while working on something & it was comical, any throttle greater than 70% and they went up in smoke in any gear. And again, this is only referencing straight line & not even getting into true handling perf which would be worse than apples & oranges.

It's cool though, it's nice SRT has other cars/models ... but how about that viper though .. vert??

 

[PeterMJ]

We all know this is apples and oranges. It's not like the GT500 puts the smack down on F & L cars because it makes gobs more HP & TQ. Look at the anemic TQ numbers from a Porsche Turbo S by comparison, yet look at the 10 sec quarter of the Porsche vs the slip sliding GT500. I wouldn't be surprised by some modest uptick but they've already said with legailities and tech, the V10 is near it's peak ability already. MOPAR may offer a SC, but factory, I dunno bout that ever happening. And I have a '14 GT500 with 700rwhp, ad that's the type of power it needs, aka modifications including tires, to get into respectable low 11 sec runs, the stock tire setup on a GT500 is just stupid, it's like driving in the rain in terms of traction. I just swapped my stock wheels back on for the weekend while working on something & it was comical, any throttle greater than 70% and they went up in smoke in any gear. And again, this is only referencing straight line & not even getting into true handling perf which would be worse than apples & oranges.

It's cool though, it's nice SRT has other cars/models ... but how about that viper though .. vert??

Understood and agreed and this is why I clearly stated marketing is based on perception instead of facts. I am pretty sure I will not be shopping for either Mustang or Challenger anytime soon

 

[05Commemorative]

Why is this not viewed as only positive news. Dodge gets a higher hp pony car to compete with mustang and Camaro. Good thing and about time. It is really nothing more or less than that. Not sure how or even why the Viper comes up in the conversation.

 

[DMan]

Why is this not viewed as only positive news. Dodge gets a higher hp pony car to compete with mustang and Camaro. Good thing and about time. It is really nothing more or less than that. Not sure how or even why the Viper comes up in the conversation.

^^^^ this. It's all good, but what about the viper vert? (lol)

 

[GONABITE]

The Hellcat is going to be awesome!! My SRT8 bone stock ran 12.4s, with the hellcat having another 125-140 HP it should see mid 11s easy. The Challenger is a great car, classic styling, comfortable interior, capable handling and great power. Job well done SRT.

 

[Stealth]

Dodge needs competition for the ZL1 and Hypo Mustang that is coming. It also needs a price-point volume car (the Viper will never fit this bill). For bragging rights I agree, I would like to see the Viper as king of the hill in stated power. However, as noted above the Challenger and Charger are not likely to outperform the Viper in any parameter other than dyno pulls.

Let's see what happens with the Viper in the C & D Lightning Lap!

 

[ViperJohn]

^^^^ this. It's all good, but what about the viper vert? (lol)

Dave.....I get the feeling you might be in the market for a Gen V convertible........is that possible?

 

[DMan]

Dave.....I get the feeling you might be in the market for a Gen V convertible........is that possible?

Hells to the yea.

But, like it seems to matters. lol

 

[Bobpantax]

The title of this thread should be "Gen V AND Hellcat Challenger". They will be great stable mates. Both cars are not meant for everyone but both cars are definitely meant for those people who yearn for exceptional looks and performance and can afford it.

 

[HANKFAN]

I have a 2014 GT500 with 740 at the wheels. I love the 2013 Viper. It uses the power so much more efficiently than my GT500. Sometimes as car guys we all read too much and get caught up in the numbers. My Viper has got plenty of grunt. I don't feel like the Viper is lacking anything having less hp than my GT500. The car is fn awesome. JD

Which car is faster in a straight line on the street, your GT500 or Viper?

 

[FLL-B/W-GTS]

On the street/track,the 560Hp/556 Tk/AWL/DCT w/LC.,10 second bone stock 911 Turbo S will destroy everything from the dig and thru the quarter,except a Mclaren or Bugatti..Period...
Smart Engineering will trump HP numbers all day long in modern HP cars...

991/911 TS is the best 10 second grand highway/autobahn cruiser ever invented....

 

[Bobpantax]

Maybe so but this post is not relevant to this discussion. No one is discussing a Porsche.

On the street/track,the 560Hp/556 Tk/AWL/DCT w/LC.,10 second bone stock 911 Turbo S will destroy everything from the dig and thru the quarter,except a Mclaren or Bugatti..Period...
Smart Engineering will trump HP numbers all day long in modern HP cars...

991/911 TS is the best 10 second grand highway/autobahn cruiser ever invented....

 

[STL RT/10]

Good comments from all. Please don't get me wrong, I'm excited about the Hellcat, just that HP numbers mean a lot to many. I know the Gen V will run circles around the Hellcat and many others. It just comes down to perception and how much more buyers will pay for roughly the same power, but more refined and usable. The new Hellcat is bound to be a success.

 

[DMan]

Maybe so but this post is not relevant to this discussion. No one is discussing a Porsche.

Lots of people are talking about the Porsche turbo S, over on the Camaro forums, since the Z28 smacked it on a real track. Another example how a car that is good in a straight line, faster by almost 1.5 secs, falls when turns are involved. I wonder if the new Challenger will be the next to beat the Turbo S around a track. How 'bout that vert though? ;-)

 

[Free2go]

The Hellcat Challenger will do three things well: look cool, sound nasty, and smoke the tires. That's all muscle cars were ever good at. The Viper is a sports car. The Challenger was designed specifically for the redneck a$$hole. The Viper was designed for a much more refined professional a$$hole...

 

[FLL-B/W-GTS]

Sure discussing a Porsche,GT500 or others is relevant to this forum, as we are discussing straight line street performance,a place were the 911 Turbo S happens to dominate..... That Hellcat is all good and with a automatic and that much HP it will give a Gen 5 a hell of a run or may beat it on the street/strip,esp w/good tires....

SRT had better step up big time with HP and other improvements with the 15 model Viper with all this competition,esp that new Z or it be end of new Vipers....We shall see...

 

[PeterMJ]

Sure discussing a Porsche,GT500 or others is relevant to this forum, as we are discussing straight line street performance,a place were the 911 Turbo S happens to dominate..... That Hellcat is all good and with a automatic and that much HP it will give a Gen 5 a hell of a run or may beat it on the street/strip,esp w/good tires....

SRT had better step up big time with HP and other improvements with the 15 model Viper with all this competition,esp that new Z or it be end of new Vipers....We shall see...

The new Z06 is heavier and has less hp than even the current Gen 5, how is this exactly a reason for Viper's demise? The latest GTR is faster in straight line and handles better than the latest Turbo S. As far as cars equipped with manual transmission go, there is no way the new Z will outrun the current Gen 5. C6 ZR1 did 0-60 in 3.4, no way new Z06 with manual transmission will match that. As far as top speed goes, the same story. From what I see, torque management gets in the way of straight line performance of Viper, Hellcat's problem may be the weight and lack of 4WD to hook it up.

 

[05Commemorative]

Let me summarize your post:
1) I want to tell everyone how fast the 911 Turbo S is in a straight line
2) I wan to tell everyone the GenV should have more HP
3) I want to repeat these same two items over and over, regardless of the topic of the thread

Sure discussing a Porsche,GT500 or others is relevant to this forum, as we are discussing straight line street performance,a place were the 911 Turbo S happens to dominate..... That Hellcat is all good and with a automatic and that much HP it will give a Gen 5 a hell of a run or may beat it on the street/strip,esp w/good tires....

SRT had better step up big time with HP and other improvements with the 15 model Viper with all this competition,esp that new Z or it be end of new Vipers....We shall see...

 

[Free2go]

On the street/track,the 560Hp/556 Tk/AWL/DCT w/LC.,10 second bone stock 911 Turbo S will destroy everything from the dig and thru the quarter,except a Mclaren or Bugatti..Period...
Smart Engineering will trump HP numbers all day long in modern HP cars...

991/911 TS is the best 10 second grand highway/autobahn cruiser ever invented....

Dude...you and Klamathpro need to get together. If you are married, I have a homework assignment for you. Go out tonight and bone the hell out of another woman, then go home and tell your wife how much better the other woman was in the sack.....everyday afterwards.

 

[DMan]

Guys:

In one post its - the new Z07 is going to spank the viper & SRT better do something or it's all over, queue the violins - BUT the Z07 is currently rates at 625HP, what many would describe as prett disappointing compared to the HP kings out there & 625 is less than 640 as I remember from my schooling.

In another post: the viper needs to have much more HP or it's all over, queue violins - um, but you just said he vette will kill it even though it has less HP.

You can't play both of these arguments or the violins. Geesh.

 

[DMan]

Oh, and how about that vert?

 

[PeterMJ]

Guys:

In one post its - the new Z07 is going to spank the viper & SRT better do something or it's all over, queue the violins - BUT the Z07 is currently rates at 625HP, what many would describe as prett disappointing compared to the HP kings out there & 625 is less than 640 as I remember from my schooling.

In another post: the viper needs to have much more HP or it's all over, queue violins - um, but you just said he vette will kill it even though it has less HP.

You can't play both of these arguments or the violins. Geesh.

New Z06 is like the Monkeys, all about marketing hype that apparently appeals to receptive masses who choose to discard reason and common sense and gladly replace it with Juechter's assurances. Spin doctors turned the new plastic fantastic into a super car before it even came out, I am truly impressed by this part. Now, the rational people will wait to see how the car will play out in real life while the believers will keep drinking kool aid and duck while the sky is falling. No doubt the new car will be as impressive at Nurburgring as the base car, LMAO.

 

[Bobpantax]

This thread is about the Gen V and the Hellcat. We all know about your Porsche. Please give it a rest.

Sure discussing a Porsche,GT500 or others is relevant to this forum, as we are discussing straight line street performance,a place were the 911 Turbo S happens to dominate..... That Hellcat is all good and with a automatic and that much HP it will give a Gen 5 a hell of a run or may beat it on the street/strip,esp w/good tires....

SRT had better step up big time with HP and other improvements with the 15 model Viper with all this competition,esp that new Z or it be end of new Vipers....We shall see...

 

[Bobpantax]

A set of street/drag radials and a well prepped track will cure the hook up problem. It did for my supercharged Chally which was running a 3.92 diff. The Hellcat will live up to its name.

The new Z06 is heavier and has less hp than even the current Gen 5, how is this exactly a reason for Viper's demise? The latest GTR is faster in straight line and handles better than the latest Turbo S. As far as cars equipped with manual transmission go, there is no way the new Z will outrun the current Gen 5. C6 ZR1 did 0-60 in 3.4, no way new Z06 with manual transmission will match that. As far as top speed goes, the same story. From what I see, torque management gets in the way of straight line performance of Viper, Hellcat's problem may be the weight and lack of 4WD to hook it up.